STATE OF MICHIGAN IN THE MICHIGAN SUPREME COURT …...2 to a trial, not by one person, but by a jury...

STATE OF MICHIGAN IN THE MICHIGAN SUPREME COURT

PEOPLE OF THE STATE OF MICHIGAN, Plaintiff-Appellee,

v No. TRESHAUN TERRANCE,

Defendant-Appellant. _________________________________

PLAINTIFF-APPELLEE’S APPENDIX

KYM WORTHY Prosecuting Attorney County of Wayne

JASON W. WILLIAMS Chief of Research, Training, and Appeals

DAVID A. McCREEDY (P56540) Principal Appellate Attorney 1441 St. Antoine, Room 1116 Detroit, Michigan 48226 (313) 224-3836

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TABLE OF CONTENTS

Page

Jury Trial – 051216 ………………………………………………………… 1a – 240a

Jury Trial – 051616 ………………………………………………………… 241a – 388a

Jury Trial – 051716 ………………………………………………………… 389a – 450a

Jury Trial – 051816 ……………………………………………………….. 451a – 563a

Jury Trial – 052016 ………………………………………………………… 564a – 583a

Plea – 091216 ……………………………………………………………….. 584a – 593a

Order – 031218_Judge Kevin Cox ……………………………………… 594a

COA Opinion – 030519 ……………………………………………………. 595a – 600a

COA Opinion – 030519_Dissent_ ………………………………………..601a – 604a

Exhibit 1 ……………………………………………………………………… 605a

Exhibit 4 (Morgue Report) ……………………………………………… 606a – 617a

Exhibit 5 (Morgue Photos) ……………………………………………… 618a – 622a

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STATE OF MICHIGAN

IN THE THIRD CIRCUIT COURT FOR THE COUNTY OF WAYNECRIMINAL DIVISION

THE PEOPLE OF THE STATE OF MICHIGAN,

-vs- Case No. 16-01235

TRESHAUN LEE TERRANCE,

Defendant. /

JURY TRIAL

BEFORE THE HONORABLE KEVIN J. COXCIRCUIT COURT JUDGE

Thursday - May 12, 2016

APPEARANCES:

MS. MARY RUBIO,Appearing on behalf of the People.

MR. WYATT HARRIS,Appearing on behalf of the Defendant.

Transcribed by:Suzanne L. Kinsey, CSMR 4477Official Court Reporter

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C O N T E N T S

Page

May 12, 2016................................... 4

Jury Trial

Jury Selection 5

Opening Statement by Ms. Rubio 202

WITNESSES:

BRANDON ROUTHIERDirect Examination by Ms. Rubio 205Cross-Examination by Mr. Harris 210Redirect Examination by Ms. Rubio 213Recross-Examination by Mr. Harris 214

CHRISTOPHER CHASEDirect Examination by Ms. Rubio 216Cross-Examination by Mr. Harris 222Redirect Examination by Ms. Rubio 228

NARVETTA TILLMANDirect Examination by Ms. Rubio 231

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E X H I B I T S

Marked Admitted

People’s Proposed Exhibit No. 1(Photograph) 230 230

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1 May 12, 2016

2 Detroit, Michigan

3 (Proceedings commencing at 9:41 a.m.)

4 THE COURT: Okay.

5 Calling case number 16-001235-FC, People

6 versus Treshaun Terrance.

7 Your names, please -- your appearances,

8 counsel?

9 MS. RUBIO: Mary Rubio for the People.

10 MR. HARRIS: Good morning, Your Honor. Wyatt

11 Harris, P-54891, on behalf of Mr. Terrance.

12 THE COURT: Okay.

13 As you know, we have a jury in the hallway.

14 I do want to go over a last, a couple last

15 things.

16 My Judicial Attorney did provide you both

17 with copies of what she believed were the elements that

18 I will read, at the appropriate time, during the jury

19 selection.

20 Do either of you have any objection to those?

21 1601 and 1604?

22 MS. RUBIO: I do not.

23 MR. HARRIS: No, Your Honor.

24 THE COURT: Okay.

25 I think we agreed, off the record, that the

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1 jury will be instructed that we expect to be done on

2 Tuesday, but it’s possible that we will be -- that the

3 case could continue until Wednesday of next week.

4 Is that reasonable?

5 MS. RUBIO: Yes, Your Honor.

6 MR. HARRIS: Yes, Your Honor.

7 THE COURT: Okay.

8 And I believe I have the most -- I have an

9 amended Information, which I will read at the

10 appropriate time.

11 Is there anything further, before we bring in

12 our jury?

13 MS. RUBIO: No, Your Honor.


15 THE COURT: Okay.

16 Deputies?

17 DEPUTY: Ladies and gentlemen, because we

18 have such a large jury, I might have everybody step out

19 in the hallway. Have a seat out there. When I have

20 room, I’ll bring you guys in, okay?

21 All rise for the jury.

22 (Whereupon the prospective jury panel was

23 brought into the courtroom).

24 DEPUTY: You may be seated.

25 THE COURT: Okay.

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1 Calling case number 16-001235-FC, People


3 Your appearances, counsel?

4 MS. RUBIO: Good morning. Mary Rubio for the

5 People.


7 Harris on behalf of Mr. Terrance.

8 THE COURT: Okay.

9 You may be seated.

10 All right.

11 Good morning, ladies and gentlemen.

12 I am Judge Kevin J. Cox, and it’s my pleasure

13 to welcome you this morning to the Frank Murphy Hall of

14 Justice, which is the Criminal Division of our Wayne

15 County Circuit Court.

16 I, I know that jury duty may be a new

17 experience for some of you.

18 Jury duty is one of the most serious duties

19 that members of our free society are asked to perform.

20 Our system of self-government could not exist

21 without it.

22 The jury is a very important part of this

23 Court. The right to a jury trial is an ancient

24 tradition, and part of our heritage.

25 The laws say that both a person who is

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1 accused of a crime, and the Prosecution, have the right

2 to a trial, not by one person, but by a jury of twelve

3 impartial persons.

4 Jurors must be as free as humanly possible

5 from bias, prejudice, or sympathy for either side.

6 Each side in a trial is entitled to jurors

7 who keep open minds until the time comes to decide the

8 case.

9 As I am sure you suspect, a trial begins with

10 jury selection.

11 The purpose of this process is to obtain

12 information about you that will help us to choose a

13 fair and impartial jury to hear this case.

14 During jury selection, myself and the two

15 lawyers that introduced themselves moments ago, will

16 ask you questions.

17 This is called the voir dire.

18 The questions are meant to find out if you

19 know anything about this case.

20 Also, we need to find out if you have any

21 opinions, or personal experiences that might influence

22 you, for against the Prosecution, the defendant, or any

23 witnesses.

24 One or more of these things could cause you

25 to be excused in this particular case, even though you

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1 may otherwise be qualified to serve as a juror.

2 The questions you are asked today may probe

3 deeply into your attitudes, beliefs, and experiences.

4 They are not meant to be an unreasonable

5 prying into your private lives.

6 The law requires that we get this information

7 so that an impartial jury may be chosen.

8 If you did not hear or understand a question,

9 you should say so.

10 If you do understand it, you should answer it

11 truthfully, and completely.

12 Please do not hesitate to speak freely about

13 anything you believe we should know.

14 During this jury selection, you may be

15 excused from serving on the jury in one of two ways:

16 First, I may excuse you for cause. That is,

17 I may decide that there is a valid reason why you

18 cannot, or should not serve in this case.

19 Or, a lawyer from one side or the other may

20 excuse you without giving any reason for doing so.

21 This is called a peremptory challenge.

22 The law gives each side the right to excuse a

23 certain number of jurors in this way.

24 If you are excused, you should not feel bad,

25 or take it personally.

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1 As I explained before, there simply may be

2 something that causes you to be excused from this

3 particular case.

4 Now, I would like you to -- I will now ask

5 you to stand, and to swear to answer truthfully, fully,

6 and honestly, all the questions that you will be asked

7 about your qualifications to serve as a juror in this

8 case.

9 If you have religious beliefs against taking

10 an oath, you may affirm that you will answer all

11 questions truthfully, fully, and honestly.

12 Please stand at this time.

13 Madame Clerk?

14 CLERK: Good morning. Raise your right

15 hands, please.

16 Do you solemnly swear or affirm that you will

17 truthfully and completely answer all questions

18 regarding your qualifications to serve as jurors in

19 this matter?

20 PROSPECTIVE JURORS: Yes.

21 CLERK: You may be seated.

22 THE COURT: Okay.

23 In a matter of seconds, Ms. Mc Call, is going

24 to pull twelve names -- fourteen names, and ask those

25 of you whose names are called, to sit in the jury box,

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1 which is to my left.

2 For those of you that remain in the audience,

3 please pay attention to the questions that are asked.

4 I want you to pay attention, because you may

5 find yourself called up into the jury box, at some

6 point this morning.

7 So, please pay attention.

8 Madame Clerk?

9 CLERK: Seat number one, Evins Jernigan.

10 Seat number two, Ricardo Devoto.

11 Seat number three, Charisse Mayes.

12 Seat number four, Asante Lindsey-Rogers.

13 Seat number five, Janis Crockett.

14 Seat number six, Sahla Harkati?

15 MR. HARRIS: How are you spelling that?

16 THE COURT: H-a-r, is that correct?

17 CLERK: Yes.

18 Seat number seven, Denise Hannah.

19 Seat number eight, Dan Wright.

20 Seat number nine, James Brown.

21 Seat number ten, Sandra Chami.

22 THE COURT: How do you spell that last name?

23 CLERK: C-h-a-m-i.

24 Seat number eleven, James Cloyd.

25 Seat number twelve, Mousa Sobh, S-o-b-h.

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1 Pronounce your last name for me, please?

2 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SOBH: Sobh.

3 CLERK: Seat number thirteen, Joann Brown.

4 Seat number fourteen, Aubrieanna Coleman.

5 THE COURT: Okay.

6 Before we go any further, I’d like to

7 introduce you to members of my staff.

8 You’ve already been introduced to Ms.

9 Mc Call. She is my Court Clerk, and she’s kind of like

10 the air traffic controller in this courtroom, and she

11 handles a lot of things that are going on in this

12 trial, as well as the, the many other cases I have on

13 my docket.

14 To my right are our two Deputies, Deputy

15 Tillman and Deputy Pompa.

16 And you will find that you will have input

17 with the Deputies from time to time. They’ll tell you

18 where to go, what to do, what time to do it all,

19 throughout this trial.

20 In addition, I have an attorney that works

21 with me, Sarah. She works in the back office. And

22 from time to time, you may notice that she brings

23 papers and things for my review, during this trial.

24 As I’m sure you all understand, this is a

25 criminal case that involves charges of murder against

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1 the defendant, which I will explain in greater detail

2 later.

3 The Defendant in this matter is named

4 Treshaun Terrance.

5 And his attorney is Mr. Harris.

6 At this time, I’m gonna ask Mr. Harris to

7 introduce himself to all of you, to introduce his

8 client to you, and to identify any witnesses that he

9 anticipates he may call during this trial?

10 MR. HARRIS: Good morning, ladies and

11 gentlemen of the jury. My name is Wyatt Harris, and I

12 represent Treshaun Terrance.

13 Mr. Terrance, would you please stand.

14 And at this, Your Honor, we don’t have any

15 witnesses.

16 THE COURT: Okay.

17 Thank you.

18 The lawyer for the State of Michigan is known

19 as the Assistant Prosecuting Attorney.

20 And in this case, the Assistant Prosecuting

21 Attorney is Ms. Rubio.

22 At this time, I’m gonna ask her to introduce

23 herself to you, to introduce the gentleman to her

24 right, and to identify any witnesses that she

25 anticipates she will call during this trial.

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1 MS. RUBIO: Good morning, everyone. I am

2 Mary Rubio. I do work for Wayne County, I’m an

3 Assistant Prosecutor.

4 Seated here at the table is the Officer in

5 charge of this case. He works for the Detroit Police

6 Department. His name is Ryan Mason.

7 Should you get selected to be on the jury,

8 you may see him going in and out, to sort of coordinate

9 witnesses, and things of that nature.

10 I have several witnesses that I may call, so

11 I am gonna list their names, but it doesn’t mean I’m

12 gonna call every one of these witnesses.

13 Dr. Leigh Hlavaty, from the Medical

14 Examiner’s Office; Narvetta Tillman; Brandon Routhier;

15 Christopher Chase; Police Officer Melanie Armstrong;

16 Police Officer Conner Corey; Police Officer Rasheen

17 Mc Claine; Sergeant Brian Terechenok, I’m sorry -- did

18 I -- okay; Police Officer Blake Jones; Police Officer

19 Michele Donald; Michelle Douglas and Christian Kerr

20 from Crime Scene Services; Police Officer Antaeus

21 Evans; Police Officer Brandolyn Johnson; Police Officer

22 Anthony Williams; Police Officer Arthur Galeczka;

23 Detective Detrick Mott; Shane Hill, from the Michigan

24 State Police; and then possibly the Officer in charge.

25 All of the Officers that I named are from the

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1 Detroit Police Department.

2 Thank you.

3 THE COURT: Thank you.

4 Okay.

5 Does anyone in the jury box know anybody, any

6 of the lawyers? Do you know Mr. Terrance; or do you

7 know any of the witnesses that have been identified in

8 this case?

9 If so, can you raise your hands for me?

10 Seeing no hands.

11 Okay.

12 We expect that this trial is going to go all

13 day long today.

14 Tomorrow is Friday, and we will be in trial

15 from noon time until probably four o’clock. Not the

16 morning, just noon until four.

17 Monday, all day.

18 And we believe we will be done on Tuesday.

19 Now, it is possible that we could carry over

20 until Wednesday. We don’t think that’s gonna be the

21 case.

22 So, I wanted to lay the schedule out for you.

23 Is there anybody in the jury that believes

24 that it would be a very significant hardship for them

25 to sit as jurors in this case, based on the schedule I

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1 have outlined for you.

2 And before anybody raises their hand, when

3 I’m thinking about severe hardship, I’m thinking on the

4 order of the soldiers that are abroad, serving their

5 country, our country, in foreign wars.

6 That’s what I’m thinking.

7 So, does anybody have a real significant

8 hardship they want to share, that will prevent them

9 from being here?

10 Your hands, please?

11 Okay.

12 Juror number one, Mr. Jernigan. What is your

13 hardship, sir?

14 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JERNIGAN: I have a

15 doctor’s excuse, that I have C.O.P.D.

16 THE COURT: Okay.

17 And do you have a -- you have an excuse?

18 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JERNIGAN: Mm-hmm.

19 THE COURT: What does it say?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JERNIGAN: It says -- it

21 tells you my condition, and that I -- he didn’t, he

22 didn’t list what I can and can’t do, but it’s, it’s

23 connected to my breathing.

24 THE COURT: Deputy, can I see the letter from

25 the doctor, please?

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1 Counsel, can you approach?

2 (Whereupon a discussion was had off the

3 record at the bench).

4 THE COURT: Okay.

5 Sir, Mr. Jernigan, good luck to you. We are

6 gonna excuse you from your service here today.

7 You will, however, have to return to the jury

8 assembly room, back on the first floor.

9 Okay?

10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JERNIGAN: Thank you.

11 THE COURT: Good luck to you.

12 Did anybody else in the first -- sir, can you

13 go to your left? Go back out that way. Thank you.

14 Did anybody else in the first row raise their

15 hand?

16 Ms. Mayes?

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MAYES: I am my

18 grandmother’s and my mother’s primary care giver,

19 Monday through Friday, and every other weekend.

20 And Monday, Wednesdays, and Friday, I have to

21 take, transport my grandmother to dialys (as spoken).

22 THE COURT: Okay.

23 Thank you for that.

24 Anybody else in the first row with their hand

25 up?

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1 Anybody in the second row?

2 All right.

3 Is it Ms., is Harkati?

4 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MAYES: Yes.

5 THE COURT: Good morning.

6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MAYES: Good morning.

7 THE COURT: What is your --

8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MAYES: I --

9 THE COURT: What is your substantial

10 hardship?

11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MAYES: I booked a flight

12 on Sunday, I’m gonna go to visit family in North

13 Africa.

14 So, I have the ticket, and I, like, I won’t

15 be able to be here Monday, and Tuesday.

16 THE COURT: Okay.


18 Anybody in the -- else in the middle row?

19 Anybody in the back row?

20 Is it Mr. --


22 THE COURT: Sobh.

23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SOBH: Yes. I have a two

24 year old, that I don’t have a sitter for the rest of

25 the week.

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1 THE COURT: Well, who’s sitting today?

2 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SOBH: His mom. She took

3 off of school today.

4 She can’t take off of school for the rest of

5 the week, so --

6 THE COURT: Okay.

7 All right.


9 In case any of you were wondering, we have,

10 we’ll be going all day, as I mentioned.

11 And we will, however, take breaks on a

12 regular basis, like, every hour and a half, every two

13 hours.

14 So -- and of course, if anybody needs to take

15 a break, sort of suddenly, please raise your hand, and

16 we can take a break at that time.

17 All right?

18 Based on -- are there any members of the jury

19 that feel that they are unable to sit as jurors,

20 because of any health conditions that they have.

21 If so, can you raise your hands?

22 Seeing no hands.

23 Okay.

24 This is a criminal case, and the paper that’s

25 used to charge the defendant with a crime is called an

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1 Information.

2 The Information in this case charges the

3 defendant, Mr. Terrance, with the following crimes,

4 which I’m now going to read to you:

5 The Information indicates that on December

6 15th, 2015, at 20170 Mendota, in the City of Detroit,

7 that the defendant, Mr. Terrance, did deliberately, and

8 with intent to kill, and with premeditation, kill and

9 murder on Dalona T. Tillman, contrary to MCL 750.316.

10 Count two of the Information alleges that Mr.

11 Terrance did, while in the perpetration, or attempted

12 perpetration of torture, murder one Dalona T. Tillman,

13 contrary to MCL 750.316, paren 1, paren “B”.

14 The defendant, Mr. Terrance, has pled not

15 guilty to these charges.

16 You should clearly understand that the

17 Information I have just read is not evidence.

18 An Information is read in every criminal

19 trial so that the defendant and the jury can hear the

20 charges.

21 You must not think that it is evidence of his

22 guilt, or that he must be guilty because he has been

23 charged.

24 A person accused of a crime is presumed to be

25 innocent.

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1 This means that you must start with the

2 presumption that the defendant is innocent.

3 This presumption continues throughout the

4 trial, and enables the defendant to a verdict of not

5 guilty unless you are satisfied beyond a reasonable

6 doubt that he is guilty.

7 Every crime is made up of parts called

8 elements.

9 The Prosecutor must prove each element of the

10 crime beyond a reasonable doubt.

11 The defendant is not required to prove his

12 innocence, or to do anything.

13 If you find that the Prosecutor has not

14 proven every element beyond a reasonable doubt, then

15 you must find the defendant not guilty.

16 A reasonable doubt is a fair, honest doubt,

17 growing out of the evidence, or lack of evidence.

18 It is not merely an imaginary or possible

19 doubt, but a doubt based on reason and common sense.

20 A reasonable doubt is just that. It is a

21 doubt that is reasonable after a careful and considered

22 examination of the facts and circumstances of this

23 case.

24 Based on what I have read, and said, thus

25 far, are there any members of the jury that believe

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1 that it would be impossible for them to serve as a fair

2 and impartial juror in this case?

3 If so, can you raise your right hands for me?

4 Seeing no hands.

5 Now, beginning with juror number two, Mr.

6 Devoto, can you tell us where you live? Meaning,

7 Livonia, or Taylor, or Trenton. I don’t want a

8 specific street or address, or anything like that. But

9 what, what City do you live in?

10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: Livonia, Your

11 Honor.

12 THE COURT: Okay.

13 And what do you do for a living?

14 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: I’m a Senior Data

15 Developer.

16 THE COURT: Okay.

17 Are you married?

18 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: Yes.

19 THE COURT: And what does your spouse do?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: She’s a lawyer.

21 THE COURT: A lawyer? And what is your

22 highest level of education?

23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: Bachelor of

24 Business Degree.

25 THE COURT: Okay.

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1 Very good.

2 Ms. Mayes, can you tell us where you live?

3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MAYES: Detroit.

4 THE COURT: And what do you do for a living?

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MAYES: A care giver.

6 THE COURT: Okay.

7 Are you married?



10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MAYES: We’re separated, so

11 I have no idea.

12 THE COURT: Okay.

13 What is your highest level of education?

14 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MAYES: Some college.

15 THE COURT: All right.

16 Ms. Lindsey-Rogers, did I get that right?

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR LINDSEY-ROGERS: Mm-hmm.

18 THE COURT: Okay.

19 Here’s a forewarning for all of you:

20 You probably did not notice, but I don’t have

21 a Court Reporter. A Court Reporter is a person that

22 types up what we say during this trial.

23 We have a far more advanced system where

24 everything that we say is being recorded. So, if you

25 see the devices on the front of the jury box, and

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1 between juror number six and juror number seven, and

2 various locations around the courtroom, those are

3 recording devices.

4 So that everything we say is recorded.

5 Now, because of everything is being recorded,

6 we can’t say, mm-hmm, and uh-uh, or shrug our

7 shoulders, for example, in response to a question.

8 So, I just want to warn all of you that,

9 please answer verbally, yes or no, or whatever the case

10 may be, so that your response is recorded.

11 Okay?

12 Ms. Rogers, where did you -- where do you

13 live?

14 PROSPECTIVE JUROR LINDSEY-ROGERS: Southgate.

15 THE COURT: And are you married?

16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR LINDSEY-ROGERS: Yes.


18 PROSPECTIVE JUROR LINDSEY-ROGERS: He works

19 at Dialogue Direct.

20 THE COURT: Okay.


22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR LINDSEY-ROGERS: I work at

23 Quicken Loans.


25 And what is your highest level of education?

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1 PROSPECTIVE JUROR LINDSEY-ROGERS: Some

2 college.

3 THE COURT: Some college.

4 All right.

5 Ms. Crockett, can you tell us where you live?

6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CROCKETT: Redford.


8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CROCKETT: I work for

9 Farmington Head Start Program.


11 Are you married?

12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CROCKETT: Yes.


14 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CROCKETT: He’s a truck

15 driver.



18 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CROCKETT: Some college.


20 Okay.

21 Ms. Harkati, can you tell us where you live?

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HARKATI: Livonia.


24 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HARKATI: I se;; oriental

25 rugs.

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1 THE COURT: You sell oriental rugs?

2 Okay.

3 Are you married?

4 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HARKATI: Yes.

5 THE COURT: What does your spouse do?

6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HARKATI: A school, school

7 bus driver.

8 THE COURT: Okay.


10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HARKATI: Some college.


12 Ms. Hannah, can you tell us where you live?

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HANNAH: Northville.


15 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HANNAH: Right now, I’m

16 retired.

17 THE COURT: And what are you retired from?

18 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HANNAH: School bus driver,

19 Novi Schools.

20 THE COURT: Okay.

21 Are you married?

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HANNAH: Yes.


24 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HANNAH: He works for Gift

25 of Life, Michigan. And he’s part of the Michigan

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1 Funeral Directors Association.

2 THE COURT: Okay.


4 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HANNAH: Certificate in

5 Phlebotomy.

6 THE COURT: Okay.

7 Mr. Wright, can you tell us where you live?

8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WRIGHT: Livonia, Michigan.


10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WRIGHT: I’m a fleet parts

11 specialist.

12 THE COURT: Okay.

13 Are you married?

14 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WRIGHT: Yes.


16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WRIGHT: She works for

17 Wayne County Health Department.

18 THE COURT: Okay.


20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WRIGHT: Some college.

21 THE COURT: Okay.

22 Mr. Brown, good morning.

23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: Good morning.

24 THE COURT: Can you tell us where you live?

25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: Detroit.

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2 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: I’m retired.

3 THE COURT: And what did you do before you,

4 you were retired?

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: I worked for

6 Delta Operations, for Ford Motor Comapny.

7 Okay.

8 Are you married?

9 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: No, single.


11 And what’s your highest level of education?

12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: Some college.


14 Is it, Chami, or Chami?

15 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CHAMI: Chami.

16 THE COURT: Chami.

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CHAMI: Mm-hmm.

18 THE COURT: Okay. Very good.

19 Ma’am, can you tell us where you live?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CHAMI: Dearborn.


22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CHAMI: I’m a Project

23 Coordinator for Henry Ford.


25 And are you married?

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1 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CHAMI: Yes.


3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CHAMI: He’s a Peri-

4 Operative Assistant.

5 THE COURT: Okay.


7 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CHAMI: Masters Degree.


9 Mr. Cloyd?

10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CLOYD: Yes.


12 Can you tell us where you live?

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CLOYD: Detroit.


15 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CLOYD: I’m retired.


17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CLOYD: Well, I’m disabled,

18 a musician.

19 THE COURT: Okay.

20 Very good.

21 Are you married?

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CLOYD: No.

23 THE COURT: What is your highest level of

24 education?

25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CLOYD: Bachelors, U of M.

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1 THE COURT: Okay.

2 Mr. Sobh, can you tell us what -- where you

3 live, sir?

4 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SOBH: Trenton.

5 THE COURT: Trenton.

6 What do you do for a living?

7 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SOBH: Pharmacy Technician.


9 Are you -- and are you married?

10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SOBH: No.



13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SOBH: Still in college.

14 THE COURT: Still in college.

15 Ms. Brown -- do we have two Browns? I guess

16 we do.

17 Ms. Brown, good morning.

18 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOANN BROWN: Good morning.


20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOANN BROWN: Highland

21 Park, Michigan.


23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOANN BROWN: Shipping and

24 receiving.

25 THE COURT: Okay.

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1 Are you married?

2 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOANN BROWN: No.


4 education?

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOANN BROWN: Eleventh.

6 THE COURT: Eleventh?

7 Okay.

8 Miss Coleman, can you tell us where you live?

9 PROSPECTIVE JUROR AUBRIEANNA COLEMAN:

10 Detroit.



13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR AUBRIEANNA COLEMAN: I work

14 with people with traumatic brain injuries.


16 And are you married?

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR AUBRIEANNA COLEMAN: No.


19 education?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR AUBRIEANNA COLEMAN: Some

21 college.


23 All right.

24 Now, have any members of the jury ever sat as

25 jurors before, in a criminal case?

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2 All right.

3 Mr. Cloyd, when did you serve as a juror in a

4 criminal case?

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CLOYD: I think it was in

6 the ‘70s.


8 A long time ago.

9 Was it in this building?

10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CLOYD: I think so.


12 Without telling me what the outcome of the

13 case was, did the jury reach a verdict in the case?

14 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CLOYD: I don’t remember.

15 THE COURT: Very good.

16 All right.

17 Anybody else in the back row with their hand

18 up?

19 Okay.

20 Now, do any members of the jury, or their

21 close friends or family members, are they either

22 lawyers, or somehow involved in the criminal justice

23 system? Maybe part of court administration, probation

24 officers, lawyers, things of that sort?

25 If so, can you raise your hands for me?

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1 All right.

2 Mr. Devoto, I think you indicated that your

3 spouse is an attorney?

4 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: My wife is an

5 attorney. I have two brothers that are attorneys. And

6 I have a brother-in-law that’s Assistant Chief of

7 Police in Midland, Michigan.

8 THE COURT: Okay.

9 Does your wife, or your other relatives that

10 are attorneys, do they practice law in this building?

11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: My wife does civil

12 law, so, it wouldn’t be in this building.

13 THE COURT: It wouldn’t be in this building.

14 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: My brothers are

15 also civil.

16 THE COURT: Okay.

17 All right.

18 Now, are you able to separate out the fact

19 that you know some lawyers, and in this case, can you

20 be the juror that pays close attention, throughout this

21 trial, listens carefully to the evidence, doesn’t

22 prejudge anybody or anything, listens to the law that I

23 instruct you on at the end of the case?

24 Can you do all that?

25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: I can, Your Honor.

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1 THE COURT: Okay.

2 Can you be a fair and impartial juror?

3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: I believe I can.


5 You’ll, you’ll -- you are affirming to all of

6 us that you’re going to be fair to the Prosecution, and

7 you’re gonna be fair to the defense, is that right?

8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: That is correct.


10 Anybody else in the first row that raised

11 their hand in response to my question?


13 How about anybody in the back row?

14 All right.

15 Mr. Cloyd, who did you have in mind, in

16 response to my question?

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CLOYD: First cousin is a

18 Family Court Judge, in Cincinnati.

19 I have a lot of friends that are Family Court

20 Judges.

21 I have a friend that’s, I don’t think it was

22 in here, but I would have to, I would have to be

23 impartial, because I couldn’t be any other way.

24 THE COURT: Okay.

25 So, let me ask you this: You’re telling all

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1 of us, because it’s true, that you’re going to pay very

2 close attention throughout this case; you’re not gonna

3 prejudge anybody or anything; you’re gonna follow the

4 law that I instruct you on; and that you will be fair

5 to the Prosecution and fair to the defense; is that

6 correct?

7 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CLOYD: Yes.


9 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CLOYD: Of course.

10 THE COURT: Anybody else in the back row,

11 that had their hand up in response to my question?

