Post on 30-Mar-2018
MastersofScaleGritHappenswithCrisisTextLine'sNancyLublin
LUBLIN:IwenttoseeIbsen’s,ADoll'sHouse,atthetheater.10throwcentersittingto
myleft.DonaldTrump.SittingtohisleftsomeskinnyblondIdidn'trecognize.Andhe's
eatingMilkduds,likeshovingtheminhismouth.FistfulatatimeandIlookathimand
I'mlike,doyouneedtoownthecompanyorarethoseavailableinthelobby,andhe
saysallHaw-Hawgrabstheboxfromtheskinnywomanhimandhandsthemtome
becauseIdon'tthinkshe'sanythingbuttofuandwater.AndandsoIeattheMilkDuds
andwestrikeupaconversationandhesayssowhatdoyoudo.
REID: That’s Nancy Lublin. Andwhat does she do? She builds non-profits theway Donald
Trumpbuildsskyscrapers.Herorganizationsarehuge,tremendous,big-leaguestuff.Believe
me.
WhenNancyaccidentallysatnexttoTrumpinthattheater,shehadjustlaunchedherfirst
non-profit,DressforSuccess.Theorganizationstartedasaclothingdrivetohelpwomenon
welfaredressforjobinterviews.Shecollectedpantsuits,pearls,pumps.Younameit,Nancy
haditpilingupinhertinyapartment.ShefiguredTrumpmighthaveasparestorageroom
somewhereinhisrealestateempire.Soshestartedpitching.
LUBLIN:ItalkaboutDressforSuccessandhowamazingitis.Andhesays,“Ohreally?Do
youenjoyit?AndIwaslike,“Yesit'sprettyamazinghelpingwomenlikemovefrom
welfaretowork.”Andhesays,“Reallyit'snotboring?”AndI'mlike,“Noit'snotboring.”
SoIsaidtohim,“Sowhatdoyoudo?”Andhesays,“Nooneeveraskedmethat
before.”AndIsaid,“Well,whatdoyoudo?Howwouldyoudescribeit?”Andhesaid,“I
guessI'mabuilder.Ibuildthings.”AndIsaid,“Oh,doyoulikeit?”ImeanlikeIgaveit
rightbacktohim.
REID:They’reofftoarockystart.Nomatter.Nancykeepspushing.
LUBLIN:Icallafriendandsayyougottogivemethenameofhispersonalassistant.She
saysit'sNormaFoerdererorwhowasfamouslyhisassistantfordecades.Igoto
Blockbuster—againthisisalongtimeago—And[buy?]likeagiantboxofMilkDuds
andIgetinacabandIsay,takemetoTrumpTower
LUBLIN:NowI'monthe26floorandIlookaroundit'sallgoldandglassandmirrors.
ThroughthegoldandglassandmirrorsIseetheskinnyblondfromthenightbeforethe
theaterandIwavedmyarms.Shecomesover.She'slike,thewomanfromthetheater.
Whatareyoudoinghere?AndIsaidlookIwillgivehimaboxofMilkDudsaweekfor
therestofhislifeifyoucanjustfindmelike500squarefeetofspacebecause
everything'sinmyapartment.Shesayshe'sbroke.Andlookaround.I'mlikeIseetimes
areroughandIshakeherhandIsay,OKwellthankyousomuch.
REID:YouhavetolovethisaboutNancy:Shedoesn’tgiveupeasily.
LUBLIN:NowagainI'manentrepreneur.Iambittenbythatbug.Idon'tgiveupthere.
SoI'mdoinglikeFoxbreakfastTVthenextweekandIlookoverandthewomansitting
nexttomeandIrecognizeherandIsay“AreyouLizSmith,thegossipcolumnist?”She
says,“Iam.”IsayyouknowIhaveastoryyoumightbeainterestedinandItoldthe
story.AndthatSundayshewritesitupinTheNewYorkPostanditrunsinhercolumn
nationallyandshetellsitonTV.AndsoMondaymorningItakethatNewYorkPostandI
gotoTrumpTowerandIsaytosecuritypleasetellNormaFoerdererthatNancyLublinis
downstairs.AndIgoupandNormaFoerderersaysit’sgoodtoseeyou.Wesawithe
saw.Hethinksit'sveryfunnybutwehavenothingforyou.Sotheendingofthestoryis
I'vegotthemostbeautifulrejectionletterI'veeverseeninmyentirefreakinlife.Like
onTrumpTowergoldembossedletterhead.AsI'vesaidbeforetoyouIcouldscrapeoff
thatlogoandmakefillingsforeveryoneIknow.Imeanthatthelogoislikeaquarterof
aninchoffthepage.Beautiful,tellingmethathehadnomoneyandsorry.Andsorry,
bestofluck.IwasworkingonsomethingthatP.S.isnowin120citiesaroundtheworld
solikeitwouldhavebeenasafebettogivemefivehundredbucks.Instead,I'vegota
storythatItelleverywhere.
REID:Thestoryisn’tsimplythatyoucan’ttake“no”forananswer.Anyonecandothat.And
frankly,ifyougettoopushy,you’remorelikelytogetarestrainingorderthananinvestor.
TherealstoryisaboutthepowerofpersistenceANDagoodPlanB.Orrather,PlansB.Just
considerNancy’smulti-channeledcharmoffensive.Shedeploysjokes,multipleboxesofMilk
Duds,letters,surprisevisitsandaNewYorkgossipcolumnist.Thisiswhatwecallgrit.And
GRITiseveryentrepreneur’strumpcard.
[ThemeMusic]
REID:I’mReidHoffman,co-founderofLinkedIn,invstoratGreylockandyourhost.Ibelieve
successfulentrepreneursneedideas,money,goodtimingandaheftydoseofluck.Butnone
ofthosematterifyoudon’thaveGRIT.
