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Kathy Townsend Court Reporters (505) 243-5018 Fax (505 ...€¦ · 4 Kathy Townsend Court Reporters...
Transcript of Kathy Townsend Court Reporters (505) 243-5018 Fax (505 ...€¦ · 4 Kathy Townsend Court Reporters...
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Kathy Townsend Court Reporters(505) 243-5018 Fax (505) 243-3606
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· · · · · · · · · · ··STATE OF NEW MEXICO·1·
· · · · · · ··BEFORE THE SECRETARY OF ENVIRONMENT·2·
· · · · · · · · · · · ·No. GWB 18-06(P)·3·
· ··4·
· ·IN THE MATTER OF THE APPLICATION·5·
· ·OF NEW MEXICO COPPER CORPORATION FOR· ·
· ·A GROUNDWATER DISCHARGE PERMIT FOR·6·
· ·THE COPPER FLAT MINE, DP-1840· ·
· ··7·
· ··8·
· ··9·
· ·10·
· ·11·
· ·12·
· · · · · · · · · ·TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS13·
· ·14·
· · · · · · · · · · · · · ·Volume 115·
· ·16·
· · · · · · ·BE IT REMEMBERED that on the 24th day of17·
· ·September, 2018, this matter came on for hearing before18·
· ·FELICIA ORTH, Hearing Officer, at the Ralph Edwards19·
· ·Auditorium in Truth or Consequences, New Mexico, at the20·
· ·hour of 9:06 a.m.21·
· ·22·
· ·23·
· ·24·
· ·25·
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· · · · · · · · · · ·A P P E A R A N C E S·1·· ·The Hearing Officer:·2·· · · ··FELICIA ORTH·3·· · · ··Hearing Officer· ·· · · ··20 Barranca Road·4·· · · ··Los Alamos, New Mexico··87544· ·· · · ··[email protected]·5·· ·For the New Mexico Environment Department:·6·· · · ··ANDREW P. KNIGHT·7·· · · ··Assistant General Counsel· ·· · · ··New Mexico Environment Department·8·· · · ··Office of General Counsel· ·· · · ··121 Tijeras Avenue, Northeast·9·· · · ··Suite 1000· ·· · · ··Albuquerque, New Mexico··8750210·· · · ··(505) 222-9540· ·· · · ··[email protected]·· ·For New Mexico Copper Corporation:12·· · · ··STUART R. BUTZIER13·· · · ··MODRALL, SPERLING, ROEHL, HARRIS & SISK, PA· ·· · · ··Attorneys at Law14·· · · ··500 Fourth Street, Northwest· ·· · · ··Suite 100015·· · · ··Albuquerque, New Mexico··87102· ·· · · ··(505) 848-183216·· · · ··[email protected]· ·· ·17·· ·For the Turner Ranch Properties, LP, and Hillsboro18·· ·Pitchfork Ranch, LLC:· ·· ·19·· · · ··CHARLES de SAILLAN· ·· · · ··NEW MEXICO ENVIRONMENTAL LAW CENTER20·· · · ··1405 Luisa Street· ·· · · ··Suite 521·· · · ··Santa Fe, New Mexico··87505-4074· ·· · · ··(505) 989-902222·· · · ··[email protected]· ·· ·23·· ·24·· ·25·
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· · · · · · · ·A P P E A R A N C E S (Continued)·1·· ·For the Elephant Butte Irrigation District:·2·· · · ··SAMANTHA R. BARNCASTLE·3·· · · ··BARNCASTLE LAW FIRM· ·· · · ··Attorneys at Law·4·· · · ··Post Office Box 1556· ·· · · ··Las Cruces, New Mexico··88004·5·· · · ··(575) 636-2377· ·· · · ··[email protected]·6·· ··7·· ··8·· ··9·· ·10·· ·11·· ·12·· ·13·· ·14·· ·15·· ·16·· ·17·· ·18·· ·19·· ·20·· ·21·· ·22·· ·23·· ·24·· ·25·
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· · · · · · · · · · · · · ·I N D E X·1·· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ··PAGE·2·· ·JEFFREY SMITH·3·· · · ··Direct Examination by Mr. Butzier· · · · · ·39·4·· ·JEFFREY SMITH and JUAN VELASQUEZ·5·· · · ··Cross Examination by Mr. de Saillan· · · · ·58·6·· · · ··Cross Examination by Ms. Barncastle· · · · ·73·7·· · · ··Redirect Examination by Mr. Butzier· · · · ·76·8·· · · ··Examination by Ms. Brittan· · · · · · · · ··81·9·· · · ··Examination by Ms. Nicoll· · · · · · · · · ·8210·· · · ··Examination by Mr. Garcia· · · · · · · · · ·8311·· · · ··Further Examination by Ms. Nicoll· · · · · ·8412·· · · ··Further Examination by Ms. Brittan· · · · ··8513·· · · ··Examination by Mr. Bokich· · · · · · · · · ·8714·· ·STEVEN FINCH15·· · · ··Direct Examination by Mr. Butzier· · · · · ·9016·· · · ··Direct Examination (Continued) by17·· · · · ·Mr. Butzier· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ·15818·· · · ··Cross Examination by Mr. de Saillan· · · ··16419·· · · ··Cross Examination by Ms. Barncastle· · · ··18720·· · · ··Examination by Ms. Brittan· · · · · · · · ·20421·· · · ··Examination by Mr. Mijal· · · · · · · · · ·20622·· · · ··Examination by Ms. Uphus· · · · · · · · · ·20923·· · · ··Redirect Examination by Mr. Butzier· · · ··21324·· · · ··Recross Examination by Mr. de Saillan· · ··22025·
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· · · · · · · · · · ·I N D E X (Continued)·1·· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ··PAGE·2·· ·STEVEN FINCH (Continued)·3·· · · ··Examination by Mr. Bokich· · · · · · · · ··221·4·· ·HARVEY CHATFIELD·5·· · · ··Public Comment· · · · · · · · · · · · · · ·138·6·· ·RHONDA BRITTAN·7·· · · ··Public Comment· · · · · · · · · · · · · · ·140·8·· ·BRUCE SWINGLE·9·· · · ··Public Comment· · · · · · · · · · · · · · ·14310·· ·RAY IRWIN11·· · · ··Public Comment· · · · · · · · · · · · · · ·15212·· ·KENNETH LYON13·· · · ··Public Comment· · · · · · · · · · · · · · ·15514·· ·RUTH GRIFFITHS15·· · · ··Direct Examination by Mr. Butzier· · · · ··22416·· ·RUTH GRIFFITHS AND ROB BOWELL17·· · · ··Cross Examination by Mr. de Saillan· · · ··28318·· · · ··Cross Examination by Ms. Barncastle· · · ··30019·· ·20·· ·21·· ·22·· ·23·· ·24·· ·25·
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· · · · · · · · · · · ··E X H I B I T S·1·
· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ··ADMITTED·2·
· ·NEW MEXICO COPPER CORPORATION:·3·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 1.··Resume of Jeffrey Smith· · · · · ·80·4·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 2.··PowerPoint presentation by· · · ··80·5·
· · · ··Jeffrey Smith·6·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 3.··Resume of Juan Velasquez· · · · ··80·7·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 4.··Resume of Katie Emmer· · · · · · ·80·8·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 5.··M3 Engineering & Technology· · · ·80·9·
· · · ··Corporation Copper Flat Project Form10·
· · · ··43-101F1 Technical Report Feasibility11·
· · · ··Study, New Mexico, USA, 201312·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 6.··New Mexico State University· · · ·8013·
· · · ··Arrowhead Center The Socioeconomic14·
· · · ··Impacts of THEMAC Resources Group Ltd.15·
· · · ··Copper Flat Mine Project in Sierra County,16·
· · · ··New Mexico, 201217·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 7.··New Mexico Copper Corporation's· ·8018·
· · · ··Financial Assurance Proposal and Supporting19·
· · · ··Material20·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 8.··Joint Powers Agreement Between· ··8021·
· · · ··New Mexico Energy, Minerals and Natural22·
· · · ··Resources Department and New Mexico23·
· · · ··Environment Department24·
· ·25·
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· · · · · · · · ··E X H I B I T S (Continued)·1·
· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ··ADMITTED·2·
· ·NEW MEXICO COPPER CORPORATION (Continued):·3·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 9.··Memorandum of Understanding· · · ·80·4·
· · · ··Between The New Mexico Environment·5·
· · · ··Department And The US Bureau of Land·6·
· · · ··Management New Mexico State Office·7·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 10.··Resume of Steven Finch· · · · ··163·8·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 11.··PowerPoint presentation by· · ··163·9·
· · · ··Steven Finch10·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 12.··THEMAC Resources letter, Re:· ··16311·
· · · ··Additional Water Balance Detail for12·
· · · ··Copper Flat Mining Scenarios Considered13·
· · · ··by BLM Proposed Action, Alternative 1,14·
· · · ··and Alternative 2, March 8, 201715·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 13.··Advances in Geology of the· · ··16316·
· · · ··Porphyry Copper Deposits, Southwestern17·
· · · ··North America, Geology of the Copper Flat18·
· · · ··Porphyry Copper Deposit, Hillsboro,19·
· · · ··Sierra County, New Mexico20·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 14.··JSAI, Technical Memorandum,· · ·16321·
· · · ··Subject:··Copper Flat open pit area22·
· · · ··groundwater chemistry data and23·
· · · ··application to SRK geochemistry model,24·
· · · ··September 26, 201725·
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· · · · · · · · ··E X H I B I T S (Continued)·1·
· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ··ADMITTED·2·
· ·NEW MEXICO COPPER CORPORATION (Continued):·3·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 15.··JSAI, Technical Memorandum,· · ·163·4·
· · · ··Subject:··Post reclamation open pit·5·
· · · ··surface area storm-water runoff·6·
· · · ··calculations, Copper Flat Project,·7·
· · · ··New Mexico Copper Corporation, September·8·
· · · ··25, 2017·9·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 16.··JSAI, Technical Memorandum,· · ·16310·
· · · ··Subject:··Hydrologic Effects of proposed11·
· · · ··Rapid Fill Reclamation of Copper Flat12·
· · · ··Open Pit, October 12, 201713·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 17.··10th International· · · · · · ··16314·
· · · ··Conference on Acid Rock Drainage & IMWA15·
· · · ··Annual Conference, Water balance modeling16·
· · · ··of preferential flow in waste rock17·
· · · ··materials, 201518·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 18.··USGS, Documentation of the· · ··16319·
· · · ··Unsaturated-Zone Flow (UZF1) Package for20·
· · · ··Modeling Unsaturated Flow Between the21·
· · · ··Land Surface and the Water Table with22·
· · · ··MODFLOW-2005, Chapter 19 Section A,23·
· · · ··Ground Water, of Book 6, Modeling24·
· · · ··Techniques, 200625·