12 Now, do any of you have any close friends or

13 family members that are in law enforcement? By that, I

14 mean, Police Officers, F.B.I., some branch of the

15 Federal government, in law enforcement?

16 If so, can you raise your right hands for me?

17 All right.

18 Mr. Devoto, who did you have in mind?

19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: My brother-in-law.

20 THE COURT: Okay.

21 And remind me what --

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: He’s the Assistant

23 Chief of Police in Midland, Michigan.

24 THE COURT: Okay.

25 And you’ve already told me you’re gonna be a

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1 fair and impartial juror?

2 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: Yes, Your Honor.


4 Anybody else in the first row?

5 Ms. Mayes?

6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MAYES: My brother. I know

7 he was retired from D.P.D., but he just recently went

8 back, the beginnin’ of this year, workin’ with some, I

9 guess, drug force. I don’t know exactly his title.

10 THE COURT: So, your brother, it sounds like

11 he may be doing something in the law enforcement field?


13 THE COURT: Okay.

14 But you’re not sure?

15 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MAYES: I don’t know what

16 his title is now. I know he retired from D.P.D., but

17 he just went back, doin’ some kind of work with --

18 THE COURT: Okay.

19 And, and you don’t recognize any of the names

20 of the witnesses that Ms. Rubio identified that she may

21 call in this case, right?

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MAYES: No.


24 So, can you separate, in this case, the fact

25 that you know a Detroit Police Officer, and can you be

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1 the juror that I described earlier? The juror that

2 will pay very close attention throughout this case;

3 won’t prejudge anybody or anything; will follow the law

4 that I instruct you on; and will be a fair and

5 impartial juror?

6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MAYES: Sure, yes.

7 THE COURT: Okay.

8 Anybody else in the first row with their hand

9 up?

10 Anybody in the middle row with their hand up?

11 Ms. Hannah?

12 Who did you have in mind in response to my

13 question?

14 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HANNAH: My dad was a

15 retired Detroit Police Officer.

16 THE COURT: Okay.

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HANNAH: But it’s been

18 about, probably twenty-five years already.

19 THE COURT: Okay.

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HANNAH: Yeah.


22 Now, you heard what I asked some of your

23 colleagues on the jury.

24 Can you separate out the fact that your

25 father was a Police Officer, and in this case, be that

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1 juror that I described? Pay very close attention; not

2 prejudge anybody or anything; keep an open mind until

3 the case is over, and I tell you that it’s appropriate

4 to decide the case. Can you do that?

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HANNAH: Yes, Your Honor.

6 THE COURT: And will you do that?


8 THE COURT: You’ll be fair to the defense,

9 and you’ll be fair to the Prosecution?


11 THE COURT: Okay.

12 Anybody else on the middle row with their

13 hand up?

14 Anybody in the back row?

15 Mr. Brown?

16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: Yes.

17 THE COURT: Who did you have in mind?

18 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: Well, I have

19 quite a few friends that’s Police Officers.

20 THE COURT: Okay.

21 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: And a good

22 friend of mine, is from New Jersey, he’s here now.

23 He’s from Detroit, but he was livin’ -- moved to New

24 Jersey, and he was a Police Officer, before he retired.

25 THE COURT: Okay.

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1 Now, you’ve heard what I’ve asked the other

2 jurors?


4 THE COURT: And I’m sure you can agree with

5 me, that it’s very important that we have fair and

6 impartial jurors, in every case?

7 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: Right.


9 Recognizing that you have known some Police

10 Officers in the past, can you separate that experience,

11 and be that juror that I just described?

12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: I believe so.

13 THE COURT: Okay.

14 Both lawyers, frankly, they want to know more

15 than you believe so. They want to know, yes, Judge, I

16 can be that juror. I can be the person that --

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: Well,

18 that’s --

19 THE COURT: Pays attention; that’s fair; that

20 follows the law; and I can be a fair and impartial

21 juror? Is that you?

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: I -- that’s

23 my honest answer, I believe so, because --

24 THE COURT: Okay.

25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: The stories

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1 that I’ve been told -- I think I can.

2 I’m -- it just --

3 THE COURT: Well, let me ask you this --

4 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: So many

5 things that have happened, you know.

6 THE COURT: Can you follow the law that I

7 give you?




11 THE COURT: That’s very important, right?

12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: Yes, I can do

13 that.

14 THE COURT: And you’ll listen to the

15 evidence? You’ll follow the law that I give you?


17 THE COURT: And you’ll make your decision

18 based on the facts you believe, and the law that I

19 instruct you on?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: Correct.


22 Thank you.

23 Anybody else in the back row with their hand

24 up?

25 Mr. Cloyd? Who did you have in mind? Do you

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1 know some Police Officers?

2 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CLOYD: Yeah, my first,

3 first cousin is between the Secret Service and the

4 President.

5 And I know a lot of Detroit Police.

6 THE COURT: Okay.

7 Let me ask you the same question that I’ve

8 asked several others.

9 Can you be the juror that I described? Keeps

10 an open mind; and is --

11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CLOYD: You know, Judge, I,

12 I’m not sure.

13 I have -- the -- my friends on the Police

14 Force are honest guys. They’re all my age.

15 THE COURT: Okay.

16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CLOYD: But --

17 THE COURT: Sir --

18 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CLOYD: I’m past --

19 THE COURT: Sir, can I just ask you to stop

20 right there.

21 Can you be a fair and impartial juror?

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CLOYD: I don’t know.

23 THE COURT: Okay.

24 All right.

25 I am going to excuse you, at this time, Mr.

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1 Cloyd.

2 Thank you for being here.

3 You’re gonna have to return to the first

4 floor.

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CLOYD: Okay.

6 THE COURT: Did anybody else in the back row

7 have their hand up?

8 Okay.

9 Now, has any member of the jury ever been the

10 victim of a crime, or anybody that’s close to you, like

11 a close friend or family member?

12 If so, can you raise your hand for me?

13 Mr. Wright, juror number eight.

14 Were you a victim of a crime, or somebody

15 close to you?

16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WRIGHT: Both.

17 THE COURT: Okay.

18 When were you the victim of a crime?

19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WRIGHT: 1986.

20 THE COURT: Okay.

21 And what, what, what were you -- what crime

22 were you the victim of?

23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WRIGHT: I was car jacked

24 at gun point, in front of my dad’s house, with my wife.

25 THE COURT: Okay.

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1 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WRIGHT: Because they were

2 trying to abduct her.

3 So, I don’t feel I could be fair and

4 impartial, either.

5 MR. HARRIS: May we approach, Your Honor?

6 THE COURT: Yeah.



9 THE COURT: You said somebody else was the

10 victim of a crime?

11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WRIGHT: Yeah, my wife was

12 there -- well, she was my fiancé at the time. She was

13 involved with, in, in that same incident.

14 THE COURT: Okay.

15 All right.

16 Did anybody else have their hand up in

17 response to my question, in the first row?


19 Anybody in the last row?

20 Mr. Brown?

21 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: Yes. I was

22 robbed, at gun point.

23 THE COURT: And when was that?

24 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: I was robbed

25 at gun point.

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1 THE COURT: When was that?

2 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: This was in

3 ‘98.

4 THE COURT: Okay.

5 Did -- was the person that robbed you ever

6 prosecuted, to your knowledge?

7 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: I believe he

8 wasn’t.

9 THE COURT: Okay.

10 All right.

11 Will you be able to separate out that

12 unfortunate experience that you had, and in this case,

13 be the fair and impartial juror that I’ve already

14 described?

15 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: That’s a good

16 question, Your Honor.

17 I mean, it just brings back memories, when I

18 think about it.

19 It wasn’t a good time.

20 I consider myself a honest person.

21 THE COURT: Okay.

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: But the

23 memories of this, and the people, and these guns, is

24 just, it’s too much.


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1 Well, you told me, earlier --


3 THE COURT: That you’re gonna pay close

4 attention --

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: Yes, on that

6 question.

7 THE COURT: And you’re gonna follow the law

8 that I instruct you on.


10 THE COURT: Right?

11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: That’s

12 correct.

13 THE COURT: Okay.

14 Anybody else in the back row, with their hand

15 up?

16 Miss Chami, Chami?

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CHAMI: Well, a close

18 friend of mine was a victim of an assault and attempted

19 murder by her ex-husband.

20 THE COURT: Okay.

21 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CHAMI: About two years

22 ago.

23 THE COURT: And did that case -- did that

24 situation work its way through the court system, to

25 your knowledge?

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1 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CHAMI: No, it did not.


3 Are you gonna be able to separate out the

4 experience of your friend, disregard it, and in this

5 case, be the juror that play close attention to the

6 facts and evidence in this case; not prejudge anybody

7 or anything; follows the law that I instruct you on, at

8 the conclusion of this case?

9 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CHAMI: It may be

10 difficult, but perhaps.


12 Miss Chami, there’s a whole universe of

13 things that happens outside this building. And what

14 I’m asking you is, in this case, can you pay attention;

15 can you follow the law; can you keep an open mind, as

16 the law instructs you to do? Can you be that person?

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CHAMI: I can.


19 Can you make a decision based on the evidence

20 that’s presented, that you believe, with consideration

21 of the law that I give you in the case?

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CHAMI: Yes.

23 THE COURT: Okay.

24 Anybody else in the back row, with their hand

25 up?

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1 PROSPECTIVE JUROR: My nephew was doin’ time

2 of forty to, forty to sixty years, and he didn’t kill

3 nobody.

4 THE COURT: Okay.

5 All right.

6 So, that’s really not the question that I,

7 that I asked, but let me ask you this, since you, since

8 you brought it up.

9 Well, first of all, have you ever been the

10 victim of a crime, or anybody close to you?

11 All right.

12 You bring up the experience of your nephew.

13 Now, in this case, can you separate out your

14 nephew’s situation, again, part of the, the universe

15 that exists outside this building?

16 You can’t do that?

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR: Nope.

18 THE COURT: You’re telling me that you can’t

19 follow the law that I instruct you on?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR: I could try.

21 THE COURT: Okay.

22 Have any of you ever been arrested, or

23 convicted of a crime, other than a miscellaneous

24 traffic offense, or do you have any other close friends

25 or family that have been arrested or convicted of a

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1 crime?


3 Ms. Mayes? Who were you referring to?

4 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MAYES: I have three

5 nephews that was -- have felonies against them for

6 armed robbery.

7 THE COURT: Okay.

8 All right.

9 In this case, can you separate out the

10 experience of your nephews, and pay attention to all

11 the facts and evidence in this case?


13 THE COURT: Okay.

14 Anybody else in the first row?


16 Anybody in the third row?

17 Ms. Rubio?

18 MS. RUBIO: Thank you.

19 Everyone, I’m just gonna follow up a little

20 bit on some of the Judge’s questions, and then I’m

21 gonna ask you some other, other questions as well.

22 First of all, juror number three, I know you

23 indicated in the beginning that it sounds like you have

24 your hands full, being a, a care giver, which is a

25 difficult thing at times.

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1 I think you indicated you’re helping taking

2 care of your mother, and as well as your grandmother?

3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MAYES: Uh-huh.

4 MS. RUBIO: And you indicated that you have

5 to take your grandmother to dialysis three days a week,

6 correct?

7 I’m sorry, I’m sorry to hear that.

8 Is -- if you are selected, is there anyone

9 else that can take your grandmother to dialysis?


11 MS. RUBIO: No? Okay.

12 Also, you indicated that you have three

13 nephews that have -- were they actually convicted of

14 the crime?


16 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Convicted of armed

17 robbery?

18 Did you go to -- was there a, a trial?


20 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Did you go and, and

21 listen, and watch it?

22 Okay. Did you talk to relatives about it?

23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MAYES: Well, it was talks

24 amongst the family, but to be -- I wasn’t really

25 interested.

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1 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And to your knowledge,

2 did, did you feel that they were treated fairly?


4 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And then juror number six,

5 you indicated, when you first got selected to sit in,

6 in these chairs, that you have a plane ticket to go to

7 North Africa, correct?

8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HARKATI: Correct.

9 MS. RUBIO: All right. And did -- and did

10 you indicate, that is non-refundable?

11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HARKATI: Yeah, it’s not

12 refundable.

13 MS. RUBIO: Okay.

14 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HARKATI: Actually, I’m

15 going for a wedding. It’s my only niece’s wedding.

16 MS. RUBIO: It’s your niece, okay. Your only

17 niece’s wedding.

18 And, and when was it, that you said that is?

19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HARKATI: It’s May 21st.

20 So, I’m flying this Sunday.

21 MS. RUBIO: Okay. All right. And it sounds

22 like it will be a joyous occasion?

23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HARKATI: Yeah.

24 MS. RUBIO: Hopefully, right?

25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HARKATI: Hopefully.

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1 MS. RUBIO: And then I know, juror number

2 twelve, and I’m sorry, I’m looking at, I’m looking at

3 my notes, it’s a lot to remember, so sometimes I have

4 to refresh my own, my own memory.

5 You indicated that you have an issue with a

6 baby sitter, right? I think you said you have a two

7 year old?

8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SOBH: Yeah.

9 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And I believe you

10 indicated that it was your wife --

11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SOBH: My girlfriend.

12 MS. RUBIO: Your girlfriend, I apologize, who

13 is home today.

14 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SOBH: Yep.

15 MS. RUBIO: Correct? I think you indicated

16 that ‘cause today she skipped her classes?

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SOBH: Yes.

18 MS. RUBIO: But normally, she can’t continue

19 to do that, correct?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SOBH: Correct.

21 MS. RUBIO: Is she a college student?

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SOBH: No, high school.

23 MS. RUBIO: High school. Okay.

24 And the -- ‘cause obviously, school’s not

25 out, for the year, correct?

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2 MS. RUBIO: All right. Is there anyone else,

3 if you are selected, is there anyone else that can

4 watch your child?


6 MS. RUBIO: Who -- how do you normally do

7 this?

8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SOBH: Normally, we would

9 have a sitter. But now that I’m out of school, I’m --

10 and the baby, so the sitter is busy now. We don’t have

11 a sitter any more.

12 MS. RUBIO: You don’t, normally, you don’t

13 use a sitter?

14 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SOBH: Normally, we did use

15 a sitter. Now, we don’t have a sitter.

16 MS. RUBIO: Any more?


18 MS. RUBIO: Okay.

19 And then juror number eight, you, you spoke

20 to us a little bit ago, I’m sorry -- that’s you. Well,

21 I know, you’re looking at the numbers, right, trying to

22 count.

23 When -- and you talked about what sounded

24 like a pretty awful ordeal, that happened with you and

25 your now wife, correct?

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1 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WRIGHT: Uh-huh.

2 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And I’m very sorry to hear

3 that.

4 Was there ever a, a criminal court case?

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WRIGHT: Oh, they never

6 found the people. They found my vehicle a couple days

7 later, that was it.

8 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And I will, I will let

9 everyone know that this case does not involve an

10 allegation of a firearm, so there’s not an allegation

11 that someone shot someone, or threatened anyone with a

12 hand gun.

13 That having been said, specifically back to

14 you, juror number eight, having been through that

15 situation, do you think -- first of all, do you

16 nder -- you understand that this is an entirely

17 different case, involving people that you never met,

18 correct?

19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WRIGHT: Mm-hmm.

20 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And of course, as we sit

21 here now, the defendant, Mr. Terrance, is, as everybody

22 knows, even though the, the real courtroom is not

23 really like T.V., one thing that is like T.V. is,

24 people, when they sit there, they’re not considered

25 guilty.

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1 Right now, he’s considered innocent, unless

2 and until proven guilty.

3 To -- do you understand that concept?

4 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WRIGHT: Yes.

5 MS. RUBIO: Okay. So, having through the

6 awful ordeal that you went through, do you think that

7 you would be able to be fair, listening to all of the

8 evidence towards Mr. Terrance, who you don’t know?

9 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WRIGHT: I don’t think I

10 could be fair and impartial. I’m opinionated, I, you

11 know, I’m a facts guy, I’ve been, you know, in quite a

12 few situations. I just don’t think I could really give

13 him a good, you know, fair, neutral opinion on it.

14 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Thank you. I appreciate,

15 I appreciate your honesty.

16 And then juror number nine, you talked a

17 little bit, also, about -- you indicated that you have

18 been, you were the victim of an armed robbery.


20 MS. RUBIO: Which I’m sure was awful.

21 And then you also indicated that you have

22 various Police friends --


24 MS. RUBIO: And specifically, I think you

25 referred to the person as, as your best friend, or one

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1 of your closest friends, who was a Police Officer in

2 New Jersey?


4 MS. RUBIO: Okay.

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: He’s retired

6 from New Jersey, but he’s, he’s here now, livin’ in

7 Detroit.

8 MS. RUBIO: And -- okay. And so, do you see,

9 you speak often?

10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: We see each

11 other every week.

12 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And do you, in, in those

13 communications, in all the time you’ve known him, did

14 he sometimes tell you what, what people often refer to

15 as, war stories? Stories about the job?


17 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And did those Police

18 stories he told you influence your opinion, one way or

19 the other, about Police?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: Some of the

21 stories did.

22 MS. RUBIO: And did, did those stories

23 influence your opinion, one way or the other, about

24 crime, and the criminal justice system?


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1 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And do you -- I’ll ask you

2 the same thing that I indicated to juror number

3 eight -- I, I -- you, you do understand that, that the

4 defendant, Mr. Terrance --


6 MS. RUBIO: Is of course, no one who has been

7 involved in any of those stories you’ve heard about?

8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: Exactly, yes.

9 MS. RUBIO: And, and the defendant, Mr.

10 Terrance, as he sits there now, is innocent unless and

11 until, until he’s proven guilty, correct?

12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: Correct.

13 MS. RUBIO: Okay. So, do you think you’d be

14 able to sit and listen to all, all the, all of the

15 testimony, and put aside personal stories that people

16 have told you, that have nothing to do with this, and

17 be fair and impartial towards myself, meaning the

18 Prosecution, as well as giving Mr. Terrance a fair

19 shake?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: I think so.

21 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Thank you. Thank you, so

22 much.

23 Now, a lot, I think several of you did raise

24 your hands, and indicate having Police relatives, or

25 friends.

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1 I know that you, juror number two, indicated

2 specifically that your brother-in-law is at Midland,

3 correct?


5 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And I believe he’s pretty

6 high up, Assistant Police Chief?


8 MS. RUBIO: Is that what you said? Okay.

9 So, I think it would probably be fair to say

10 that he, he has probably, in the whole time you’ve

11 known him, talked about work a little bit, here and

12 there? Or not really?

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: I, I know that he

14 was in squad, but I never really discussed cases with

15 him, anything like that.

16 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And do you consider

17 yourself someone to have respect for the work the

18 Police do?


20 MS. RUBIO: Okay. But there will be an

21 instruction, if -- should you be selected, the Judge,

22 for everyone, the Judge will give what are called

23 instructions. The Judge will read the law that

24 everyone is required to follow.

25 And one of the instructions that the Judge

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1 will read is that a Police Officer’s testimony is to be

2 taken in the same way as any other witness, meaning

3 that just because someone’s a Police Officer, you don’t

4 say to yourself, oh, wow, they’re the Police, so it has

5 to be true.

6 Do you, do you understand that concept?

7 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: Yes, I -- we’re

8 all human beings, so --

9 MS. RUBIO: Okay.

10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: There’s good and

11 there’s bad.

12 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And so, do you believe

13 that, despite your connection with knowing Police

14 personnel, that you’d be able to be fair and impartial,

15 in the trial, but also towards Police testimony?


17 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Thank you so much.

18 Now, that having been said, I’m sure that

19 there are plenty of us that have had a, a not so great

20 experience with Police.

21 Anyone ever been pulled over for speeding?

22 Show of hands?

23 Anyone ever been infuriated when you’re

24 pulled over by the Police, especially let’s say, it’s

25 rush hour, and you’re thinking to yourself, you

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1 seriously have nothing better to do, but sit on the

2 side of the road, behind a bush, and wait, wait for me

3 to go a whopping, you know, ten miles over? Who cares,

4 what if I’m going fifteen miles over? There’s crime,

5 there’s crime going on.

6 Anyone ever felt that way?

7 Show of hands. Lots of folks, even the

8 Officer in charge.

9 Now, that having been said, is there anyone

10 who feels like they’ve had such a nasty experience with

11 Police, that you would not be able to fair and

12 impartial, when listening to testimony involving

13 Police?

14 In other words, you’d sit there, and look at

15 that Officer, and say, you know, those dirty rotten

16 scoundrels, that, you know, they, they just hand out

17 tickets. I, I don’t believe anything he says.

18 Does anyone here feel that that’s instantly

19 how you would feel, about the Police, as soon as you

20 heard testimony from Police?

21 There’s no hands. Okay.

22 Now, I know that you, juror number thirteen,

23 indicated that, it sounds like you have not had a good

24 experience with the criminal justice system.

25 You indicated that you have a family member

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1 who is serving quite a bit of time, in prison, correct?

2 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOANN BROWN: Yes.

3 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And you don’t feel that he

4 should be there, correct?

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOANN BROWN: Correct.

6 MS. RUBIO: Okay. So, do you -- again, and

7 I’ll ask you this, I, I’ve said this a couple times,

8 but I need to hear it from you.

9 You understand, of course, that this case is

10 gonna involve no one that you’ve -- no one to do with

11 your relative, and no one you’ve ever seen or heard

12 from before, correct?

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOANN BROWN: Yeah.

14 MS. RUBIO: Okay. So, this is an entirely

15 different than that of your relative. Do you think

16 that, given that information, you would be able to put

17 aside that experience, and be fair and impartial for

18 this case?

19 I, I’m so sorry, people are coughing. I

20 couldn’t --

21 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOANN BROWN: I, I don’t

22 know.

23 MS. RUBIO: You said, you, you don’t know?

24 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOANN BROWN: My nephew’s

25 doin’ forty to sixty, and he didn’t kill nobody, or

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1 nothin’.

2 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And so, you don’t think

3 you could be fair, here?

4 Okay. Thank you. I, I appreciate your

5 honesty.

6 This case, you already know, from listening

7 to, a little bit of what the Judge has said, that this

8 is a murder case.

9 This case involves the defendant being

10 accused of murdering a young woman named Dalona

11 Tillman.

12 And during the course of this case, there

13 will be various testimony.

14 There will also be testimony from Police,

15 civilians, but ultimately, there will also be testimony

16 from a Medical Examiner.

17 There -- that Medical Examiner will talk

18 about how Ms. Tillman died, and there will be

19 photographs of Ms. Tillman, who is, of course,

20 deceased.

21 There will be photographs of -- from what you

22 call Crime Scene Services, that would be Evidence

23 Technicians, people that responded, and took

24 photographs of her, deceased, right shortly after she

25 died.

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1 And then, of course, photographs of the home.

2 Some of these might be considered graphic, to

3 some people.

4 Is there anyone here that just knowing that

5 you’ll have to see those photographs --

6 THE COURT: Counsel, can you approach?

7 MS. RUBIO: Yes.



10 MS. RUBIO: All right.

11 I apologize, that’s something the Judge

12 doesn’t want me to talk about.

13 So, moving on --

14 MR. HARRIS: May we approach, Your Honor?

15 THE COURT: Yeah.



18 MS. RUBIO: The Judge is also gonna read you

19 the law about, you already heard the Judge talk about

20 some, I think the Judge even mention the word,

21 elements. Elements of a crime, you probably heard the

22 Judge say that, when he read what the defendant is

23 accused of doing.

24 If you’re selected, you’re gonna hear the

25 Judge read these again in the beginning of the case,

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1 and in the end of the case.

2 This is ultimately what I am -- what I am

3 charged with showing that the defendant has done.

4 It is, of course, my job. I always like to

5 tell people, lots of times, that the, there really

6 aren’t many similarities to the real, this being real

7 life, and T.V.

8 A lot of us have seen Law and Order. Oddly

9 enough, even though this is what I do for a living, I

10 love that show.

11 I probably love it because --

12 THE COURT: Your question is?

13 MS. RUBIO: Okay. I, I’m sorry, can we

14 approach?

15 THE COURT: No. I want you to ask the jurors

16 a question.

17 MS. RUBIO: Okay. I, I really need to

18 approach, at this point --

19 THE COURT: Counsel --

20 MS. RUBIO: Or I need to make --

21 THE COURT: I’m ordering you to ask a

22 question to the jurors.

23 MS. RUBIO: Okay. I don’t even know where I

24 was, so just give me a second. I’m sorry.

25 THE COURT: You were asking about elements.

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1 MS. RUBIO: The difference -- anyway,

2 there -- it’s very different being here, than seeing

3 T.V. dramas.

4 And one of the things that ultimately, if you

5 are selected, you are gonna be the ultimate finders of

6 the facts. It will be up to you to decide, in

7 listening to all the testimony, whether you believe the

8 testimony that you hear.

9 And if there are Exhibits, it will be up to

10 you to evaluate, and look at the Exhibits.

11 It will be up to the Judge to read you the

12 law.

13 And then, of course, as the Judge --

14 THE COURT: Counsel, counsel, can you ask the

15 jurors a question?

16 MS. RUBIO: Okay. I can, I can try, Judge.

17 It’s just, it’s just hard because you keep interrupting

18 my flow, and then I lose my train of thought. It’s

19 difficult.

20 THE COURT: Okay.

21 MS. RUBIO: Okay.

22 THE COURT: I’m gonna give you one last

23 opportunity to ask a question.

24 MS. RUBIO: So one of the --

25 THE COURT: If you don’t want that

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1 opportunity, we’ll go to Mr. Harris.

2 MS. RUBIO: One of the things the Judge is

3 gonna read to you, are the instructions on the law.

4 The law consists of these crimes. Every crime is made

5 up of elements.

6 And the elements, let’s just say that a crime

7 has --

8 THE COURT: Miss Rubio -- can all of you all

9 follow the law that I instruct you on, in this case?

10 If you can’t, can you please raise your hand

11 for me.

12 Seeing no hands.

13 Your next question?

14 MS. RUBIO: So, let’s say that an, that an

15 element is a hamburger. Let’s just say you have a

16 hamburger for dinner.

17 Does anyone -- who likes hamburgers?

18 Anybody?

19 Okay. Juror number two raised his hand.

20 So, a hamburger is, just say, a burger, being

21 the meat, and then a bun, do you agree, juror number

22 two?

23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: I do.

24 MS. RUBIO: That that is a bare bones

25 hamburger?

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2 MS. RUBIO: Do you like anything else on a

3 hamburger?

4 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: Sure.

5 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Let’s just say you like

6 mustard, to make it easy.

7 But you agree, a hamburger is the meat patty,

8 and the bun, correct?

9 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: Correct.

10 MS. RUBIO: So, the mustard is not necessary,

11 but you like it?


13 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Let’s just say, let’s just

14 say, to make it easy.

15 So, with here, the Judge is gonna read the

16 elements. There may ultimately be other things that

17 you want, when the end of this whole case is over, but

18 I’m not required to show anything other than the

19 elements.

20 Does everybody understand that concept?

21 People are shaking their heads.

22 Does someone not understand that concept?

23 Juror number fourteen, you look like you have

24 a face. Are you sure?

25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR AUBRIEANNA COLEMAN: I’m

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1 sure.

2 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Great. Thank you.

3 Has anyone ever -- here ever, here, been on a

4 diet?

5 Okay.

6 Has anyone ever had a hard time adhering to

7 the diet?

8 Well, I’ve been on about twenty diets, and

9 probably will be on twenty more. And often times,

10 like, if like I’m gonna go out to dinner, for example,

11 and someone orders dessert. And I say to myself, I’m

12 not gonna order dessert. But the cake comes, it is set

13 on the table, with three or four forks.

14 And I have the opportunity to think about it,

15 if I’m gonna pick up that fork, take, and take a bite

16 of that cake.

17 So, I’m able to think about it, for I don’t

18 know, five or ten seconds. I’d probably take a bite of

19 the cake.

20 Does anyone here disagree with the idea that

21 I had the, I had those seconds to contemplate.

22 Does everyone understand what I’m asking?

23 I, that I had a second to think about it.

24 I mean, does anyone here think that you would

25 have no ability to, to control yourself, and thing,

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1 even for a second, in your mind?

2 No? And that’s, I see you, juror number

3 five.

4 You, you agree with what I’m saying? You’re

5 able to think about it for a second, correct?

6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CROCKETT: Yes.

7 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Another thing you’re gonna

8 hear, and ultimately the Judge will instruct you on, is

9 reasonable -- the concept of reasonable doubt.

10 I, I am required to prove the case beyond a

11 reasonable doubt.

12 That is not beyond all doubt. You may have

13 heard the expression, probably on T.V., beyond the

14 shadow of a doubt.

15 That is not applicable here.

16 The concept, the legal concept is beyond a

17 reasonable doubt.

18 So, an example I would use, we’ve all been

19 sitting in here for a while. Some of you all have been

20 here for some hours, probably, if you got here early in

21 the morning, went to the jury room, came up here.

22 And in here, there’s no windows, correct?

23 So, nobody has any idea of what the weather

24 is like outside right now. Does everybody agree with

25 that?

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2 MS. RUBIO: Okay.

