The St. Cloud State UniversityLand Surveying Program

MSPS Annual Convention February 1, 2008

Professor Ken WongDirector of Land Surveying Department of Geographykwwong@stcloudstate.edu

Evolution of the Land Surveying Program

1. MLSA2. Program at SCSU3. New faculty 2000, second faculty 20044. Program progress and development5. ABET accreditation 20056. MSPS support 7. The Future – and beyond 2008

Minnesota Land Surveyors Association

1. Upgrading the profession’s education 2. Mandated the Bachelor’s degree in

Surveying from an ABET accredited institution 1985

2. The debate of the degree requirement3. Educational requirements of neighboring

states and across the nation

The Land Surveying Program

1. MLSA lobbied universities in Minnesota2. The Geography department in 1995 agreed

to set up a Bachelor of Science degree in Land Surveying and Mapping Science with a GIS Minora. Early emphasis was in GIS

b. Four courses evolved to year 2000; GEOG 335 Land Surveying, GEOG 336 Advanced Surveying, GEOG 435 Boundary Law, GEOG 436 GPS/GIS

Surveying Faculty

1. Ken Wong was hired in 2000 from Canada2. A new nine course (27 credits) surveying

curriculum was set up and approved by the university by spring 2001 which became the basis for ABET accreditation

3. Henry Hochmair was hired in 2004 from Austria

Program Progress and Development since 2000

1. Students in the B. Sc. Land Surveying major increased from 25 to over 100 since 2000

2. Surveying course offerings – most courses are available on ITV/web, class sizes 17 to 42

3. Interactive Television and the web offerings4. Graduates – 75 since year 1995

5. Surveying Scholarships (in excess of $24k annually), MSPS, ACSM, MSES, ACECM, Ulteig, Westwood

Program Progress and Development since 2000 (2)

6. ‘Categories’ of studentsBachelor of Science (100+), Bachelor of Elective Studies in Land Surveying (25+) Undergraduate Certificate in Land Surveying (5) Or ‘simply’ take a surveying course(s)

7. Surveyors from the profession are invited to speak in surveying courses

8. Equipment acquisition – funding from MSPS, MACS and matching funds from SCSU

Program Progress and Development since 2000 (3)

9. Articulation agreements in Minnesota and neighboring states – 12

10. The National Fundamentals of Surveying FS examination

• SCSU students in the last semester may write the national FS examination in April (or October)

• SCSU Passing rates • Students from MN on passing FS are LSIT if they possess

Bachelor’s degree in surveying or other degrees

The Four-Year Degree at SCSU

• 120 credits for bachelor’s degree• Transfer credits from colleges– Averages 45 to 54 credits incl. Gen. Ed.

SCSU requires:

• General Education credits – 41 or MTC– Electives to reach 120 credits

• Land Surveying credits – 60

Articulation Transfers

• Dunwoody Institute, Minneapolis MN – 2 yr.*• Lake Superior College, Duluth MN• N. Dakota College of Sciences, Wahpeton ND• NE Wisconsin Technical College, Tampa Bay WI• Nicolet Community College, Rhinelander WI• Rochester Community College, Rochester MN* • St. Cloud Technical College, St. Cloud MN• St. Paul College, St. Paul MN• S. Central Technical College, Mankato MN* • SE Technical College, Sioux Falls SD

Land Surveying Curriculum 1

Surveying subjects – all 3 credits adopted 2001: GEOG 335 Land SurveyingGEOG 336 Control and Geodetic SurveyingGEOG 433 Cadastral SurveysGEOG 435 Boundary LawGEOG 436 GPS/GIS IntegrationGEOG 438 Geodesy and Survey AdjustmentsGEOG 439 Survey SeminarSEOG 444 Surveying InternshipGEOG 455 Urban Site Development

Land Surveying Curriculum 2

GIS and Cartography – all 3 credits• GEOG 216 Principles of GI Science• GEOG 316 Introduction to GIS• GEOG 350 Remote Sensing• GEOG 394 Int. to Urban Planning• GEOG 402 Techniques in GIS• GEOG 406 Thematic Cartography• GEOG 462 Concepts in Spatial Analysis– GIS minor by taking GEOG 407, GEOG 408

Land Surveying Curriculum 3Mathematics

• MATH 221 Calculus and Analytic Geometry I (5 CR)• MATH 222 Calculus and Analytic Geometry II (4 CR)• STAT 229 Statistics for Physical Sciences (3)

• Summary of Land Surveying major:– Surveying [27 credits]– GIS/Cartography [21 credits]– Mathematics [12 credits] Total: 60 credits

• Planning ahead prior to SCSU while at Tech• ABET requires 9 credits in science Astronomy 100, Physics 100, Computing

100, Chemistry 100, Biology 100• College Algebra, Trigonometry, Calculus I, GEOG 216

Why Pursue Further Surveying Education?

• Bachelor’s degree in Surveying required for licensure as a Land Surveyor in MN

• Self-employed/partner, own company• A broader horizon of the profession *• A great future as a Surveyor, shortage in

MN and the US [low numbers are not just MN problem]

• Recognition as an educated Professional *

College Planning for Further Surveying Education

• What can you plan now for ‘then’? • Can I endure another 2.5 years of study/poverty after XXXX Technical

College? • Can I handle this academic program in Land Surveying?

It may not be as easy as it appears - courses may ‘look’ easy!!! • How are my mathematical skills? Study ethic• Do I have enough survey work experience?