Somepeoplemistakegritforsheerpersistence.Chargingupthesamehill,againandagain.
Butthat’snotquitewhatImeanbytheword“grit.”Thesortofgrityouneedtoscalea
businessislessreliantonbruteforce.It’sactuallyonepartdetermination,onepartingenuity,
andonepartlaziness.Yes,laziness.
YANG:I'mverylazy.IthinkmybiggestfaultgrowingupwasthatIwasneververy
complete.Iwasneververythorough.
REID:That’sJerryYang,co-founderofYahoo!Andafiercelydeterminedentrepreneur.Andit
turnsoutwehadlazinessincommon.Here’swhatItoldhim.
REID:ItendIthinkpersonallythatlazinessisoneofthefoundationsofintelligence
becauseiflookingforthoseshortcutssoIactuallythinkthatit'sactuallyinfacta
positiveattributeinthiscase.
YANG:WellThat'sniceofyoutosaybutReidbutwhenIwasyoungIwas,mynickname
inmyfamilywasMr.Lazy.Myuncles,mymomeverybodycalledmeMr.Lazy,Iwasso
lazy.Imust’vebeenveryintelligent.
REID:Wellthisissomethingwediscoveredthatweshare.BecausewhenmydadandI
wereonhissabbaticalinKenya,thedrivercalledmeLazyBones.Sowehaveyouknow
wehaveacertainparallelhistory.
YANG:IknewIlikedyouforareason.
REID:Lazybonesoftheworld,unite.Inanycase,Ithinkthisconversationgetsuscloserto
thetruenatureofentrepreneurialgrit.Youshouldbebullheadedinyourpursuitofabig
idea,butalwaysonthelookoutforshortcuts.
Youwanttoconserveyourenergy.Youwanttominimizefrictionandfindthemosteffective,
mostefficientwayforward.Youmightactuallyhavemoregritifyoutreatyourenergyasa
preciouscommodity.Soforgetthetiredclicheofrunningamarathon.Youwanttobemore
likeIndianaJones,somersaultingunderblades,racingafewstepsaheadofarollingboulder
andswingingyourwhipuntilyoureachyourholygrail.
Ifyouaskme,NancyLublinistheentrepreneurialequivalentofIndianaJones.Andwe’ll
comebacktoherstoryinaminute.Butfirst,awordfromoursponsor,ZipRecruiter.
[note:teamstilldecidingbetweentheseapproaches]
Ifyouaskme,NancyLublinistheentrepreneurialequivalentofIndianaJones.Iwantedto
talktoherforthisepisodebecausesheisa10outof10whenitcomestogrit.Andshealso
doesherworkinthenot-for-profitsector,whichhasevenmorelandminesthanthe
commercialworld.Capitalishardertocomeby,talentishardertorecruit,andouroverall
society—atleasthereintheU.S.—broadlyrewardscommercialpeoplemorethanthey
rewardnon-profitpeople.
We’llcomebacktoNancy’sstoryinaminute.Butfirst,awordfromoursponsor,
ZipRecruiter.
REID:Sobeforewegettoourguests—theentrepreneurswhoputthe“grr”inthewordgrit
—I’dliketoopen,abituncharacteristically,withaquotefromtheBible.
“Theraceisnottotheswift,northebattletothestrong,orbreadtothewise,orriches
tothediscerning,orfavortotheskillful;buttimeandchancehappentothemall.”
Timeandchancehappentousall—exceptNancyLublin.Timeandchancedon’thappento
Nancy.Grithappens.Andoncethisqualitykicksin,she’sunstoppable.
Nancyhasscaledthreehugelysuccessfulnot-for-profitorganizationsthatchampionthe
world’smostneedy.
REID:I’vebetonNancybefore—andsohavealotofinvestors.Why?Partlybecauseshehas
thesamebiasforactionthatI’veseeninallgreatscaleentrepreneurs.Getherthinkingabout
somesocialproblem,andshegetsrestless.Shecan’ttolerateit.Take,forinstance,hernot-
for-profit,DressforSuccess.You’llrecall,shewantedtohelpwomenonwelfareenterthe
workforceinstyle.Entertainingly,Nancynevercaredmuchforfashion.Ifanything,shefinds
itludicrous.
LUBLIN:Myfathergrowingupwasalawyerandheusedtotellmethatwhenhewas
hiringsecretarieshe'dlookoutthewindowandwatchthemgofromthecartothe
buildingandthenhe'dknowbeforetheyreachedthebuildingwhetherornothe'dhire
them.SoIthoughtwastheworstthingIhadeverheard.Iwaslikethat'syoujust
describeddiscriminationtome.That'shorrible.Andhesaidandit'sthetruthsogo
combyourhair.AndsoImeanIjustknewthattheworldworksthiswaywe
discriminatebasedonafirstlookoneverybody.Andsothat'swhereDressforSuccess
camefrom.
REID:SoNancyhasjustidentifiedahugeproblem.Employersjudgejobapplicants—
especiallywomen—basedontheirphysicalappearance.Shemighthavevaliantlystruggled
forfairerhiringpractices.Butthat’sastruggleforactivists—thesortofpeoplewhocan
tolerateanincrementalbattlewithhistoryandhumannature.
ButNancywantsasolutionnow.Shecan’tchangethewaybossesthinkovernight.Butshe
canleveltheplayingfieldbygivingwomenaccesstoprofessionalclothing.Shehasanidea.
Shehas$5000inseedmoneyfromhergrandfather’sestate.Andshe’sabouttogetherfirst
unlikelycollaborators.