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· · · · · · · · ··E X H I B I T S (Continued)·1·
· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ··ADMITTED·2·
· ·NEW MEXICO COPPER CORPORATION (Continued):·3·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 19.··Hydrology of Waste Rock· · · · ·163·4·
· · · ··Dumps, MEND Associate Project PA-1,·5·
· · · ··July 1995·6·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 20.··Proceedings America· · · · · · ·163·7·
· · · ··Society of Mining and Reclamation,·8·
· · · ··Application of Unsaturated Zone·9·
· · · ··Hydrology at Waste Rock Facilities:10·
· · · ··Design of Soil Covers and Prediction of11·
· · · ··Seepage, 199912·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 21.··Resume of Ruth Griffiths· · · ··28113·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 22.··PowerPoint presentation by· · ··28114·
· · · ··Ruth Griffiths15·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 23.··Resume of Rob Bowell· · · · · ··28116·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 24.··Resume of Amy Prestia· · · · · ·28117·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 25.··Elsevier, hydrometallurgy 73,· ·28118·
· · · ··Investigation of the leaching of19·
· · · ··chalcopyrite ore in acidic solutions,20·
· · · ··200321·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 26.··Aquatic Consultants, Inc.,· · ··28122·
· · · ··Copper Flat Mine Biological Assessment,23·
· · · ··November 201424·
· ·25·
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· · · · · · · · ··E X H I B I T S (Continued)·1·
· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ··ADMITTED·2·
· ·NEW MEXICO COPPER CORPORATION (Continued):·3·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 27.··ASTM International, Standard· ··281·4·
· · · ··Test Method for Accelerated Weathering of·5·
· · · ··Solid Materials Using a Modified Humidity·6·
· · · ··Cell, 1996·7·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 28.··ASTM International, Standard· ··281·8·
· · · ··Test Method for Column Percolation·9·
· · · ··Extraction of Mine Rock by the Meteoric10·
· · · ··Water Mobility Procedure, 201311·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 29.··PTI Environmental Services· · ··28112·
· · · ··and Santa Fe Pacific Gold Corporation,13·
· · · ··Limnologic Conditions in Three Existing14·
· · · ··Nevada Pit Lakes:··Observations and15·
· · · ··Modeling Using CE-QUAL-W216·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 30.··The University of Chicago· · · ·28117·
· · · ··Press, The Journal of Geology, Limits of18·
· · · ··the Natural Environment in Terms of pH19·
· · · ··and Oxidation-Reduction Potentials,20·
· · · ··May 196021·
· ·22·
· ·23·
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· · · · · · · · ··E X H I B I T S (Continued)·1·
· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ··ADMITTED·2·
· ·NEW MEXICO COPPER CORPORATION (Continued):·3·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 31.··Australian Centre for Mining· ··281·4·
· · · ··Environmental Research, Comparison of·5·
· · · ··Oxidation Rates of Sulfidic Mine Wastes·6·
· · · ··Measured in the Laboratory and Field,·7·
· · · ··February 2000·8·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 32.··Mineralogical Association of· ··281·9·
· · · ··Canada, Environmental Geochemistry of10·
· · · ··Sulfide Mine Waste, Chapter 4, Mineralogy11·
· · · ··of Ochre Deposits Formed by Sulfide12·
· · · ··Oxidation, 199413·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 33.··Pergamon, Applied· · · · · · · ·28114·
· · · ··Geochemistry, Sorption of arsenic by iron15·
· · · ··oxides and oxyhydroxides in soils, 199416·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 34.··The Geological Society of· · · ·28117·
· · · ··London, Mine Water Hydrogeology and18·
· · · ··Geochemistry, The hydrogeochemical19·
· · · ··dynamics of mine pit lakes, 200220·
· ·21·
· ·22·
· ·23·
· ·24·
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· · · · · · · · ··E X H I B I T S (Continued)·1·
· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ··ADMITTED·2·
· ·NEW MEXICO COPPER CORPORATION (Continued):·3·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 35.··Geology and Ore Deposits· · · ··281·4·
· · · ··2000: The Great Basin and Beyond·5·
· · · ··Proceedings Volume II, Geochemical·6·
· · · ··Predictions of Metal Leaching and Acid·7·
· · · ··Generation: Geologic Controls and·8·
· · · ··Baseline Assessment, 2000·9·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 36.··Bureau of Land Management,· · ··28110·
· · · ··Nevada Bureau of Land Management Rock11·
· · · ··Characterization and Water Resources12·
· · · ··Analysis Guidance for Mining Activities,13·
· · · ··200814·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 37.··US Geological Survey· · · · · ··28115·
· · · ··Professional Paper, Geological Survey16·
· · · ··Research 1966, Uphole Seismic17·
· · · ··Measurements as an Indication of Stress18·
· · · ··Relief in Granitic Rock Tunnels19·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 38.··Elsevier, Chemical Geology· · ··28120·
· · · ··244, Sensitivity analyses in pit lake21·
· · · ··prediction, Martha mine, New Zealand 2:22·
· · · ··Geochemistry, water-rock reactions, and23·
· · · ··surface adsorption, 200724·
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· · · · · · · · ··E X H I B I T S (Continued)·1·
· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ··ADMITTED·2·
· ·NEW MEXICO COPPER CORPORATION (Continued):·3·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 39.··Am. Chem. Soc. Symp. Series· · ·281·4·
· · · ··550, Environmental Geochemistry of·5·
· · · ··Sulfide Oxidation, Chapter 23, Secondary·6·
· · · ··Iron-Sulfate Minerals as Sources of·7·
· · · ··Sulfate and Acidity·8·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 40.··Pergamon Press Ltd, Applied· · ·281·9·
· · · ··Geochemistry, Vol. 9, Reactivity of10·
· · · ··aquatic iron (III) oxyhydroxides -11·
· · · ··implications for redox cycling of iron12·
· · · ··in natural waters, 199413·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 41.··Elsevier, Journal of· · · · · ··28114·
· · · ··Chemical Exploration 64, Predicting the15·
· · · ··effects of evapoconcentration on water16·
· · · ··quality in mine pit lakes, 31 May 199817·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 42.··Pergamon, Applied· · · · · · · ·28118·
· · · ··Geochemistry 14, Review, Geochemical and19·
· · · ··equilibrium trends in mine pit lakes, 199920·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 43.··Proc 7th International· · · · ··28121·
· · · ··Symposium on Water-Rock Interaction,22·
· · · ··Geochemical classification of mine23·
· · · ··drainages and natural drainages in24·
· · · ··mineralized areas, 199225·
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· · · · · · · · ··E X H I B I T S (Continued)·1·
· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ··ADMITTED·2·
· ·NEW MEXICO COPPER CORPORATION (Continued):·3·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 44.··Pergamon, Wat. Sci. Tech.· · · ·281·4·
· · · ··Vol. 28, Sediment Quality Objectives and·5·
· · · ··Criteria Development in Germany, 1993·6·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 45.··Elsevier Science Publishers,· ··281·7·
· · · ··Colloids and Surfaces, 59, Physical·8·
· · · ··chemical interpretation of primary·9·
· · · ··charging behaviour of metal (hydr)oxides10·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 46.··INTERA, Baseline Data· · · · · ·28111·
· · · ··Characterization Report for Copper Flat12·
· · · ··Mine, Sierra County, New Mexico, Draft,13·
· · · ··February 201214·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 47.··INTERA, Baseline Data· · · · · ·28115·
· · · ··Characterization Report for Copper Flat16·
· · · ··Mine, Sierra County, New Mexico, Draft,17·
· · · ··addendum, February 201218·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 48.··Mining Engineering,· · · · · · ·28119·
· · · ··Technical Papers, Stratification controls20·
· · · ··of pit mine lakes, February 200921·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 49.··JSAI, Amendment to the Stage· ··28122·
· · · ··I Abatement Plan Proposal for the Copper23·
· · · ··Flat Mine, October 14, 201124·
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· · · · · · · · ··E X H I B I T S (Continued)·1·
· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ··ADMITTED·2·
· ·NEW MEXICO COPPER CORPORATION (Continued):·3·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 50.··JSAI, Conceptual Model of· · · ·281·4·
· · · ··Groundwater Flow in the Animas Uplift·5·
· · · ··and Palomas Basin, Copper Flat Project,·6·
· · · ··Sierra County, New Mexico, May 22, 2012·7·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 51.··JSAI, Technical Memorandum,· · ·281·8·
· · · ··Subject:··Review of methods and·9·
· · · ··assumptions for predicting open pit water10·
· · · ··quality, Copper Flat Project, New Mexico,11·
· · · ··December 17, 201412·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 52.··JSAI, Technical Memorandum,· · ·28113·
· · · ··Subject:··Estimated evaporation rate for14·
· · · ··future Copper Flat open pit, September 1,15·
· · · ··201516·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 53.··JSAI, Draft Technical· · · · · ·28117·
· · · ··Memorandum, Subject:··Proposed Copper Flat18·
· · · ··open pit reclamation plan and inputs for19·
· · · ··evaluating water quality predictions,20·
· · · ··March 25, 201521·
· ·22·
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· · · · · · · · ··E X H I B I T S (Continued)·1·
· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ··ADMITTED·2·
· ·NEW MEXICO COPPER CORPORATION (Continued):·3·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 54.··JSAI, Technical Memorandum,· · ·281·4·
· · · ··Subject: Copper Flat open pit area·5·
· · · ··groundwater chemistry data and application·6·
· · · ··to SRK geochemistry model, September 26,·7·
· · · ··2017·8·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 55.··JSAI, Technical Memorandum,· · ·281·9·
· · · ··Subject:··Expected selenium concentrations10·
· · · ··from supply Wells PW-1 through PW-4,11·
· · · ··Copper Flat Project, New Mexico Copper12·
· · · ··Corporation, September 26, 201713·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 56.··Elsevier, International· · · · ·28114·
· · · ··Journal of Rock Mechanics and Mining15·
· · · ··Sciences & Geomechanics Abstracts,16·
· · · ··Volume 21, Evaluation of17·
· · · ··excavation-induced changes in rock18·
· · · ··permeability, June 198419·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 57.··Plenum Publishing· · · · · · · ·28120·
· · · ··Corporation, Atomic Energy, Vol. 82,21·
· · · ··Performance Estimation in Exploiting22·
· · · ··the Yuzhnoe Uranium Deposit by23·
· · · ··Underground Leaching, 199724·
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· · · · · · · · ··E X H I B I T S (Continued)·1·
· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ··ADMITTED·2·
· ·NEW MEXICO COPPER CORPORATION (Continued):·3·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 58.··Klohn-Crippen Consultants· · · ·281·4·
· · · ··Ltd and Placer Dome Canada Limited,·5·
· · · ··Mineralogical Changes During NP·6·
· · · ··Determinations and Their Implications,·7·
· · · ··1997·8·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 59.··Department of Mining and· · · ··281·9·
· · · ··Mineral Process Engineering, University10·
· · · ··of British Columbia, Determination of11·
· · · ··Neutralization Potential in the12·
· · · ··Prediction of Acid Rock Drainage, 199713·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 60.··Elsevier, Advances in Water· · ·28114·
· · · ··Resources 29, Upscaling geochemical15·
· · · ··reaction rates using pore-scale network16·
· · · ··modeling, 200517·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 61.··Elsevier, Gechimica et· · · · ··28118·
· · · ··Cosmochimica Acta 72, Scale dependence of19·
· · · ··mineral dissolution rates within single20·
· · · ··pores and fractures, 200821·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 62.··Elsevier, Minerals· · · · · · ··28122·
· · · ··Engineering 18, Heap leaching kinetics are23·
· · · ··proportional to the irrigation rate24·
· · · ··divided by heap height, 200525·
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· · · · · · · · ··E X H I B I T S (Continued)·1·
· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ··ADMITTED·2·
· ·NEW MEXICO COPPER CORPORATION (Continued):·3·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 63.··Buka Environmental and· · · · ··281·4·
· · · ··Kuipers & Associates, Predicting Water·5·
· · · ··Quality at Hardrock Mines, Methods and·6·
· · · ··Models, Uncertainties, and·7·
· · · ··State-of-the-Art, 2005·8·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 64.··New Mexico Bureau of Mines· · ··281·9·
· · · ··and Mineral Resources, Geology and10·
· · · ··Evolution of the Copper Flat Porphyry11·
· · · ··System, Sierra County, New Mexico,12·
· · · ··February 1, 200113·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 65.··Environmental Geochemistry· · ··28114·
· · · ··International Pty Ltd, Advances in Acid15·
· · · ··Drainage Prediction Using the Net Acid16·
· · · ··Generating (NAG) Test, 199717·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 66.··University of Queensland· · · ··28118·
· · · ··and others, Effect of Fracture19·
· · · ··Permeability on Connectivity of20·
· · · ··Fracture Networks, 200921·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 67.··MDAG.com Internet Case Study· ··28122·
· · · ··22, Should a Humidity-Cell Sample Be23·
· · · ··Gently Agitated During Testing?··200624·
· ·25·
19
· · · · · · · · ··E X H I B I T S (Continued)·1·
· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ··ADMITTED·2·
· ·NEW MEXICO COPPER CORPORATION (Continued):·3·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 68.··Pergamon Press Ltd,· · · · · · ·281·4·
· · · ··Applied Geochemistry, Vo. 7, Processes·5·
· · · ··controlling acid attenuation in the·6·
· · · ··unsaturated zone of a Triassic sandstone·7·
· · · ··aquifer (U.K.), in the absence of·8·
· · · ··carbonate minerals, 1992·9·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 69.··US Geological Survey, The· · · ··28110·
· · · ··Environmental Geochemistry of Mineral11·
· · · ··Deposits, Chapter 6, Geochemistry of Acid12·
· · · ··Mine Waters, 199913·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 70.··Soil Science Society of· · · · ··28114·
· · · ··America, Acid Sulfate Weathering, Chapter15·
· · · ··3, Aqueous Pyrite Oxidation and the16·
· · · ··Consequent Formation of Secondary Iron17·
· · · ··Minerals, 198218·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 71.··US Geological Survey,· · · · · ··28119·
· · · ··Water-Resources Investigations Report20·
· · · ··99-4259, User's Guide to PHREEQC (Version21·
· · · ··2) - A Computer Program for Speciation,22·
· · · ··Batch-Reaction, One-Dimensional Transport,23·
· · · ··and Inverse Geochemical Calculations, 201024·
· ·25·
20
· · · · · · · · ··E X H I B I T S (Continued)·1·
· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ··ADMITTED·2·
· ·NEW MEXICO COPPER CORPORATION (Continued):·3·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 72.··Mine Water and the· · · · · · ··281·4·
· · · ··Environment 22, Technical Article, The·5·
· · · ··Limnology of Summer Camp Pit Lake:··A·6·
· · · ··Case Study·7·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 73.··Ministry of Employment and· · ··281·8·
· · · ··Investment, Reclamation Section, Energy·9·
· · · ··and Minerals Division, Draft Guidelines10·
· · · ··and Recommended Methods for the Prediction11·
· · · ··of Metal Leaching and Acid Rock Drainage12·
· · · ··at Minesites in British Columbia, April,13·
· · · ··199714·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 74.··New Mexico Bureau of Geology· ··28115·
· · · ··and Mineral Resources Open-file report 475,16·
· · · ··The Natural Defenses of Copper Flat, Sierra17·
· · · ··County, New Mexico, August 200318·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 75.··Economic Geology, Vo. 98,· · · ·28119·
· · · ··Tectono-Magmatic Precursors for Porphyry20·
· · · ··Cu-(Mo-Au) Deposit Formation, 200321·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 76.··Oxygen Transport, Chapter 8,· ··28122·
· · · ··Sulfide Oxidation Mechanisms:··Controls23·
· · · ··and Rates of Oxygen Transport24·
· ·25·
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· · · · · · · · ··E X H I B I T S (Continued)·1·
· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ··ADMITTED·2·
· ·NEW MEXICO COPPER CORPORATION (Continued):·3·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 77.··Minerals Engineering, 22,· · · ·281·4·
· · · ··Humidity cell tests for the prediction·5·
· · · ··of acid rock drainage, 2009·6·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 78.··Elsevier Scientific· · · · · · ·281·7·
· · · ··Publishing Company, Colloids and Surfaces,·8·
· · · ··2, The Interaction of Anions and Weak·9·
· · · ··Acids with the Hydrous Goethite (a-FeOOH)10·
· · · ··Surface, 198011·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 79.··Bureau of Mines Report of· · · ·28112·
· · · ··Investigations, Blast-Produced Fractures13·
· · · ··in Lithonia Granite, 197414·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 80.··EPA Industrial Environmental· ··28115·
· · · ··Research Laboratory, Office of Research16·
· · · ··and Development, Environmental Protection17·
· · · ··Technology Series, Field and Laboratory18·
· · · ··Methods Applicable to Overburdens and19·
· · · ··Minesoils, March 197820·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 81.··SRK Consulting, NI-43-101· · · ·28121·
· · · ··Preliminary Assessment, THEMAC Resources22·
· · · ··Group Limited, Copper Flat Project,23·
· · · ··Sierra County, New Mexico, 201024·
· ·25·
22
· · · · · · · · ··E X H I B I T S (Continued)·1·
· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · ··ADMITTED·2·
· ·NEW MEXICO COPPER CORPORATION (Continued):·3·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 82.··SRK Consulting, Geochemical· · ·281·4·
· · · ··Characterization Report for the Copper·5·
· · · ··Flat Project, New Mexico, May 2013·6·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 83.··SRK Consulting, Predictive· · ··281·7·
· · · ··Geochemical Modeling of Pit Lake Water·8·
· · · ··Quality at the Copper Flat Project, New·9·
· · · ··Mexico, December 201410·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 84.··SRK Consulting, Humidity· · · ··28111·
· · · ··Cell Termination Report for the Copper12·
· · · ··Flat Project, New Mexico, February 201413·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 85.··Pergamon, Applied· · · · · · · ·28114·
· · · ··Geochemistry 15, Geochemical modeling15·
· · · ··approach to predicting arsenic16·
· · · ··concentrations in a mine pit lake, 200017·
· ·NMCC Exhibit 86.··THEMAC Resources Group, Mine· ··28118·
· · · ··Operation and Reclamation Plan, Copper19·
· · · ··Flat Mine Project, Sierra County, New20·
· · · ··Mexico, July 18, 201221·
· ·22·
· ·23·
· ·24·
· ·25·
23
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··Good morning.·1·