3 THE COURT: Three minutes, counsel.

4 MS. RUBIO: Let’s say that somebody comes in

5 here, right, right now, somebody just walks into the

6 courtroom, and they have a rain coat, they have an

7 umbrella, and they’re all wet, from head to toe, and

8 they’re shaking off their umbrella, and the rain coat

9 is wet.

10 What does anybody think that that signifies?

11 PROSPECTIVE JURORS: It’s rainin’ outside.

12 MS. RUBIO: That it’s raining outside.

13 Does anybody think that that’s not what

14 happened?

15 Raise your hand.

16 Okay.

17 So, even though you didn’t see it, with your

18 own eyes, juror number nine, that -- you indicated

19 that, it’s raining outside? That’s what it means?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: That’s

21 correct.

22 MS. RUBIO: Okay.

23 Thank you.

24 I don’t have any other questions.

25 THE COURT: Mr. Harris?

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1 MR. HARRIS: Miss Lindsey-Rogers, if you were

2 asked to make a decision in this case right now, what

3 would your verdict be?

4 PROSPECTIVE JUROR LINDSEY-ROGERS: I don’t

5 know, I haven’t heard any, the testimony, or evidence.

6 You need evidence. I couldn’t make a decision right --

7 MR. HARRIS: Okay. Miss Hannah, you’re asked

8 to make a decision right now. What would your verdict

9 be?

10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HANNAH: I’d say, not

11 guilty.

12 MR. HARRIS: Thank you, Miss --

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HANNAH: Until proven

14 guilty.

15 MR. HARRIS: Thank you, Miss Hannah.

16 Miss Chami, is it?

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CHAMI: Mm-hmm.

18 MR. HARRIS: Chami? You’d agree with Miss

19 Lindsey-Rogers, or do you agree with Miss Hannah?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CHAMI: Miss Lindsey-

21 Rogers.

22 MR. HARRIS: You agree with Miss Lindsey-

23 Rogers?

24 How many agree with Miss Lindsey-Rogers?

25 Okay. So, I see a sign of about seven or

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1 eight hands.

2 Mr. Sobh?


4 MR. HARRIS: Sobh. You didn’t have your hand

5 up. Why?

6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SOBH: I agree with --

7 MR. HARRIS: Miss Hannah, right?


9 MR. HARRIS: You’d have your hand up. Miss

10 Hannah says, I’d have to find him not guilty, right?

11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SOBH: That’s what I agree

12 with.

13 MR. HARRIS: Miss Hannah, why’d you have to

14 find him not guilty?

15 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HANNAH: Well, I’d have to

16 know all the evidence, first.

17 MR. HARRIS: Have you heard any evidence,

18 Miss --

19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HANNAH: No.

20 MR. HARRIS: Hannah?

21 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HANNAH: No.

22 MR. HARRIS: Have you heard any evidence,

23 Miss Lindsey-Rogers?

24 PROSPECTIVE JUROR LINDSEY-ROGERS: No.

25 MR. HARRIS: Have you heard any evidence, Mr.

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1 Sobh?


3 MR. HARRIS: Miss Chami, have you heard any

4 evidence?

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CHAMI: No.

6 MR. HARRIS: This man sits here, innocent.

7 And he remains innocent, all through this trial.

8 All through this trial.

9 Can you all keep your minds focused on that,

10 that he is innocent until the Judge sends you in to

11 deliberate, and you come back with a verdict?

12 Do you understand that?


14 MR. HARRIS: Can I see a show of hands that

15 everybody understands that?

16 So, no matter what happens during this trial,

17 ‘til this Judge, Judge Cox says, go back there and

18 deliberate, and come back with a verdict, he’s not

19 guilty.

20 No matter what evidence you hear, he’s not

21 guilty, and you have to keep that mindset.

22 Can you all do that?


24 MR. HARRIS: Mr. Brown?

25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: Yes?

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1 MR. HARRIS: What do you expect the defense

2 to do in this case?

3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: Prove that

4 he’s not guilty.

5 MR. HARRIS: Okay. Miss Crockett, what do

6 you expect the defense to do in this case?

7 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CROCKETT: Show that, show

8 that he’s not guilty. Show to prove that he’s not

9 guilty.

10 MR. HARRIS: Okay.

11 Mr. Devoto, what do you expect the defense to

12 do in this case?

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: To refute any

14 elements that come up, that say that he is guilty.

15 MR. HARRIS: What does that mean, Mr. Devoto,

16 refute?

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: Well, it means,

18 whatever’s brought up by the Prosecution, your

19 responsibility is to make sure that whatever she brings

20 up is not believed, or, or doesn’t reflect really on

21 your case.

22 MR. HARRIS: Do you agree with Mr. Brown, and

23 excuse me, Miss Crockett, that I -- we have to prove

24 that my client’s not guilty?

25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: No, because

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1 it’s -- he’s already not guilty. They have to prove

2 that he is guilty.

3 MR. HARRIS: Okay.

4 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DEVOTO: You don’t have to

5 prove anything.

6 You could sit there, and do nothing, and if

7 she did a really horrible, then he would go free, if he

8 was innocent.

9 MR. HARRIS: So, you’re early -- oh, yeah,

10 oh, geeze.

11 You just realized something. Tell us all

12 what you just realized?

13 THE COURT: Okay.

14 Let, let me just interrupt here.

15 I read you the following, a while ago:

16 The Prosecutor must prove each element of the

17 crime beyond a reasonable doubt.

18 The defendant is not required to prove his

19 innocence, or to do anything.

20 If you find that the Prosecutor has not

21 proven every element beyond a reasonable doubt, then

22 you must find the defendant not guilty.

23 Is there anybody on this jury that cannot

24 follow that law, that instruction? If so, raise your

25 hand?

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1 Seeing no hands.

2 Mr. Harris?

3 MR. HARRIS: Does everybody understand that

4 instruction?


6 MR. HARRIS: That’s a difficult concept to

7 understand.

8 This is not tennis. The ball doesn’t go back

9 and forth.

10 They have the burden of proof.

11 You can hold the Prosecutor to the burden of

12 proof, correct? Everybody?


14 MR. HARRIS: This involves the death of a

15 young lady.

16 Miss Har --

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HARKATI: Harkati.

18 MR. HARRIS: Harkati?

19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HARKATI: Mm-hmm.

20 MR. HARRIS: Because this is a young woman,

21 who fell victim to something, would you, just on the

22 sheer fact that she is a woman, hold that against my

23 client?

24 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HARKATI: No.

25 MR. HARRIS: How about you, Miss Coleman?

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1 Just on the fact that this is a woman, would you hold

2 that against my client?

3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR AUBRIEANNA COLEMAN: No.

4 MR. HARRIS: Miss Mayes?


6 MR. HARRIS: As you look away from me, right,

7 Miss Mayes?


9 MR. HARRIS: No? Okay.

10 Miss Mayes, you understand that he is not

11 guilty, at this point in time, correct? You understand

12 that, right?

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MAYES: Oh, yes, until --

14 yes.

15 MR. HARRIS: You understand?

16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MAYES: Oh, yes.


18 Judge Cox, I’m sure, is gonna read you an

19 instruction that says: You can’t be biased.

20 A lot of things happen out there, but you’ve

21 got to pay just particular attention to the evidence,

22 and let the evidence guide you.

23 Can you all do that?


25 MR. HARRIS: Yes?

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2 MR. HARRIS: Show of hands?

3 Miss Brown, I understand that you had this

4 situation with your, is it your nephew?

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOANN BROWN: My nephew.

6 MR. HARRIS: Your nephew. Were you present

7 at any of the court proceedings?

8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOANN BROWN: Just one.

9 MR. HARRIS: Okay. Did he go to trial?

10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOANN BROWN: Yes.


12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOANN BROWN: And a jury

13 convict --

14 MR. HARRIS: Well, I’m -- please just answer

15 my question.

16 Were you, were you present at the incident,

17 yes or no?

18 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOANN BROWN: No.

19 MR. HARRIS: Okay. So, you really don’t know

20 what happened, correct, ‘cause you weren’t there?

21 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOANN BROWN: All I know

22 is, a jury convicted --

23 MR. HARRIS: You weren’t there, correct? You

24 don’t know what happened? Okay.

25 Can you keep an open mind, as to the facts of

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1 this case, and not let the facts of your nephew’s case

2 affect you in your decision?

3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOANN BROWN: I sayin’, I

4 try.

5 MR. HARRIS: Thank you.

6 No further questions, Your Honor.

7 THE COURT: Challenges for cause, to the

8 People?

9 MS. RUBIO: Your Honor, I would ask that

10 juror numbers three and six be excused for cause.

11 Did the Court want me to elaborate. I --

12 I’m, I’m not indicating that they said they

13 couldn’t be fair and impartial. I guess I’m talking

14 about their commitments.

15 I know that juror number three -- I’m sorry,

16 I apologize. Juror -- yes, I’m, I’m right. It is

17 juror number three. She indicated there’s no one else

18 to take her grandmother to dialysis; and juror number

19 six had the non-refundable plane ticket.

20 THE COURT: I, I recog -- I have heard what

21 they said about their commitments.

22 MS. RUBIO: All right.

23 THE COURT: And I am denying your request to

24 dismiss them for cause.

25 MS. RUBIO: Okay.

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1 Thank you.


3 defense?

4 MR. HARRIS: Your Honor, I’d ask that juror

5 number eight, Mr. Wright, be challenged for cause.

6 He indicated that --

7 THE COURT: I, I recall his testimony.

8 MR. HARRIS: Okay.

9 THE COURT: Or his responses.

10 Mr. Wright, I am excusing you from this jury,

11 for cause.

12 You can leave, return to the first floor.

13 Number thirteen, Ms. Brown, I’m excusing you

14 from this jury, also. You can return to the first

15 floor.

16 Peremptory challenges, to the People, and you

17 can exercise multiple challenges.


19 The People would like to thank and excuse

20 jurors number three and six.

21 THE COURT: Is that Ms. Mayes, and Ms.

22 Harkati, Harkati?

23 MS. RUBIO: Yes.

24 THE COURT: Okay.

25 You are excused from this -- from jury

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1 service. You can return to the first floor.

2 Give me one second, Mr. Harris.

3 MR. HARRIS: Okay.

4 THE COURT: Okay.

5 Peremptory challenges to the defense?

6 MR. HARRIS: Your Honor, we’d like to thank

7 and excuse juror seated in seat number nine, Mr. Brown.

8 THE COURT: Mr. Brown, you are excused, at

9 this time. And Mr. Harris -- thank you for being here.

10 You’re gonna have to return to the first floow.

11 You can --

12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JAMES BROWN: Okay.

13 THE COURT: Leave.

14 Mr. Harris, you can exercise multiple

15 peremptories, at this time.

16 MR. HARRIS: And we’d like to thank and

17 excuse juror seated in seat number two.

18 THE COURT: Number two?

19 Mr. Devoto, thank you for being here today.

20 I’m gonna excuse you. You can return to the first

21 floor jury assembly room.

22 Madame Clerk?

23 CLERK: Seat number one, Clarence Peterson.

24 Seat number two, Samuel Williams.

25 Seat number three, Cynthia Moore.

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1 Seat number six, Kelly Drake.

2 Seat number eight, Sandra Mc Carty.

3 THE COURT: Excuse me.

4 Ma’am, are you Miss Moore?

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: Yes.

6 THE COURT: You were called to seat number

7 three.

8 CLERK: Seat number nine, Michael Beason.

9 Seat number eleven, Alice Faunce.

10 Seat number thirteen, Nina Cilia.

11 THE COURT: Okay.

12 Mr. Peterson, good morning to you.

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: Good morning,

14 sir.


16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: Romulus.


18 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: I Pastor a

19 church, and I also work a part-time job, which I’m the

20 only one there, loadin’ and unloadin’ trucks.

21 THE COURT: Okay.

22 Are you married?

23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: Yes, I am.


25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: My wife is a

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1 care giver.

2 THE COURT: Okay.

3 What’s your highest level of education?

4 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: Some college.


6 Mr. Williams, can you tell us where you live?

7 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WILLIAMS: City of

8 Plymouth.


10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WILLIAMS: Director of

11 Sales, Technology.

12 THE COURT: Okay.

13 Are you married?

14 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WILLIAMS: Yes.


16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WILLIAMS: Retired, C.P.A.

17 THE COURT: Okay.


19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WILLIAMS: Bachelor.


21 Ms. Moore, good morning. Can you tell us

22 where you live?

23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: Inkster.

24 THE COURT: What do you do for a living?

25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: I work in a store.

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1 THE COURT: Okay.

2 Are you married?

3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: No.


5 education?

6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: Associates.

7 THE COURT: Associates Degree? Okay.

8 Miss Drake, good morning to you.

9 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DRAKE: Good morning.


11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DRAKE: Detroit.


13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DRAKE: A Registered Nurse.

14 MR. HARRIS: I couldn’t --

15 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DRAKE: Registered Nurse.

16 THE COURT: A Registered Nurse? Okay.

17 You -- this is an old building, and this is a

18 large room, and the acoustics are far from optimal

19 here. So, please try to project your voice, so that

20 everybody can hear you, okay? Thank you.

21 Are you married?

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DRAKE: Yes.


24 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DRAKE: He’s a factory

25 worker.

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1 THE COURT: Okay.


3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DRAKE: Associates Degree.

4 THE COURT: Okay.

5 Ms. Mc Carty?

6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MC CARTY: Yes.


8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MC CARTY: Good morning.


10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MC CARTY: Westland.


12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MC CARTY: I own a heating

13 and air conditioning business.

14 THE COURT: Okay.

15 Are you married?



18 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MC CARTY: He works for the

19 business.

20 THE COURT: Okay.


22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MC CARTY: High school.

23 THE COURT: Okay.

24 Mr. Beason, can you tell us where you live?

25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR BEASON: Southgate.

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2 PROSPECTIVE JUROR BEASON: I’m a Police

3 Officer.

4 THE COURT: Okay.

5 Are you married?

6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR BEASON: Yes.


8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR BEASON: She’s a car rep,

9 for automotive.



12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR BEASON: Bachelors Degree.

13 THE COURT: Okay.

14 Ms. Faunce?

15 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FAUNCE: Yes.

16 THE COURT: Good morning to you. Can you

17 tell us where you live?

18 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FAUNCE: Westland.


20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FAUNCE: Unemployed.

21 THE COURT: Are you married?

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FAUNCE: yes.


24 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FAUNCE: Tool and die

25 maker.

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1 THE COURT: Okay.


3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FAUNCE: High school.

4 THE COURT: Okay.

5 Is it Ms. Cilia? Did I pronounce that

6 correctly?

7 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CILIA: Yes. Yes.

8 THE COURT: Okay.

9 Where do you live?

10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CILIA: In Canton.


12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CILIA: I waitress at Leo’s

13 Coney Island.

14 THE COURT: You waitress at?

15 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CILIA: At Leo’s Coney

16 Island.

17 THE COURT: Okay.

18 Are you married?

19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CILIA: No.


21 education?

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CILIA: I’m in college

23 right now.

24 THE COURT: Okay.

25 All right.

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1 Mr. Peterson, would you have raised your hand

2 in response to any of the questions that were asked

3 earlier this morning?

4 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: Yes.

5 THE COURT: Okay.

6 And do you remember what those questions

7 were? I’ll remind you, if you don’t remember what,

8 what they were?

9 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: Okay. Have I --

10 have we ever experienced any tragics in our family?

11 Yes, I had two nephews, in different

12 instances, were brutally married -- murdered, with a

13 weapon.

14 THE COURT: Okay.

15 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: With a weapon.

16 THE COURT: Okay.

17 So, you’re talking about, in response to the

18 question about being victims of crime?

19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: Victim of crime.

20 THE COURT: Okay.

21 So, you’ve had two nephews that were the

22 victims of crime.

23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: And I also have

24 a son, who’s mentally retarded. A crime was committed

25 on him, and they said there wasn’t enough evidence.

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1 THE COURT: Okay.

2 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: He couldn’t

3 defend his self, so --

4 THE COURT: Okay.

5 Would you have raised your hand in response

6 to any other questions?

7 For example, have you served as a juror

8 before?

9 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: No, I haven’t.

10 THE COURT: Okay.

11 Do you have close relationships with any

12 Police Officers, anybody in law enforcement?

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: No, I haven’t.

14 THE COURT: Do you have any close friends or

15 relatives that work in the court system, whether

16 they’re lawyers, or Judges, Court Administrators,

17 things of that sort?

18 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: No, Your Honor.

19 THE COURT: Okay.

20 Has anybody in your family ever been

21 arrested, or convicted of a crime, other than you know,

22 a minor traffic offense?

23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: My grandson.


25 Was he con --

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1 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: A felony,

2 breakin’ and enterin’, and to do bodily harm.

3 THE COURT: Okay.

4 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: I guess that’s

5 what it is.

6 THE COURT: Okay.

7 So, you’ve told us about close family members

8 that were the victims of crime.

9 And you’ve heard what this case is about,

10 haven’t you?

11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: Right.

12 THE COURT: You understand what this case

13 is --

14 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: Right.

15 THE COURT: Is about?

16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: Yes, Your Honor.

17 Yes.

18 THE COURT: Okay.

19 Can you separate out those very unfortunate

20 experiences that you referenced, occurred to your

21 nephews, and to your son; and in this case, can you pay

22 close attention to all the evidence; can you keep an

23 open mind throughout this case, and not prejudge

24 anybody or anything; can you follow the law that I give

25 you in this case? Can you do that?

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1 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: Yes, Your Honor.

2 THE COURT: Okay.

3 So, can you be a fair and impartial juror, to

4 the Prosecution, and same to the defense?

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: To be honest

6 with you, sometimes what happened kind of weighs on my

7 mind, and with the things that are goin’ on, and people

8 are hurt with weapons, that it disturbs me a lot.

9 THE COURT: Okay.

10 Well, the question, with all due respect, is

11 this case. This is not about the outside world.

12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: I understand

13 that.

14 THE COURT: This is about a case where the

15 jury is asked to follow the law. To listen to all the

16 evidence in this case, and to be fair and impartial to

17 the Prosecution and the defense.

18 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: I can.

19 THE COURT: You can do that?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: I can do that.

21 THE COURT: And you’ll do that in this case?

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: I’ll do it to

23 the best of my ability?

24 THE COURT: Thank you, sir.

25 All right.

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1 Mr. Williams -- I’m sorry.

2 You would not have raised your hand in

3 response to any other questions, is that correct?

4 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: No.


6 Mr. Williams, would you have raised your hand

7 in response to any of my questions, earlier?

8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WILLIAMS: A few. A, a few

9 of them.

10 THE COURT: Okay.

11 Do you remember what they were?

12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WILLIAMS: I know a few

13 attorneys.

14 My brother-in-law is a fraud investigator for

15 Blue Cross/Blue Shield.

16 THE COURT: Okay.

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WILLIAMS: There’s been,

18 you know, some miscellaneous crimes in the family.

19 Stolen cars, things like that. So --

20 THE COURT: Okay.

21 You’ve heard this question asked many times.

22 Recognizing that maybe some people have been convicted

23 of some offenses in your family, recognizing that you

24 know a few attorneys, can you separate those

25 relationships, and those experiences, from this case,

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1 and this courtroom, and can you be the juror that I

2 described, which is a person that is committed to

3 listen to all the evidence, to be fair and impartial,

4 to keep an open mind throughout this case, and to

5 follow the law? Can you do that?


7 THE COURT: Okay.

8 Miss Moore, would you have raised your hand

9 in response to any of my questions?


11 THE COURT: Do you remember what those

12 questions were?

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: I’ve been a juror.

14 THE COURT: Okay.

15 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: My ex-husband was

16 arrested and convicted of a crime.

17 THE COURT: Okay.

18 Anything else?

19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: He also was car

20 jacked and beaten. I had to come and pick him up.

21 THE COURT: He was, or you were?

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: He was.

23 THE COURT: Okay.

24 So, were you a juror in this case -- in this

25 building?

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3 How long ago was that?

4 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: More than fourteen

5 years ago, I know.

6 THE COURT: Okay.

7 Without telling me what the jury decided, did

8 the jury make a decision in that, that case?


10 THE COURT: Okay.


12 THE COURT: Now, you mentioned some of your

13 ex-husband’s experiences.

14 Can you separate out the experiences of your

15 ex-husband, and in this case, be that juror that I’ve

16 described so many times before?

17 The person that commits to everybody here

18 that you’re gonna keep an open mind, you’re gonna

19 follow -- you’re gonna pay close attention to the

20 evidence, you follow the law that I instruct you on.

21 Can you do that?

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: I’d try.


24 Okay.

25 The question is, can you be fair, and can you

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1 be impartial to the Prosecution?

2 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: I repeat, I, I’d

3 try.


5 All right.

6 Ms. Drake, would you have raised your hand in

7 response to any of the questions that were asked

8 earlier?


10 My, my mother is a retired Detroit Police

11 Officer.

12 THE COURT: Okay.

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: I’ve been car

14 jacked by -- at gun point; and I’ve been robbed at gun

15 point.

16 THE COURT: Okay.

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: Never been a juror.


19 Recognizing that you have been the victim of

20 a crime, and we’re here on a, a case where there is, in

21 a, in a criminal court, where there’s allegations of

22 that -- where crimes were committed in this case.

23 Can you separate out your personal

24 experience, of being the victim of a crime, and in this

25 case, pay attention to the evidence that’s presented in

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1 this case, and keep an open mind, and follow the law?



4 Now, the fact that your mother is a former

5 Police Officer, can you assure all of us that you will

6 separate out that relationship with your mother, and

7 knowing that Police Officers are gonna be testifying in

8 this case, can you be that fair and impartial juror?



11 Now, there is a law that I give, at the end

12 of the case, which basically says, that the -- you must

13 hold the testimony of a Police Officer to the sam

14 standards you would hold any other witness to? Meaning

15 that you can’t favor the testimony of a Police Officer,

16 just because he’s a Police Officer, and you can’t

17 disfavor the testimony of a Police Officer, just

18 because he or she, I apologize, is a Police Officer?

19 Can you do that?



22 Ms. Mc Carty, would you have raised your hand

23 in response to any of the questions I asked?


25 THE COURT: Do you remember what they were?

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1 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MC CARTY: Well, the first

2 one is, I’m supposed to have a heart catheterization on

3 Monday morning.

4 THE COURT: Okay.

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MC CARTY: And I know a lot

6 of officers of the Court, I know a lot of Police

7 Officers, had several crimes.


9 All right.

10 So, you have a significant medical procedure?

11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MC CARTY: It’s supposed to

12 be done at eleven o’clock Monday morning.


14 All right.

15 Well, I wish you the best of luck, and I’m

16 gonna excuse you from this case, at this time.

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MC CARTY: Okay. Thank

18 you.


20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MC CARTY: I appreciate

21 that.

22 THE COURT: Good luck to you.

23 You’re gonna have to return to the first

24 floor, the jury assembly room.

25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MC CARTY: Okay. Thank

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1 you.

2 THE COURT: Mr. Beason, would you have raised

3 your hand, in response to any of my questions, other

4 than the obvious that you know Police Officers?

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR BEASON: No, sir.


7 You’ve never been a juror before?

8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR BEASON: I’ve received jury

9 duty, but I never served on one.

10 THE COURT: Okay.

11 All right.

12 You remember the questions that I asked

13 earlier?

14 PROSPECTIVE JUROR BEASON: Yes.


16 And you understand, it’s been represented,

17 that there are gonna be other Police Officers

18 testifying -- there are going to be Police Officers

19 testifying in this case. You understand that?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR BEASON: Yes, sir.


22 Simply stated, despite the fact that you’re a

23 Police Officer, and despite the fact that there are

24 going to be Police Officers testifying in this case,

25 can you assure everybody in this courtroom,

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1 particularly the Prosecution and the defense, that you

2 will be that juror that pays very close attention to

3 all the evidence in this case, that you keep an open

4 mind, you don’t prejudge anybody or anything, that

5 you’ll follow the law that I give you at the conclusion

6 of this case?

7 Will you do that?

8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR BEASON: Absolutely.


10 And you are certain that you will be a fair

11 and impartial juror, to the Prosecution and the

12 defense? Can you -- can you tell us, that’s the case?

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR BEASON: Yes, sir.


15 Ms. Faunce, would you have raised your hand

16 in response to any of my earlier questions?

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FAUNCE: Just one. I was a

18 juror four or five years ago, and it involved a Police

19 Officer.

20 THE COURT: Okay.

21 Was that the only -- would you have raised

22 your hand for any other questions, other than prior

23 jury service?

24 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FAUNCE: No.

25 THE COURT: Okay.

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1 Can you separate out that experience, as a

2 juror, in the past, and in this case --


4 THE COURT: Keep an open mind, and be a fair

5 and impartial juror?



8 Ms. Cilia, am I pronouncing that correctly?

9 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CILIA: Yes.

10 THE COURT: I’m still not sure.



13 Okay.


15 to any of my questions?

16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CILIA: No.

17 THE COURT: Okay.

18 You’ve never been a juror?

19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CILIA: No, I’m just -- I’m

20 nineteen. I’m just a baby, so --


22 Okay.

23 Fair enough.

24 Okay.

25 I certainly, I’m gonna permit the lawyers to

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1 ask you all questions, in a few minutes.

2 But this is probably a good time to take a

3 break.

4 I’m gonna excuse you now.

5 Deputies, should we have these jurors go in

6 here?

7 DEPUTY: Mm-hmm.


9 I would like the jurors seated, to retire to

10 the jury room, for your break.

11 There’s rest rooms in there.

12 And for those of, for those of you that are

13 in the audience, we’re gonna take a fifteen minute

14 break, or so. So, please assemble outside my

15 courtroom, at about twenty minutes before twelve, okay?

16 Thank you.

17 DEPUTY: All rise for the jury.

18 (Whereupon the prospective jurors were

19 excused from the courtroom).


21 (Whereupon a recess was had in the

22 proceedings from 11:22 a.m. to 11:55 a.m.)

23 THE COURT: Okay.

24 We’re back on the record in case number

25 16-001235-FC, People versus Treshaun Terrance.

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1 Your appearances?



4 Harris on behalf of Mr. Treshaun Terrance.

5 THE COURT: Okay.

6 Are we ready to bring our jury back?





11 brought back into the courtroom).


13 THE COURT: Okay.

14 We’re back on the record in case number




18 MR. HARRIS: Good morning, Your Honor, and

19 the jury. Wyatt Harris on behalf of Mr. Treshaun

20 Terrance.

21 THE COURT: Okay.

22 Ms. Rubio?


24 Juror number one, I know that you indicated

25 that you are a Pastor?

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1 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: Mm-hmm.

2 MS. RUBIO: I just wanted to make sure

3 that -- do -- to see whether or not you have any

4 issues, sitting in, sitting in judgment of someone,

5 because obviously, if you’re selected --

6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: Yeah, I, I do.

7 MS. RUBIO: I’m sorry?

8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: Yes.

9 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Now, and I’m sure you

10 understand, the purpose here, of course, if you are

11 selected, would be to listen to all of the evidence,

12 and then for the jury, together, to decide whether or

13 not they believe the defendant -- that you all believe

14 the defendant is guilty, or not guilty?

15 That would be the, the end of your, of your

16 role, after that, okay.

17 And you’re saying, just with that

18 information, and the law that the Judge gives you, you

19 would have an, an issue with deciding that?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: I would have --

21 wouldn’t have no issue with that.

22 MS. RUBIO: You would not have an issue?

23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: I would -- yeah,

24 you know.

25 MS. RUBIO: Okay. So, for purposes of this

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1 criminal proceeding, you would be able to render some

2 kind of a judgment, if you will, either way, regarding

3 the defendant?

4 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: This -- I don’t

5 know what this --

6 THE COURT: Sir, are you able to participate,

7 with the jurors, listen to the evidence, apply the law

8 to the facts you believe in this case, and make a

9 decision, collectively, with the other members of the

10 juror -- jury, as to whether the defendant is guilty,

11 or not guilty, of the crimes that are charged?

12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PETERSON: Yes

13 THE COURT: Okay.

14 MS. RUBIO: Thank you so much, Judge.

15 Juror number six, you indicated that you are

16 a Registered Nurse? Yes?

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DRAKE: Yes.

18 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And what, what type of

19 nurse are you?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DRAKE: At this time, I

21 work in a ambulatory surgical setting.

22 MS. RUBIO: Okay. I didn’t -- I’m sorry,

23 since I’m not a nurse?

24 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DRAKE: So, I schedule

25 surgeries, do minor surgeries, with the physicians.

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1 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And do you work in any

2 kind of emergency capacity?

3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DRAKE: No, ma’am.

4 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Thank you.

5 And juror number three, you indicated that,

6 unfortunately, you’ve had -- your husband, it sounds

7 like, has been both convicted of a crime, and also was

8 a victim of a crime?

9 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: Mm-hmm.

10 MS. RUBIO: Yes?


12 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And I got the idea that

13 was some time ago?


15 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And as far as when your

16 husband was convicted of a crime, did you feel he was

17 treated fairly?

18 MS. RUBIO: Do you understand the question,

19 or --

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: Yeah.

21 MS. RUBIO: Okay.

22 You’re thinking?


24 MS. RUBIO: You do?


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1 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And as far as when he was

2 convicted of a crime, would you be able to set that

3 experience aside, and be fair and impartial, today,

4 towards both me, and Mr. Terrance?