LUBLIN:AndsoIwasinlawschoolIwenttomylawprofessorandsaidheyIhavethis
ideawhatdoyouthink.AndhesentmetoSisterMaryNurniinSpanishHarlem.And
thenshebroughtintwoothers.WhenIwenttomeetthemforthefirsttimeIfully
expectedthemtomeetmeinlikeinhabitwithlockedarmssingingliketheSoundof
Music...andinsteadthey'rereallycool.They'relikekindoflikesocialworkers.They’re
reallycoolwomen.ThedrawbackwasItookfinancialadvicefromthem.Theytoldmeto
putthe$5000intoasixmonthCDinthebank,whichmeantwestartwithnomoney.So
likedon'ttakefinancialadvicefrompeoplewhotakeanoathofpovertyislikethe
lessonthere.13:53
00:14:53WheneverIhavedoneastartup,thefirstthingIactuallydoiscallmyfamily
andfriends.Becauseyouthink“Theyloveme,andIlovethem.”Thatdoesn'tmean
they'regoingtoloveyouridea.
AndthethingaboutthenunsisIreallyhadnorelationtothembefore.Buttheyknew
fucktonsaboutmovingpeoplefromwelfaretowork.Theyknewexactlywhatwasgoing
oninNewYorkCityandhowtomakethishappenandhowtogetitstarted.Theywere
theywereactuallytheexactrightpeopletostartthiswith.
REID:SohowdidNancyandthreenunsmanagetoscalethisideaworldwide?Theydidn’t
havemuchmoney.Theydidn’thaveconnectionstowealthyphilanthropists.Andthey
certainlydidn’thavestaff.Theironlyassetwastheirknowledgeofthewelfaresystem.That
systemincludedavastnetworkofgovernmentandprivateagenciesdedicatedtohelping
women.Nancysimplybuiltanorganizationthatcouldtapintothistalentnetworkforfree.
LUBLIN:Thechallengeoriginallywaswehavethesepeoplewhoaremovingfrom
welfaretowork.Howdoyougetthemintothesystemwithoutpassingajudgmenton
individuals.Andthenhowdowesolveourlaborproblemintheshop?Sowecombined
that.Andwhatwedidwaswescreenedagencies.Wewouldapprovedomesticviolence
shelters.Wewouldapprovejobtrainingprograms.Wewouldapprovehomeless
shelters.Andthentheycouldsendwhoevertheywantedtotheshop.Asabarterwe
requiredthemtosendsomeonetostafftheshoponedayamonth.Sowegotfreelabor
andhighqualityreferralsanddidn'teverhavetopassanyjudgmentontheindividualso
everybodywhocametouswasworthdressingbecauseoneofouremployees
essentiallyhadreferredthem....Andbythewaythismodelofstaffingtheshopand
referringstaystodayinover100locationsaroundtheworld.
REID:NoticewhatNancydidnotdo—shedidnottrytobuildanentiresystemfromscratch
byherself,whichisatrapmanyentrepreneursfallinto.Shelookedaroundherforother
sourcesofenergy.Likeatinyjiujitsuartist,sheredirectstheenergyofstronger,heavier
fighters.Andthisway,shechannelsthecollectivestrengthoftheexistingwelfaresystem
towardrealizingthisideawithher.Thisisaclassicscalingtechniquethatnonprofitstypically
don’tmaster.Nancy’sorganizationsaretherareexception.
Youcanthinkofthistechniqueasamagnificentshortcut.Andit’sthekindofshortcutNancy
findsagainandagain.Shedartsahead.Shefindsquick,systemicfixestobiggnarlyproblems.
It’sapatternthroughoutherstoryofgrit.
SoNancyhassomuchgritthatnotonlywouldshecountasa10outof10gritpersoninthe
commercialworld,butshegoesanddoesitinthenonprofitworldwhichhasevenmore
landminesBecausecapitalismuchhardertocomeby,youdon'tgettoaself-sustaining
business,alotoftalentwantstogoworkwherethey'repaidalotmore.Andwhat'smoreour
overallsocietyatleasthereintheU.S.butprobablybroadlyrewardscommercialpeople
morethantheyrewardnonprofitpeople.
Withherfirstnon-profitstartup,Nancycutsthroughalloftheseconstraints.That’swhygritis
theessentialsuperpowerforentrepreneurs.Itbeatsbrains,brawnorboatloadsofcash.It’s
anunstoppablequalitythathelpsfoundersovercomeimpossibleoddsinthepublicorprivate
sector.AndthesamequalitythathelpedNancynavigatethewelfaresystem,workedjustas
wellassheworkedherwaythroughNewYork’suppercrustofdonors.
LUBLIN:SointheearlydaysofDressforSuccesswewoulddotheseclothingdrives.So
womenwouldgiveusclothessowewoulddoaclothingdriveatlikeGoldmanSachs
whentheygocorporatecasual.Andsowegetbeautifulbeautifulsuitsandlikethe
largestsuitwouldbeasize8andtheaveragesizeAmericanisactually14andthe
averagesizeDressforSuccessclientwasa22.Butwealwaysdidthosesuitdrives
anywaybecauseonceyougaveusyourArmanisuitsyougaveusmoney.Sowewould
takethosesuitsandwemightwarehousethemfortwoyearsbutwewerehappytoget
thosesuitsfromthosewomenatGoldmanbecausethentheywouldwriteuschecks
becausetheyfeltclosenesstousbecausewehadthatsuitthattheylikeinterviewed
somebodyinorthattheyyouknowlikewentonCNBCthefirsttimetheywerewearing
thatArmanisuit.Nowwehaditandsoitwasactuallykindofadonormechanism.Itwas
partofthewholecycleofDressforSuccess,ofkindofwealthybusinesswomen
connectingwithwomenwhoaregoingtogooutandlandtheirfirstjobs.Thatwasthe
trickofthetrade.