· · · · · · ·My name is Felicia Orth.··I'm a Hearing·2·
· ·Officer appointed by the New Mexico Environment·3·
· ·Department to conduct a hearing in the matter of·4·
· ·Discharge Permit 1840.·5·
· · · · · · ·This is a Discharge Permit applied for by the·6·
· ·New Mexico Copper Corporation for the proposed Copper·7·
· ·Flat Mine.··It was docketed by the hearing clerk as·8·
· ·GWB 18-06(P).·9·
· · · · · · ·UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER:··You'll need to turn10·
· ·that thing up a little bit.11·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··Okay.12·
· · · · · · ·Does it help if I'm closer to it?13·
· · · · · · ·Okay.14·
· · · · · · ·THE INTERPRETER:··And the interpreter is15·
· ·ready, as well.16·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··The hearing is being recorded and17·
· ·transcribed by Cheryl Arreguin of Kathy Townsend Court18·
· ·Reporters.19·
· · · · · · ·There is also simultaneous interpretation20·
· ·between Spanish and English.21·
· · · · · · ·Ma'am.22·
· · · · · · ·(SANDRA O. CALDWELL, the interpreter, was duly23·
· · · · · · ·sworn.)24·
· · · · · · ·THE INTERPRETER:··Good morning.25·
24
· · · · · · ·Sandra Olivares Caldwell, certified court·1·
· ·interpreter for the State of New Mexico.·2·
· · · · · · ·I swear to interpret faithfully between·3·
· ·English and Spanish languages to the best of my ability·4·
· ·in accordance with the ethics and protocols of the·5·
· ·interpreter profession.·6·
· · · · · · ·Madam Hearing Officer, may I make the·7·
· ·announcement?·8·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··Yes.·9·
· · · · · · ·Use the --10·
· · · · · · ·THE INTERPRETER:··Thank you.11·
· · · · · · ·Good morning, ladies and gentlemen.12·
· · · · · · ·I'm here to provide language access to anyone13·
· ·who is more comfortable in another language besides14·
· ·English.··If you are more comfortable in another15·
· ·language, no matter what language that is, please let me16·
· ·know.··If you are here assisting someone or accompanying17·
· ·someone who is more comfortable in another language,18·
· ·please let me know.19·
· · · · · · ·I'll be making an announcement in Spanish.20·
· · · · · · ·(In Spanish.)21·
· · · · · · ·Everyone present is comfortable in English?22·
· · · · · · ·Thank you very much.23·
· · · · · · ·Madam Hearing Officer, no requests at this24·
· ·point for interpreter services, but I will be available25·
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Kathy Townsend Court Reporters(505) 243-5018 Fax (505) 243-3606
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· ·at any time during the hearing.·1·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··Thank you very much.·2·
· · · · · · ·All right.··So the hearing will be conducted·3·
· ·in accordance with the New Mexico Water Quality Act, the·4·
· ·New Mexico Ground and Surface Water Protection·5·
· ·Regulations, the Supplemental Permitting Requirements·6·
· ·for Copper Mine Facilities, commonly known as the Copper·7·
· ·Mine Rule.··And, of course, the procedures that apply·8·
· ·here come from those sources and also 20.1.4 of the New·9·
· ·Mexico Administrative Code.10·
· · · · · · ·All testimony will be taken under oath.··All11·
· ·testimony will be subject to cross-examination.12·
· · · · · · ·A few housekeeping matters.13·
· · · · · · ·The restrooms are through that door at the14·
· ·back of the auditorium.15·
· · · · · · ·There is something of a coffee setup over16·
· ·here, although I have to explain it.··All you'll find in17·
· ·the hot water pot is hot water.··If you want leaded18·
· ·coffee, you cut open one of these Cafe Bustelo.··If you19·
· ·want unleaded, you open the German decaffeinated coffee.20·
· ·And then there are tea bags, half and half and sugar21·
· ·cubes.22·
· · · · · · ·There are restaurants nearby, I know.··We will23·
· ·take a lunch break somewhere 11:30, noon, whenever24·
· ·there's a good stopping place in a witness' testimony.25·
26
· · · · · · ·Public comment will be invited throughout the·1·
· ·hearing.··We also have a special session set aside for·2·
· ·public comment where we'll hear no technical witnesses.·3·
· ·That will be starting tomorrow night, that's Tuesday·4·
· ·night, at 5:00 p.m.·5·
· · · · · · ·Otherwise, if you have public comment to·6·
· ·offer, please let me know.··We don't interrupt a·7·
· ·technical witness' testimony, but at the end of a·8·
· ·technical witness' testimony, especially if we're about·9·
· ·to take a break, I will invite your public comment.10·
· · · · · · ·So really just let me know or let John Baca --11·
· ·where is John?12·
· · · · · · ·MR. BACA:··Right here.13·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··There he is.··That's John Baca.··He14·
· ·is the hearing clerk.··You see him there in the striped15·
· ·shirt.16·
· · · · · · ·If you have a question, you want to let us17·
· ·know about public comment, you've noticed the coffee18·
· ·pot's empty, whatever it is, talk to John, and we will19·
· ·figure it out together.20·
· · · · · · ·Let's see.21·
· · · · · · ·We will not go past about 7:00 p.m. each day.22·
· ·Again, it kind of depends on where the witnesses are in23·
· ·their testimony.24·
· · · · · · ·No decisions will be made this week.··The25·
27
· ·essential process is we're making an evidentiary record.·1·
· ·The transcript will be produced.··The parties will have·2·
· ·a chance to submit posthearing proposed findings and·3·
· ·conclusions.··I do a Hearing Officer report.··All of·4·
· ·that goes to the cabinet secretary.··So it will be some·5·
· ·months before a decision is made around anything we're·6·
· ·doing here this week.·7·
· · · · · · ·Also, I saw some E-mail traffic in the·8·
· ·administrative record, and I wanted to be clear about·9·
· ·another aspect of the -- of the public comment, which is10·
· ·your comment can come in verbally on this record here,11·
· ·with the court reporter, this week, and if we continue12·
· ·into the second week, that week, as well.··However, when13·
· ·we adjourn, nothing further can come in, no public14·
· ·comment, no technical testimony, nothing.15·
· · · · · · ·Those are the procedures of the Environment16·
· ·Department, and this is the Environment Department17·
· ·hearing.18·
· · · · · · ·There is another hearing that will occur the19·
· ·week of October 22nd, also in T or C, but that's a20·
· ·hearing for another agency, the Mining and Minerals21·
· ·Division of the Energy, Minerals and Natural Resources22·
· ·Department.··They have different rules.23·
· · · · · · ·In that proceeding, they actually invite24·
· ·written public comment after adjournment.··So if you25·
28
· ·have something to say to EMNRD MMD, the Mining and·1·
· ·Minerals Division, after the evidentiary record, the·2·
· ·public comment record is closed, you can still do that.·3·
· ·Just not for this hearing.··So just get it in first.·4·
· · · · · · ·Let's see.·5·
· · · · · · ·Again, we will take a lunch break.··We won't·6·
· ·typically take a dinner break.··When we break in the·7·
· ·early evening, it will be for the night.·8·
· · · · · · ·Are there any questions about what I would·9·
· ·call administrative or housekeeping matters?10·
· · · · · · ·Mr. Butzier.11·
· · · · · · ·MR. BUTZIER:··Madam Hearing Officer, just one12·
· ·point of clarification.13·
· · · · · · ·Is it the case that if somebody comes after14·
· ·work, between the 5 and 7 o'clock time frame, who wants15·
· ·to give public comment, that that person will have an16·
· ·opportunity during that window regardless of where we17·
· ·are in the -- in the technical testimony?18·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··If you mean tomorrow night, the19·
· ·answer is yes.20·
· · · · · · ·MR. BUTZIER:··But not otherwise?21·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··If someone really wants to be heard22·
· ·and that's their chance, if you will, that's their23·
· ·window --24·
· · · · · · ·MR. BUTZIER:··Okay.25·
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29
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··-- we can take them.··I definitely·1·
· ·want to make a space for anyone who wants to offer·2·
· ·comment.··I just want to do it with the least possible·3·
· ·disruption.·4·
· · · · · · ·MR. BUTZIER:··And I know in the past that·5·
· ·you've often invited public comment just before lunch.·6·
· · · · · · ·Is that your intention in this proceeding?·7·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··So that's something we can do.·8·
· ·Again, depending on where the technical witness is,·9·
· ·breaks are often an excellent time to get some public10·
· ·comment in, either before or after lunch, or before we11·
· ·break for the day.12·
· · · · · · ·MR. BUTZIER:··Thank you, Madam Hearing13·
· ·Officer.14·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··Yes.··Again, just let us know that15·
· ·you're ready to offer comment.16·
· · · · · · ·Any other questions about administrative17·
· ·matters?18·
· · · · · · ·Ma'am.19·
· · · · · · ·Tell me your name.20·
· · · · · · ·MS. BRITTAN:··My name is Rhonda Brittan.21·
· · · · · · ·I was wondering if -- will public comment be22·
· ·restricted to a time limit?23·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··I don't like to place time limits24·
· ·on folks.··Most folks don't -- don't need them.··I will25·
30
· ·ask you not to repeat yourself.··I mean, there are other·1·
· ·rules about public comment, no personal attacks, don't·2·
· ·repeat yourself and don't stray into technical·3·
· ·testimony, testimony that would require a scientific·4·
· ·background.··But other than that, we'd like to hear what·5·