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: Like I told the

6 Judge, I, I would try. I would try.

7 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And as far as the

8 unfortunate incident in which your husband was a victim

9 of crime, is there anything about that experience that

10 would cause you to not be able to be fair and

11 impartial, today?


13 MS. RUBIO: Okay. I believe you indicated

14 that was a car jacking?

15 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: Mm-hmm.

16 MS. RUBIO: Yes?

17 Okay. And you understand, this is not a car

18 jacking?





23 MR. HARRIS: Mr. Williams, do you believe

24 people get up in this witness chair, swear to tell the

25 truth, and lie?

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1 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WILLIAMS: Do I believe

2 that?

3 MR. HARRIS: Yes.


5 MR. HARRIS: You think they lie?

6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WILLIAMS: Some people --

7 MR. HARRIS: Really? They swore to told the

8 truth. Told the Judge, I swear, I’m gonna tell the

9 truth?

10 Get up here, and not tell the truth?

11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WILLIAMS: I think there

12 are, there are people that do do that.

13 MR. HARRIS: Miss Drake, do you believe that?

14 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DRAKE: Do I believe that

15 people --

16 MR. HARRIS: Get up in this witness chair,

17 and don’t tell the truth?

18 PROSPECTIVE JUROR DRAKE: I believe that some

19 people would possibly get in that chair, and not tell

20 the truth?


22 Mr. Williams, do you have any children?

23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WILLIAMS: I do.

24 MR. HARRIS: Older or younger?

25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WILLIAMS: I have a

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1 daughter thirty, and a son twenty-eight.

2 MR. HARRIS: Okay. Let’s take ‘em back to

3 about seven or eight.

4 Could you tell when your children may not

5 have been telling you the truth?

6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WILLIAMS: My daughter,

7 yes; my son, no.

8 MR. HARRIS: Your son’s pretty slick, your

9 daughter, she’d, she’d been caught, huh?

10 How were you able to tell your daughter

11 wasn’t telling you the truth?

12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WILLIAMS: She’d look away.

13 MR. HARRIS: She’d look away. Not look you

14 in the eye?

15 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WILLIAMS: Correct.

16 MR. HARRIS: Okay. And you’d think that’s

17 when, or is that one of the body signs that you might

18 look for for making a determination as to whether

19 somebody’s telling you the truth?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WILLIAMS: Yes, it is. I

21 do it in my profession.

22 MR. HARRIS: You do it in your profession?

23 I forgot, what was your profession?

24 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WILLIAMS: Sales.

25 MR. HARRIS: Sales. Oh, yeah.

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1 I’ll maybe buy somethin’ from you, right?

2 Miss Cilia, you said you were in school?


4 MR. HARRIS: What are you studying?

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CILIA: Energy.

6 MR. HARRIS: Okay. Are you going to classes

7 now?

8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CILIA: I just got done.

9 MR. HARRIS: Okay. Okay. So, this time

10 frame’s not gonna cause you a problem?

11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CILIA: I do work a lot,

12 and I have -- I’m going on vacation soon, for a while.

13 So, I need to make some money before I leave for this

14 trip, for this big trip I’m going on. So --


16 Miss Faunce?

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FAUNCE: Yes?

18 MR. HARRIS: Are you familiar with a Judge

19 Faunce, out in Macomb?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FAUNCE: I believe I’m

21 related, but distant.

22 MR. HARRIS: Okay. Okay. You didn’t mention

23 that during your questioning.

24 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FAUNCE: No, I don’t know

25 her.

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1 MR. HARRIS: Miss Mc Carty --

2 THE COURT: That was number eight.

3 MR. HARRIS: Oh, for cause. I see it, I see

4 it, I’m sorry.

5 Miss Moore, can you be fair and impartial?

6 You, you seem to be hesitating, and we, we want people

7 that will say, yes, I’ll be fair and impartial.

8 If you can’t, be honest with us and tell us

9 you can’t.

10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: It might be ‘cause

11 of the circumstance.

12 MR. HARRIS: It might be because of the

13 circumstances?


15 MR. HARRIS: You mean, the circumstances of

16 this particular case?

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: In relation to

18 my --

19 MR. HARRIS: In relation to your?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: My past

21 circumstances, yes.

22 MR. HARRIS: Okay. Are you talking about the

23 situations with your husband?

24 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: My ex-husband, yes.

25 MR. HARRIS: Your ex-husband?

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2 MR. HARRIS: Specifically, the car jacking?


4 MR. HARRIS: His criminal offense?


6 MR. HARRIS: What was he convicted of?

7 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: Domestic violence.

8 MR. HARRIS: Okay. Okay. So, that brings

9 back memories to you?


11 MR. HARRIS: Okay. I can understand that.

12 And you think that hearing testimony in this

13 case, might affect you, based on the decision -- based

14 on the past history that you had with your husband, in

15 terms of domestic violence?

16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MOORE: Possibly, yeah.

17 MR. HARRIS: Okay. Okay. We appreciate your

18 honesty.

19 Thank you very much, Your Honor.

20 THE COURT: Okay.

21 Challenges for cause, to the People?

22 MS. RUBIO: Pass, Your Honor.


24 defense?

25 MR. HARRIS: Your Honor, I’d like you to

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1 consider juror number three for cause.

2 She indicated -- you heard what she said.

3 She has a little history there.

4 THE COURT: I am going to deny the request to

5 excuse juror number three for cause.

6 Any others?

7 MR. HARRIS: How about juror number one?

8 THE COURT: I, I am going to deny your

9 request to dismiss Mr. Peterson for cause.

10 Any others?


12 THE COURT: Okay.

13 Peremptory challenges, to the People?

14 MS. RUBIO: Thank you. The People would likt

15 to thank and excuse juror number three.

16 THE COURT: Is that Ms. Moore?

17 MS. RUBIO: That is.

18 THE COURT: Ms. Moore, you are excused.

19 You’re gonna have to return to the first floor, okay?

20 Thank you.

21 Counsel, as I mentioned before, you may

22 exercise multiple peremptory challenges.

23 Any others?


25 THE COURT: Okay.

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1 Peremptory challenges, to the defense?

2 MR. HARRIS: I’d like to thank and excuse

3 juror seated in seat number one, Your Honor; and juror

4 seated in seat number nine.

5 THE COURT: Did you say nine?

6 MR. HARRIS: Yes.

7 THE COURT: Okay.

8 Mr. Beason, you are excused. And I think you

9 said, Mr. Peterson?

10 MR. HARRIS: Peterson, correct.

11 THE COURT: Number one.

12 Thank you, both gentlemen. You may return to

13 the jury room -- the jury assignment room on the first

14 floor.

15 Madame Clerk?

16 CLERK: Seat number one, Gwenetta Cook.

17 Seat number three, Morgan Spencer.

18 Seat number eight, Theodore Mills.

19 Seat number nine, excuse me if I mess this

20 up. Fatme Ftouni?

21 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FTOUNI: Yes.

22 CLERK: Can you pronounce your last name,

23 please?

24 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FTOUNI: Ftouni

25 CLERK: First name?

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1 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FTOUNI: Fatme.

2 THE COURT: Okay.

3 Juror number one, Miss Cook, good mor -- good

4 afternoon, to you.


6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COOK: Redford, Michigan.


8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COOK: I’m a reach truck

9 driver.


11 Are you married?

12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COOK: No.


14 education?

15 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COOK: Twelfth grade.

16 THE COURT: Twelfth grade.

17 Miss Spencer, there you are.

18 Where do you live, ma’am?

19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SPENCER: Plymouth.


21 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SPENCER: I’m a substitute

22 teacher.

23 THE COURT: Okay.

24 Are you married?

25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SPENCER: No.

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2 education?

3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SPENCER: Bachelors.


5 Mr. Mills, juror number eight, good

6 afternoon, sir. Can you tell us where you live?

7 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MILLS: I live in Detroit.


9 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MILLS: I work for Miller,

10 Canfield, Pappastone.

11 THE COURT: The law firm?

12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MILLS: Yes, sir.

13 THE COURT: Okay.

14 Are you married?


16 THE COURT: Now, are you an attorney at that

17 law firm?

18 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MILLS: No, sir.

19 THE COURT: Okay.

20 And you are married?



23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MILLS: She’s an attorney.

24 THE COURT: Okay.


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1 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MILLS: B.A.

2 THE COURT: Okay.

3 Juror number nine, pardon me, but can you

4 pronounce your last name for me?

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FTOUNI: Ftouni,

6 F-t-o-u-n-i.

7 THE COURT: Okay.


9 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FTOUNI: Dearborn Heights.


11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FTOUNI: I home make, and I

12 go to school.

13 THE COURT: Very good.

14 Are you married?

15 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FTOUNI: Yes.


17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FTOUNI: He’s over seas.

18 THE COURT: He’s over seas. Okay.


20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FTOUNI: High school, but

21 I’m returning to college. My first day is gonna be

22 Monday, this Monday.

23 THE COURT: You start school again?

24 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FTOUNI: Yeah, I’m taking

25 English.

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1 I don’t understand everything.

2 THE COURT: Okay.

3 Every -- okay.

4 What is your highest -- oh, your highest

5 level of education is, you completed high school?

6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FTOUNI: Yeah, but --

7 THE COURT: Was that in a different country?

8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FTOUNI: Yeah.

9 THE COURT: And where was that?

10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FTOUNI: Lebanon. Lebanon.

11 THE COURT: In Lebanon. Okay. Very good.

12 Ms. Cook?

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FTOUNI: And plus I not

14 much English. That’s why I’m working on my English.

15 THE COURT: I understand.

16 Okay.

17 Ms. Cook, would you have raised your hand in

18 response to any of the questions that I asked earlier?

19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COOK: Yes.


21 Do you remember what those questions were?

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COOK: I’m havin’ surgery

23 on Wednesday morning.

24 My brother was convicted of murder.

25 And I have a uncle that was a Police Officer.

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1 THE COURT: Okay.

2 Now, you’ve heard what this case is about,

3 correct?



6 And did you say your brother was convicted of

7 murder?


9 THE COURT: And you understand, that’s a

10 charge in this case?


12 THE COURT: Okay. Now, can you separate out

13 the circumstance that involved your brother, and in

14 this case, as it relates to these parties, can you pay

15 very close attention to the evidence that’s presented

16 in this case?

17 Can you keep an open mind, throughout this

18 case, and not prejudge anybody, or anything?

19 Can you follow the law that I instruct you on

20 at the end of this case?

21 And can you be a fair and impartial juror?

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COOK: I can try to.

23 THE COURT: Okay.

24 Okay.

25 I’m sorry, you said you would have raised

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1 your hand relative to your brother, and I, I don’t

2 recall --

3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COOK: And my uncle was a

4 Police Officer.

5 THE COURT: Your uncle was a Police Officer?

6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COOK: Mm-hmm.

7 THE COURT: Was that in Detroit?


9 THE COURT: And you heard that some of the

10 witnesses in this case may be Detroit Police Officers?



13 Can you separate out your relationship with

14 any Detroit Police Officers, or former Detroit Police

15 Officers, you may have known, and in this case, be a

16 fair and impartial juror to both sides?


18 THE COURT: Okay.

19 All right.

20 Miss Spencer, would you have raised your hand

21 in response to any questions?

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SPENCER: Yes.

23 I have a flight booked to California on

24 Monday, for a job interview.

25 And my best friend was a victim of domestic

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1 violence.

2 And my other friend was convicted for killing

3 someone, drunk driving.

4 THE COURT: Okay.

5 Now, you understand what this case is about?



8 Can you be a juror that will separate out --

9 can you separate out those experiences that you’ve

10 mentioned, and pay close attention during this case,

11 keep an open mind throughout the case, and follow the

12 law that I instruct you on?



15 Anything else that you want to tell us about

16 yourselves, in terms of serving as a juror. In, in

17 other words, was there anything else you would have

18 raised your hand to?



21 Mr. Mills, obviously you know lawyers. So, I

22 am sure you would raise your hand to that question.

23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MILLS: Yes.

24 THE COURT: Would you have raised your hand

25 in response to any of the other questions?

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2 THE COURT: And what were they?

3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MILLS: I was victim of a

4 crime.

5 And my wife has defended several City of

6 Detroit Police Officers, too.

7 THE COURT: Okay.

8 All right.

9 So, you know some Police Officers, you know

10 some lawyers?


12 THE COURT: And you are the victim of a

13 crime?


15 THE COURT: When were you the victim of a

16 crime?

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MILLS: About fourteen

18 years ago.


20 And what, what was -- what crime were you the

21 victim of?

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MILLS: Car jacking, gun

23 point.

24 THE COURT: Okay.

25 And you’ve heard what the allegations are,

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1 what the charges are, in this case, correct?

2 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MILLS: Correct.


4 Can you separate your experience as being the

5 victim of a crime, and in this case, do what I’ve said

6 countless times?



9 And can you assure the Prosecution and the

10 defense that you will be a fair and impartial juror?


12 THE COURT: And that you will follow the law

13 that I instruct you on?



16 Ms. Ftouni, would you have raised your hand

17 in response to any question I asked you?

18 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FTOUNI: I, because I lack

19 in English, I don’t remember them very well.

20 THE COURT: Okay.

21 Let me ask you a question.

22 Have you been able to understand everything I

23 have said today?

24 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FTOUNI: A little bit.

25 THE COURT: A little bit?

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1 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FTOUNI: Yeah.

2 THE COURT: Well --

3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FTOUNI: There, there’s

4 some words I don’t understand.

5 THE COURT: Okay.

6 Are you afraid that you can’t be a fair and

7 impartial juror because you may not understand

8 everything that’s said in this case?

9 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FTOUNI: In English, yes.

10 I, but if it’s in Arabic, I will understand. I’d be --

11 I’ll get a fair decision.

12 THE COURT: Okay.

13 Okay.

14 But your -- are you asking the Court to

15 excuse you in this case, because you can’t be fair,

16 because you may not understand everything?

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FTOUNI: Because I’m afraid

18 of that, yeah.

19 THE COURT: Okay.

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FTOUNI: If there’s

21 translator, I’ll be glad to stay, and --

22 THE COURT: Okay.

23 I’m gonna excuse you, at this time, ma’am.

24 Please return to the first floor.

25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR FTOUNI: Thank you so much.

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1 THE COURT: Okay.

2 Miss Rubio?


4 Juror number one, the -- you said several

5 things.

6 You indicated that your uncle was a Police

7 Officer?

8 And did he and you used to talk about his

9 work a lot?


11 MS. RUBIO: Okay. You also indicated that

12 your brother was, I believe you said, convicted of

13 murder?


15 MS. RUBIO: Did you attend any of the court

16 proceedings?


18 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And did you feel that he

19 was treated fairly?


21 MS. RUBIO: And would you be able to set

22 aside -- I’m sorry, how long ago was that?

23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COOK: That was fifteen

24 years ago.

25 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Was that in Wayne County?

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1 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COOK: Yes, it was right

2 here, in --

3 MS. RUBIO: Frank Murphy?


5 MS. RUBIO: Okay. So, would you be able to

6 set aside that experience, from fifteen years ago,

7 knowing that this is an entirely different case,

8 different Judge, different attorneys, certainly this is

9 some defendant you’ve never seen before, and be fair to

10 both the defense and to the Prosecution?

11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COOK: Yes, I think I can.

12 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And, and lastly, you

13 indicated that you do have a surgery scheduled for

14 Wednesday?


16 MS. RUBIO: And of course, I don’t mean to be

17 too personal, but is it something you consider a minor

18 surgery, or a major surgery?

19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COOK: It’s -- I’m gonna be

20 admitted.

21 MS. RUBIO: You would be admitted.

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COOK: Mm-hmm.

23 MS. RUBIO: So --


25 MS. RUBIO: It -- was -- is it fair to say

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1 that it would be unreasonable for you to have to try to

2 reschedule this?

3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COOK: Yes, it would be

4 unreasonable.

5 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Thank you, for your

6 honesty.

7 And Ms. Spencer, you indicated that your best

8 friend was a victim of domestic violence?

9 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SPENCER: Mm-hmm.

10 MS. RUBIO: And did you attend -- I’m sorry,

11 was there a court proceeding?


13 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Did -- and then you

14 indicated that you have a friend who was convicted of a

15 very serious crime. Did you attend any of those court

16 proceedings?


18 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Did you hear anything

19 about any of the court proceedings?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SPENCER: A little bit, but

21 not much.

22 MS. RUBIO: Okay. As, as far as you know,

23 did you feel that that, that your friend was treated

24 fairly?

25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SPENCER: Yeah.

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1 MS. RUBIO: Okay. You also indicated that

2 you have a job interview scheduled for next week?

3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SPENCER: Mm-hmm.

4 MS. RUBIO: Yes?

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SPENCER: Yeah, on Monday.

6 And I’m supposed to go to California. The job is in

7 California, so --

8 MS. RUBIO: Is in California?

9 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SPENCER: Yeah.

10 MS. RUBIO: So you already have the, the

11 interview set up, on Monday?

12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR SPENCER: It’s for Tuesday,

13 but my flight is on Monday.

14 MS. RUBIO: Your flights is on Monday? Okay.

15 Thank you.

16 And juror number eight, you indicated that

17 your wife is an attorney? Specifically, you indicated

18 that she has -- one of the things she’s done is

19 defended, you said, defended Police Officers?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MILLS: Correct.

21 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Does she practice civil

22 law, or criminal law?

23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MILLS: Civil.

24 MS. RUBIO: Civil. Okay. And you’ve heard

25 the Judge say, more than once today, that he would give

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1 the instructions. He would tell, if you are selected,

2 he will everybody what the law is.

3 So, if you are selected, would you -- do you

4 understand that you would have to just follow the law

5 that the Judge gives you. You couldn’t, for example,

6 go home and ask your wife, because she’s a lawyer. The

7 Judge will -- would give you the law here.

8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MILLS: Yes, I understand.

9 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Thank you. Thank you so

10 much.


12 Thank you.


14 Mr. Harris?

15 MR. HARRIS: Mr. Mills, what kind of position

16 do you have at Miller, Canfield?

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MILLS: I work for the

18 litigation dispute resolution.

19 MR. HARRIS: Okay. Thank you.

20 Okay. The counseling group?

21 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MILLS: No.

22 MR. HARRIS: I thought you said a counseling

23 group?

24 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MILLS: I said, litigation

25 dispute resolution.

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1 MR. HARRIS: Okay.

2 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MILLS: Not --

3 MR. HARRIS: Okay.

4 Would you feel compelled that you’d have to

5 tell your wife, after this is all over, what your

6 decision was in this case?

7 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MILLS: No, we, we really

8 don’t talk about work.

9 MR. HARRIS: Okay. I understand.

10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MILLS: It’s the same

11 thing.

12 MR. HARRIS: Okay. She knew you were gonna

13 be here today, though, right?

14 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MILLS: Yes, she knew.

15 MR. HARRIS: And Miss Cook, this case could

16 go over to Wednesday. Would that present a problem to

17 you?


19 MR. HARRIS: And there’s no hope of

20 rescheduling?


22 MR. HARRIS: And did you indicate to us that

23 it was an over night situation?

24 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COOK: Yes, I’ll be

25 admitted.

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1 MR. HARRIS: You’ll be admitted. Okay.

2 Thank you, Judge


4 People?

5 MS. RUBIO: I would ask that jurors one and

6 three be excused for cause.

7 THE COURT: Denied.

8 Any further challenges for cause?

9 MS. RUBIO: No.


11 defense?

12 MR. HARRIS: None, Your Honor.

13 THE COURT: Okay.

14 Peremptory challenges to the People?

15 Of course, you may utilize multiple.


17 The People would like to thank and excuse

18 jurors one and three.

19 THE COURT: Okay.

20 Any others?

21 MS. RUBIO: No, no, Your Honor.

22 THE COURT: Jurors number one and number

23 three, that’s Ms. Cook and Miss Spencer, you’re excused

24 at this time. You can return to the first floor, the

25 jury assembly room.

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1 Thank you.

2 Mr. Harris, peremptory challenges to the

3 defense?

4 MR. HARRIS: We have none at this time, Your

5 Honor.

6 THE COURT: Okay.

7 Madame Clerk?

8 CLERK: Seat number one, Paul Isim --

9 Isiminger.

10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR ISIMINGER: Isiminger.

11 Close enough.

12 CLERK: Seat number three, Matthew Winther.

13 Seat number nine, Isaac Rust.

14 THE COURT: Okay.

15 Mr. Isiminger, did I pronounce that --

16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR ISIMINGER: Yeah.

17 THE COURT: Close? Okay.


19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR ISIMINGER: Canton.


21 PROSPECTIVE JUROR ISIMINGER: Yes.

22 THE COURT: And what does your spouse do for

23 a living?

24 PROSPECTIVE JUROR ISIMINGER: She is a clerk

25 for the City of Dearborn.

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2 PROSPECTIVE JUROR ISIMINGER: I’m a

3 supervisor at Ford.

4 THE COURT: Okay.


6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR ISIMINGER: The Bachelors

7 in Criminal Justice.

8 THE COURT: Okay.

9 It’s Mr. Winther? Good afternoon to your --

10 to you.


12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WINTHER: I live, I live in

13 Canton, as well.


15 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WINTHER: I’m an I.T.

16 manager at Ford.


18 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WINTHER: Yes, I am.


20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WINTHER: She’s a teacher.

21 THE COURT: Okay.


23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WINTHER: Masters.

24 THE COURT: Okay.

25 Is it Mr. Rust?

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1 PROSPECTIVE JUROR RUST: Yep.


3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR RUST: Livonia.


5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR RUST: Deliver pizza.

6 THE COURT: Good for you. Are you married?

7 PROSPECTIVE JUROR RUST: No.

8 THE COURT: And what’s your highest level of

9 education?

10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR RUST: High school

11 graduate.

12 THE COURT: Okay.

13 Mr. Isiminger, can -- would you have raised

14 your hand in response to any of the questions that were

15 asked earlier?

16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR ISIMINGER: I’m -- only on

17 my brother-in-law’s a Sheriff in Kent County.

18 THE COURT: Okay.

19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR ISIMINGER: Or Sheriff

20 Deputy.

21 THE COURT: That was the only question you

22 would have raised --

23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR ISIMINGER: That was, that

24 was it.


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1 You’ve heard what this case is about?


3 THE COURT: And you’ve heard a lot by now.

4 PROSPECTIVE JUROR ISIMINGER: Yep.

5 THE COURT: Can you tell us all, can you

6 affirm to everybody here, that you will separate out

7 your relationship to your relative in law enforcement,

8 and that you will be a fair and impartial juror?


10 THE COURT: Okay.

11 Mr. Winther, would you have raised your hand

12 in response to any of the questions?

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WINTHER: A good friend of

14 mine who’s a retired Police Officer.

15 And I’ve been a juror on a number of

16 occasions.

17 THE COURT: Okay.

18 Have you been a juror in this building

19 before?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WINTHER: I don’t believe

21 so.

22 THE COURT: Okay.

23 I’m guessing that you’ve never been a juror

24 on a criminal case, then, is that, is that true?

25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WINTHER: I believe I was

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1 on, I believe it was a criminal case.

2 THE COURT: In what City, or what building?

3 Was it in this City?

4 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WINTHER: I thought it was

5 in the Coleman Young building. It’s been a number of

6 years.

7 THE COURT: Okay.

8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WINTHER: Back in the ‘80s,

9 I believe it was.

10 THE COURT: Okay.

11 When you sat as a juror, would -- did the

12 jury reach a verdict in each of those cases?

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WINTHER: Yes.

14 THE COURT: Okay.

15 All right.

16 Can you be a fair and impartial juror in this

17 case?

18 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WINTHER: Yes, I can.


20 Mr. Rust, would you have raised your hand in

21 response to any questions that were asked?

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR RUST: No.


24 Can you be the, the juror that I described

25 earlier? The person that pays close attention to all

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1 the evidence; keeps an open mind; follows the law that

2 I instruct you on?

3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR RUST: Yes.

4 THE COURT: Can you be a fair and impartial

5 juror to the Prosecution, and to the defense?



8 Ms. Rubio?


10 Juror number one, you indicated that, I think

11 you, your brother-in-law is in law enforcement?

12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR ISIMINGER: Mm-hmm.

13 MS. RUBIO: Yes?

14 Okay. Does he talk to you about his work?

15 PROSPECTIVE JUROR ISIMINGER: Not really, no.

16 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And you indicated that

17 your wife is a clerk in the City of Dearborn?


19 MS. RUBIO: So, she -- does she sit in the

20 courtroom?

21 PROSPECTIVE JUROR ISIMINGER: No, it’s a --

22 she’s in charge of the licensing, and things like that,

23 for the City. So, no, not the courts.

24 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And then you also

25 indicated, you have a Degree in Criminal Justice?

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2 MS. RUBIO: Okay. A lot of people who gets

3 those degrees do that, and then they go on to become

4 Police Officers.


6 MS. RUBIO: Is that something that you want

7 to do, or --

8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR ISIMINGER: Originally it

9 was. It didn’t work out at the time when I finished

10 with school. So --

11 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Did you have any bad

12 experiences, trying to become a Police Officer, or

13 nothing like that?

14 PROSPECTIVE JUROR ISIMINGER: No, just the

15 timing when I graduated, was --

16 MS. RUBIO: Okay.

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR ISIMINGER: You know.

18 MS. RUBIO: Thank you so much.

19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR ISIMINGER: Mm-hmm.

20 MS. RUBIO: And then juror number three, you

21 indicated you have a friend, I think, who is a Police

22 Officer?

23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WINTHER: Retired.

24 MS. RUBIO: I’m sorry?

25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WINTHER: Retired.

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1 MS. RUBIO: Retired. Okay. And does he talk

2 to you -- he or she, I’m sorry, talk to you about his

3 work, or old war stories, or --

4 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WINTHER: Nor really, no.

5 It doesn’t come out much.




9 Mr. Harris?

10 MR. HARRIS: Mr. Isiminger?

11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR ISIMINGER: Yep?

12 MR. HARRIS: Because you wanted to become a

13 Police Officer, not so long ago, I’ll say.


15 MR. HARRIS: Would you take the testimony of

16 a Police Officer, would you consider the testimony of a

17 Police Officer more important than the testimony of

18 just a --

19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR ISIMINGER: No.

20 MR. HARRIS: Civilian citizen?

21 PROSPECTIVE JUROR ISIMINGER: No.

22 MR. HARRIS: Okay. Because you understand

23 the Judge is giving you an instruction --


25 MR. HARRIS: You got to treat it the same?

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2 MR. HARRIS: You understood my discussion

3 with your fellow jurors, about presumption of

4 innocence?


6 MR. HARRIS: Beyond a reasonable doubt, in

7 terms of what the Prosecutor’s got to prove?


9 MR. HARRIS: And burden of proof?

10 How about you, Mr. Winther, same questions?

11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WINTHER: Yes, I

12 understand.

13 MR. HARRIS: And Mr. Rust?


15 MR. HARRIS: Thank you.

16 Thank you, Judge.

17 THE COURT: Okay.

18 Challenges for cause, to the People?

19 MS. RUBIO: None, Your Honor.


21 defense?


23 THE COURT: Peremptory challenges to the

24 People. Of course, I mentioned we can -- you can

25 exercise several, at this time?

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2 THE COURT: Peremptory challenges, to the

3 defense?

4 MR. HARRIS: May I have one moment?

5 THE COURT: You may.

6 MR. HARRIS: Your Honor, we’d like to thank

7 and excuse juror seated in seat number one, Mr.

8 Isiminger; and the juror seated in seat number three,

9 Mr. Winther.

10 THE COURT: Okay.

11 Gentlemen, thank you for your time today.

12 I’m gonna ask you to return to the first floor.

13 All right.

14 We are going to take a lunch break in a

15 second, but let’s fill seats number one and seats

16 number three.

17 CLERK: Seat number one, Amanda Hiatt.

18 Seat number three, Mustafa Muhammad.

19 THE COURT: Okay.

20 At this time, we are gonna break for lunch.

21 It is essentially twelve thirty.

22 I’m gonna ask that all of our jurors please

23 be back, assemble outside my courtroom, by one thirty-

24 five, which is in an hour.

25 Okay?

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1 Greektown is a very short walk to -- I, I

2 heard it may be raining. Greektown is a very short

3 walk, if you want to stretch your legs, maybe get

4 something to eat.

5 There’s a place to eat in this building, on

6 the ground floor.

7 But wherever you’re travels take you, please,

8 out of respect to all the jurors, be back here within

9 the hour, so that we can start promptly at one thirty-

10 five.

11 Okay?

12 Thank you.

13 MR. HARRIS: Your Honor, may we approach,

14 before you --

15 THE COURT: Yes.



18 THE COURT: I should have mentioned, and I

19 apologize that I didn’t.

20 You’ll hear this several times.

21 There’s a very important law that you’re

22 going to hear later, which says that you cannot discuss

23 this case with anybody? Okay.

24 Meaning, your friends, your relatives, you

25 can’t talk about this case at lunch time.

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1 You can’t talk about this case until the jury

2 is -- has been told to retire and discuss the case,

3 after the, after the evidence has concluded.

4 So, it goes without saying, that during this

5 lunch break, please, none of you, discuss this case

6 with anyone.