• University education is not for everyone, YOU decide what is best for you, assess your own abilities

In General Education (pre-calculus)– College Algebra – Trigonometry– Take as much Gen Ed courses as possible– Plan academically for Calculus and statistics

ABET Accredited in 2005• Accreditation Board for Engineering

Technologies ABET – national • Bachelor of Science in Land Surveying is

accredited – not BES • Accredited with retroactivity to October 1,

2004 - September 30, 2008, for a period of 4 years

• Accreditation is an on-going process, with periodic re-accreditation

ABET Accredited (2)

Other issues:- Faculty salary - Future Faculty - Annual progress reports if needed to ABET- On-going process (re-accreditation in 4 to 6 years)- Recording of student grades (office of the Registrar)- Low student numbers are not a problem at SCSU

MSPS and SCSU

• Minnesota Society of Professional Surveyors MSPS Financial Support and SCSU Matching Program

• Since 2001 – Equipment (GPS equipment)– Software (AutoCAD, Starnet)– Equipment maintenance and software update

MSPS and SCSU (2)

• MSPS support– SCSU Land Surveying Industrial Advisory

Committee IAC– Speakers in surveying courses– Curriculum development– On-going financial support

The Future – 2008 and Beyond

1. The national push for a Bachelor’s degree2. Program (course) delivery and the web 3. The present accreditation expires September

30, 20084. New equipment and new curriculum5. Professor Ken Wong’s pending departure and a

new search for replacement in January 20086. Student enrollment7. The national survey education scene

The Future – 2008 and Beyond

The National ‘push’ for the bachelor’s degree1. The reality of the degree and faculty2. Degree requirement for licensure across the

country3. MN is an ‘island’ with degree4. Lack of students entering the profession and

the universities. Some states are ‘considering’ to ‘going back’

The Future – 2008 and Beyond

Program (course) Delivery 1.ITV and the web growing (From the total of 102

students on the web - 27 was off-campus. From the 27 off campus - 19 has a previous degree)

2.Dual sections, currently two sections of GEOG 335 and GEOG 336

3.Two sections should be offered in GEOG 455

The Future – 2008 and Beyond

ACCREDITATION • The SCSU Land Surveying accreditation expires

September 30, 2008 resulting in another Self-Study

• What is accreditation? • Why accreditation? • On-going assessment – graduate and employer

surveys• Documentation in minutes and emails

The Future – 2008 and Beyond

New Equipment and Curriculum1.Robotics2.Potential new courses to Land Surveying

a. Business course(s)b. Split present GEOG 438 (Geodesy and Survey Adjustments) into two separate courses with respective names

The Future – 2008 and Beyond

• Professor Ken Wong’s pending departure and a new search for replacement in January 2008– New faculty search for replacement January 08 – Stay for Orientation of new faculty during fall 08– Higher salary schedule

The Future – 2008 and Beyond

• STUDENT ENROLLMENT 1. Presently total of over 140 students in three

categories2. Most students are part time, with about 40 full

time students3. ITV /web will be integral part to maintain high

student numbers4. Anticipated B.Sc. & BES graduates

per year: 14

The Future – 2008 and Beyond

THE NATIONAL SURVEYING EDUCATION SCENE1.Lack of students entering universities and

graduating less than 300 per year2.Future is great for graduates3.Lack of SURVEYING faculty4.University Surveying program closures5.Number of university surveying programs in

the US – approximately 22

Surveying Programs in Universities • Alabama – Troy State University*• Arkansas – University of Arkansas • Alaska – University of Alaska*• California – California State Polytechnic

University*, California State University*• Colorado – Metropolitan State College of

Denver*• Florida – University of Florida*

* ABET accredited

Surveying Programs in Universities

• Georgia – Southern Polytechnic State University*

• Idaho – Idaho State University*• Illinois – Southern Illinois University• Indiana – Purdue University*• Kansas – Kansas State University • Kentucky – University of Kentucky• Louisiana – Nicholls State University

Surveying Programs in Universities

• Maine – University of Maine• Michigan – Ferris State University*, Michigan

Technological University*• Minnesota – St. Cloud State University*• Mississippi – Mississippi State University• Missouri – Southern Missouri State

University • Montana – Montana State University

Surveying Programs in Universities

• Nevada – Great Basin College• New Jersey – New Jersey Institute of

Technology*, Thomas Edison State College, Rutgers University

• New Mexico – New Mexico State University*• New York – Alfred State University• Ohio – Ohio State University*, University of

Akron*

Surveying Programs in Universities

• Oklahoma – Oklahoma State University• Oregon – Oregon Institute of Technology*,

Oregon State University • Pennsylvania – Pennsylvania State University*• Puerto Rico – Polytechnic University of Puerto

Rico, University of Puerto Rico• Tennessee – East Tennessee State University*

Surveying Programs in Universities

• Texas – Texas A&M University*, University of Texas at Tyler

• Virginia – Old Dominion University*• Wyoming – University of Wyoming*

• ‘Former’ programs – U of C at Berkley, U of Iowa, U of Minnesota, U of Washington, U of Wisconsin

The Future – 2008 and Beyond

• US surveying programs exist but ‘with difficulties’

• Accreditation of surveying programs• Future faculty searches at SCSU• Lack of surveying faculty

The Future – 2008 and Beyond

• 1. The education challenge

• 2. The student numbers challenge and graduates

• 3. The licensing challenge

• 4. Surveying faculty