· ·you have to say.·6·
· · · · · · ·Are there other questions?·7·
· · · · · · ·No.··All right.·8·
· · · · · · ·So I have the pleadings in front of me.·9·
· ·You -- anyone is welcome to look at them when we're on a10·
· ·break.··We also have the administrative record here11·
· ·somewhere.··It's usually maintained by the bureau.12·
· · · · · · ·Andrew, do you have that?13·
· · · · · · ·MR. KNIGHT:··Madam Hearing Officer -- I'm not14·
· ·sure it's on.15·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··It's on.16·
· · · · · · ·MR. KNIGHT:··It's on.17·
· · · · · · ·The administrative record, we have -- we have18·
· ·large portions as -- as the applicant, I imagine, does,19·
· ·as well.··But the administrative record was maintained20·
· ·electronically in this proceeding, and it is 18,000-some21·
· ·pages long.··So the entire record -- as far as I know,22·
· ·the entire record is not in paper at this point, and I23·
· ·think it would be impractical to print out the entire24·
· ·thing.25·
31
· · · · · · ·But certainly the application and most·1·
· ·relevant parts of it I think we can -- we can have for·2·
· ·inspection if someone would like to.·3·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··So that reminds me.··If you would·4·
· ·reach for your devices, please, and either turn them off·5·
· ·or set them on stun.··Those of us who are trying to make·6·
· ·the record appreciate it.··Thank you for that.··And if·7·
· ·you need to take a call, just step out of the -- step·8·
· ·out of the room.·9·
· · · · · · ·Sign-ins.··So we have some sign-in sheets.10·
· ·Please sign in, give us as much information as you -- as11·
· ·you'd like, even if it's just your name.··The sign-in12·
· ·sheets are used as evidence of public participation and13·
· ·for the correct spelling of your name in the transcript14·
· ·if you ask a question or speak up.15·
· · · · · · ·No salesmen will call.··So please just sign in16·
· ·and indicate on the sheet whether you would like to give17·
· ·public comment.··And we might approach you -- if we see18·
· ·that you are desirous of giving public comment, we might19·
· ·approach you and ask you if you have any time20·
· ·constraints.21·
· · · · · · ·Any other questions at all?22·
· · · · · · ·No?··All right.23·
· · · · · · ·Oh, ma'am.24·
· · · · · · ·UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER:··Where's the sign-in25·
32
· ·sheet?·1·
· · · · · · ·MR. BACA:··Oh, right here.·2·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··John Baca is running around with·3·
· ·the sign-in sheets.··We had a number of people come into·4·
· ·the room before -- before the sheets were at the sign-in·5·
· ·table.·6·
· · · · · · ·Okay.··In that case, Mr. Knight, if you would·7·
· ·begin the appearances.·8·
· · · · · · ·MR. KNIGHT:··Good morning, Madam Hearing·9·
· ·Officer.10·
· · · · · · ·My name is Andrew Knight.··I am representing11·
· ·the Mining and Environmental Compliance Section of the12·
· ·Ground Water Bureau of the New Mexico Environment13·
· ·Department.14·
· · · · · · ·And with me today I have three witnesses,15·
· ·Mr. Kurt Vollbrecht, Mr. Bradley Reid and Dr. Joseph16·
· ·Marcoline.17·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··And --18·
· · · · · · ·MR. KNIGHT:··And our division director,19·
· ·Mr. Bruce Yurdin, is with me at the table.20·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··All right.··Thank you.21·
· · · · · · ·Mr. de Saillan.22·
· · · · · · ·MR. DE SAILLAN:··Thank you, Madam Hearing23·
· ·Officer.24·
· · · · · · ·My name is Charles de Saillan, and I'm25·
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Kathy Townsend Court Reporters(505) 243-5018 Fax (505) 243-3606
33
· ·representing Turner Ranch Properties and the Hillsboro·1·
· ·Pitchfork Ranch.·2·
· · · · · · ·With me today is Steve Dobrott, who is the·3·
· ·former manager of the Ladder Ranch.·4·
· · · · · · ·To his left is Jim Kuipers, who is one of our·5·
· ·experts.·6·
· · · · · · ·Directly behind me is Kendra Palmer, who is a·7·
· ·paralegal with the New Mexico Environmental Law Center.·8·
· · · · · · ·And to her left is Tom Myers, who is our·9·
· ·hydrologist expert.10·
· · · · · · ·I think Bob Cunningham, who is the owner of11·
· ·the Hillsboro Pitchfork Ranch, should be close by.12·
· · · · · · ·MR. CUNNINGHAM:··Right back here, Charlie.13·
· · · · · · ·MR. DE SAILLAN:··Right there.14·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··All right.··Thank you.15·
· · · · · · ·MR. DE SAILLAN:··Thank you.16·
· · · · · · ·MS. BARNCASTLE:··Good morning, Madam Hearing17·
· ·Examiner.18·
· · · · · · ·Samantha Barncastle for the Elephant Butte19·
· ·Irrigation District.20·
· · · · · · ·With me today is the manager of the district,21·
· ·Mr. Gary Esslinger, one of my experts, Dr. Carroll, and22·
· ·three more of my experts, in order, Mr. Fuchs, Dr. King23·
· ·and Mr. Libbin.24·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··Thank you.25·
34
· · · · · · ·Mr. Butzier.·1·
· · · · · · ·MR. BUTZIER:··Madam Hearing Officer, Stuart·2·
· ·Butzier of the Modrall Sperling law firm in the Santa Fe·3·
· ·office.·4·
· · · · · · ·With me today at the table here are New Mexico·5·
· ·Copper representatives, including Mr. Jeff Smith and·6·
· ·Ms. Katie Emmer.·7·
· · · · · · ·Mr. Andrew Maloney is in the back over there·8·
· ·with Tulla, who you'll hear about from Mr. Smith when he·9·
· ·testifies.10·
· · · · · · ·And then I've got a number of experts here11·
· ·that I think I will wait to introduce as we go forward12·
· ·unless you want me to introduce them now.13·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··No.··That's all right.14·
· · · · · · ·MR. BUTZIER:··Okay.15·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··Thank you.16·
· · · · · · ·MR. BUTZIER:··Thank you.17·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··And while I have Mr. Butzier there,18·
· ·are you interested in making an opening statement, or19·
· ·are there preliminary matters we need to address before20·
· ·your opening statement?21·
· · · · · · ·MR. BUTZIER:··I have not prepared an opening22·
· ·statement other than I can just say that we intend to23·
· ·offer five witnesses in support of New Mexico Copper's24·
· ·position in this proceeding.25·
35
· · · · · · ·And we'll start with the chief operating·1·
· ·officer, Mr. Jeff Smith, and I'd like to go ahead and·2·
· ·call him, and he will sort of introduce some of the·3·
· ·matters for the -- for the hearing today.·4·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··All right.··Thank you.·5·
· · · · · · ·Let me just ask if there's anyone else who·6·
· ·would like to make an opening statement or reserve.··It·7·
· ·is your choice.·8·
· · · · · · ·Hearing nothing -- oh.·9·
· · · · · · ·MR. DE SAILLAN:··We will reserve our opening10·
· ·statement until the commencement of our presentation.11·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··Okay.12·
· · · · · · ·MR. DE SAILLAN:··Thank you.13·
· · · · · · ·MS. BARNCASTLE:··I will likewise reserve mine.14·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··Okay.15·
· · · · · · ·MR. KNIGHT:··Madam Hearing Officer, I have an16·
· ·opening statement I can make at this time.17·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··Right now.··All right.··Thank you,18·
· ·Mr. Knight.19·
· · · · · · ·MR. KNIGHT:··Good morning, parties, members of20·
· ·the public, Madam Hearing Officer.21·
· · · · · · ·We are here this week for a fairly narrow22·
· ·purpose, to determine whether this mine if constructed23·
· ·and operated in accordance with this permit will cause24·
· ·exceedances of groundwater quality standards at places25·
36
· ·of withdrawal.·1·
· · · · · · ·There are many other peripheral issues, and·2·
· ·some of those are important, and they will be discussed,·3·
· ·but at its core the decision to issue this permit·4·
· ·revolves around that single question.·5·
· · · · · · ·You'll hear from the department's three·6·
· ·witnesses this week that we have spent literally years·7·
· ·scrutinizing the Mine Plan, the history of this site,·8·
· ·the geology and groundwater flow characteristics of the·9·
· ·area, and combined that with consultation with multiple10·
· ·other federal and state agencies and lessons learned11·
· ·from decades of our own permitting experience.12·
· · · · · · ·And through an iterative process, the bureau13·
· ·has created a permit that will allow mining to occur14·
· ·while protecting the quality of groundwater according to15·
· ·both the Copper Rule and the New Mexico Water Quality16·
· ·Act.··This permit does not allocate water -- any water17·
· ·for use at the mine, and it's not by itself a permit to18·
· ·operate the mine.··It is a permit to discharge water in19·
· ·such a way that surrounding groundwater is protected.20·
· · · · · · ·The Copper Rule was designed to be a permit by21·
· ·rule, a set of comprehensive, prescriptive requirements22·
· ·that an applicant must show they can meet, and if the23·
· ·department finds those requirements are met, the permit24·
· ·is issued.··We do not have the discretion to consider25·
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· ·other factors outside the scope of groundwater quality.·1·
· ·This permit does not depend on any certain amount of·2·
· ·water being available.··It only sets maximum discharge·3·
· ·limits.·4·
· · · · · · ·In the first public draft of the proposed·5·
· ·permit which was released back in February, the bureau·6·
· ·imposed a number of additional conditions on the mine·7·
· ·operators on top of those required by the Copper Rule.·8·
· ·We find that those -- those conditions are both·9·