7 Thank you.



10 excused for lunch).


12 THE COURT: Okay.

13 We will see you back here at one thirty, or

14 so.


16 proceedings from 12:34 p.m. to 1:38 p.m.)

17 THE COURT: Okay.

18 We’re on the record in case number


20 Your appearances?


22 MR. HARRIS: Wyatt Harris on behalf of Mr.

23 Terrance, Your Honor.

24 THE COURT: Okay.

25 We are outside the presence of the jury.

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1 It’s my understanding that juror number

2 twelve, Mr. Sobh, S-o-b-h, mentioned to my Clerk that

3 he has an emergency. I have asked you both, what your

4 input is, on that situation.

5 And it seems to me, both indicated your

6 agreement that we should excuse him for cause, and just

7 to have my Deputy let him know, in the hallway, that he

8 is free to go.

9 Did I accurately recite our agreement?



12 THE COURT: Okay.

13 We will do that, then.

14 That’s what we’ll do.

15 Anything else before we get the jury back in

16 here?

17 MR. HARRIS: Not on behalf of Mr. Terrance,

18 Your Honor.


20 THE COURT: Okay.

21 So, you want to ask him to stand back, or

22 something like that? However you want to do it.

23 Okay.

24 Why don’t we bring the jury in?


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1 THE COURT: I’m gonna have you fill that seat

2 right now.


4 brought back into the courtroom).


6 THE COURT: Okay.

7 We’re on the record in case number



10 MS. RUBIO: Good afternoon. Mary Rubio for

11 the People.

12 MR. HARRIS: Good afternoon, Your Honor.

13 Wyatt Harris on behalf of Mr. Terrance.

14 THE COURT: Okay.

15 Are the parties ready to continue on our voir

16 dire?


18 THE COURT: Our jury selection?


20 THE COURT: Okay.

21 Madame Clerk, can you please fill seat number

22 twelve?

23 CLERK: Seat number twelve, Angela Meyers.

24 THE COURT: Okay.

25 Juror number one, Miss Hiatt, can you tell us

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1 where you live?

2 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HIATT: I live in

3 Southgate.


5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HIATT: I am a bartender.

6 THE COURT: Okay.

7 Are you married?

8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HIATT: No.


10 education?

11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HIATT: In -- I’m in

12 college.

13 THE COURT: In college.

14 All right.

15 Juror number three, is it Mr. Muhammad?

16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MUHAMMAD: Yes.

17 THE COURT: Welcome.


19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MUHAMMAD: Detroit.


21 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MUHAMMAD: Valet driver.

22 THE COURT: Okay.

23 Are you married?

24 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MUHAMMAD: No.

25 THE COURT: What’s your highest level of

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1 education?

2 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MUHAMMAD: In college.

3 THE COURT: Okay.

4 Ms. Meyers, can you tell us where you live?

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MEYERS: Detroit.


7 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MEYERS: Work for Blue

8 Cross and Blue Shield.


10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MEYERS: No.


12 education?

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MEYERS: Associates Degree.


15 Miss Hiatt, can you tell us if you would have

16 raised your hand in response to any of the questions

17 that were asked earlier?

18 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HIATT: I was a juror

19 before, like two years ago, at Frank Murphy. We

20 reached a verdict.

21 My brother is a Detroit Police Officer.

22 And I think that’s it.

23 THE COURT: Okay.

24 Have you, or anybody close to you, ever been

25 arrested or convicted of any crime?

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2 THE COURT: Have you, or anybody close to

3 you, ever been the victim of a crime?


5 THE COURT: Okay.

6 Now, you obviously know some Police Officers?

7 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HIATT: Mm-hmm.

8 THE COURT: Is that yes?

9 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HIATT: Yes.


11 You tes -- you said that when you sat as a

12 juror before, the jury did reach a verdict?


14 THE COURT: Okay.

15 And your brother is a Police Officer?


17 THE COURT: Now, you’ve heard what this case

18 is about?


20 THE COURT: Do you understand that there’s

21 gonna be some Police Officers testifying in this case?


23 THE COURT: You did hear my instruction on

24 how you are to treat the testimony of a Police Officer?


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1 THE COURT: Okay.

2 Can you assure everybody in this courtroom,

3 that you will be the juror that pays close attention to

4 all the evidence in this case?


6 THE COURT: Keeps an open mind; doesn’t

7 prejudge anybody or anything; that you will follow the

8 law that I give you?


10 THE COURT: And that you will be a fair and

11 impartial juror?


13 THE COURT: Okay.

14 Mr. Muhammad, would you have raised your hand

15 in response to any of the questions I asked?

16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MUHAMMAD: About, the one

17 about havin’ --

18 THE COURT: Well, I asked, I asked a few, and

19 I’ll -- it’s been a while, and I can refresh your

20 memory.

21 Have you ever sat a juror before?



24 Have you ever been a victim of a crime, or

25 has anybody close to you ever been the victim of a

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1 crime?

2 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MUHAMMAD: My two brothers

3 and my best friend.

4 THE COURT: Okay.

5 And what, what crimes were they victims of?

6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MUHAMMAD: All kind of

7 stuff.

8 THE COURT: All kinds of stuff.

9 All right.

10 Do you have any close friends, relatives,

11 acquaintances, that are in law enforcement, like Police

12 Officers?



15 All right.

16 Do you have any close friendships, or

17 relationships, with anybody that works in a court

18 system, or with any lawyers, or Court Administrators?



21 You talked about your family members.

22 You understand what this case is about? You

23 heard what I read earlier?

24 PROSPECTIVE JROR MUHAMMAD: Yes.


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1 In this case, obviously it’s very important

2 to both parties, that they get fair, fair jurors,

3 impartial jurors.

4 You can understand that? Yes?


6 THE COURT: You have to verbalize your

7 answers. Remember, I talked about that?

8 All right.

9 In this case, can you pay close attention to

10 all the evidence; can you keep an open mind, and not

11 prejudge anybody, or anything, in this case; can you

12 follow the law that I instruct you on?

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MUHAMMAD: I don’t feel

14 comfortable doing it.


16 And, and when you say you don’t feel

17 comfortable, why -- what is, what do you mean by that?

18 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MUHAMMAD: Just don’t.

19 It’s, like --

20 THE COURT: Do you think you can’t be fair?

21 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MUHAMMAD: Right.


23 Okay.

24 Is that because of the circumstances that

25 involved your family members?

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3 I’m gonna excuse you, at this time. You’re

4 gonna have to return to the first floor, okay, the jury

5 assembly room.

6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MUHAMMAD: All right.


8 Ms. Meyers, would you have raised your hand

9 in response to any of the questions that I asked

10 earlier?

11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MEYERS: Yes.

12 THE COURT: Do you remember what those

13 questions were?

14 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MEYERS: I do.

15 THE COURT: Okay.

16 What would you have raised your hand for?

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MEYERS: I found my fiancé

18 murdered.

19 And I’m almost certain that the defense is

20 the defense that was in that case.

21 THE COURT: The defense lawyer?

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MEYERS: In 2010. It was

23 here.

24 THE COURT: Okay.

25 Do you think you know Mr. Harris?

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2 THE COURT: Okay.

3 All right.

4 Can I assume you don’t know Mr. Harris, but

5 you recognize him, perhaps?



8 And does, does that impact your --

9 MR. HARRIS: Judge, may we approach?

10 THE COURT: Sure.



13 THE COURT: Okay.

14 Ms. Meyers, you’ve heard what this case is

15 about?

16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MEYERS: I have.


18 And recognizing that, or appreciating that

19 you may recognize Mr. Harris, can you put that aside?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MEYERS: I believe that I

21 can be fair. However, I, I can’t sit through another

22 murder trial.

23 I sat through that one for almost a year.

24 I -- mentally --

25 MR. HARRIS: Judge --

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1 THE COURT: Okay.

2 All right.

3 MR. HARRIS: May we approach?

4 THE COURT: Okay.

5 I’m gonna excuse you, Ms. Meyers, at this

6 time, okay. You’re gonna re, return to the first

7 floor.

8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR MEYERS: Thank you.

9 THE COURT: Madame Clerk, why don’t we fill

10 both seats.

11 CLERK: Seat number three, Linda Collier.

12 Seat number twelve, Samuel Johnson.

13 THE COURT: Okay.

14 Good afternoon, Miss Collier.


16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COLLIER: Romulus.


18 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COLLIER: I’m retired. I

19 was a clerical worker.

20 THE COURT: Okay.

21 Are you married?

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COLLIER: No.


24 education?

25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COLLIER: Certificate of

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1 Business School.

2 THE COURT: Okay.


4 to any of the questions that were asked earlier?

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COLLIER: Yes.

6 THE COURT: Okay.

7 And what questions would you have raised your

8 hand to?

9 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COLLIER: Well, my home was

10 broken into, but there was no, no bodily harm to

11 anybody.

12 I do have family members that are Police

13 Officers.

14 And also a District Court, not relatives, but

15 very, very close friends.

16 And I, I think that’s it.

17 THE COURT: Okay.

18 You know what this case is about?

19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COLLIER: Mm-hmm.

20 THE COURT: Is that a yes?


22 THE COURT: Okay.

23 Can you be the juror, one of the jurors in

24 this case, all the jurors, that pays close attention to

25 all the evidence; keeps an open mind throughout this

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1 case; doesn’t prejudge anybody or anything; and follows

2 the law that I give in this case?


4 THE COURT: Okay.

5 Mr. Johnson, good afternoon.

6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: Hello.


8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: Romulus.

9 THE COURT: And what do you do for a living,

10 sir?

11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: I’m a retail

12 store manager.


14 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: Yes.


16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: She’s a Senior

17 Logistics Manager for FedEx.

18 THE COURT: Okay.


20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: Some college.

21 THE COURT: Okay.


23 to any of the questions that I asked earlier?

24 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: A lot, except

25 for, I never served on a jury.

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1 THE COURT: Okay.

2 So, pretty much all the other ones?



5 All right.

6 Do you know anybody, do you have friends,

7 family members, close acquaintances, that have been

8 arrested or convicted of a crime, including yourself?

9 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: My brother, for

10 murder.

11 THE COURT: Okay.

12 And when was that?

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: It’s been a

14 while.

15 THE COURT: Okay.

16 Was he convicted?

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: Yes, ‘87.

18 THE COURT: Okay.

19 And did you --


21 THE COURT: Participate in his trial? Did

22 you go to the --

23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: I was there, I

24 was at the trial, yes.

25 THE COURT: Okay.

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1 Can you separate out the experience --

2 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: I’m sorry, I’m

3 sorry.

4 THE COURT: Let me get the question out,

5 although, often times, we understand what the

6 question’s going to be.

7 Can you separate out your brother’s

8 experience, and in this case, be a fair and impartial

9 juror, to both of the Prosecution and the defense?

10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: Yes, sir.


12 Do you know Police Officers, or people in law

13 enforcement, or lawyers, Judges, or people in court

14 administration?

15 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: Good friend,

16 Detroit Police Officer.

17 THE COURT: Okay.

18 One, or several?

19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: Just one.


21 Now, can you separate out your relationship

22 with your friend, and again, be fair and impartial to

23 the Prosecution, and the defense?



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1 And have you, or anybody else, been the

2 victim of a crime? Anybody close to you?

3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: Me and my wife.

4 THE COURT: Okay.

5 And, and what occurred with you and your

6 wife?

7 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: Assault, it was

8 an assault. We were younger, though, we were a lot

9 younger. It was about, almost like twenty years ago.

10 THE COURT: Okay.

11 Can you separate out that unfortunate

12 experience, and in this case, pay close attention to

13 the evidence, in this case; keep an open mind; and

14 follow the law?


16 THE COURT: Okay.

17 Okay, Miss Rubio?


19 Juror number three, you indicated that

20 unfortunately, your home was broken into?


22 MS. RUBIO: At some point.


24 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Was there a criminal case

25 as a result of that?

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1 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COLLIER: No. No, they

2 never caught anyone.

3 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Was there -- did Police

4 come to your assistance?


6 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And did you feel that you

7 were treated fairly?


9 MS. RUBIO: By the Police?


11 MS. RUBIO: Okay.

12 I’m sorry, go ahead.

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COLLIER: And I -- I

14 forgot, I was on a jury before.

15 THE COURT: Was that in this building?

16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COLLIER: No, no, it

17 wasn’t. It was a --

18 THE COURT: Was it a criminal case?


20 THE COURT: Okay.

21 Thank you.

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COLLIER: Sorry.


24 Have you, or anyone close to you, ever been

25 accused or convicted of a crime?

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3 And juror number twelve, you indicated that,

4 unfortunately, your brother was tried and convicted of

5 murder, some years ago, correct?

6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: Mm-hmm.

7 MS. RUBIO: Do you feel he was -- I’m sorry?

8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: I just -- I shook

9 my head. I wanted to say, yes.

10 MS. RUBIO: Oh, thank you, thank you.

11 Do you feel he was treated fairly, though?

12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: yes.

13 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And you indicated that

14 there was an incident in which you and your wife were

15 assaulted, some years ago, also, correct?

16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: Correct.

17 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Was -- did that result in

18 a criminal case?


20 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And was anyone convicted?


22 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And do you feel that that

23 process was fair?


25 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And so, and you would be

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1 able to set aside both of those experiences, both your

2 brother, as a defendant, and your -- you and your wife,

3 as victims, set that aside, and be fair and impartial

4 in this case?


6 MS. RUBIO: Okay.

7 Thank you.


9 THE COURT: Okay.

10 Mr. Harris?

11 MR. HARRIS: Miss Hiatt?


13 MR. HARRIS: Hear testimony in this case, and

14 Mr. Terrance doesn’t get on the witness stand and

15 testify.

16 You gonna go in that jury room and say, wow,

17 should have testified? I wish I’d of heard from him?

18 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HIATT: Yeah, I think so.

19 MR. HARRIS: Yes?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HIATT: Yeah, I think so. I

21 mean --


23 THE COURT: Let me interrupt if I may, Mr.

24 Harris.

25 MR. HARRIS: Be my guest, Judge.

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1 THE COURT: You haven’t heard an instruction

2 yet.

3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HIATT: Okay.

4 THE COURT: That -- but you will, at the end

5 of the case, that, that indicates that the defendant

6 Mr. Terrance, has the absolute right not to testify in

7 this case, and you can take no adverse inference from

8 that, essentially.

9 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HIATT: Okay.

10 THE COURT: If that was the law, can you

11 follow that?

12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HIATT: Yeah.

13 THE COURT: Okay.

14 Mr. Harris?

15 MR. HARRIS: Miss Collier, could you follow

16 that law?

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COLLIER: I would honestly,

18 I would wonder.

19 MR. HARRIS: Really want to hear from him,

20 huh?

21 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COLLIER: Well, I, I would,

22 I would just wonder.

23 MR. HARRIS: But you can go in that jury

24 room, and understand, following the Judge’s

25 instructions --

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1 PROSPECTIVE JUROr COLLIER: Yes.

2 THE COURT: That you can’t go in there and

3 say, boy, if I had have heard from him, it would have

4 been -- I’d make a different decision? You can’t base

5 your decision on that.

6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COLLIER: No, I wouldn’t

7 base it.

8 MR. HARRIS: How about you, Mr. Johnson?

9 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: Yes, I could

10 follow that.

11 MR. HARRIS: Okay. Mr. Johnson, eleven to

12 one, I don’t care which side of the fence you’re on.

13 Can you hold to your position in the jury room?


15 MR. HARRIS: Eleven to one?


17 MR. HARRIS: How about you, Miss Collier?


19 MR. HARRIS: How about you, Miss Hiatt?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HIATT: Yes

21 MR. HARRIS: Eleven to one?


23 MR. HARRIS: Miss Hiatt, are you a leader, or

24 a follower?

25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HIATT: Leader.

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1 MR. HARRIS: Leader?

2 Miss Collier, are you a leader or a follower?

3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR COLLIER: A follower, in

4 some things; and a leader in some things.

5 MR. HARRIS: Okay. How about you, Mr.

6 Johnson?

7 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: I’m a leader, but

8 the world needs both.

9 MR. HARRIS: Pardon me?

10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: I’m a leader, but

11 the world needs both.

12 MR. HARRIS: Needs both?

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: Yeah.

14 MR. HARRIS: You married, Mr. Johnson?

15 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: Yes, I am. I’m a

16 follower at home.

17 MR. HARRIS: I’m married, too. I understand.

18 I’m a leader in some instances.

19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR JOHNSON: Yes, I agree.

20 MR. HARRIS: Thank you very much, Judge. I

21 understand, sir.


23 People?


25 THE COURT: Mr. Harris, challenges for cause?

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3 People?



6 defense?


8 juror seated in seat number two, Mr. Williams.

9 THE COURT: Okay.

10 Mr. Williams, thank you for being here today.

11 I’m gonna ask that you return to the first

12 floor.

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR WILLIAMS: Thank you.

14 MR. HARRIS: Can I exercise another one?

15 THE COURT: Oh, please. I forgot to ask you

16 that.


18 juror seated in seat number one, also.

19 THE COURT: Miss Hiatt, thank you for being

20 here. We’re gonna excuse you to return to the first

21 floor.

22 Yes, sir?

23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR: I’m sorry, mind if I ask

24 a question. I know what the days this is gonna run to.

25 Probably all the way up to Wednesday or Thursday,

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1 correct?

2 THE COURT: We think we’re gonna be done

3 Tuesday. It’s possible that it could be until

4 Wednesday.

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR: Those, those are days

6 that be, Tuesday and Wednesday, mainly, will be a

7 concern to me.

8 Like I said before, I’m a retail store

9 manager, and anything anybody know about retail, we

10 have our yearly inventory. And that’s where my focus

11 has been the last two weeks, and I -- my inventory’s on

12 Wednesday.

13 So, that, that will only be my concern. I

14 can, whatever you need, but that’s -- that’ll be my

15 concern.


17 Okay.

18 Madame Clerk.

19 CLERK: Seat number one, Stacey Grammatico.

20 Seat number two, Laura Cesa. Can you

21 pronounce that, please?

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CESA: Cesa.

23 THE COURT: Okay.

24 MS. Grammatico, can you tell us where you

25 live?

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1 PROSPECTIVE JUROR GRAMMATICO: Livonia.


3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR GRAMMATICO: I’m a school

4 teacher.

5 THE COURT: Okay.

6 Are you married?

7 PROSPECTIVE JUROR GRAMMATICO: I am.


9 PROSPECTIVE JUROR GRAMMATICO: He’s an

10 Engineer.


12 education?

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR GRAMMATICO: Masters.




17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR GRAMMATICO: No.

18 THE COURT: Okay.


20 case?

21 PROSPECTIVE JUROR GRAMMATICO: Yes.


23 You know what this case is about. You, you

24 heard, you were paying attention earlier?

25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR GRAMMATICO: I was.

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1 THE COURT: And you’ve heard me ask, many,

2 many times, what it takes to be an appropriate juror?

3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR GRAMMATICO: Correct.

4 THE COURT: And you can tell everybody here

5 that you will be that juror, and you’ll be a fair and

6 impartial, is that true?

7 PROSPECTIVE JUROR GRAMMATICO: I will.

8 THE COURT: Okay.

9 Ms. Cesa, can you tell us where you live?

10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CESA: Livonia.


12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CESA: Yes.


14 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CESA: Stay at home mom.


16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CESA: Engineer.


18 education?

19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CESA: Bachelors.

20 THE COURT: Okay.


22 to any questions I asked?

23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CESA: A couple.

24 I have a good friend who’s a Police Officer.

25 And a couple family members who are

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1 attorneys.

2 THE COURT: Okay.

3 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CESA: But nothing, nothing

4 in the criminal area.

5 THE COURT: Okay.

6 So, is it fair for me to conclude, from your

7 answer that, although you know some attorneys, and you

8 know a Police Officer, there is nothing about those

9 relationships that would prevent you from being a fair

10 and impartial juror?

11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CESA: Yes, that’s --

12 THE COURT: Okay.

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CESA: That’s true.

14 THE COURT: You’re gonna -- if, if you’re

15 seated in this jury, you will pay very close attention

16 to this case, keep an open mind, and follow the law

17 that I instruct you on, is that true?


19 THE COURT: Okay.

20 Ms. Rubio?

21 MS. RUBIO: I’m so sorry, please. I know

22 that we have number two is new, and --

23 THE COURT: And one.

24 MS. RUBIO: Oh, juror number. I, I

25 apologize.

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1 And you’ve sat here for a long time, and

2 you’ve listened to all these questions. Is there

3 anything that no one has asked, that you thought to

4 yourself, if I get up there, I better tell ‘em this.

5 Juror number one?


7 MS. RUBIO: Great. Juror number two?

8 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CESA: No.

9 MS. RUBIO: And I was giving some examples

10 earlier, to illustrate some legal concepts.

11 I think, and counsel also gave some examples.

12 If either of you were sitting up here, would

13 you have had some issues, was there, was there

14 something you didn’t understand, that wasn’t clear, to

15 either of you?

16 Juror number one?


18 MS. RUBIO: Juror number two?

19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CESA: No.




23 MR. HARRIS: Juror number one, would you want

24 a juror such as yourself, sitting -- if you were

25 sitting in this chair, would you want a juror such as

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1 yourself to be in that chair?

2 PROSPECTIVE JUROR GRAMMATICO: Yes.

3 MR. HARRIS: How about you, number two?


5 MR. HARRIS: You understood the concepts that

6 I talked about earlier, with your fellow jurors?


8 MR. HARRIS: Who has the burden of proof,

9 number one?

10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR GRAMMATICO: Prosecutor.

11 MR. HARRIS: Thank you, number two.

12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CESA: I helped her out.

13 MR. HARRIS: Great anticipation.

14 No further questions.

15 THE COURT: Okay.

16 Challenges for cause, Ms. Rubio?





21 People?



24 MR. HARRIS: Can I have just a moment?

25 THE COURT: Absolutely.

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1 MR. HARRIS: Judge, I’d like to thank and

2 excuse juror seated in seat number two.

3 THE COURT: Okay.

4 Miss Cesa, thank you for being here today.

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR CESA: Thank you.

6 THE COURT: You’re gonna have to return to

7 the firs floor.

8 MR. HARRIS: That would be it, Your Honor.


10 Madame Clerk?

11 CLERK: Seat number two, Elizabeth Pawluszka.

12 Pronounce your last name for me, please?

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PAWLUSZKA: Pawluszka.

14 THE COURT: Good afternoon. Can you tell us

15 where you live?

16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PAWLUSZKA: I live in

17 Plymouth.


19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PAWLUSZKA: I’m a stay at

20 home mom, to four small children.

21 THE COURT: Okay.

22 Are you married?

23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PAWLUSZKA: Yes.


25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PAWLUSZKA: Executive

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1 Sales, Business Development for a health care company,

2 out in L.A.

3 THE COURT: And what is your highest level of

4 education?

5 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PAWLUSZKA: Bachelor of

6 Science.

7 THE COURT: Okay.


9 to any of the questions that were asked earlier?


11 THE COURT: And do you remember what those

12 questions were?

13 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PAWLUSZKA: I sat on a

14 jury.

15 THE COURT: I’m sorry?

16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PAWLUSZKA: I sat on a

17 jury.

18 THE COURT: Okay.

19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PAWLUSZKA: There was a

20 verdict. It was here.

21 I have family and friends that are lawyers.

22 And the hardship would be, I have no one to

23 watch my children. My husband has to be out of town,

24 for work, all next week. So --

25 THE COURT: Okay.

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1 Okay.

2 Recognizing that you know some lawyers, and

3 Police Officers, and you sat as a juror before, is

4 there anything about those situations, that would

5 prevent you from being a fair and impartial juror?

6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PAWLUSZKA: No.

7 THE COURT: Okay.

8 And I recognize that you have children, but

9 virtually everybody here has an obligation outside this

10 court building. And you can serve as a juror in this

11 case? You can find somebody to sit for your children?

12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PAWLUSZKA: No. My family

13 is out of town. I grew up in Chicago. So, I mean, I

14 bring my kids to my doctor appointments. I, I -- it’s

15 hard pressed for during the day.

16 THE COURT: How old are your children?

17 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PAWLUSZKA: Nine, six,

18 five, and two.

19 THE COURT: Okay.

20 So, are some of them in school?

21 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PAWLUSZKA: The older two

22 are in school.

23 THE COURT: Okay.

24 Miss Rubio?

25 MS. RUBIO: Ma’am, you indicated that you

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1 know, you know some lawyers? Is that a yes?

2 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PAWLUSZKA: yes.

3 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Do they practice criminal

4 law?


6 MS. RUBIO: Okay. You also -- oh, I’m sorry,

7 have you, or anyone close to you, ever been a victim of

8 a crime?


10 MS. RUBIO: What kind of crime?

11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PAWLUSZKA: My sister was

12 beaten in an alley.

13 MS. RUBIO: I’m sorry to hear that. Was

14 there a criminal proceeding?

15 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PAWLUSZKA: There was. I

16 don’t recall what happened, I just know he was not a

17 U.S. citizen, so he was deported.

18 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Were you -- did you attend

19 any of the court proceedings?


21 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Have you, or anyone you

22 know, ever been accused or convicted of a crime?


24 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Do you feel that -- and

25 I’m sorry, how long ago was that situation with your

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1 sister?

2 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PAWLUSZKA: Hmm, eleven

3 years ago.

4 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And do you feel that you

5 would be able to put that situation aside, and put that

6 experience aside, and be fair and impartial here?

7 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PAWLUSZKA: I would hope

8 so.

9 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And, and then what makes

10 you say it like that?

11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PAWLUSZKA: It just -- I

12 was the first person, like, to help her. So, it

13 just -- I, I don’t know.

14 MS. RUBIO: So, you saw her, up close and

15 personal?


17 MS. RUBIO: Right after this happened?



20 I don’t have any other questions. Thank you

21 so much.


23 MR. HARRIS: Miss Pawluszka, who’s taking

24 care of your children today?

25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR PAWLUSZKA: My husband had

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1 to take the day off work.

2 MR. HARRIS: No other questions, Your Honor.


4 People?

5 MS. RUBIO: None for cause.


7 MR. HARRIS: None for cause, Your Honor.


9 People?

10 MS. RUBIO: The People like to thank and

11 excuse juror number two.

12 THE COURT: Miss Pawluszka, thank you for

13 being here.

14 You can return to the first floor.

15 Any other peremptory challenges, Miss Rubio?

16 MS. RUBIO: Oh, I’m sorry. No. No, thank

17 you, Your Honor.


19 defense?

20 MR. HARRIS: None at this time, Your Honor.

21 THE COURT: Madame Clerk?

22 CLERK: Seat number two, Harold Hamilton.

23 THE COURT: Good afternoon, Mr. Hamilton.

24 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: Good afternoon.


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1 I’m sorry?

2 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: Good afternoon.


4 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: Wayne, Michigan.

5 THE COURT: Okay.

6 What do you do for a living?

7 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: Retired.


9 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: Ford Motor

10 Company.

11 THE COURT: Are you married?

12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: No.


14 education?

15 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: Associates

16 Degree.

17 THE COURT: Okay.



20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: Yes.

21 THE COURT: And what, what questions would

22 you have raised your hand for?

23 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: I’ve been a jury

24 member.

25 And I have a -- my, one of my sons was

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1 arrested for, and tried.

2 THE COURT: Okay.

3 Any other questions that you can recall?

4 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: Nope.


6 When you were a juror, previously, was it in

7 this building?


9 THE COURT: And I don’t want to know what the

10 jury decided, but was a verdict reached in the case?

11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: There was two

12 charges, one was, and one wasn’t.

13 THE COURT: Okay.

14 With respect to your -- was your son

15 convicted of something?


17 THE COURT: Okay.

18 Is there anything -- you’ve heard what this

19 case is about?


21 THE COURT: You’ve heard a lot of questions,

22 I asked the jurors this morning, a lot of the questions

23 that the lawyers have asked today.


25 case?

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2 THE COURT: Okay.

3 Counsel, can you approach, please?



6 THE COURT: Ms. Rubio?


8 Sir, you indicated that your son was arrested

9 and charged with a crime?


11 MS. RUBIO: Okay. How long ago was that?

12 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: Uhm, about four

13 years.

14 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And so, he had to go

15 through the whole criminal process?


17 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And did you attend his

18 court proceedings?


20 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Do you feel he was treated

21 fairly?

22 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: Uh, no.

23 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And what City did this

24 take place in?

25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: The, the

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1 incident happened in Wayne, but he was tried here.

2 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And did you feel that he

3 wasn’t treated fairly by the whole system, or by the

4 Police, or by the person who accused him of the crime?

5 What, what, what wasn’t -- who didn’t treat him fairly?

6 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: I, I, I thought

7 the person that accused him of the crime left a lot to

8 be desired; and I thought the Prosecutor in that case

9 went way overboard, tryin’ to get a conviction.

10 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And I can, I can respect

11 that.

12 Do you -- but of course, you understand, this

13 is an entirely --

14 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: Oh, yeah. Yeah.

15 MS. RUBIO: Different case?

16 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: I, like I said,

17 I’ve served on a jury before.

18 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Okay. And you feel that

19 you’d be able to set that situation aside?

20 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: Yeah.

21 MS. RUBIO: And be fair and impartial towards

22 both of us?