REID:Noticehowshekeepsturningproblems--inthiscase,pilesofuselessclothing--into
solutions:asourceoffunding.It’swhyIcallthebestentrepreneurs“infinitelearners”.The
morethornypatchestheyhit,themoreeffectivetheybecomeathackingtheirwayout.The
onlyproblemisthatsomeCEOs—likeNancy—getabitaddictedtoproblem-solving.If
there’snoproblemtosolve,well,theycreatesome.
LUBLIN:I'mawartimeCEO.Oncethingsgetgoodandit'speacetimeIgetboredandI
eitherwanttolikedosomethingelsewildtoitorI'llfuckitupbecauseI'mlikenobut
wecandoblahblahblah.AndandsoIgetboredandImoveon.
REID:Thisisoneofthebyproductsofgrit.It’sasortofrestlessenergythateventually
compelledNancytoleaveDressforSuccess,onceithadscaled.
LUBLIN:HavewetalkedaboutScooby-Doosyndrome?HaveItalkaboutthiswithyou?.
HOFFMAN:No.
LUBLIN:OKsoyou’veseenScooby-Doo?
HOFFMAN:Mm-hmm.
LUBLIN:EveryScoobyDooepisodeisthesame.Thereisachurchoramovietheaterit's
goingtobetorndowntobecomeastripmallOK.Andthere'slikeazombieoraghost
that’shauntingit.Andsoamysteryteamgetscalledtofindthezombieorghostand
ShaggyandScoobyaresomehowtheonesthatalwaysfindthezombieorgoeven
thoughVelmaknewitthewholetimewhichistotallyweirdbutwhatever.Andthey
unmaskthezombiebecauseit'snotazombieorghost.It'slikethegranddaughterofthe
founderofthemovietheaterorlikethepastthejanitorofthechurch.It'sthefucking
founder,thefounderisthezombieorghosthauntingthebuildingitdoesn'twantto
leave.IhadnodesiretobeaScoobyDoovillain.Right.SoIleavethingsIbuildthings
andthenImoveon.I'mnotparticularlysentimental
REID:AndclearlyyouwatchalotofScoobyDoo.
LUBLIN:ImeancomeonI'man80skid.Weallwatchedalotofthat.
REID:SoNancyfoundanewproblem,anearlybankruptorganizationcalledDoSomething
dotorg.DoSomethingmobilizesyoungpeopletovolunteerforworthycauses.Backin2003,
itwasnearlydefunct.
00:30:43
REID:AndsowhatwasthestateofDoSomethingwhenyouarrived?
LUBLIN:Bad.Itwasonfire.AndrewShuestarteditwhenhewasonMelrosePlacebut
thenhewentoffairandhadthreekidsinNewJersey,andDoSomethingfellonreally
hardtimes.WhenIgottheretheyhadjustlaidoff21outof22people.Theyhadlost
theirofficespace,andeverythingwasinboxesinstorageinQueens.Theywere$250K
indebtandhadabout$74000inthebankitwastotallytotallyfucked.
REID:Nancywassmitten.
LUBLIN:Ithoughtthenamewasgreat.DoSomethingwasgreat.Therewasno
organizationthatwascoolandfunforyoungpeopleanditwasthereneededtobe
somethingthatmadevolunteerismandsocialchangefunandenergeticandsotomeit
waslikeaficusplantyouknowliketheleavesfalloffallthetime.Butlikeiftherootsare
goodyoucanprobablybringthemback.AndIthoughtthisisinteresting.I'vealsojust
turned30andIwasgettingheadhuntedforanumberofveryseriousroles.ButwhatI
realizedwasthattheheadhunterwasonlybringinginmetomaketheheadhunterlook
good,likehere'sonecrazyoutsidetheboxcandidate.Lookwe'rebringingyoua30year
oldentrepreneur.NoonewastakingmeseriouslyandIwantedtotakesomethingthat
wastotallyscrewedandprovethatactuallyyeahI'manentrepreneurandI'malsoreally
smart.Ithinksometimesentrepreneursarewrittenoffaswackyvisionaries.Youknow
wewecanbemorethanthat.Wearesystemsthinkers.
REID:Beforelong,Nancygotthatficusplantflourishing.Thebreakthroughmoment?When
herteamidentifiedacrucialshiftintechnologythatmadeallthedifferenceinreachingtheir
adolescentaudience.Ifyouknowateenager,youprobablyalreadyknow:Togettheir
attention:?Textthem.
33:20
LUBLIN:Ithinkprobablythebiggestepiphanywasthepivottotext.Andthebestthing
thatIdidwasgetoutoftheway.SoIwasonaconferencecallandIsawthroughthe
glassdoorpeopleinmyofficehigh-fivingeachother.andIwaslike,“Whatisgoingon?
Whyareyouallsohappy?”Anditturnsoutthattwolikeentrylevelemployeeshad
polled500defunctusers—likepeoplewehadn'theardfrominsixmonthsprobablye-
mailthem20timesandpulledtheirmobilenumbersandtextthemaboutacampaign
wehaddone.AndinnineminutesIsawa20percentresponserate.Holycrap.AndI
wasIwassmartenoughtosay“Let'sdothat.”AndalsoIguessIwassmartenoughto
createanenvironmentwhereentry-levelemployeesfeltcomfortableexperimenting.