· ·necessary and required in order for this permit to10·
· ·comply with the Water Quality Act.11·
· · · · · · ·The Water Quality Act also sets the criteria12·
· ·for denying a Discharge Permit.··In Section 74-6-5 of13·
· ·the New Mexico Statutes, it states that, quote, a permit14·
· ·shall be denied if the discharge would cause or15·
· ·contribute to water contaminant levels in excess of any16·
· ·state or federal standard.··Determination of the17·
· ·discharge's effect on groundwater shall be measured at18·
· ·any place of withdrawal of water for present or19·
· ·reasonably foreseeable future use.20·
· · · · · · ·A few words about the administrative record.21·
· ·The administrative record contains those materials22·
· ·relied on by the bureau in issuing the permit.··It23·
· ·contains the application, records of our consultation24·
· ·with other agencies, all communications with interested25·
38
· ·parties relevant to the permit and thousands of pages of·1·
· ·test results and scientific studies.·2·
· · · · · · ·The administrative record does not contain·3·
· ·materials that are not relevant to the issuance of this·4·
· ·permit or materials that, while arguably relevant, were·5·
· ·not relied upon by the bureau in issuing this permit.·6·
· · · · · · ·There are many issues connected with the·7·
· ·operation of this mine, but we are here this week to·8·
· ·discuss only one important subset of those issues,·9·
· ·potential impacts to groundwater quality and the10·
· ·measures to be taken to prevent those impacts that would11·
· ·lead to exceedances of standards at places of12·
· ·withdrawal.13·
· · · · · · ·We received a number of thoughtful, reasoned14·
· ·comments on the draft permit from the parties here today15·
· ·and from members of the public.··We have made changes to16·
· ·the permit in response to those comments, and those17·
· ·changes impose additional burdens on the applicant.··As18·
· ·the additional conditions imposed in the first draft of19·
· ·the permit, we believe those additional conditions are20·
· ·reasonable and necessary, and we have provided an21·
· ·explanation of them as required by the Copper Rule.22·
· · · · · · ·In closing, there are many -- many other valid23·
· ·topics for discussion related to this mine, and while24·
· ·they are all important, they are not all the subject of25·
39
· ·this particular hearing.··This permit is but one·1·
· ·component of a very long process, certainly an important·2·
· ·one, but only one piece of the puzzle.·3·
· · · · · · ·Thank you.·4·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··Thank you, Mr. Knight.·5·
· · · · · · ·Mr. Butzier.·6·
· · · · · · ·MR. BUTZIER:··Thank you, Madam Hearing·7·
· ·Officer.·8·
· · · · · · ·We'd like to call Mr. Jeff Smith as our first·9·
· ·witness.10·
· · · · · · · · · · · · ·JEFFREY SMITH11·
· · · ··having been first duly sworn or affirmed, was12·
· · · ··examined and testified as follows:13·
· · · · · · · · · · ··DIRECT EXAMINATION14·
· ·BY MR. BUTZIER:15·
· · · ··Q.· ·Good morning, Mr. Smith.16·
· · · · · · ·Would you please identify yourself for the17·
· ·record.18·
· · · ··A.· ·My name is Jeff Smith.··I'm the chief19·
· ·operating officer for New Mexico Copper.20·
· · · ··Q.· ·And, Mr. Smith, what will you be presenting in21·
· ·the hearing today?22·
· · · · · · ·MR. SMITH:··Katie, can you go to the first23·
· ·slide.24·
· · · · · · ·This slide is an outline of my presentation25·
40
· ·that I'll give today.·1·
· · · · · · ·I'll start off with a summary of my·2·
· ·qualifications and followed by a summary and overview of·3·
· ·New Mexico Copper Corporation.·4·
· · · · · · ·After that, I will talk a bit about the Copper·5·
· ·Flat project and give a brief summary of community·6·
· ·benefits that will result from the project.·7·
· · · · · · ·Then I will go into a summary of our·8·
· ·application for a Discharge Permit and the methods that·9·
· ·we are using to protect groundwater.10·
· · · · · · ·I will discuss the major mine units that are11·
· ·covered by the permit and a summary of our Reclamation12·
· ·and Closure Plan.13·
· · · · · · ·After that, I will talk about our financial14·
· ·assurance that we have -- our proposal that we have15·
· ·submitted, and then I will conclude with an introduction16·
· ·of our other experts.17·
· · · ··Q.· ·(BY MR. BUTZIER)··And, Mr. Smith, would you18·
· ·please describe your expertise and qualifications to be19·
· ·talking about these topics.20·
· · · ··A.· ·As I stated in my introduction, I am the chief21·
· ·operating officer of New Mexico Copper Corporation.22·
· · · · · · ·I have a degree in mining engineering that I23·
· ·earned from the University of Arizona and a master's24·
· ·degree in business management from Stanford University25·
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· ·Graduate School of Business.·1·
· · · · · · ·I have 35 years of experience in mine·2·
· ·management and mine engineering.··My experience includes·3·
· ·work in the United States, Mexico and South America.·4·
· · · · · · ·Excuse me.·5·
· · · · · · ·My experience includes time at the Quintana·6·
· ·Minerals Copper Flat Mine from 1980 to 1983.·7·
· · · · · · ·During my career, I served as -- on the·8·
· ·Economic Development Authority for Pershing County,·9·
· ·Nevada, and I have knowledge and understanding of the10·
· ·New Mexico Copper Rule requirements to prevent water11·
· ·pollution.12·
· · · · · · ·Thank you.13·
· · · · · · ·MR. BUTZIER:··Madam Hearing Officer, at this14·
· ·time, New Mexico Copper would like to offer Mr. Smith as15·
· ·a mine management and mine engineering expert who also16·
· ·has expertise in connection with compliance with the New17·
· ·Mexico Copper Rule.18·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··Objections?19·
· · · · · · ·All right.··He's so recognized.20·
· · · ··Q.· ·(BY MR. BUTZIER)··At this time, Mr. Smith,21·
· ·would you please proceed with the prepared presentation22·
· ·that you've made.23·
· · · ··A.· ·New Mexico Copper Corporation is the owner of24·
· ·the project assets.··The company is the permittee, the25·
42
· ·developer and will be the operator of the Copper Flat·1·
· ·Mine.·2·
· · · · · · ·New Mexico Copper Corporation is organized as·3·
· ·a New Mexico domestic profit corporation.··The company·4·
· ·was organized in 2010.·5·
· · · · · · ·New Mexico Copper is a wholly-owned subsidiary·6·
· ·of THEMAC Resources Group, which is listed on the·7·
· ·Toronto Stock Exchange.··The majority shareholder in·8·
· ·THEMAC is Tulla Group, which is an Australian family·9·
· ·investment group.10·
· · · · · · ·Tulla's other mining investments include11·
· ·Norseman Gold, which is Australia's longest continuously12·
· ·running gold mining operation that has produced over13·
· ·5.5 million ounces of gold over 65 years in Western14·
· ·Australia.15·
· · · · · · ·Tulla is fully funding the Copper Flat16·
· ·project, and Tulla has invested more than $55 million to17·
· ·date in the project for engineering, property18·
· ·acquisition, permitting and all the consultants that are19·
· ·needed to accomplish that.20·
· · · · · · ·Our plans are designed to meet or exceed21·
· ·health, safety and environmental regulatory22·
· ·requirements.23·
· · · · · · ·We are committed to developing a long-term24·
· ·relationship with our neighbors in Sierra County, and25·
43
· ·we're dedicated to providing the local community with·1·
· ·significant opportunities for employment and economic·2·
· ·development.·3·
· · · · · · ·We recognize the concerns and issues of·4·
· ·neighboring property owners and the community at large,·5·
· ·and we have included measures to address these concerns·6·
· ·in our plans.·7·
· · · · · · ·Copper Flat Mine property is accessed by State·8·
· ·Highway 152, about 20 miles southwest of Truth or·9·
· ·Consequences and four miles northeast of Hillsboro.10·
· · · · · · ·Mining at the property dates back to the late11·
· ·1800s.··There has been placer gold and copper mining at12·
· ·the property, and the history includes copper mining by13·
· ·Quintana Minerals from 1980 to 1983.14·
· · · · · · ·The land -- the property is -- the permit15·
· ·boundary at the property encompasses approximately 2,20016·
· ·acres.··This is a mix of private and public land,17·
· ·approximately 40 to 50 percent private ground.··The18·
· ·public land is administered by the BLM, and our19·
· ·unpatented mining claims cover the entirety of the20·
· ·public land.21·
· · · · · · ·Reserves at Copper Flat include 675 million22·
· ·pounds of copper, 20 million pounds of molybdenum,23·
· ·250,000 ounces of gold and 5 to 6 million ounces of24·
· ·silver.25·
44
· · · · · · ·The production method at Copper Flat will be·1·
· ·an open pit mine with a conventional flotation mill.·2·
· ·The operation is very typical of the industry and very·3·
· ·straightforward.·4·
· · · · · · ·The duration of the project will begin with·5·
· ·two years of construction, followed by 12 years of·6·
· ·production, which then in turn will be followed by 10 to·7·
· ·20 years of reclamation and closure.·8·
· · · · · · ·A feasibility study has been prepared on the·9·
· ·project by M3 Engineering with assistance from a wide10·
· ·range of technical experts.··That feasibility study11·
· ·resulted in a positive result and the decision to move12·
· ·forward with development of the mine.13·
· · · · · · ·Permitting is moving forward.··Our federal EIS14·
· ·and state permits are progressing.··We are using a15·
· ·common Mine Plan for all agencies, and that includes the16·
· ·Reclamation and Operation Plan.17·
· · · · · · ·This slide shows the location of the mine.18·