24 MS. RUBIO: Here today?

25 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: Yep.

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1 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And have you, or anyone

2 close to you, ever been a victim of a crime?


4 MS. RUBIO: You?


6 MS. RUBIO: And how long ago was that?

7 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: Well, let me

8 see. About eight years ago, my car was stoled out of

9 my driveway.

10 MS. RUBIO: Okay.

11 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: And about six

12 years after that, my house was broken into.

13 No charges were filed in either case.

14 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Was that because it was

15 never determined who did those things?


17 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Was there -- did the

18 Police investigate?

19 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: I know they

20 didn’t investigate the car theft, but they might have

21 taken a minute or two on the home invasion.

22 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Were you satisfied with

23 the work that the Police did, or not?

24 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: Oh, yeah. There

25 wasn’t much else they could do.

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1 MS. RUBIO: Okay. And that was also in

2 Wayne?


4 MS. RUBIO: Okay. Thank you so much.


6 MR. HARRIS: When did your son go to trial?

7 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: Uhm, I don’t

8 remember the exact date. I’d say, probably --

9 MR. HARRIS: Can you give us, just a year?

10 PROSPECTIVE JUROR HAMILTON: I want to say,

11 like, 2012, maybe.

12 MR. HARRIS: Okay. And when you served on a

13 jury, were you the jury Foreman?


15 MR. HARRIS: No further questions.

16 THE COURT: Okay.

17 Challenges for cause, Ms. Rubio?





22 People?



25 MR. HARRIS: Can I have a moment?

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1 THE COURT: Sure.

2 MR. HARRIS: I think we have a jury, Your

3 Honor.

4 THE COURT: Okay.

5 MR. HARRIS: We’re satisfied.


7 To those of you in our audience, that were

8 brought up here as prospective jurors, thank you for

9 your service.

10 You can all return to the first floor, to the

11 jury assembly room.

12 Thank you.

13 (Whereupon the remaining prospective jurors

14 were excused).

15 THE COURT: Ladies and gentlemen of the jury,

16 you have been chosen to decide a criminal charge, made

17 by the State of Michigan, against one of your fellow

18 citizens.

19 I will now ask you to stand and swear to

20 perform your duty, to try this case justly, and to

21 reach a true verdict.

22 If your religious beliefs do not permit you

23 to take an oath, you may, instead, affirm to try the

24 case justly, and reach a true verdict.

25 Please stand.

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1 CLERK: Raise your right hands, please.

2 Do each of you solemnly swear or affirm that

3 in this action now before the Court, you will justly

4 decide the questions submitted to you, that unless you

5 are discharged by the Court from further deliberation,

6 you will render a true verdict, and that you will

7 render your verdict only on the evidence introduced,

8 and in accord with the instructions of the Court, so

9 help you God?

10 JURORS: I do. Yes.

11 CLERK: You may be seated.

12 THE COURT: Okay.

13 Ladies and gentlemen, now I will explain some

14 of the legal principles that you will need to know, and

15 the procedure that we will following in this trial.

16 A trial follows this procedure:

17 First the Prosecutor makes an opening

18 statement, where she give her theories about the case.

19 The defendant’s lawyer does not have to make

20 an opening statement, but he may make an opening

21 statement, after the Prosecutor makes hers, or he may

22 wait until later.

23 These statements are not evidence. They are

24 only meant to help you to understand how each side

25 views this case.

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1 To prove the charges, the Prosecutor must

2 prove the following beyond a reasonable doubt:

3 The defendant is charged with the crime of

4 first degree, premeditated murder.

5 To prove this charge, the Prosecutor must

6 prove each of the following elements beyond a

7 reasonable doubt:

8 First, that the defendant caused the death of

9 Dalona Tillman.

10 That is, that Dalona Tillman died as a result

11 of being smothered, and/or asphyxiated.

12 Second, that the defendant intended to kill

13 Dalona Tillman.

14 Third, that this intent to kill was

15 premeditated. That is, thought out beforehand.

16 Fourth, that the killing was deliberate,

17 which means that the defendant considered the pros and

18 cons of the killing, and thought about, and chose his

19 actions before he did it.

20 There must have been real and substantial

21 reflection for long enough to give a reasonable person

22 a chance to think twice about the intent to kill.

23 The law does not say how much time is needed.

24 It is for you to decide if enough time passed under the

25 circumstances of this case.

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1 The killing cannot be the result of a sudden

2 impulse, without thought or reflection.

3 Fifth, that the killing was not justified,

4 excused, or done under circumstances that reduce it to

5 a lesser crime.

6 The defendant is also charged with first

7 degree felony murder.

8 The prove this charge, the Prosecutor must


10 reasonable doubt:

11 First, that the defendant caused the death of

12 Dalona Tillman.

13 That is, that Dalona Tillman died as a result

14 of being smothered, and/or asphyxiated.

15 Second, that the defendant had one of these

16 three states of mind:

17 He intended to kill;

18 Or he intended to do great bodily harm to

19 Dalona Tillman;

20 Or he knowingly created a very high risk of

21 death, or great bodily harm, knowing that death or such

22 harm would be the likely result of his actions.

23 Third, that when he did the act that caused

24 the death of Dalona Tillman, the defendant was

25 committing, or attempting to commit the crime or

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1 torture.

2 For the crime of torture, the Prosecutor must


4 reasonable doubt:

5 First, that the defendant had custody, or

6 physical control over Dalona Tillman.

7 This means that the defendant used force or

8 the threat of force, either to confine Dalona Tillman

9 by interfering with her liberty, or to restrict Dalona

10 Tillman’s freedom of movement.

11 Second, that the defendant exercised custody

12 or physical control over Dalona Tillman, without her

13 consent, or without lawful authority to do so.

14 Third, that at the time the defendant had

15 custody or physical control over Dalona Tillman, he

16 intentionally caused great bodily injury to Dalona

17 Tillman.

18 Great bodily injury means, internal injury,

19 poisoning, serious burns or scalding, severe cuts, or

20 multiple puncture wounds.

21 Fourth, that the defendant intended to cause

22 Dalona Tillman to suffer cruel or extreme physical

23 pain, or mental pain and suffering.

24 The Prosecutor does not need to prove that

25 Dalona Tillman actually suffered any pain.

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1 Lastly, that the killing was not justified,

2 excused, or done under circumstances that reduce it to

3 a lesser crime.

4 Next, the Prosecutor presents her evidence.

5 The Prosecutor may call witnesses to testify,

6 and may show you exhibits like documents or objects.

7 The defendant’s lawyer has the right cross-

8 examine the Prosecutor’s witnesses.

9 After the Prosecutor has presented all her

10 evidence, the defendant’s attorney may also offer

11 evidence, but does not have to do so.

12 By law, the defendant does not have to prove

13 his innocence, or produce any evidence.

14 If the defense does call any witnesses, the

15 Prosecutor has the right to cross-examine them.

16 The Prosecutor may also call witnesses to

17 contradict the testimony of the defense witnesses.

18 After all the evidence has been presented,

19 the Prosecutor and the defendant’s lawyers will make

20 their closing arguments.

21 Like opening statements, these are not

22 evidence. They are only meant to help you to

23 understand the evidence, and the way each side sees the

24 case.

25 You must base your verdict only on the

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1 evidence.

2 You will be provided with copies of my final

3 instructions, in writing, at the conclusion of the

4 trial, for use during your deliberations.

5 My responsibilities as the Judge in this

6 trial are to make sure that the trial is run fairly,

7 and efficiently; to make decisions about evidence; and

8 to instruct you about the law that applies to this

9 case.

10 You must take the law as I give it to you.

11 Nothing I say is meant to reflect my own

12 opinions about the facts of the case.

13 As jurors, you are the ones that will decide

14 this case.

15 Your responsibility as jurors is to decide

16 what the facts of the case are. This is your job, and

17 no one else’s.

18 You must think about all the evidence, and

19 all the testimony, and then decide what, what each

20 piece of evidence means, and how important you think it

21 is.

22 This includes how much you believe what each

23 of the witnesses said.

24 What you decide about any fact in this case

25 is final.

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1 When it comes -- I’m sorry. When it is time

2 for you to decide the case, you are only allowed to

3 consider the evidence that was admitted into

4 evidence -- I’m sorry, admitted in the case.

5 Evidence includes only the sworn testimony of

6 the witnesses; the exhibits admitted into evidence; and

7 anything else I tell you to consider as evidence.

8 It is your job to decide what the facts of

9 this case are.

10 You must decide which witnesses you believe,

11 and how important you think their testimony is.

12 You do not have to accept or reject

13 everything a witness says.

14 You are free to believe all, none, or part of

15 any person’s testimony.

16 In deciding which testimony you believe, you

17 should rely on your common sense, and every day

18 experience.

19 I lost my place. Here we go.

20 However, in deciding whether you believe a

21 witness’s testimony, you must set aside any bias or

22 prejudice you have based on the race, gender, or

23 national origin of the witness.

24 There is no fixed set of rules for judging

25 whether you believe a witness, but it may help you to

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1 think about these questions:

2 Was the witness able to see or hear clearly?

3 How long was the witness watching or

4 listening?

5 Was anything else going on that might have

6 distracted the witness?

7 Does the witness seem to have a good memory?

8 How does the witness look and act while

9 testifying?

10 Does the witness seem to be making an honest

11 effort to tell the truth, or does the witness seem to

12 evade the questions, or argue with the lawyers?

13 Does the witness’s age or maturity affect how

14 you judge his or her testimony?

15 Does the witness have any bias, or prejudice,

16 or any personal interest in how this case is decided?

17 Have there been any promises, threats,

18 suggestions, or other influences that affect how the

19 witness testifies?

20 In general, does the witness have any special

21 reason to tell the truth, or any special reason to lie?

22 All in all, how reasonable does the witness’s

23 testimony seem when you think about all the other

24 evidence in the case?

25 The questions the lawyers ask the witnesses

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1 are not evidence. Only the answers are evidence.

2 You should not think that something is true

3 just because one of the lawyers asks a question that

4 assumes, or suggests, that it is.

5 I may ask some of the witnesses questions

6 myself.

7 These questions are not meant to reflect my

8 opinion about the evidence.

9 If I ask questions, my only reason would be

10 to ask about things that may not, not have been fully

11 explored.

12 During the trial, you may think of a

13 question, an important question, that would help you to

14 understand the facts in this case.

15 You are allowed to ask such questions.

16 You should sit and wait to ask questions

17 until after a witness has finished testifying, and both

18 sides have finished their questioning.

19 If you still have an important question after

20 this, do not ask it yourself. Raise your hand, write

21 the question down, and pass it to the Deputy, who will

22 then give it to me.

23 Do now show your question to the other

24 jurors.

25 If your question is not asked, it is because

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1 I determined, under the law, that the question should

2 not be asked.

3 Do not speculate about why the question was

4 not asked.

5 In other words, you should draw no

6 conclusions or inferences about the facts of the case,

7 nor should you speculate about what the answer might

8 have been.

9 Also, in considering the evidence, you should

10 not give greater weight to testimony merely because it

11 was given in answer to a question submitted by a member

12 of the jury.

13 On the other hand, if you cannot hear what a

14 witness says, a witness or a lawyer says, please raise

15 your hand and ask to have the question or answer

16 repeated.

17 During the trial, the lawyers may object to

18 certain questions, or statements made by the other

19 lawyer, or witnesses.

20 I will rule on these objections according to

21 the law.

22 My rulings for or against one side or the

23 other are not meant to reflect my opinions about the

24 facts of the case.

25 Sometimes the lawyers and I will have

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1 discussions out of your hearing.

2 Also, while you are in the jury room, I may

3 have to take up other matters that have nothing to do

4 with this case.

5 Pay no attention to these interruptions.

6 I mentioned this instruction earlier:

7 You must not discuss this case with anyone,

8 including your family or friends.

9 You must not even discuss it with the other

10 jurors until the time comes for you to decide the case.

11 When it is time for you to decide the case, I

12 will send you to the jury room for that purpose.

13 Then you should discuss the case amongst

14 yourselves, but only in the jury room, and only when

15 all the jurors are present.

16 When the trial is over, you may discuss, if

17 you wish, the case with anyone.

18 If I call for a recess during trial, I will

19 either send you back to the jury room, or allow you to

20 leave the courtroom on your own, and go about your

21 business.

22 But you must not discuss the case with

23 anyone, or let anyone discuss it with you, or in your

24 presence.

25 If someone tries to do that, tell him or her

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1 to stop, and explain that a juror, that as a juror, you

2 are not allowed to discuss the case.

3 If he or she continues, leave and report the

4 incident to me as soon as you return to court.

5 You must not talk to the defendant, the

6 lawyers, or the witnesses about anything at all, even

7 if it has nothing to do with the case.

8 Now, you may find yourself in the hallway, or

9 in the convenience store downstairs, or in an elevator,

10 with a witnesses or an attorney in this case.

11 They will ignore you, because they know that

12 that’s their obligation.

13 Do not construe their, their ignoring as

14 their being rude, or inappropriate.

15 They, again, they simply know that they

16 cannot have any contact with you; and you cannot engage

17 them in any type of contact, as well.

18 It is very important that you only get

19 information about this case in court, when you are

20 acting as the jury; and when the defendant, the

21 lawyers, and I are all here.

22 During the trial, do not read, listen to, or

23 watch any news reports about this case.

24 Under the law, the evidence you consider to

25 decide the case must meet certain standards.

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1 For example, witnesses must swear to tell the

2 truth; and the lawyers must be able to cross-examine

3 them.

4 Because news reports do not have to meet

5 these standards, they could give you incorrect, or

6 misleading information, that might unfairly favor one

7 side.

8 So, to be fair to both sides, you must follow

9 this instruction.

10 The restrictions I’m about to describe are

11 meant to ensure that the parties get a fair trial.

12 In our Judicial system, it is crucial that

13 jurors are not influenced by anything, or anyone,

14 outside this courtroom.

15 Now that many jurors have easy access to

16 information through hand held devices, and other

17 technology, jurors may be tempted to use these devices

18 to learn about some aspect of the case.

19 But if a juror was to do this, it would harm

20 both parties.

21 The parties’ attorneys would have no way of

22 knowing that a juror has gotten outside information,

23 and would have no chance to object if that information

24 was false, untrustworthy, or irrelevant.

25 Remember, no matter how careful and

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1 conscientious news reporters, family members, friends,

2 and other people outside the courtroom may be,

3 information about the case from T.V., radio, the

4 internet, and social media will inevitably be

5 incomplete, and could be incorrect.

6 Please bear these things in mind as I read

7 the following instructions.

8 These restrictions apply from this moment,

9 until I discharge you from jury service.

10 You must decide this case based solely on the

11 evidence you see and hear in this courtroom.

12 You must not consider information that comes

13 from anywhere else.

14 This means that during the trial, you must

15 not read, watch, or listen to news reports about the

16 case, whether in newspapers, on T.B., on the radio, or

17 the internet.

18 You also must not research any aspect of the

19 case during trial. This means research using cell

20 phones, computers, or any other electronic device to

21 search the internet, as well as research with

22 traditional sources like dictionaries, reference

23 manuals, newspapers, or magazines.

24 You must not investigate the case on your

25 own, or conduct any experiments concerning the case,

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1 including investigation or experiments using the

2 internet, computers, cell phones, or other electronic

3 devices.

4 You must not visit the scene of any event at

5 issue in this trial.

6 If it is necessary for you to view or visit

7 the scene, court staff will take you there as a group,

8 under court supervision.

9 You must not consider as evidence any

10 personal knowledge you have of the scene.

11 Before your deliberations, you must not

12 discuss this case with anyone, even your fellow jurors.

13 After you begin deliberations, you should

14 discuss this case with your fellow jurors, but you

15 still must not discuss this case with anyone else,

16 until after I discharge you from your jury service.

17 Until I have discharged you from your jury

18 service, you must not share any information about the

19 case, by any means, including cell phones, or social

20 media.

21 If you discover that a juror has violated my

22 instruction, report it to my Deputy.

23 You may take notes during the trial, if you

24 wish, but of course, you don’t have to.

25 If you take notes, you should be careful that

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1 it does not distract you from paying attention to all

2 the evidence.

3 When you go to the jury room to decide your

4 verdict, you may use your notes to help you remember

5 what happened in the courtroom.

6 If you take notes, do not let anyone, except

7 the other jurors, see them during deliberations.

8 Your notes will not be examined by anyone.

9 And when your jury service concludes, your notes will

10 be collected and destroyed.

11 In a few minutes, you all will be provided

12 with a folder.

13 The folder will have a legal pad, pen, and of

14 course you can take notes on the legal pad, with the

15 pen. You will have a pad, that specifically allows --

16 that is for questions, if you wish to ask a questions.

17 And you will also be provided with a copy of

18 the elements of the crimes alleged in this case, for

19 your review.

20 You can see that we have chosen a jury of

21 fourteen individuals.

22 After you have heard all the evidence, and my

23 instructions, we will draw lots to decide which two of

24 you will be dismissed in order to form a jury of

25 twelve.

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1 Possible penalty should -- excuse me, should

2 not influence your decision.

3 It is the duty of the Judge to fix the

4 penalty within the limits provided by law.

5 I may give you more instructions during the

6 trial.

7 And at the end of the trial, I will give you

8 detailed instructions about the law in this case.

9 You should consider all of my instructions as

10 a connected series. Taken all together, they are the

11 law to you.

12 After all the evidence has been presented,

13 and the lawyers have given their closing arguments, I

14 will give you detailed instructions about the rules

15 that apply to this case.

16 Then, you will go to the jury room to decide

17 your verdict.

18 A verdict must be unanimous.

19 That means every juror must agree on it, and

20 it must reflect the individual decision of each juror.

21 It is important for you to keep an open mind,

22 and not make a decision about anything in the case

23 until you go to the jury room to decide the case.

24 Okay.

25 Counsel, can you approach?

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3 THE COURT: Okay.

4 Ladies and gentlemen, at this time, I’m gonna

5 ask that you retire to the jury room. That will be

6 your room for the next few days.

7 We’re gonna take about a ten or fifteen

8 minute break, at this time.

9 All right?

10 Thank you.

11 DEPUTY: All rise.

12 (Whereupon the jurors were excused from the

13 courtroom).



16 proceedings from 2:40 p.m. to 2:52 p.m.)

17 THE COURT: Okay.

18 We’re back on the record in case


20 People, are you ready?

21 MS. RUBIO: Yes, Your Honor. Thank you.


23 MR. HARRIS: Yes, we’re ready, Your Honor.


25 We’ll being out the jury.

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2 (Whereupon the jurors were brought back into

3 the courtroom).


5 THE COURT: Okay.

6 We are on the record in 16-001235-FC, People


8 Your appearances?


10 MR. HARRIS: Good afternoon, Your Honor.

11 Wyatt Harris on behalf of Mr. Terrance.

12 THE COURT: Okay.

13 All right.

14 Miss Rubio?

15 MS. RUBIO: And Your Honor, just before I

16 start, I would make a motion for an order of

17 sequestration.

18 THE COURT: Okay.

19 You have no objection?

20 MR. HARRIS: Join in that motion, Your Honor.

21 THE COURT: Okay.

22 Are there any witnesses in the courtroom?

23 MS. RUBIO: I don’t believe so. Is Ms.

24 Tillman in the courtroom?

25 No, okay. Great. My witnesses are in the

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1 witness room.

2 Thank you.

3 THE COURT: Okay.

4 Ms. Rubio, your opening statement?


6 OPENING STATEMENT BY MS. RUBIO

7 On December 15th, of last year, at a house on

8 Mendota Street, in the City of Detroit, Ms. Dalona

9 Tillman took her last breath, at the hand of that man,

10 the defendant.

11 You will hear testimony from the Medical

12 Examiner, about the agonizing, brutal last moments of

13 her life.

14 The Medical Examiner will get on that stand,

15 and tell you that she had so many bruises, all over her

16 body, that she quit counting, after about seventy.

17 You will hear that she had multiple cuts and

18 abrasion, about her person.

19 You will that she was ultimately smothered to

20 death.

21 And the Medical Examiner will tell you, in

22 detail, how all of this is obvious.

23 She will also tell you how long it takes to

24 smother someone, to death.

25 You will hear from the E.M.S. drivers, who

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1 arrived on the scene.

2 And you will hear that the E.M.S. drivers

3 arrived, and that the only people in the home were Ms.

4 Tillman, and the defendant.

5 And you will hear that the E.M.S. drivers

6 loaded Ms. Tillman into the ambulance, and that the

7 defendant did, in fact, ride with them, to the

8 hospital.

9 You will hear that ther was some discussion

10 between the E.M.S. drivers, and the defendant.

11 You will hear that they arrived at the

12 hospital, and Ms. Tillman, of course, didn’t survive.

13 And you will hear that the family members of

14 Dalona Tillman arrived at the hospital, specifically,

15 her mother, Narvetta Tillman.

16 You’ll hear from Narvetta Tillman.

17 And you’ll hear that she exchanged words with

18 the defendant, and you’ll hear that the defendant spoke

19 briefly with the Officer in charge, and left. He did

20 not stick around at the hospital.

21 You’ll hear from Officers who made the scene,

22 and what they observed, at the house.

23 You’ll hear from Evidence Technicians, who

24 are from the Crime Scene Services, of the Detroit

25 Police Department.

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1 And you’ll hear that they took various

2 photographs of Ms., Ms. Tillman, various photographs of

3 the home.

4 And you will also hear from a representative

5 from the Michigan State Police Department.

6 And that, you will hear that the -- there was

7 evidence gathered, and sent off to a lab, and that

8 there was suspected blood in various locations in the

9 home, and that that was sent to the lab, and tested,

10 and that it was, in fact, blood. It was, in fact,

11 human blood.

12 You will also hear from Police personnel, who

13 spoke to the defendant.

14 And you will hear various versions of the

15 event given by the defendant, the conflict one another.

16 And ultimately, I will -- when everything’s

17 over, I will get up, and I will ask you to find the

18 defendant guilty as charged.

19 Thank you so much.


21 MR. HARRIS: Your Honor, we reserve our

22 opening.

23 THE COURT: Okay.

24 Ms. Rubio, your first witness?

25 MS. RUBIO: The People call Brandon Routhier.

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1 THE COURT: Okay.

2 B R A N D O N R O U T H I E R

3 Called as a witness and having been first duly sworn by the

4 Clerk, was examined, and testified as follows:

5 THE COURT: Okay.

6 Sir, what’s your name?

7 WITNESS: Brandon Routhier.

8 THE COURT: Can you spell your last name?

9 WITNESS: R-o-u-t-h-i-e-r.

10 THE COURT: Can you raise your right hand for

11 me?

12 Do you swear or affirm that the testimony you

13 give in this matter will be the truth, the whole truth,

14 and nothing but the truth?

15 WITNESS: I do.

16 THE COURT: Okay.

17 Please have a seat to my left.

18 Go ahead, Ms. Rubio.


20 DIRECT EXAMINATION

21 BY MS. RUBIO:

22 Q Good afternoon. Please tell us your name and

23 occupation.

24 A My name is Brandon Routhier. I’m a Technician, E.M.T.

25 with Detroit Fire Department.

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1 Q Okay. And were you also employed as such back December

2 15th, of 2015?

3 A Yes, ma’am.

4 Q Okay. And did you receive a, a run to a location on

5 Mendota, specifically 20170 Mendota, in the City of

6 Detroit?

7 A Yes, ma’am.

8 Q Okay. And did you know why you were going to that

9 location?

10 A I recall that it’s a, unresponsive.

11 Q Okay. What does that mean?

12 A Someone’s not responding, at all.

13 Q Okay. And so, when you arrived, what -- at the

14 location, what did you see?

15 A There was a gentleman on the porch, waving us down.

16 And we got out, and went into the house.

17 Q Okay. When you went into the house, what did you see?

18 A Saw a black female, laying on a, the futon, or bed,

19 couch, type of, you know, like a couch, just laying

20 there, not breathing.

21 Q Okay. And do you recall when you entered the home,

22 what, what room it was in? Did you have to go through

23 some rooms, or --

24 A That was in the -- right in the front room.

25 Q In the front room. Okay.

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1 And you indicated, she was not breathing?

2 A You could see that she was not breathing when you

3 walked in.

4 Q Okay. And so, what did you do next?

5 A I went over to the female, and checked for a pulse.

6 There was no pulse.

7 So, then we pulled her -- I pulled her onto

8 the, onto the floor, and started compressions.

9 Q And what happened next?

10 A After I started compressions, we put the A.D. on her,

11 and there was no shock advised.

12 And there was a -- the young man that was

13 waving us down, he was stan -- he was standing right

14 at, ‘cause I was on my knees, he was right at my

15 shoulder level.

16 And I asked him what happened.

17 Q Okay. And just one second.

18 Did, did you -- do you see that young man

19 here today?

20 A The gentleman right here.

21 MS. RUBIO: Let the record reflect the

22 witness has pointed to and identified the defendant.

23 THE COURT: Noted.


25 Q (By Ms. Rubio): And you asked him what happened?

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1 A Yes, ma’am.

2 Q Okay. What did he say?

3 A He said that she wasn’t feeling good, and she was --

4 she smoked weed earlier. She came in, and laid down.

5 Q Okay. Okay. And then, did you -- what happened next?

6 Did you ask him anything else?

7 A As we -- I was doing compressions, she had quite a few

8 different lacerations to her face, and other marks on

9 her, that looked like she had had some type of trauma

10 to her.

11 And I asked, I asked him, what happened to

12 her face?

13 And he said that she got into a fight

14 yesterday.

15 Q Okay. What happened next?

16 A We continued with our, with our treatment. And took

17 her out to the truck, and just continued C.P.R. And

18 transported her to the hospital.

19 Q Okay. And when -- were you -- was she transported in

20 an ambulance?

21 A Yes, ma’am.

22 Q Okay. And where were you seated?

23 A I was in the back, with her, when we were in the --

24 continuing compressions and C.P.R., to the hospital.

25 Q Okay. And then, so were you with a partner?

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1 A Yes. My, my partner was driving.

2 Q Okay. And was there anyone else in the vehicle, other

3 than Ms. Tillman -- I’m, I’m sorry, other than the

4 woman you were working on, yourself, and your partner?

5 A The gentleman sitting right there, he also -- he rode

6 up front with my partner.

7 Q Okay. And then what happened once you arrived at the

8 hospital?

9 A The patient was on the cot. We took the pat -- cot out

10 of the truck, and we went into Sinai Grace Hospital,

11 and we went into the recess room, and transferred care,

12 patient care, to the doctors and nurses in the recess

13 room.

14 Q Okay. And was that the end of your interaction with

15 that female?

16 A Yes, ma’am.

17 Q Okay. And did you, did you learn the name of the

18 female?

19 A Not ‘til after. I mean, at, at that point, it’s not,

20 it’s not really like a, like for us, we’re just more

21 worried about her health, and trying to do what we can

22 for her. I’m not really worried about a name that --

23 Q Okay. That’s not typically part of your role, correct?

24 A Well, we try to get as much information as we can.

25 But, in that, in that type of situation, we’ve -- we,

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1 we would just make it as, like a Jane Doe, because

2 we’re not -- we’re worried about the person that, and

3 trying to, you know, regain consciousness, and a heart

4 beat, and that type of stuff, so we can worry about

5 that information later.

6 Q Absolutely. Okay.

7 Thank you.

8 MS. RUBIO: I don’t have any further

9 questions.


11 CROSS-EXAMINATION

12 BY MR. HARRIS:

13 Q The individual that you say was Mr. Terrance, on the

14 porch, did he have a cell phone in his hands?

15 A I don’t, I don’t recall that.

16 Q And you’re absolutely certain you saw someone jumping

17 on a porch, trying to get your attention?

18 A Someone was waving their hand, yes.

19 Q And are you sure it was this gentleman?

20 A Yes, sir.

21 Q Absolutely certain?

22 A Yes, sir. That’s the gentleman that was waving his

23 hands.

24 Q And when you say that this individual was on the porch,

25 that would have meant that they were away from the

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1 individual that was having the trauma, correct?

2 A He was on the porch. And when we walked in, she was on

3 the, the couch.

4 Q They were in two separate locations, correct?

5 A Yes, sir.

6 Q And you don’t recall if, if that gentleman was on the

7 phone?

8 A I don’t remember a phone. I, I, I don’t recall a

9 phone, in its hand.

10 Q Okay. Do you recall ever hearing anyone from 9-1-1 on

11 the -- on a phone?

12 A No, sir.

13 Q Okay.


15 THE COURT: Anything further from you, Miss

16 Rubio?



19 if any of you have a question for the witness, please

20 raise your hand.

21 And if so, you’ll write your question down.

22 Seeing, seeing no hands, you may -- oh, we do

23 have a hand.

24 All right.

25 Can you write your question down?

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4 THE COURT: Okay.

5 Question one: Was she ever responsive,

6 question mark?

7 Was there a rhythm per E.K.G. -- E.C.G.?

8 WITNESS: She was never response.

9 And we’re a basic truck. We cannot tell if

10 there is an, an E.K.G.

11 But, the A.E.D. will only shock at defib or

12 V-tack, and the A.E.D. said, no shock advised. The

13 whole, the whole code, the whole transport.