Andlikethat'swhatyou'vegottodoasanentrepreneurialCEOisgetoutoftheway
sometimes.Andthenwhenyouseesomeonedosomethingreallysmart:Grabitand
elevateit,andbelike,“Let'sdothat.”Andsowepivotedandwebecameamembership
organizationandwedideverythingaroundtext,andgrewrapidlythankstothat.
REID:Nancy’sabilitytotapEVERYresourcearoundher—includingherentry-levelemployees
—isoneofherhiddenstrengthsasascaleleader.UnderNancy’sguidance,DoSomething
addsnearly5millionteenagersasmembers.Andthenshedoessomethingtrulydaring.She
hatchedanideaforathirdnot-for-profitcalledCrisisTextLine.Andshegoesaheadand
launchesit,atthesametime.
LUBLIN:Idon'trecommendhavingtwofulltimejobs.
REID:NoticehowNancydoesn’trelishholdingdowntwoimpossiblydemandingjobsatonce.
Butyouhavetounderstandhermotivation.Whensheseesaproblem,shewantstosolveit
fast.Thebiggertheproblem,thegnarlierthesolution,themoreshewantstosolveit.
REID:HerirrepressibleurgetolaunchCrisisTextLinebeganwithasingletextfromasingleteenager.Yousee,DoSomethingsentallitscommunicationsbytextmessage.Andtheirvolunteerswouldrespondbytextaswell.Eachcampaignwouldunleashawaveofgoodwillandcheer,forthemostpart.Buttherewerealwaysafewteenswhorepliedtothesetexts,askingforhelp.
ButtherewouldbeacoupleofdozenmessagesoutofflowsayingthingslikeI'mbeing
bullied.Mybestfriendsareaddictedtocrystalmeth.Andwewouldtriagethem
REID:Oneday,Nancyreadatextmessagethatshecouldn’tstopturningoverinherhead.It
wasinresponsetoaDoSomethingcampaign.
LUBLIN:Andthenwegotamessagethatputmeonthisotherpath,thatliterallysaidhe
won'tstoprapingme.It'smydad.Hetoldmenottotellanyone.AndthenthelettersR
Uthere.Canyouimagine?You'retheCEO.Someonebringsthatandputsitonyourdesk
andsaysIdon'tknowwhattodowiththis.It'slikebeingpunchedinthestomach.So
horrific.Icouldn’tbelieveitwashappeningtoarealhumanandthen…Howbaddoesit
havetobetosharethat,liketobesoalonethatyousharethatwithanorganizationlike
this,andyoudon'tknowwhereit'sgoing.AndsowebuiltCrisisTextlinereallyforher.
REID:Herewecometothewellspringofgrit.Youhavetohaveamission—acallingthat’sso
powerful,itmakesyouwanttorunthroughaminefield,onafoggyday,withyourshoelaces
tiedtogether.
NancyenvisionedCrisisTextLineasahotlinethatwouldfunneltextmessagesfrom
distressedteenstocrisiscentersaroundthecountry.Itwouldopenupawholenewlineof
communicationforteenagerswhopreferredtheconvenienceandanonymityofwritingfrom
theirphones.NancyfiguredshecouldearmarksomeportionofDoSomething’sbudgetfor
thecause.Theywereaveraging$6millionayearincorporatesponsorships.Therewasjust
oneproblem.Aserviceforsuicidalteenswasnotanaturalfitforcorporatesponsors.
LUBLIN:IwenttotheboardandsaidIwanttodothisandyouguysIthinkrightlysaid,
brandconfusionwithDoSomething.DoSomethingishopehopefulhopefulhappy
volunteerism.CrisisTextLineisadifferentthing.Likewe’llgiveitourblessing.But
you’vegottodoitontheside.AndsoIdiditatthesametimeforalongtime.Itwas
harderthanIthoughtitwasgoingtobe.Anditwasmaybeharderthanitshouldhave
been.Thetruthisittookmetwoyearstosecurethefundingtodoit.Iwoulddialfor
dollars.AndIfoundoneafriendthatwaslikeyou'llcomeintomyofficeeveryweekfor
anhourandgothroughmyRolodex,andonthethirdweekIspoketosomeoneandin
fiveminutesIdescribeditfiveandsaidstopstopstop.I'mgoingtogiveyou$50,000
becausesomeoneneedstogiveyoumoneytoseeifthiswillgoanywhere.AndImay
neverseeyouagainbutit'sworthputtingthismoneydown.AndIwanttobe
anonymoussoIrefertohimforalongtimeasMr.X.He'snowfinebeingknown.It's
actually,it’sPeterBlum,whoistheboardchairofDonorsChoose,whohasdonethis.
He'smadebetsonpeoplelikethat,notexpectinganyreturntheseearlybetsonsocial
changeideas.That'sawesome.Andwiththatmoneyitbecamereal.Ihadtoreallydoit.
IhiredourCTOandourChiefDatascientist,eventhoughIonlyhad$50Ksothatwasn’t
goingtokeepthemverylong.Andsothenitmeant,shitIreallyhadtofindtherestof
themoneyandmakethishappen.
REID:SoNancy,onceagain,wasscalingonashoestringbudget.ShefiguredCrisisTextLine
couldpiggybackonapatchworkofcrisishotlinesacrossthecountry.Shewouldsupplythe
textmessages,thecounsellorswouldsupply24-hoursupport.Itwasshapinguptobe
anotheroneofhercleverjiu-jitsumoves,shewaschannelingtheirenergytothewrong
teens.Crisiscounsellorstendtospecializeinspecificissues,likesuicideorsexualabuseor
eatingdisorders.Andthisledsomecounsellorstowritesomeratherawkwardscripted
responses.