· ·This is the location within -- within a copper belt that19·
· ·extends from Arizona to New Mexico and down into Mexico.20·
· ·The Copper Flat Mine is located at the star just21·
· ·southwest of Truth or Consequences.··And Hillsboro is --22·
· ·will be in this location here.··Highway 152 runs from23·
· ·I-25 to Silver City.24·
· · · · · · ·The region is served by rail.··There's a rail25·
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· ·line that extends over to Arizona and then down into·1·
· ·Mexico.·2·
· · · · · · ·As you can see from this, there is a·3·
· ·significant number of copper mining and mineral deposits·4·
· ·in this belt.·5·
· · · · · · ·This slide shows our production profile that·6·
· ·is outlined in our operating plans.··It covers a 12-year·7·
· ·operating period and shows average head grade and copper·8·
· ·production into concentrate in the blue bars.··We will·9·
· ·be producing a concentrate at the operation and then10·
· ·shipping that away for smelting.11·
· · · · · · ·The first five years are planned to be higher12·
· ·grade.··This will achieve a payback of the financing13·
· ·soon in the operation and then allow production to14·
· ·continue without the -- the financing overhead.··First15·
· ·five years will produce approximately 35,000 tons of16·
· ·copper per year and then followed by approximately17·
· ·25,000 tons of copper.18·
· · · · · · ·The ore at Copper Flat lends itself to a very19·
· ·typical and common crushing and grinding practice that20·
· ·is used throughout the industry today.··We will be21·
· ·flotating -- employing flotation to produce a copper22·
· ·concentrate that contains the gold and silver, as well,23·
· ·and produce a separate molybdenum concentrate.24·
· · · · · · ·We are employing standard flotation reagents.25·
46
· ·There's no leaching on site or any other process.··And·1·
· ·after the concentrate is produced, it's shipped away for·2·
· ·smelting.·3·
· · · · · · ·The concentrate will have low impurities and·4·
· ·is expected to yield a clean 28 percent copper grade.·5·
· ·There's been metallurgical test work completed on the·6·
· ·ore body that has -- has guided us in development of our·7·
· ·concentrate quality.··We produce it in a lab.·8·
· · · · · · ·In addition, we have the records from the·9·
· ·Quintana operation that also describes the10·
· ·characteristics of the concentrate.11·
· · · · · · ·There will be several community benefits that12·
· ·develop from this -- developing the Copper Flat Mine.13·
· ·These benefits are described and were -- were developed14·
· ·by the Arrowhead Center in a report that was produced in15·
· ·2012.16·
· · · · · · ·In this report, the Arrowhead Center projects17·
· ·that there will be 1,156 jobs created during18·
· ·construction.··This includes direct, indirect and19·
· ·induced jobs.··And this number is through the State of20·
· ·New Mexico.21·
· · · · · · ·Construction of the project will add22·
· ·$55.6 million to the statewide labor income and will add23·
· ·nearly $80 million to the value of materials and goods24·
· ·that are produced within the state.25·
47
· · · · · · ·Construction expenditures will include·1·
· ·$45 million spent here in Sierra County and another·2·
· ·$49 million spent in the rest of the state.·3·
· · · · · · ·During the operation, there will be 270·4·
· ·full-time direct jobs at the mine.··Individual wages·5·
· ·will be very good, ranging from 35,000 to 60,000 annual,·6·
· ·plus benefits.··In addition to that, there will be a·7·
· ·large number of indirect and induced jobs here in Sierra·8·
· ·County, for a total of 360 to 400 jobs total.·9·
· · · · · · ·Federal and state taxes paid will -- are10·
· ·estimated to be 175 million, in ad valorem, severance,11·
· ·income and gross receipts taxes.12·
· · · · · · ·After mining, there will be 10 to 20 years of13·
· ·reclamation and closure, and there will be ongoing jobs,14·
· ·wages and tax benefits occurring during that period.15·
· · · · · · ·Our application for Discharge Permit started16·
· ·in 2010.··There was a Sampling and Analysis Plan and17·
· ·Baseline Data Report that was produced by INTERA and18·
· ·issued in 2012.19·
· · · · · · ·Our initial application for a Discharge Permit20·
· ·was submitted in 2011, which is prior to New Mexico21·
· ·adopting the Copper Rule.··As the application was being22·
· ·developed, there were discussions happening in Santa Fe23·
· ·on the Copper Rule, and we were developing our plans to24·
· ·meet the requirements that we felt would be coming25·
48
· ·through the Copper Rule.·1·
· · · · · · ·In 2017, we completed a revision to the·2·
· ·application and reorganized the application to·3·
· ·demonstrate compliance with the Copper Rule.·4·
· · · · · · ·Our application is supported by numerous·5·
· ·technical reports and supported by a Mining and·6·
· ·Reclamation Plan that has been submitted to all of the·7·
· ·agencies that are involved in permitting this mine.·8·
· · · · · · ·The application includes extensive water·9·
· ·management methodologies and controls for protecting --10·
· ·for protecting groundwater.11·
· · · · · · ·The application was deemed by NMED to be12·
· ·administratively complete in 2012 and then followed by13·
· ·deemed to be technically approvable on February 1, 2018,14·
· ·and draft DP-1840 was issued by the agency on15·
· ·February 2, 2018.16·
· · · · · · ·On this slide, I've listed example methods17·
· ·that we've employed in our plans to prevent water18·
· ·pollution as required by the Copper Rule.19·
· · · · · · ·The plan includes water management planning,20·
· ·engineering and design of facilities and structures with21·
· ·sufficient capacity to contain anticipated storm events.22·
· · · · · · ·The site grading and -- we have included site23·
· ·grading and construction of diversion structures to24·
· ·direct unaffected stormwater away from the mine25·
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· ·facilities and limit stormwater running onto the mine·1·
· ·facilities.·2·
· · · · · · ·Stormwater that falls directly onto the mine·3·
· ·facilities will be captured for use at the mine.·4·
· · · · · · ·The ore processing is by flotation only.·5·
· ·We're not employing ore leaching or solvent extraction·6·
· ·processes.·7·
· · · · · · ·We have developed and will implement and·8·
· ·follow a waste rock characterization and management·9·
· ·program.··As testimony continues today, there will be10·
· ·discussion of materials that have been identified as --11·
· ·as potential acid-generating.··That material is very12·
· ·small in nature.··We have identified -- we have a plan13·
· ·to identify that in the field as we mine it and will14·
· ·segregate it and store it properly in our facilities.15·
· · · · · · ·We will be constructing fully lined and16·
· ·contained process facilities, including the flotation17·
· ·plan, the tailing storage facility, the process water18·
· ·piping systems and process and affected water19·
· ·impoundments.20·
· · · · · · ·We will have a solution management process at21·
· ·the tailing storage facility throughout the operation22·
· ·and through the reclamation and closure phases,23·
· ·including facility draindown after processing ends,24·
· ·followed by placement of an engineered cover and25·
50
· ·revegetation of the tailings facility.·1·
· · · · · · ·Our plans include reclamation of legacy·2·
· ·disturbances that will be completed during construction·3·
· ·and operation.··Early in our development phase as we're·4·
· ·constructing the facility, we will address unreclaimed·5·
· ·mine waste stockpiles that exist from previous·6·
· ·operations at the property.··We will reshape them, grade·7·
· ·them, cover and revegetate.·8·
· · · · · · ·We will complete reclamation and closure of·9·
· ·the site according to our Reclamation Plan that has been10·
· ·submitted following the operation, and this also11·
· ·includes reshaping and revegetation of the disturbances12·
· ·that we create during the operation.13·
· · · · · · ·I'd like to introduce now the major mine units14·
· ·that we'll be talking about today.··And to accompany15·
· ·this, we have a figure that we'll go to that outlined16·
· ·these major mine units.17·
· · · · · · ·First on the list is the open pit.··The future18·
· ·open pit is located in this area.19·
· · · · · · ·Just for reference, this outline on this20·
· ·figure, this is the permit boundary that encompasses21·
· ·approximately 2,200 acres.··At the west end of the22·
· ·permit area is the open pit.··This is located primarily23·
· ·on private ground that is owned by New Mexico Copper.24·
· · · · · · ·The process facility is to the east of the25·
51
· ·open pit, in this area here.··This facility -- this·1·
· ·facility includes contained and lined facilities, will·2·
· ·be utilizing existing foundations in locations in this·3·
· ·area here, this disturbed area here.·4·
· · · · · · ·The tailings storage facility is located in·5·
· ·the southwest region of the permit area -- or --·6·
· ·sorry -- southeast area of the permit area.··This will·7·
· ·be a synthetically lined storage facility, located·8·
· ·adjacent to the process area.··The liner for this·9·
· ·facility is a high density polyethylene, or HDPE,10·
· ·synthetic liner, 80-mil thick, high quality, standard11·
· ·liner that is used for environmental containment around12·
· ·the world today.13·
· · · · · · ·The TSF includes solution underdrain and14·
· ·collection and process water recycling systems.··The15·
· ·water recovered from this facility will be reused for16·
· ·mineral recovery as part of a Water Conservation Plan.17·