14 THE COURT: Okay.

15 Why, why, if no pulse, no breathing, was she

16 transferred to hospital?

17 WITNESS: We have protocols for City of

18 Detroit, that if they do not find -- fit the criteria

19 of dead on scene, that we initiate C.P.R.

20 So, there was no rigger mortis, there was

21 lividity, there’s no obvious signs of death, she was

22 still warm.

23 So, in, in our protocol, it shows, we’re

24 supposed to initiate C.P.R., and transport the patient.

25 THE COURT: Okay.

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1 Next question: Was there anyone else at the

2 home?

3 WITNESS: There was no one else at the home,

4 that we saw.


6 MS. RUBIO: Just as a follow up.

7 REDIRECT EXAMINATION

8 BY MS. RUBIO:

9 Q You’ve referred to this A.E.D., for those of us who are

10 not savvy about medical terminology, what if -- can you

11 just tell us what that is?

12 A It’s a defibrillator, that will, will shock the

13 patient, if they are in V-tack or V-fib.

14 Q What is V-tack?

15 A Ventricular tachycardia, or ventricular fibrillation.

16 So, a heart is not pumping right, and they -- it’s a,

17 it will -- the ventricle, in tachycardia, where it’s,

18 it’s beating really fast; V-fob, which is, it’s just

19 fluttering.

20 So, it will shock the heart, to put it in a

21 normal rhythm that everybody here in the courtroom has.

22 Q Okay. Well, to follow up on that, earlier you

23 testified that you did not feel a pulse. Did you --

24 was, was the heart beating in any fashion?

25 A No, ma’am.

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1 Q Thank you.

2 MS. RUBIO: I don’t have any further

3 questions.


5 RECROSS-EXAMINATION

6 BY MR. HARRIS:

7 Q Were you -- are you familiar with this location, 2071

8 Mendota?

9 A That was the first time that we’d -- that I have ever

10 been to that residence.

11 Q Okay. And do you know if that location has an upstairs

12 to it?

13 A I do not know.

14 Q Okay. So, when you say, no one was at home, you don’t

15 know if someone may have been in another part of the

16 house, correct?

17 A I do not, no.

18 Q You just didn’t see anyone in the living room, where

19 you were?

20 A Yes, sir.

21 Q Other than Mr. Terrance, correct

22 A Correct.

23 Q Thank you.

24 THE COURT: Miss Rubio?

25 MS. RUBIO: I don’t have any other questions.

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2 any additional questions?

3 If so, please raise your hand.

4 Seeing no hands.

5 You may step down, sir.

6 Thank you.

7 WITNESS: Thank you, sir.

8 (Whereupon the witness was excused).

9 THE COURT: Your next witness?

10 MS. RUBIO: I call -- the People call

11 Christopher Chase.

12 C H R I S T O P H E R C H A S E


14 Court, was examined, and testified as follows:

15 THE COURT: Can you tell us your full name?

16 WITNESS: Christopher Lee Chase.

17 THE COURT: Can you spell your last name?’

18 WITNESS: C-h-a-s-e.


20 me?




24 WITNESS: Yes, I do.

25 THE COURT: Okay.

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3 BY MS. RUBIO:

4 Q Good afternoon. Could you please tell us your name and

5 occupation?

6 A Christopher Chase, Detroit Fire Department, E.M.S.

7 Division.

8 Q Okay. And did you response to a location on Mendota,

9 with Brandon Routhier, back on December 15th of last

10 year?

11 A Yes, ma’am.

12 Q Okay. And do you recall if that was day time, or night

13 time?

14 A Early afternoon.

15 Q Okay. And when you got to the location, did you go

16 inside?

17 A Yes, ma’am.

18 Q Okay. And what, what or who did you see when you first

19 went in?

20 A A young man standin’ on the porch, waving his arms at

21 us.

22 Q Okay. And do you see him here today?

23 A Yes, ma’am.

24 Q Could you point to him?

25 A Right there.

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1 MS. RUBIO: Let the record reflect that the

2 witness has pointed to the defendant.

3 THE COURT: Noted.


5 Q (By Ms. Rubio): And so, once you got out of the

6 vehicle, did you three then go inside; you, your

7 partner, and the defendant?

8 A Yeah, the defendant, my partner, then myself.

9 Q Okay. And what did you see when you went inside?

10 A There was a female laying on the couch, on her back.

11 Q Okay. And did you have an opportunity to observe her,

12 her person?

13 A Yeah, she had lacerations to her face, her knuckles

14 were scraped up.

15 Q Okay. And did -- then what did you do next?

16 A At that time, my partner was speaking to the, the male

17 in the house. I was told to go out and get the

18 stretcher, and to come back in, to get the rest of our

19 equipment. So --

20 Q Okay. And you did that?

21 A Yes, ma’am.

22 Q Okay. And then what happened?

23 A We extricated the patient out to the truck, and started

24 working on her, because she was not breathing.

25 Q Okay. And how long -- did -- I’m sorry, so, when you

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1 had her in the truck, were you doing that while it was

2 parked?

3 A Yes, we were in front of the house working her. Well,

4 we got her out of the house, started working on her,

5 doin’ C.P.R. on her, but vital signs were absent, and

6 you know, we proceeded to the hospital.

7 Q And did you -- was she also worked on in the house?

8 A Initially, not at, not at first.

9 Q Okay.

10 A We got, we extricated her out, ‘cause we didn’t know

11 the situation, at the time, what was goin’ on. I

12 actually --

13 Q And then -- but at some point, you were outside, while

14 your partner remained inside?

15 A Yes, ma’am.

16 Q Okay. Then, then you said you worked on her outside,

17 while the vehicle was parked?

18 A Yes, ma’am.

19 Q How long did that happen?

20 A I couldn’t give you exact time on there. I’d have to

21 look at the run report.

22 Q Okay. And then, at some point, did the vehicle take

23 off?

24 A Yes.

25 Q Okay.

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1 A I -- yeah, that -- at that time, we left the scene, and

2 transported her to the hospital.

3 Q Okay. And what were you, what were you doing during

4 the transport?

5 A I was driving.

6 Q Okay. And there was you, and your, your partner, and

7 of course the person that you -- that, that you had

8 gone to, to see, and work on, correct?

9 A Yes, ma’am.

10 Q Anyone else in the vehicle?

11 A Yeah. The defendant was in the front seat with me.

12 Q With you?

13 A Yes.

14 Q Okay. And did you and he speak at all, during the ride

15 to the hospital?

16 A While en route, I did question, again, since, you know,

17 we were -- everybody was separated. Tell me again what

18 happened?

19 Q What did he say?

20 A He said, she got in an argument -- got in a fight the

21 day before, and they were smokin’ weed. And then he

22 said, at that time, well she was -- they were smokin’

23 weed because she didn’t feel good. And he said, he

24 didn’t want to take her last breath, and that was it.

25 And I just kind of looked at him, and he

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1 never answered me again.

2 Q Okay. He said, he did not want to take her last

3 breath?

4 A Yes, ma’am.

5 Q Okay. And then, what -- you said he didn’t say

6 anything else, after that, to you?

7 A To me.

8 Q Okay. What else -- what happened after that?

9 A He was on the phone with somebody. I don’t know who.

10 Q Okay. And so, obviously, you saw him with a phone?

11 A Yes, ma’am.

12 Q Okay. And do you recall what hand he was holding the

13 phone in?

14 A Left hand.

15 Q And why, why do you know that?

16 A Not knowing the situation, being in the front seat, you

17 know, we got a passenger. When you see someone movin’

18 around, they’re constantly lookin’. So, when he’s got

19 his phone up, I see, like, a red substance on his hand,

20 that kind of caught me off guard.

21 Q Okay.

22 A And just kind of left it alone, like that, when we got

23 to the hospital.

24 Q Okay. And you -- did you know what that red substance

25 was?

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1 A No, ma’am.

2 Q Okay. Did it appear dry, or wet, or --

3 A It appeared dry. I mean, it wasn’t, like, running down

4 his hands or nothin’.

5 Q Okay. And what did it look like to you?

6 MR. HARRIS: Objection. It would just be

7 pure speculation.

8 THE COURT: Well, if you can describe -- it’s

9 not objectionable to ask if you could describe it.

10 Q (By Ms. Rubio): Can you do that? Can you describe

11 what it looked like?

12 A Honestly, it looked like blood. It looked like dry

13 blood, you know, like, you got your hands bloody, and

14 it kind of, like, ran down your hand.

15 Q Okay.

16 A Down the palm, like, the back side of your hand.

17 Q And you’re pointing to the -- as you just say, the back

18 side?

19 A The back side.

20 Q Of the hand?

21 A Yes.

22 Q Okay. And when you were in the house, before you

23 left --

24 A Mm-hmm.

25 Q When you were in the house, did you, at any time, see

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1 anyone else?

2 A No, ma’am.

3 Q Okay. And earlier, when you were saying that you went

4 and got the stretcher, and then you worked on, worked

5 on her outside, for a minute, were you implying that

6 nobody ever worked on her, in any fashion, on the

7 inside of the house?

8 A Prior to our arrival?

9 Q No, you. You or your partner?

10 A I don’t know. My partner did, initially, when it --

11 when he -- when I walked out. I went and got the

12 stretcher.

13 Q Okay. Okay.

14 MS. RUBIO: Hold on one second.

15 I don’t have any other questions. Thank you

16 so much.

17 THE COURT: Okay.

18 Mr. Harris?

19 CROSS-EXAMINATION

20 BY MR. HARRIS:

21 Q Now, when you say you saw an individual out on the

22 porch, did you see Mr. Terrance out on the porch?

23 A Yes, sir.

24 Q Okay. And did he have a cell phone?

25 A He had something in his hand.

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1 Q In his hand? Could you tell if he may have been

2 talking to somebody?

3 A Not from where my -- I was driving, so he was on the

4 passenger’s side of the truck.

5 Q Okay. When you first arrived at the location, before

6 Mr. Terrance got into the E.M.S. truck, you saw someone

7 jumping on the porch. One, was that Mr. Terrance?

8 A Yes, sir.

9 Q Okay. Two, did you see him with a cell phone?

10 A No.

11 Q And Mr. Terrance, you said, was the first person to go

12 inside the house?

13 A Yes, sir.

14 Q And you were the last person?

15 A Yes, sir.

16 Q And between, between the two of you, your partner went

17 in, Mr. Chase?

18 A No, I’m Mr. Chase.

19 Q I mean, Mr. Routhier?

20 A Routhier, yes.

21 Q Routhier. Okay. And you had to get from the porch, to

22 this couch, and that’s some distance, is that correct?

23 From any -- from off the porch, into the

24 house?

25 A Yeah, maybe six, seven feet.

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1 Q Okay. But it is a distance?

2 A Yes.

3 Q Okay. You didn’t have a situation where you went in

4 the house, and Mr. Terrance was still -- was in the

5 house already, correct?

6 A No.

7 Q You specifically remember Mr. Terrance being on that

8 porch?

9 A Yes, sir.

10 Q And you -- do you specifically remember if Mr. Terrance

11 was on a phone?

12 A I do not recall if he was on the phone, at that time.

13 Q Do you recall even hearing anyone from 9-1-1 on the

14 phone?

15 A I do not recall any of that.

16 Q Okay. Now, you also said that on the ride to the

17 hospital -- at any point, did you write down,

18 specifically, what Mr. Terrance said?

19 A Did I?

20 Q Yes.

21 A No, sir.

22 Q I understand you were the driver.

23 A Yes.

24 Q But did you get to a stop light, and make a note?

25 A No, we didn’t really stop for no lights. So, no.

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1 Q Okay. But you remember him specifically saying, he

2 didn’t want her to take his last breath -- her last

3 breath?

4 A Yes, sir.

5 Q You remember that, specifically?

6 A Specifically.

7 Q And you said that he was holding his phone with his

8 left hand, is that correct?

9 A Holding a phone, yes.

10 Q A phone. How fast were you traveling in this E.M.S.?

11 A I couldn’t tell you exactly at that time.

12 Q Thirty, forty miles an hour?

13 A Possibility.

14 Q Okay. You have to watch out for traffic, correct?

15 A Yes, sir.

16 Q He, Mr. Terrance, was not guiding you through traffic,

17 correct?

18 A No, sir.

19 Q Not giving you directions, correct?

20 A No, sir.

21 Q Okay. And so then you say you looked at his left hand,

22 correct?

23 A Yes, sir.

24 Q And you said you saw, on his left hand, a red

25 substance?

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1 A Yes, sir.

2 Q Correct? Okay.

3 At any point in time, when this E.M.S. truck

4 stopped, and you got out of your truck, did you say

5 anything to anybody about a red substance being on his

6 hands?

7 A I questioned my partner about it.

8 Q What do you mean, you questioned your --

9 A I mean, I -- let me rephrase that.

10 I said something to my partner.

11 Q What did --

12 A About that.

13 Q You say to him --

14 A I noticed a red substance --

15 Q Specifically?

16 A On his hands.

17 Q Okay. Besides your partner, did you say anything to

18 anybody else about a red substance being on his hands?

19 A The Detective, when I was questioned.

20 Q On that day?

21 A On that day.

22 Q On that particular day?

23 A No, sir.

24 Q You didn’t encounter any kind of security from the

25 hospital?

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1 A The security was involved in it, yes.

2 Q Okay. Did you say to security, hey, I saw a red

3 substance on the hands of, of the man that rode over

4 with us, at the house?

5 A I do not remember that.

6 Q Okay. You didn’t take a picture of his hands, did you?

7 A No, sir.

8 Q And you didn’t say anything to the Police, on the day

9 that you rode with him, over there -- you didn’t take a

10 picture of his hands, correct?

11 A No, I didn’t take a picture of his hands, sir.

12 Q Now, on his hand, did you see anything other than a red

13 substance?

14 A I saw what appeared to be tattoos.

15 Q Okay. And can you, for the jury, point where on his

16 hand you allegedly saw this red substance, using your

17 hand?

18 A He was holdin’ his phone up --

19 Q Correct.

20 A Like right around this area.

21 Q Right around --

22 A Like, like, right here.

23 MR. HARRIS: Let the record reflect that the

24 witness has taken his right hand, and identified with

25 his forefinger, and I guess it’s his middle finger.

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1 Yeah, it is his middle finger, and placed it over his

2 left hand, just below the knuckles, right at the level

3 of the bottom of his thumb, and right just below the,

4 the middle finger being just below his wrist.

5 You agree with me, counsel?

6 MS. RUBIO: I do, I do. Thank you.

7 Q (By Mr. Harris): And you say that this substance

8 appeared dry?

9 A Yes, it did not appear to be running.

10 Q And in that area, did you see tattoos in that area?

11 A I --

12 Q That you identified?

13 A I couldn’t identify what they were, but --

14 Q No, but did you see tattoos?

15 A It looked like he had a tattoo on his, top of -- like,

16 in this area, yes.

17 Q But in the area that you identified to this jury, as to

18 where you saw blood, do you know if you saw a tattoo in

19 that area?

20 A Well, I could not tell you that.

21 Q Thank you.



24 REDIRECT EXAMINATION

25 BY MS. RUBIO:

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1 Q When you drive the E.M.S. vehicle, to respond to

2 various locations, are you also simultaneously

3 listening to live 9-1-1 calls between the callers and

4 the dispatchers?

5 A No, ma’am.

6 Q Okay. Thank you.

7 MS. RUBIO: No other questions.


9 MR. HARRIS: No questions, Your Honor.


11 if you have any questions, please raise your right

12 hand.

13 Seeing no questions -- seeing no hands.

14 Thank you, sir. You can step down.


16 THE COURT: Miss Rubio?

17 MS. RUBIO: Your Honor, may we approach for

18 one moment?

19 THE COURT: Certainly.

20 Mr. Harris, I believe you’re referring to --

21 MR. HARRIS: I’m sorry.



24 THE COURT: Ms. Rubio, your next witness?

25 MS. RUBIO: Yes, my next witness is Narvetta

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1 Tillman.

2 Let me take one moment, and we can mark

3 something.

4 And this is -- sorry.

5 The People are, are marking People’s Exhibit

6 1, which is a, a photo of Ms. Tillman, and defense

7 counsel has indicated he has no objection to that, is

8 that correct?

9 MR. HARRIS: That is correct, Your Honor.

10 THE COURT: Okay.

11 So, are you moving, at this time, that

12 Exhibit 1 be admitted?

13 MS. RUBIO: I am, Your Honor.

14 MR. HARRIS: No objection, Your Honor.

15 THE COURT: Okay.

16 Exhibit No. 1, which is a photograph, shall

17 be admitted.


19 N A R V E T T A T I L L M A N


21 Court, was examined, and testified as follows:

22 THE COURT: Okay.

23 Ma’am, if I can just stop you right there.

24 Can you tell us your name?

25 WITNESS: Narvetta Tillman.

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2 Two things, can you speak louder, and can you

3 spell your name for us?

4 WITNESS: Narvetta Tillman. N-a-r-v-e-t-t-a,

5 T-i-l-l-m-a-n.


7 Can you raise your right hand for me.




11 WITNESS: Yes.

12 THE COURT: Okay.



15 BY MS. RUBIO:

16 Q Good afternoon, ma’am. I’m gonna ask you some

17 questions, and it’s important, as the Judge just

18 stated, that you keep your voice up, and you have to

19 answer out loud, because everything’s being recorded,

20 okay?

21 A Yes.

22 Q So, you probably have to speak a little louder than

23 that.

24 And if you don’t understand something, just

25 let me know, okay?

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1 A Okay.

2 Q And you are Narvetta Tillman?

3 A Yes.

4 Q Okay. Are you related to Dalona Tillman?

5 A That was my daughter.

6 Q Okay. And I’m gonna take your attention to, back to

7 December 15th, of 2015. At some point, did you go to a

8 hospital?

9 A Yes.

10 Q Okay. And what caused you to go to the hospital?

11 A I received several phone calls, from my daughter’s cell

12 phone.

13 When I returned the phone call, Mr. Terrance

14 called and said, two girls had jumped on my daughter,

15 and he didn’t know what to do.

16 So, he called the ambulance, and I

17 immediately hung up, and left.

18 Q Okay. And what -- you say, Mr. Terrance. Who are you

19 referring to?

20 A Tre.

21 Q I’m sorry, can you point to someone?

22 A Tre.

23 Q Okay.

24 MS. RUBIO: Let the record reflect the

25 witness has pointed to the defendant.

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1 THE COURT: Noted.


3 Q (By Ms. Rubio): And his, his name, his full name is

4 Treshaun Terrance. Did you know him as, and refer to

5 him, as Tre?

6 A Yes.

7 Q Okay. And prior to this date, did you know him?

8 A Yes.

9 Q And how long had you known him?

10 A Hmm, a couple of years.

11 Q And how is it that you knew him?

12 A Through my daughter.

13 Q Okay. And you, you say, through your daughter. Was

14 there a -- what was their relationship?

15 A Boyfriend, girlfriend.

16 Q Okay. And when you indicated a moment ago that your,

17 you said your daughter’s cell phone was ringing -- I,

18 I’m sorry, you were receiving calls from your

19 daughter’s cell phone, correct?

20 A Yes, I was at work.

21 Q And when you say, your daughter, are you referring to

22 Dalona Tillman?

23 A Yes.

24 Q Okay. And so, then when you answered, it was, instead,

25 the defendant on the phone?

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1 A Correct.

2 Q Okay. And did he also tell you where your daughter was

3 A Sinai Grace.

4 Q Okay. So, you said you hung up. Then what did you do?

5 A I left work, and I went to the hospital.

6 Q Okay. And what happened when you got to the hospital?

7 A Immediately when I got there, the lady told me that my

8 daughter was gone.

9 Q You say, the lady. Is that someone who works at the --

10 A A doctor, or yeah. I’m not quite sure who she was.

11 Q Okay. And what happened next?

12 A I aksed (as spoken) to see her. And I went in by

13 myself. I examined her body. And I came back out, and

14 I aksed him, why did he do that to my daughter.

15 Q Okay. And what did he say?

16 A He swear on his dead daddy’s grave, he didn’t do it.

17 Q And what happened next?

18 A I went back in the room, with my daughter, and I just

19 sit there for a while.

20 Q Other than those, those --

21 A Maybe --

22 Q I’m sorry.

23 A About ten or fifteen minutes. And when I came back, my

24 fiancé and my son was there, and I said, where did he

25 go?

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1 Q Who?

2 A And -- Tre.

3 Q Okay.

4 A And they said, we don’t know.

5 So, I went walkin’ towards the emergency

6 door, and he had her cell phone, up to his ear. And I

7 went out there, and I snatched her phone, and I came

8 back in the hospital. And I don’t know where he went

9 after that.

10 Q How did you know it was her phone?

11 A Because it was purple.

12 Q Okay. You recognized that phone?

13 A Absolutely.

14 Q Okay. And so, you said you snatched the phone? Did

15 the two of you exchange any words, at that time?

16 A He said, he paid for the phone. I said, chalk it up.

17 How many did I pay for that you tore up? And that was

18 it.

19 Q And then, you didn’t see him any more after that, in

20 the hospital?

21 A No.

22 Q Okay. And other than that brief exchange, that you

23 indicated the, the two of you had, at first, did, did

24 you exchange any other words?

25 A No.

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1 MS. RUBIO: Just one second.

2 Q (By Ms. Rubio): Other than the defendant saying to you

3 that your daughter got in a fight with two girls, did

4 he give you any other details?

5 A No.

6 Q I, I’m sorry?

7 A No.

8 Q And prior to this, this date, when you walked in and

9 saw your, your daughter in the hospital, when was the

10 last time you had seen her, in person?

11 A That would have been that Sunday. The Sunday, ‘cause

12 that was Tuesday. So, it was Sunday.

13 Q I’m sorry. So, so, this, the day that your daughter

14 died, you’re saying was on a Tuesday?

15 A Yes.

16 Q Okay. And so, you saw your daughter two days,

17 previous?

18 A Yes.

19 Q Okay. And when you saw your daughter two days

20 previous, did she have anything noticeable, any

21 injuries noticeable, on her person?

22 A Not on her face, but she had long sleeves on, and long

23 pants, ‘cause I normally check, check her --

24 Q Okay.

25 A Every time I see her.

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1 Q But as far as you know, two days previous, you didn’t

2 see any cuts --

3 A Scars or anything.

4 Q Or bruises --

5 A On her face, no.

6 Q On her, okay. And on the day she died, was she living

7 with you?

8 A No.

9 Q Okay. Who was she living with?

10 A Tre.

11 Q Okay.

12 MS. RUBIO: I don’t have any other questions,

13 at this time.


15 MR. HARRIS: I have no questions of this

16 witness, Your Honor.

17 THE COURT: Okay.

18 Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, if any of

19 you have a question, please raise your hand.

20 Seeing no hands.

21 You may step down. Thank you.

22 WITNESS: Thank you.



25 MS. RUBIO: Your Honor, I think I’ve run out

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1 of witnesses today.

2 THE COURT: Okay.

3 All right.

4 Well, it’s quarter to four. We were gonna

5 stop at four o’clock, anyway.

6 So, this would be a good time to stop for the

7 day.

8 Ladies and gentlemen, we are going to pick up

9 tomorrow, at around -- right around noon. I think I

10 mentioned that earlier. Tomorrow’s Friday.

11 So, please be here at twelve o’clock noon.

12 And we will begin where we left off.

13 All right.

14 Remember, as I told you earlier, extremely

15 important, do not discuss this case with anyone.

16 I know you will have curious friends, curious

17 children, curious spouses, that are probably gonna want

18 to talk about this case, that they know that you came

19 to serve jury duty today.

20 Please tell them that the Judge, the Judge

21 explicitly told you, at least a half a dozen times,

22 that you cannot discuss this case with anyone.

23 Thank you very much.

24 We will have you retire to the jury room.

25 You can put your notes and binders in there, and then

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1 you are free to leave.


3 (Whereupon the jurors were excused for the

4 day).



7 MS. RUBIO: Yes.



10 (Whereupon the proceedings were concluded for

11 the day at 3:45 p.m.)

12 - - -

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CERTIFICATION OF COURT REPORTER

STATE OF MICHIGAN ) ) ss.COUNTY OF WAYNE )

I, SUZANNE L. KINSEY, Official Court Reporter

in and for the Third Circuit Court for the County of Wayne,

State of Michigan, do hereby certify that the foregoing

pages 1 through 240, inclusive, comprises a full, true and

correct rendition, to the best of my ability, of the

proceedings and testimony recorded by the Court in the

matter of the People of the State of Michigan versus

Treshaun Lee Terrance, Case No. 16-01235, on May 12, 2016

(Jury Trial).

Suzanne L. Kinsey, CSMR 4477 Official Court Reporter

Dated:________________________

Detroit, Michigan

The authenticity of the foregoing transcript is null and void

unless affixed with an original signature of the Court Reporterin blue ink.

240

Suzanne Kinsey

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STATE OF MICHIGAN



-vs- Case No. 16-01235


Defendant. /

JURY TRIAL


Monday - May 16, 2016

APPEARANCES:




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C O N T E N T S

Page

May 16, 2016................................... 4

Jury Trial

WITNESSES:

DR. LEIGH HLAVATYDirect Examination by Ms. Rubio 8Cross-Examination by Mr. Harris 36Redirect Examination by Ms. Rubio 48Recross-Examination by Mr. Harris 52Redirect Examination Continuing by Ms. Rubio 55

SHANE HILLDirect Examination by Ms. Rubio 66Voir Dire Examination by Mr. Harris 90

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3

E X H I B I T S

Marked Admitted

People’s Proposed Exhibit No. 4(Autopsy Report) 5

People’s Proposed Exhibit No. 5(Autopsy Photos) 5

People’s Proposed Exhibit No. 6(Lab Report) 64

People’s Proposed Exhibit No. 7(Disk of Photos) 64

People’s Proposed Exhibit No. 8(9-1-1 Call) 65

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4

May 16, 20161

Detroit, Michigan2

(Proceedings commencing at 9:42 a.m.)3

THE COURT: Okay. 4

Calling case number 16-001235-FC, People5

versus Treshaun Terrance.6

Your appearances?7

MS. RUBIO: Mary Rubio for the People.8

MR. HARRIS: Good morning, Your Honor. Wyatt9

Harris, on behalf of Mr. Terrance.10

THE COURT: Okay. 11

I understand that the Prosecutor is12

requesting to go out of order a little bit. She would13

like the testimony of the Medical Examiner, at this14

time.15

And then when the Medical Examiner’s16

testimony is concluded, go back to the Detective that17

was testifying, when we broke, on Friday.18

Is there any objection to that, counsel?19

MR. HARRIS: No objection.20

THE COURT: All right. 21

Anything else before we get started?22

MS. RUBIO: Additionally, I have two exhibits23

I plan on introducing, through the Medical Examiner. 24

One being People’s Proposed No. 4, which is25

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5

her report.1

One being People’s Proposed No. 5, which are2

the autopsy photos. I did show them to counsel.3

Do -- does coun -- do you have any4

objections?5

MR. HARRIS: No, Your Honor. I don’t have6

any.7

THE COURT: Okay. 8

Are the People moving -- Mr. Harris, you’re9

not objecting to either 4 or 5, is that correct?10

MR. HARRIS: No -- that’s correct, Your11

Honor, I am not.12

THE COURT: Okay. 13

So, counsel, are you moving, at this time,14

for the admission of Exhibits 4 and 5.15

MS. RUBIO: Yes, we are, Your Honor.16

And I, I also wanted to indicated, I don’t17

know how or when Your Honor wants to deal with it. We18

don’t need to necessarily go into it at length, right19

now, but I wanted to make the Court aware that,20

yesterday, at approximately noon, I received a voice21

mail from defense counsel, indicating that he had22

several issues with the three hour interrogation video,23

of the defendant.24

I did advise counsel, prior to trial, that I25

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6

did plan on introducing it.1

Counsel indicated he would send me a detailed2

e-mail indicating all the spots that he had a problem3

with. 4

I did receive an e-mail at approximately one 5

fifteen, with about five spots listed.6

And then I received another e-mail, at7

approximately seven p.m., last night, with seventeen8

areas listed, totaling an hour and fifty-three minutes9

that defense counsel feels should be redacted.10

Naturally, we are not seeing eye to eye about11

that, and I take issue with the fact that it’s the12

middle of trial, and I already had planned on13

introducing this.14

But I’m, I mean, I’m sure counsel has a, a15

lot he wants to say about it.16

I just wanted to bring it up, so that we’re17

not blind siding Your Honor later, and I think this18

issue needs to be resolved.19

THE COURT: Consider it brought up.20

And consider me blind sided.21

So, okay.22

So, let’s bring out the jury.23

MS. RUBIO: Okay. 24

Thank you. 25

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DEPUTY: All rise for the jury. 1

(Whereupon the jury was brought into the2

courtroom).3

DEPUTY: You may be seated.4

THE COURT: Okay. 5

We are on the record in case number 6

16-001235-FC, People versus Treshaun Terrance.7

Your appearances, counsel?8



Harris on behalf of Mr. Terrance. 11

THE COURT: Okay.12

It is my understanding, Miss Rubio, that you13

are now going to call the Medical Examiner, to testify,14

which would an interruption of Detective Mason’s15

testimony, and that we will get back to Detective16

Mason’s testimony, when the Medical Examiner’s17

testimony is over, is that correct?18

MS. RUBIO: Yes, it is, Your Honor.19


MS. RUBIO: Thank you. 21

THE COURT: Okay. 22

Please call your next witness.23

MS. RUBIO: At this time, the People would24

call Dr. Leigh Hlavaty.25

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D R. L E I G H H L A V A T Y1