LUBLIN:Weoriginallybuiltthisthinkingwewouldjustbethepipeswewouldbethe
technologyandwewouldfarmthisouttoothercrisiscenterstodothecounseling.And
wekeptgrowinglikefastfastfastandwewentfrom3to11inlikesixmonthscrisis
centerswhatwenoticedwasthattheywereincrediblydiverse.Likeonecrisiscenter
wouldaskeverysingletext[er]areyoufeelingsuicidaltoday?No.Ihaveacalculusfinal
thisafternoon.ShouldIbefeelingsuicidal?Likethequalitywasallovertheplacewasn't
great.Soweculledbestpracticesfromtheplatformandsaidwellwhatifwetrainedour
ownpeoplebasedonwhatwe'reseeing.Andsowetrainedthismagic12cohortand
quicklysawthattheyoutperformedoneveryKPIandpivoted.Sowedumpedallofthe
crisiscenterswhowewerepaying.Sowesavedthatmoney.Movedinsteadtoa
volunteermodelandbasicallybecameamarketplace.
REID:Nancyhasmadeahugelyriskydecision,here.She’sscramblingforfunding.She’sjust
jettisonedherpartnershipswiththeexperiencedcounsellorswhoweresupposedtohelpher
scale.Andifshehasanychanceofkeepingherideaafloat,shehastonowtrainanarmyof
novicesintheartoftextingwithdistressedteens.
[midrollad]
Fortunately,Nancyhasagiftforrecruitingandcelebratingvolunteers.Infact,thegreatest
shortcutNancyhaseverfound—theonesheturnstoagainandagain—isthealmost
bottomlesswellofhumanindustriousness.WhatNancyunderstandssowellisthatpeople
lovetohelp.Sometimesallyouneedtodoisaskthem.
Nancyissoconfidentvolunteerswillanswerhercall,thatsheenvisionsamarketplacefor
crisishotlinevolunteers—muchinthewayUberbuiltamarketplacefordriversorAirbnb
builtamarketplaceforhomerentals.Buthowonearthdoesshematchsupplyanddemand?
Shecan’toffersurgepricingtovolunteersduringaspikeinteenageneed.Shecan’tofferany
pricingatall.Whatsheneedsisasurgeofgoodwill.
It’saboldvision.Andthereareahandfulofotherscaleleaderswhowilltellyouthatthis
works.
GREGBALDWIN:Ithinkasarulewetendtounderestimatepeople'shungeranddesire
tobehelpful.
REID:That’sGregBaldwin,PresidentofVolunteerMatch.Theirwebsitematchesmillionsofvolunteerswithmorethan100,000organizationsthatneedtheirhelp.Themostscalablenon-profits,hesays,startwithapleaforhelpthat’sambitious—vergingonunreasonable.
BALDWIN:WhenyouknowwhenHabitatforHumanitygotstartedhowunreasonableis
ittothinkthatyoucaninvitemillionsofpeopletohelpbuildhomesforotherpeople.
It'sacrazyidea.Whenyouthinkaboutitbutittooksomebodytoasktoseehow
powerfulthataskistobringpeopleintodoingsomethingthattheythinkisimportant.
CrisisTextLineisanotheramazingexampleofthat.It'ssounreasonabletothinkthat
peoplewouldwillinglytaketimeoutoftheirbusylivestobeontheircellphonetexting
withkidsincrisis.Itjustitalmostdoesn'tmakesensewhysomeonewoulddothat.And
certainlyyoucanimaginebeingreluctanttoasksomebodytodothat.Butwhatwefind
sooftenisit'sinthosebigboldasks,thoseunreasonableasks,thatsomeofthemost
amazingthingshappen.
REID:Forthisepisode,wedidaflashpolloftheVolunteerMatchcommunity—themanagersatnon-profitswhoareonthefrontlinesofthesecrazyrequests.Wewantedtoknowjusthowhardthey’llpushtheirvolunteers.Andhowfarwastoofar?Soweasked,“Haveyoueverheardavolunteersay,‘You’reaskingtoomuchofme?’Morethan400volunteermanagersresponded.Andstatistically,speaking,itwasaresounding“No.”
BALDWIN:Only11percentofVolunteermanagershaveeverheardthat,whichis
fascinating.
REID:AndthenweaskedwhethertheythoughttheycouldaskMOREoftheirvolunteers.
BALDWIN:And70percentoftheuserssaidyes.Sotherealquestionis:What'skeeping
peoplefrommakingtheserequeststhatareyouknowsomewhatoutsidethenorm?
REID:It’sagoodquestion.AndJohnLilly,theformerCEOofMozilla,hasatheory.Mozillais
anopen-sourcewebbrowserpoweredalmostentirelybyvolunteers.Theydoeverything
fromcodingtomarketingtotranslation—andJohnactuallybelievesthesevolunteers,
workingforfree,canruncirclesaroundpaidprofessionals.Youjusthavetoknowhowto
workonaslidingscale.
LILLY:Sotherearewaysforpeopletocontributeanhouraweek,to40hoursaweek,
or80hoursaweek.Anditkindofscalesupanddown,whichmostorganizationsdon't
knowhowtodo.Theyknowhowtohaveyoubeanemployeeornot,sosortof
binary.Opensource,thesuccessfulones,figureoutawaytobeonaspectrum.
Volunteersisnotahomogenouscategory.It’sallsortsofdifferenttypes.
There'saguyIrememberfromUlanBator,whotranslatedforFirefoxintoMongolian.
Andforhimhediditbecauseifhehadn'tdonethathisparentswouldn't,whoonly
spokeMongolian,wouldn'thavebeenabletounderstandsoftwaretoaccessthe
Internet.Andsoforthesepeopletheydoitasalaboroflove.Andyouknowyou'll
knowthissinceyoulearnedLatin,butliketherootofthewordamateursisomma
whichmeansIlove.AndIthinkthatamateursandvolunteersinmanywaysaremore
powerfulthanprofessionalsbecausetheydoitfornon-monetary.Theydoitdespite
allthechallengesandallthehardparts.