· ·The TSF dam that's at the front of this impoundment will18·
· ·be designed, constructed and will comply with OSE Dam19·
· ·Safety requirements.20·
· · · · · · ·There are HDPE-lined impoundments and ponds21·
· ·located adjacent to the tailing storage facility, our22·
· ·waste rock stockpiles, the process area.··These ponds23·
· ·and impoundments are designed to include capacity for24·
· ·stormwater events.25·
52
· · · · · · ·The mine's waste rock stockpiles are located·1·
· ·adjacent to the open pit and the open pit surface·2·
· ·drainage area and northeast of the process area.··These·3·
· ·waste rock stockpiles are located on low permeability·4·
· ·andesite bedrock.·5·
· · · · · · ·Included in the facility are roads and·6·
· ·administrative areas.··The surfaces of these areas will·7·
· ·be graded and maintained for stormwater management.·8·
· ·This area -- or these areas include a wastewater package·9·
· ·treatment facility that will discharge greywater to the10·
· ·tailings facility.11·
· · · · · · ·I'll describe now elements of our Reclamation12·
· ·and Closure Plan.13·
· · · · · · ·The engineering for the Reclamation and14·
· ·Closure Plan is complete, and plans have been submitted15·
· ·to the -- along with the Mining Operation and16·
· ·Reclamation Plan, which also serves as the Closure Plan17·
· ·for the Discharge Permit.18·
· · · · · · ·The New Mexico Copper's Discharge Permit19·
· ·application including the Closure Plan was deemed20·
· ·technically complete by NMED on February 1, 2018.21·
· · · · · · ·The plan includes salvage of growth media22·
· ·ahead of construction and storage of the growth media23·
· ·for reuse at reclamation.24·
· · · · · · ·The plan includes three large growth media25·
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· ·stockpiles that will be located at strategic areas·1·
· ·around the property, the mine property.··These·2·
· ·stockpiles will be graded and revegetated and access·3·
· ·controlled to prevent erosion in the future and maintain·4·
· ·those stockpiles for the future.·5·
· · · · · · ·After mining is complete, the material will be·6·
· ·removed from those stockpiles and used for covering the·7·
· ·facilities and revegetation phase.·8·
· · · · · · ·Shortly after mining ends, the open pit will·9·
· ·be filled with freshwater to the equilibrium level of10·
· ·the hydraulic sink and partially revegetated to limit11·
· ·oxidation of the pit walls.··The mine rock stockpiles at12·
· ·the tailings facility will be covered with growth media13·
· ·and revegetated.14·
· · · · · · ·Water from the tailings facility will be15·
· ·removed through evaporation, and following that the16·
· ·surface will be regraded, covered and revegetated.17·
· · · · · · ·Buildings, pipelines and other surface18·
· ·structures will be removed.··The concrete foundations19·
· ·will be broken and removed or buried as appropriate.20·
· · · · · · ·All pond and trench liners will be removed,21·
· ·and the excavations will be backfilled and revegetated,22·
· ·except as needed for ongoing water management.23·
· · · · · · ·New Mexico Copper will post financial24·
· ·assurance for the reclamation and closure of Copper25·
54
· ·Flat, and the financial assurance will be held jointly·1·
· ·by NMED, MMD and the BLM.·2·
· · · · · · ·Our financial assurance proposal is based on·3·
· ·the estimated cost of reclamation -- the cost of·4·
· ·reclamation and closure as performed by third-party·5·
· ·contractors under agency management as required by·6·
· ·19.10.12 NMAC, which is administered by MMD.·7·
· · · · · · ·Our financial assurance proposal also includes·8·
· ·a Closure Water Management Plan as required by·9·
· ·20.6.7.33H NMAC, which is administered by NMED.10·
· · · · · · ·The estimated cost of reclamation and closure11·
· ·has been prepared by SRK Consulting using the Copper12·
· ·Flat Reclamation and Closure Plan that was prepared by13·
· ·Golder Associates as part of our permit applications.14·
· ·The costing for the proposal was prepared using15·
· ·estimating standards and practices that have been16·
· ·accepted by a wide range of regulatory agencies and17·
· ·jurisdictions.18·
· · · · · · ·The estimate relies on average productivities19·
· ·from the Caterpillar Handbook and other similar20·
· ·references and costing references, not best case.··In21·
· ·addition, the estimate -- the proposal includes and22·
· ·incorporates cost factors from agency guidelines, from23·
· ·the MMD agency guidelines.24·
· · · · · · ·The financial assurance estimate prepared by25·
55
· ·SRK and submitted for review totals $55.8 million.··This·1·
· ·total includes contractor performance of the work,·2·
· ·mobilization and demobilization, agency management and·3·
· ·contract administration, closure water management and·4·
· ·monitoring.·5·
· · · · · · ·The cost calculations require approval by·6·
· ·three agencies.··The Copper Flat estimate was submitted·7·
· ·for agency review on August 9th, 2018.·8·
· · · · · · ·Documentation of our cost estimate is provided·9·
· ·as an exhibit to our notice of intent.10·
· · · · · · ·We have several experts here to provide11·
· ·testimony on our plans and designs, and I would like at12·
· ·this time to introduce them.··The team here today was13·
· ·drawn from a larger group of experts which we have14·
· ·employed over a number of years since 2010 to develop15·
· ·the plans and designs for this project.16·
· · · · · · ·With us today is Steven Finch from John17·
· ·Shomaker & Associates.··Mr. Finch will be presenting18·
· ·testimony on groundwater hydrology at the Copper Flat19·
· ·area.20·
· · · · · · ·Dr. Ruth Griffiths of SRK Consulting has21·
· ·joined us from Cardiff, UK.··Dr. Griffiths will be22·
· ·discussing geochemistry at the Copper Flat Mine.23·
· · · · · · ·Following Dr. Griffith, we will have a24·
· ·discussion of the tailing storage facility design from25·
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· ·Dave Kidd, our design engineer from Golder Associates.·1·
· · · · · · ·Todd Stein, also at Golder Associates, was·2·
· ·focused on developing our reclamation plans, and·3·
· ·Mr. Stein will give an update on our reclamation plans·4·
· ·and designs.·5·
· · · · · · ·We have many other experts that have been·6·
· ·employed on this project, and they are reflected in the·7·
· ·record.·8·
· · · · · · ·That concludes my presentation.·9·
· · · ··Q.· ·I do have a couple of questions, Mr. Smith.10·
· · · · · · ·In your opinion, do the various plans and11·
· ·proposals included with New Mexico Copper Corporation's12·
· ·application materials that are in the administrative13·
· ·record fully meet or exceed the requirements of the14·
· ·Water Quality Act, the Copper Rule and associated15·
· ·groundwater program regulations administered by the New16·
· ·Mexico Environment Department?17·
· · · ··A.· ·Yes, they do.18·
· · · ··Q.· ·In your opinion, will the construction,19·
· ·operation, maintenance, reclamation and closure20·
· ·activities that occur at the Copper Flat Mine in21·
· ·accordance with the plans and procedures that are22·
· ·outlined in the materials -- will those operations,23·
· ·construction reclamation and closure meet or exceed the24·
· ·requirements of the Water Quality Act, the Copper Rule25·
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Kathy Townsend Court Reporters(505) 243-5018 Fax (505) 243-3606
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· ·and the associated groundwater program regulations·1·
· ·administered by the New Mexico Environment Department?·2·
· · · ··A.· ·Yes, they will.·3·
· · · ··Q.· ·And is it the case that Mr. Juan Velasquez·4·
· ·will be joining you and be available to -- for·5·
· ·questioning as part of the cross-examination relating to·6·
· ·the scope of your direct testimony?·7·
· · · ··A.· ·Yes.··He will.·8·
· · · ··Q.· ·And could you please just briefly introduce·9·
· ·Mr. Velasquez and explain his role in this.10·
· · · ··A.· ·Mr. Velasquez is principal of Velasquez11·
· ·Environmental Services.··Mr. Velasquez has been12·
· ·assisting us for a number of years in developing our13·
· ·permit applications and developed the application for14·
· ·the Discharge Permit for submittal to the Environmental15·
· ·Department.16·
· · · ··Q.· ·Thank you, Mr. Smith.17·
· · · · · · ·With that, Madam Hearing Officer, we'd like to18·
· ·make most -- make both Mr. Smith and Mr. Velasquez19·
· ·available for cross-examination, as discussed20·
· ·previously.21·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··All right.22·
· · · · · · ·If Mr. Velasquez would join Mr. Smith at the23·
· ·table, we'll have him sworn in.24·
· · · · · · ·(JUAN VELASQUEZ was administered the oath.)25·
58
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··Okay.··Thank you.·1·
· · · · · · · ·JEFFREY SMITH and JUAN VELASQUEZ·2·
· · · ··having been first duly sworn or affirmed, were·3·
· · · ··examined and testified as follows:·4·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··Mr. Knight, we'll start with you.·5·
· · · · · · ·Do you have questions of Mr. Smith or·6·
· ·Mr. Velasquez?·7·
· · · · · · ·MR. KNIGHT:··I do not.·8·
· · · · · · ·MS. ORTH:··Mr. de Saillan.·9·
· · · · · · ·MR. DE SAILLAN:··Thank you, Madam Hearing10·
· ·Officer.11·
· · · · · · · · · · · ·CROSS EXAMINATION12·
· ·BY MR. DE SAILLAN:13·
· · · · · · ·MR. DE SAILLAN:··Good morning.14·
· · · · · · ·My name is Charles de Saillan.··I'm with the15·
· ·New Mexico Environmental Law Center.16·
· · · · · · ·I'd like to start out with some questions17·
· ·about the benefits to the community that you discussed18·
· ·earlier, and I want to direct my questions to Mr