REID:AndNancyisanexpertatwhippingupthatinneromma,thatinnerlove.Shestarts
fromthepremisethatshe’snotuniqueincaring.Plentyofotherpeoplecouldcareasmuch
asher.Shejusthastofindthem.Andsellthemonhercause.
Andifyouwanttoknowwhattruegritsoundslike,justlistentohermultifacetedapproach
torecruitment.Shesoundsabitlikeagoldprospectorwhoknowsexactlywheretopanalong
theriver.
LUBLIN:Sorecruitmentsure.Zeroinginonlikewhoareourbestcrisiscounselorsand
figuringthatoutwaskeyandnowfindingmoreofthem.Turnsoutthatitshifts.LIke
post-election,sadliberalsaregreat.We'relovingsadliberals.Peoplereallywanttofeel
likethey'rethey'rehavinganimpactonsomethingandwhat'sbetterthantalkingto
anotherstrangerinthemostdiremomentsoftheirlife.It'sarealimpact.Momsofa
certainage,lovethem.Deafandhardofhearing.Phenomenal.Mostorganizationsdon't
knowwhattodowiththem.Hardtovolunteerifyou'redeafandhardofhearing.We
loveyou.Veterans.Iloveveterans,especiallywhentheheatisonandwe'respiking.The
veteransarelike“Wegotthis.Wecandoit.Let'sgo.”
ThisswellofofvolunteersallowedCrisisTextLinetoscalequicklyandmeetthegrowing—
andspiking—demand..
LUBLIN:We'vedonezeromarketing.WehaveexchangeWe'vedoneover700,000
conversationssincelaunching.Thatworksouttobecloseto30millionmessages
exchanged.
REID:Butthose30millionmessagesdidn’tarriveinasteadystream.Theywouldspikeand
dip,regardlessofhowmanycounsellorswereavailableatthetime.Soshestartedtriaging
themessagesthroughacombinationofgruntworkandbigdata.
Theyhadtoidentifythekeywordsandphrasesthatteenagersuseintimesofdistress,and
thenrankthosewordsonascalefromworryingtolet’scall911,immediately.Theystarted
withtheobviouslydistressingwords.
LUBLIN:Soweoriginallyputintothealgorithmwordslike“die,”“suicide”or
“overdose.”Ifyoutextinthosewordsyou'renumberoneinthequeue.Andthenwe
addedamachinelearninglayerandsaidwellwhatreallyendsupinahighriskcase.
Whatarethewordspeopleuse?Anditturnsoutthattherearethousandsofthemthat
aremorehighriskthanthansuicide.Apparentlyit's16timesmorepowerfulnotsix
timesmorepowerful16timesmorelikelytoendupcalling911thanthewordsuicide
whichIknowI'vealreadyreadthisyouknowbutwhateverlistenerscanguessandit's
it'sactuallyit'sibuprofen,aspirin,tylenol,advilit'sthemostcommondruginyour
house.Soyounotonlyhavetheideaandtheplanbutyou'vethemeansandthetiming
becauseit'srightinyourmedicinecabinet.Sothosewordsandtheunhappyfacecrying
emojiisfourtimesmorepowerfulfourtimesmorelikelyforustoendupcalling911
thanthewordsuicide.ThehashtagKMS.Anyideawhatthatstandsfor?Neitherdidwe.
Thealgorithmsdiscoveredthat’skillmyself.Thisisaperfectexampleofscienceofdata,
oftechnologymakinganorganizationfasterandmoreaccurate.
REID:Beforelongherteamwasequippedtohandlehugeinfluxesofmessages.Soonshewas
detectingwavesofanxietyrollingacrossmiddleschoolsnationwide.Thedatawas
unprecedentedinitsscopeandtimeliness.
LUBLIN:Ohgosh.Sothehardthingaboutmarketplaces.Soyoudon'tcontrolsupplyand
youdon'tcontroldemand.Everyonceinawhilethere’llbeanunpredictableevent.Now
ifIranLyftIcanputsurgepricinginplaceandsoyoucanhandlethat.Sounpredictable
eventsforCrisisTextLinearethingslikeZaynleavingOneDirection.Andwehadjust
tonsofpeopletextinginwithseriousanxiety.
REID:Forthoselistenerswhohaven’theardofZaynorOneDirection,I’lltranslateintoold
fogieterms—ZaynwouldbeZaynMalik,aBritishsingerfortheboybandOneDirection.And
whenhelefttheband,itwasabitlikeJustinTimberlakeleaving‘NSyncorJohnLennon
leavingtheBeatles.Itmaynotsoundlikeabigdealtopeopleofacertainage.Buttoalotof
teenagersatthetime,thenewswasshattering.Nancycallsthesurgeoftextsfollowinghis
departure,“theZaynspike.”
LUBLIN:Imeanthehashtag“cutforZayn,”trendedworldwideforalmostthreedays
whenZaynleftOneDirection.Thesearegirlscuttingrealskinhopingthathewouldsee
thisandrejoinOneDirection.Andthatsentrealtraffictous.Thatwasrough.The
electionnight.AtonepointwesaweighttimesnormaltrafficmostlyLGBTQtexters,
childrenofimmigrantsandimmigrantsthemselvestextingandaskingiftheirfamilywas
goingtobedeportedandthensexualassaultsurvivors,includingsurvivorswhohad
beenassaultedyearsagobutalsohadbeenassaultedinthat24hourperiodsaying
shouldIbotherwithmycourtcase,shouldIbothergoingtopolice.Who'sgoingto
believemenow.FeelingtriggeredbytheelectionofTrump.
REID:Andhowdoyoubuildthecapacityforthat?
LUBLIN:Againasamarketplace.
REID:Andwhat'sthesizeofthevolunteernumber?
LUBLIN:Yeah.That'sover3000.Andandtheytakealotoftimeandcaringandloveand
that'sactuallymyprimaryfocus.Imeantheyarewhoweare.Andcanyouimagine,
theydoitallforfreelikethey'regivingustimeattwoo'clockinthemorning.They're
incredible,incrediblepeople.
REID:“Theyarewhoweare.”ThatonesentencesumsuptheapproachtoscalethatNancy
hastakenthroughouthercareer.Sheidentifiesthepeopleandorganizationswhocantake
herideaforward,andshemakesthemherown.There’salottobesaidaboutstickingwitha
vision,andadaptingitthroughtheyears—weatheringtheriseandfallofluck.
ButIdon’twanttooverstatethepowerofgrit.Ultimatelyyourplansaresubjecttoluck.You
maybethinking,Ithoughtgritwasmysuperpower—myopportunitytoovercometimeand
chance.It’salittlemorenuancedthanthat.IlikethewaySamAltman,presidentofthe
SiliconValley’smostsuccessfulaccelerator,YCombinator,unpacksthisproblem.
SAM:ThewayIhavealwaystriedtothinkaboutitformyselfisthatluckisabigfactor
butI'mgoingtokeepworkingandeventuallyyouknowbecauseit'sarandomvariable
it'sgoingtoswingmyway.AndIthinkthat'sroughlytherightmindsettohave.Ifyou
don’tacknowledgetheroleofluckatalllikeIthinkyou'reWronginadangerousway
whereyousortofjustarenotagreathumanandyoucan'tlookat—Igotreallyluckyat
somepoints—that'sprobablybad.
Butifyou'realsolikewellit'sallaboutluckandyouknowIhavenochance.Theworldis
againstmeandI'mjustgoingtosithereandcomplainthat'snotgoingtoworkeither.So
Ithinktheroughlycorrectmindsetisluckisimportant.ButI'meventuallygoingtoget
luckyandI'mgoingtojustworkreallyharduntilIdo
REID:ThatmaybetheoneofthebetterdefinitionsofoptimismIthinkI'veheard.
REID:Andtoseehowthisinteractionbetweengritandluckreallyworks,Iwanttointroduce
youtoonelastentrepreneur.SaraBlakely,thefounderandCEOofSpanx,a$250milliona
yearundergarmentindustryheavyweight.Ontheonehand,shehadtheultimatelucky
break.ShesentaprototypicalpairofSpanxtohertelevisionhero.Shetellsmeshewas
hardlypreparedforwhatwouldhappennext.
SARA
01:03:26
SoIinventedthisproductandIsentagiftbaskettoOprahoftheproductwithanotein
itandfoundoutAndrewhodressesherputitinherwardrobeandsheputitonand
loveditandbasicallyhasworniteverydaysince.
REID
01:03:42
That'sawesome.Andthenwhatdidtheshow.Howdidtheshowimpactyourbusiness.
SARA
01:03:48
Ohitwasunbelievable.ImeanIhadnomoneytoadvertiseIwasrunningitoutofmy
apartmentandOprahhelditupandsaidThisismyfavoriteproduct.Soeverything
startedgoingbezerk.
REID:ButthissensationalappearanceisactuallyjustthetailendofherjourneytoOprah.
SarahadbeendoingeverythingshecouldtoappearonOprahforthebetterpartofadecade.
Youprobablyhaven’theardaboutherfailedattempts.Saratickedoffafewforme.
SARA
01:02:14
WellwhenIwasinmy20sincollegeIIhadavisualizationthatIcreatedformyselfthat
wouldmeanthatIhadarrived.AndmyvisualizationwasmesittingontheOprah
WinfreyShowbecauseinmymindifIwassittingonhershowitmeansIhaddone
somethingreallyrightanddonesomethingamazingwithmylife.AndIhadnoideahow
Iwasgoingtogetthere.ButIwas100percentsureIwasthere.
01:02:40ImeanIwassoclearseeingmyselfonstageandthenIcalledthenext10years
ofmylifefillingintheblanksIwasalwaysthinkingisthiswhat'sgoingtogetmeonthe
Oprahshow.YouknowItaketheLSATandgotolawschoolbecauseIthoughtmaybeI'd
tryafamouscaseandthat'showIenduponOprah.ButthenIfailedtheLSATtwiceand
couldn'tgetintolawschool.AndthenIdidstandupcomedyforawhileandIthought
maybethat'smaybesomethinghereishowIenduponOprahsoIwasconsciouslyand
subconsciouslypursuingthingsthatIthoughtcouldultimatelygetmetothatthat
snapshotthatmeantsuccessforme.
REID:NowbeforeIleaveyou—Saraisofferingyou,thelistener,atestofyourownmettle.
Youcanspeaktoher,personally,aboutallofherplansB.She’llcallyou,ononecondition.
SARA
Andyouknowthescrappysideofmecan'tresistbutIyouknowItoldyouIjuststarted
InstagramandIwouldloveforthepeoplelisteningtofollowmeonInstagramandI'm
goingtochooseoneofyourlistenersiftheyputhashtagMastersofScaleinmylatest
postthattheyseeandI'mgoingtocallthemanddoaprivate20minutecallwiththem
wheretheycanaskmeanything.
REID:Grittylisteners,theracetoamasterclasswithSarabeginsnow.Andifyoucan’tget