Called as a witness and having been first duly sworn by the2

Court, was examined, and testified as follows: 3

THE COURT: Okay. 4

You can stop right there.5

Can you tell us your name?6

WITNESS: Dr. Leigh Hlavaty.7

THE COURT: Can you spell your name for me?8

WITNESS: The first name is Leigh, L-e-i-g-h,9

the last name is spelled H-l-a-v-a-t-y.10

THE COURT: One more time. H-a-l --11

WITNESS: H-l-a-v-a-t-y. The “H” is silent.12

THE COURT: Okay. 13

Can you raise your right hand for me?14

Do you swear or affirm that the testimony you15

give in this matter will be the truth, the whole truth,16

and nothing but the truth? 17

WITNESS: Yes, I do.18

THE COURT: Okay. 19

Please have a seat.20

DIRECT EXAMINATION21

BY MS. RUBIO: 22

Q Good morning. Could you please tell us your name, and23

occupation?24

A My name is Dr. Leigh Hlavaty, and I’m the Deputy Chief25

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Medical Examiner at the Wayne County Medical Examiner’s1

Office.2

Q And how long have you worked there?3

A I’ve been there, in some form or another, since 1998.4

Q Okay. And as a Medical Examiner, what, what is your5

educational background?6

MR. HARRIS: Your Honor, I would be willing7

to stipulate to the fact that Dr. Hlavaty is a expert8

in Forensic Pathology. And please correct me if I’m9

wrong, with regards to the title. She’s testified 10

in -- and admitted cases, here in this building.11

So, I would stipulate to her expertise.12

MS. RUBIO: I appreciate that. I just want13

to get a little bit of background.14

Thank you so much. 15


WITNESS: I received my Medical Degree from17

Wayne State University, School of Medicine.18

I did my Residency in the field of Anatomic19

Pathology, at Detroit Medical Center.20

I then did a Fellowship in the field of21

Forensic Pathology, at the Office at which I have22

remained employed my entire career.23

I -- at the end, all that training, I became24

Board certified in both Anatomic and Forensic25

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Pathology.1

Q (By Ms. Rubio): And can you tell us what Anatomic2

Pathology is?3

A Anatomic Pathology is simply the study of diseases. 4

Those are the hospital Pathologists that, if you get5

your gallbladder removed, they will examine the organ,6

and determine what diseases were present in it.7

Q And can you tell us what Forensic Pathology is?8

A Forensic Pathology is the study of diseases, and9

injuries, and specifically how they relate to or cause10

death.11

Q Okay. 12

MS. RUBIO: So, at this time, the People13

would -- well, would ask that the Doctor be considered14

an expert in both areas of Anatomic and Forensic15

Pathology.16

MR. HARRIS: No objection, Your Honor.17

THE COURT: Okay. 18


THE COURT: It is noted.20

Q (By Ms. Rubio): I’m gonna take your attention back to21

December 15th of 2015. Were you working on that22

particular date?23

A Yes.24

Q Okay. And as it relates to this case, did you conduct25

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a, an examination of a body by -- and with the case1

number of 15-13848?2

A Yes, I did. 3

Q Okay. And typically, after doing an, an autopsy, an4

examination, do you prepare a report?5

A Yes, I do.6

Q Okay. And did -- and you prepared a report in this7

case?8

A Yes.9

Q Okay. And --10

MS. RUBIO: May I approach the witness?11

THE COURT: You may.12

MS. RUBIO: Okay. 13

Q (By Ms. Rubio): I’m showing you People’s Exhibit No.14

4. I just want to see if that’s familiar to you?15

A Yes. People’s Proposed Exhibit 4 is a photocopy of the16

six page autopsy report, the two page body diagram, and17

the toxicology report that was issued for Dalona18

Tillman.19

Q Okay. Thank you. And is, is that typically what a20

report consists of?21

A Yes.22

Q Okay. Additionally, when an examination is done, are23

there photographs taken of the deceased?24

A Yes. We will take photographs, if there are external25

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injuries present.1

Q Okay. And was that done in this case?2

A Yes, it was.3

Q Okay. And I’m going to show you --4

MS. RUBIO: May I approach again?5

THE COURT: Yes.6

MS. RUBIO: Okay. 7

Q (By Ms. Rubio): What has already been marked and8

introduced as People’s No. 5. Do you recognize that?9

A Yes. These are proof sheets of the fifty photographs10

that were taken of the external injuries present on11

the, the decedent, identified at Dalona Tillman.12

Q Okay. And so, those photographs correspond with this13

report?14

A Yes.15

Q In People’s 4?16

Okay. Thank you. 17

When you first do an exam -- oh -- an18

examination on anybody, what’s the first thing you do?19

A The first thing we do is, we look at the unclothed20

body, while we are hearing, for the first time, the21

circumstances surrounding that particular person’s22

death.23

Q Why are the circumstances important for your24

examination?25

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A The circumstances are important because it puts the1

body into context for us. We will hear what was2

happening, at least by the person who reported the3

death to us, to what was occurring around the time of4

the death. It’s also an opportunity for us to find out5

if there’s any medic -- known medical history, or other6

relevant history, that might direct us, while we’re7

performing the exam.8

Q Okay. And so, once you -- when you looked at the9

unclothed body, in this case, that of Ms. Tillman, what10

did you observe?11

A She -- her body was extensively covered with injuries,12

quite literally from her head down to her left foot.13

Q And --14

A And those injuries consisted of contusions, and15

abrasions, and lacerations, and incised wounds, as well16

as a pale pressure mark.17

Q Okay. And you referenced a body chart, moments ago,18

when I drew your attention to People’s Exhibit No. 4?19

A Correct. There were two body diagrams.20

Q Okay. I’m gonna draw your attention to the screen21

here. Are you able to see this?22

A Yes.23

Q Okay. And can everyone see it?24

JURORS: Mm-hmm, yes.25

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MS. RUBIO: Okay. 1

Q (By Ms. Rubio): Okay. What is it we’re looking at?2

A We are looking at the drawings of the head, shown in3

four views, and then I depicted the location of all of4

the external injuries present on her face, and her5

neck.6

Q Okay. And what was of note to you, in, in, in 7

examine her -- or if you -- I’m sorry, strike that.8

Rather, if you could go through, in more9

detail, the injuries that you noted in this chart.10

A The injuries that were present on, on her face, were11

numerous. I’ll start with the pale, the band of12

pallor, as it’s identified in the photograph.13

That was an area of pallor, or paleness,14

present going across her face. It was four inches15

wide, by one inch long, and fairly rectangular. 16

And it was present across the cheeks, and the17

nose, and it indicates that pressure was placed on that18

part of her face, and blocked her, her nostrils.19

Q And did -- and you indicated there was actually a20

difference in color?21

A Yes.22

Q Okay. I’m gonna take your attention, for a moment, off23

of this chart, and to People’s No. 5, drawing your24

attention specifically to, and I’m gonna try to magnify25

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this, to -- there’s a, a photograph down, my finger is1

pointing at it, in the corner, of the face. Can you2

see that?3

A Yes.4

Q Okay. What are we looking at here?5

A What we are looking there at is an actual autop -- a6

photograph taken of her body, before we did the7

internal examination of the autopsy. 8

And that photograph show that band of pallor9

that was present, across the cheeks, and her nose.10

You can also see it to the photograph, to the11

right, and above.12

Q To the right, being the one directly next to it, to the13

right?14

A Correct.15

Q And then you indicated, above. Would that be above,16

which one?17

A Above the, the lower left one there.18

Q Okay. So, directly above?19

A So, both of those, all three of those photographs show20

the, the blanching of color, present on her cheeks, and21

her nose.22

Q And what does that signify to you?23

A Again, that is where pressure is placed. I can24

demonstrate it, on my arm.25

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If you apply pressure, tightly, to the body,1

and then release, you can see a band of pallor, where2

the, where the pressure was. 3

Because I’m alive, with a beating heart, when4

I release the pressure, the blood returns to the area,5

and the paleness goes away.6

If you die with this pressure applied, you no7

longer have a beating heart, and the blood does not8

return, and the area of paleness remains, or persists.9

Q Okay. 10

A And that is what we’re seeing across, again, her nose11

and her cheeks.12

Q And what else did you note about the face, in general?13

A There were injuries also present to the mouth. On the14

lips, there were small abrasions, and a laceration. 15

And then, when we looked on the inside of her mouth,16

she had abrasions corresponding to the edges of teeth,17

present on the inside of her upper lip. And then she18

had a large laceration on the left inner corner of her19

mouth.20

Q What did that signify to you?21

A These injuries indicate that there was force applied to22

her mouth, as well. Enough force to leave impressions23

of the teeth on the lips, and to cause tearing of the24

lips. 25

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And this force would have been -- would have1

prevented her from being able to breathe through her2

mouth.3

Q Okay. And again, looking at People’s No. 5, with the,4

the photographs here. Is there any, any photo, in5

particular, that is -- references the injuries you just6

mentioned?7

A Yes. If you look at the middle column, the bottom8

photograph shows her lips, and all of the darkened9

color there are the injuries present on the outside of10

her lips. 11

The photograph, right in the middle of the12

page, is upside down, but it does show the inside of13

her mouth, and there’s a large laceration next to the14

forceps, that’s present, again, on the inside of her15

mouth.16

Q I’m gonna flip it around. Okay. 17

And so, you said, the middle. You’re, 18

you’re --19

A Yes.20

Q The one that my finger is pointing at?21

A Correct.22

Q Okay. And there is, when you said, the forceps,23

there’s an instructing hold, holding the mouth open in24

this photograph?25

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A Correct, so that we could see the, the internal1

injuries.2

Q Okay. Going back to the chart in, in People’s 4. What3

other injuries did you note, to the face?4

A To the face, we had several injuries. First of all,5

there were bruises, which are contusions.6

And these were present on her right forehead,7

both of her cheeks, and both sides of her jaw.8

There were also abrasions, which is scraping9

of the skin. And this was present about the -- about10

both of her eyes, on the bridge of her nose, and on her11

left cheek.12

There was an incised wounds, which are cuts. 13

So, these are injuries created by a sharp instrument,14

and these cuts were on her mid-forehead, on her right15

upper eye lid beneath the brown, on the bridge of her16

nose, and on the left side of her chin.17

Then the only other injuries that that18

diagram depicts are the injuries to her neck. And19

those would be abrasions, and that was on the left20

front, and right side of her neck.21

Q And you noted all of those in, in the chart?22

A Yes.23

Q Okay. You also, it, it’s typical, when doing an24

examination, to also have a chart of the en, the entire25

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body, is that right?1

A Yes.2

Q Okay. And also taking your attention, again, to3

People’s 4. This is a standard body chart, created by4

your office, correct?5

A Correct.6

Q Okay. What --7

THE COURT: Ms. Rubio, excuse me.8

MS. RUBIO: I’m sorry?9

THE COURT: I am going to take a five minute10

break here.11

MS. RUBIO: Okay. 12

THE COURT: So, we’ll hold that thought.13

Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, I’m gonna14

excuse you for a brief recess. 15

You can return to the jury room.16


(Whereupon the jurors were excused from the18

courtroom.)19

THE COURT: THE COURT: Okay. 20

We’re back on the record in 16-001235-FC.21

Your appearances?22


MR. HARRIS: Wyatt Harris on behalf of24

Treshaun Terrance.25

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THE COURT: Okay.1

Sorry for that interruption.2

Are we ready to proceed?3

MS. RUBIO: Yes, Your Honor.4

THE COURT: Okay. 5

You can bring them back.6


(Whereupon the jurors were brought back into8

the courtroom).9

DEPUTY: You may be seated. 10

THE COURT: Okay. 11

Our jury has returned, in case number 12


Your appearances, once again, counsel.14



Harris on behalf of Mr. Treshaun Terrance.17

THE COURT: Okay.18

Sorry for that interruption.19

Ms. Rubio, you can continue.20

MS. RUBIO: Thank you so much.21

Q (By Ms. Rubio): Doctor, I believe we left off, and I22

had just referenced the full body chart, that you23

prepared, in this case, in reference to Dalona Tillman. 24

And I don’t believe we had discussed anything that you25

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observed on the, on the body, is that your1

recollection?2

A Correct.3

Q Okay. So, in looking at this body chart, what, what is4

it that you indicated, as far as injuries?5

A Present on the body, excluding the head and neck, were6

innumerable contusions, at least seventy-one abrasions,7

and in total, there were seven incised wounds, or cuts. 8

We’ve already discussed four of them, so there are9

three left that we have not talked about. 10

And the body diagram shows the general11

location of the contusions, abrasions, and cuts present12

on her body, below the neck.13

Q Okay. And it shows this, this, with an image of the14

front and the, and the back of the body, correct?15

A Correct.16

Q Okay. And so, there are actual markings on, on this17

diagram. And does, and does that -- and then,18

actually, I’m sorry. And then there’s also a key at19

the top?20

A Yes.21

Q Indicating certain marks for abrasions, certain marks22

for contusions, and then it looks like it says, I.W.,23

for incised wound, is that correct?24

A Yes.25

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Q Okay. You indicated, a moment ago, you said that there1

were, your word, innumerable, was it contusions --2

A Yes.3

Q Or abrasions? Contusions?4

A Contusions, yes,5

Q Okay. What is a contusion?6

A A contusion is a bruise.7

Q Okay. And so, when you say that, does that mean,8

literally, there were so many bruises that you could9

not count?10

A Yes. We tried to count injuries to give an, an11

estimate as to the minimum number of particular type of12

injury present. 13

In this case, with the bruises, there were14

some that were more small, or discreet; then there were15

other parts of the body where they were starting to16

overlap; and then finally, there were other parts of17

the body that were just completely covered with18

bruising. So, I was unable to provide a minimum of19

contusions in this case.20

Q Okay. And as it relates to the bruising, were you21

able, were you able to tell whether they were fresh,22

or, or older?23

A The majority of the bruising was recent, or fresh,24

meaning it was red, purple, or blue, which, for the25

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medical definition, would mean they were inflicted1

within a day of death. 2

Every bruise except one appeared fresh. 3

There was one bruise on the body, a large one on the4

back of the left thigh. That one was starting to turn5

colors, and that would, therefore, be an older, or6

healing, or resolving bruise.7

Q Okay. Drawing your attention, for a moment, to8

People’s 5, specifically the bottom two photographs, of9

what appear to be an arm. Can you see those from where10

you are?11

A Yes.12

Q Okay. What is depicted in these two, two photographs?13

A What you’re seeing is what we call the lateral, or the14

outer aspect of her right shoulder, and her right upper15

arm. And these photographs were taken to depict the16

diffuse bruising. The outer part of that arm is17

completely covered by bruising, and then the smaller,18

darker injuries, that when you get to see it more close19

up, those are the abrasions, or skin scrapes, that20

were, were also present on that part of her, of her21

body.22

Q Okay. And you used a word, you said, diffused23

bruising. 24

A Yes.25

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Q What does that mean?1

A That the -- her shoulder and her upper arm were2

completely covered by a bruise.3

Q And was that bruise we just saw, is that one giant4

bruise?5

A It could be one giant bruise, or it could be multiple6

bruises that had overlapped, to the point where the7

entire extremity was covered with bruise.8

Q Okay. Additionally, you reference abrasions. And, an9

what is an abrasion?10

A An abrasion is a scraping of the surface of the skin.11

Q Okay. And I believe you indicated that you did count a12

certain number of abrasions?13

A Yes. Excluding the injuries to the mouth, there were14

seventy-one abrasions present on her body.15

Q Okay. And, and where were those abrasions?16

A The other diagram we -- I already talked about the ones17

on her face and her neck.18

Q Yes.19

A The ones that this body diagram depicts, are the20

abrasions that are present on her bilateral upper back,21

her mid back, both buttocks, and then there were22

multiple abrasions present on both of her shoulders,23

upper arms, elbows, forearms, the back of both of her24

hands, both thighs, both lower legs, and then her left25

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foot and, and ankle.1

Q Okay. And as to the abrasions, were you able to tell2

whether they were fresh, or old?3

A There were seven abrasions that had started to scab4

over, which would indicate that they were slightly5

older, or healing. The rest of the abrasions present6

on her body were fresh, again, meaning they were7

inflicted within a day of her death.8

Q Okay. And when you say inflicted within a day, is, is9

that as best as you can tell. Like, for example, you,10

you can’t tell if it was within six hours, or twelve11

hours, or it’s just within a day?12

A Correct. They could have been inflicted within minutes13

before her death, or any -- at any point up to twenty-14

four hours.15

A day is when the body will start to heal16

injuries, meaning scab over, clot, and bruises will17

start to turn colors.18

Q Okay. You also indicated that you observed cuts?19

A Yes.20

Q And I’m sorry, is that also the -- did you use the21

word, incised wounds, or is that something different?22

A An incised wound is a cut.23

Q Okay. And how many did you observe?24

A There were seven total, but there were three depicted25

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on this diagram, the three that were present on the1

body. There was one on the back of each hand, and then2

there was one on the front of her right thigh.3

Q One on the back of each hand?4

A Yes.5

Q Okay. And one on her right thigh?6

A Correct.7

Q Okay. And just to be clear, because the jury will have8

an opportunity to view these later, I just want to draw9

your attention to one particular mark on Miss Tillman’s10

body.11

And in the very, very middle, there’s -- I’m12

pointing my finger at one particular photograph, and I13

believe that when -- the photograph directly above it,14

is a, an enlargement of that?15

A Yes.16

Q What is this?17

A That is an incised wound, or cut, but that is a wound18

that was placed on the body, in the hospital.19

She was taken to the hospital, and they20

attempted to resuscitate her, and she was pronounced21

dead after about forty-five minutes.22

And part of that, of their efforts, were to23

insert a chest tube, into he left side of her chest.24

So, while that is an injury present on her25

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body, that was, was not one that was on her body,1

before she got to the hospital.2

Q Okay. And, and so, because of that, when you discussed3

the incised wounds on her body, just a moment ago, that4

was not one that you named, is that correct?5

A That is correct. That one is listed in the autopsy6

report, under evidence of treatment, not evidence of7

injury.8

Q Okay. And other than that wound, that I’ve just shown9

you, and that you explained, were the other -- they,10

the other incised wounds, were ones that you discussed11

in your report?12

A Yes, correct.13

Q Okay. And that you just previously testified to?14

A Yes.15

Q Okay. Are you able to tell the age of an incised16

wound?17

A Yes. Incised wounds heal pretty similar to abrasions,18

meaning they will start to scab over. And the only19

incised wound that showed evidence of scabbing was the20

one in the back of the left hand. All of the other21

ones were recent, and showed no evidence of healing.22

Q Okay. Was that the extent of your examination, of the23

exterior of the body?24

A Yes.25

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Q Okay. Once you’re done examining the exterior of the1

body, what do you do next?2

A We then proceed to the internal examination, which is3

where we remove all of the organs, from the head, neck,4

chest, abdomen, and pelvis. And there, I’m looking,5

not only for injuries, but I’m also looking for6

diseases, at this point.7

Q Okay. And what did you find, in this case?8

A In this case, other than the injuries on the inside of9

her mouth, there were no internal injuries present, to10

any of the body’s vital structures, or organs, and11

there were also no diseases present, in, in any of her12

organs, either.13

Q Why is that important?14

A It’s always important, when we do a complete and15

thorough autopsy, meaning, looking for diseases, and16

also testing for toxicology, just to, to see, we’re17

trying to put all the pieces together, what could have18

possibly caused death, what could have contributed to19

death, and then what ultimately had nothing to do with20

the death.21

Q Okay. And you just brought up a, a point you, you22

referenced toxicology. What does that mean?23

A That’s where we draw the, the fluids from the body, the24

blood, if we can get urine, the fluid from the eyes,25

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and then a piece of liver tissue, and we test these1

substance -- these specimens for drugs. 2

In this case, her blood was looked for the3

drugs of abuse and therapeutic medications.4

And then we expanded it, and we looked for5

additional drugs that would -- are more designer drugs,6

the syndetic and cannabanoids, and the novel psycho7

actives (all phonetic).8

So, we did a comprehensive toxicology panel9

on her.10

Q Okay. And is that something that is typically done in11

an autopsy?12

A No. In the cases like this, we will usually just look13

for drugs of abuse, or therapeutic medications. But14

this case, ultimately, at the conclusion of the15

autopsy, I had no diseases, I had no internal injuries,16

and I did have marks on the face, indicating that the17

decedent had been smothered.18

However, I wanted to be completely certain19

that there was nothing else going on in this case.20

Q Okay. And just to be clear, in laymen’s term, when you21

say, drugs of abuse, what are you -- what do you mean?22

A We’re typically talking about the heroin, phentanol,23

cocaine, other narcotics pills, like, like Vicodin,24

Oxycodone, those would be the types of drugs that, when25

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we talk about drugs of abuse, we’re referring to.1

Q Okay. So, drugs that literally people sometimes abuse?2

A Correct.3

Q Okay. And so, did you do -- what, probably not you, do4

you sent out this -- these specimens for, for5

toxicology, or do you do them yourself?6

A We draw these specimens, and we send them under a chain7

of custody, to a laboratory, N.M.S. Labs in8

Pennsylvania, and they perform our toxicology. And9

then they retain those specimens for two years, beyond10

the date of examination.11

Q Okay. And did you get those results back?12

A Yes.13

Q Was there more than one toxicology done in reference to14

Ms. Tillman?15

A Yes. We first start with the expanded panel, which16

were the drugs that would be used in therapeutic17

medications. That came back with only the breakdown18

products of marijuana present.19

I then ordered the two additional, more20

comprehensive panels. 21

And so, therefore, those tests were ordered22

after the first panel.23

Q Okay. And what were the results of the more24

comprehensive panels?25

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A That it was negative. Ultimately, the only substance1

she had in her system at the time of her death were the2

breakdown products of marijuana.3

Q And what does, breakdown products, mean?4

A Breakdown products refers to any drug that you take5

into your body, your body will break it down into6

smaller compounds that it can then eliminate, and7

remove from your body, so that these breakdown products8

of marijuana were the only things left in her system.9

Q Okay. And why did you order the more comprehensive10

round of, of tests?11

A I ordered it because, ultimately, I knew that the marks12

on her face were indicative of a death by, by13

smothering, which is a form of asphyxia, which is an14

inability to breathe.15

When we were examining potential asphyxia16

cases, or smothering cases, those are cases that are a17

diagnosis of exclusion.18

Sometimes in smothering cases, there are no19

autopsy findings, no marks around the nose and the20

mouth.21

For instance, if it’s an infant, smothered22

with a large bed pillow, it’s large soft object, and23

the infant can’t struggle with -- in comparison to the24

adult.25

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So, these cases, by procedure and policy, we1

have to exclude all possible other causes of death2

before we can conclude that the death was due to3

asphyxia.4

Smothering, some smothering cases are like5

this one, in that there are marks on the nose, and on6

the mouth.7

But, again, as a policy and procedure, we8

will proceed to eliminate all other potential causes of9

death.10

Q Okay. 11

A And so, we’ll do the comprehensive toxicology, and also12

do microscopic examination of the organs, which in, in13

this case.14

Q Okay. And did the breakdown products of marijuana --15

I’m sorry, so, ultimately, after you got the16

toxicology, did that complete your, your examination17

of, of Ms. Tillman?18

A Yes. And then I would then officially declare the19

cause and manner of death, yes.20

Q Okay. And, and what was the cause of death, that you21

declared?22

A The cause of death was smothering.23

Q Okay. And I believe you explained a moment ago what24

smothering is?25

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A Oh, yeah. Smothering is an inability to breathe, due1

to external blockage of the nose and, and the mouth. 2

So, there was pressure placed on her nose, and her3

mouth, preventing her from breathing. And that is what4

ultimately, caused her death.5

Q Okay. And what was the manner of death?6

A The manner of death is homicide.7

Q And do you -- as to the cause of death, how long does8

it take to smother a person? Do you have any knowledge9

about that?10

A To smother an adult, it can take anywhere from ninety11

seconds, up to two and a half to three minutes.12

Q Okay. And as far as your determining the cause and13

manner of death, was there -- were there any other14

contributing factors that you found?15

A No. Although she had been extensively beaten, again,16

there were no internal injuries present whatsoever. 17

So, the beating did not cause or contribute to her18

death.19

There were no diseases present, and the20

toxicology, although it showed breakdown products of21

marijuana, that did not cause or contribute to her22

death, either.23

So, ultimately, the only thing that was24

present was the smothering, and that’s what resulted in25

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her death.1

Q Okay. Going back to, for a moment, to the injuries on2

her body, what, just taking it, I guess, injury by3

injury, looking at the cuts, or incised wounds, was4

there anything significant about those?5

A Uhm --6

Q Or what do they signify to you?7

A They signified that there -- that she, at some point,8

in this, in this struggle, or assault, that there was a9

sharp object involved. And that it did result in10

cutting of her skin. There were no internal injuries11

present as a result of those, and though cuts that were12

present on the backs of, of her hands, would be13

consistent with her struggling or attempting to defend14

herself.15

Q Okay. And based on the number of contusions, and16

abrasions that you have already testified to, was there17

any significant about that, to you?18

A There would be two things that would be significant:19

One is that this was an extensive beating,20

that she had sustained, in order to get those -- that21

number of injuries.22

However, it was a beating that did not result23

in any internal injuries.24

The second point that would be significant,25

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as a Forensic Pathologist, is that the injuries that1

were present, on the outer, or lateral aspects of her2

arms and legs, would again be consistent with her using3

her limbs, in order to defend herself, during the4

assault.5

Q One second.6

And then, ultimately, we talked earlier, that7

you prepare a report, and you review it, and then you8

sign it yourself, correct?9

A Yes.10

Q Okay. Do you recall the date that that report was11

completed, and you, and you signed it?12

A I completed and signed the report on January 26th, of13

this year.14

Q Okay. And just for the record, I think you did15

reference something. Was that, was that your report?16

A Oh, yes. Yes.17

Q Okay. Now, it -- on the, the first page of People’s18

Exhibit No. 4, which is the Office of the Wayne County19

Medical Examiner Post Mortem Report, it indicates that20

the date that, the date pronounced dead being December21

15th. And then it indicates that, performed post22

mortem examination on the body of Dalona Tillman on23

December 16th, of 2015.24

A Yes.25

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Q Is that correct?1

A Yes.2

Q Okay. So, her cause, her cause and manner of death was3

not ruled upon by you until, it sounds like, almost a4

month a half later, would that -- is that right?5

A Yes.6

Q Okay. Why is that?7

A That was the length of time it took to get the8

histology back from her organs, to complete all of the,9

all of the toxicology, and to have a conversation with10

Officer in charge of the, of the case, in order to try11

and get further investigation into the circumstances12

around the death.13

Q Okay. Is that unusual, for that length of time?14

A No. In cases of asphyxia, or smothering, again,15

because we have to wait for more pieces of the puzzle,16

it will take us longer to rule on those particular17

types of deaths, as opposed to, say, a gun shot wound18

case.19

Q Okay. 20

MS. RUBIO: One second.21

I don’t have any other questions, at this22

time.23

THE COURT: Mr. Harris?24

CROSS-EXAMINATION25

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BY MR. HARRIS: 1

Q Good morning, Dr. Hlavaty.2

A Good morning.3

Q Dr. Hlavaty, you indicated that this autopsy was done4

on Dalona Tillman, 12/16/2015?5

A Yes.6

Q And you received the toxicology report back on7

12/31/2015, is that correct?8

A I -- that’s when I received the first round of the9

toxicology.10

Q Okay. 11

A And then, that is when the two additional panels were12

added.13

Q May I see that second panel that you have there?14

A This is the complete report. That’s the only one that15

I have.16

Q Thank you. 17

And then you issued the Medical Examiner’s18

report, on January the 26th --19

A Yes.20

Q 2016, correct?21

A That’s correct.22

Q Now, prior to your seeing Miss Tillman’s body, what23

information did you have regarding her death, if any?24

A I, I had the information that was reported to our25

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office, from the hospital. And then I also had1

information from the Police. So, I had two pieces of2

information, the morning that I performed the autopsy.3

Q Okay. When you say, you had information from the4

Police, were those their Crisnet reports?5

A No. Referring to our case registration summary, which6

is the report that our Investigators complete,7

regarding the cases, as they’re reported, this would be8

information from a Detective, or Sergeant Armstrong,9

that would be someone that our Investigators had10

contacted, after the death was reported to us, by a Dr,11

Ryan Ernst.12

Q Can I see that, please?13

A Certainly.14

Q At the time that you, just before you went to do the15

autopsy, Dalona Tillman, you did have information that16

Miss Tillman may have been in a fight?17

A Yes, correct.18

Q And so, you knew about this fight, correct?19

A Yes.20

Q You would agree with me that the seventy-one injuries,21

abrasions, contusions, and incised wounds, could have22

resulted as a result of a fight, correct?23

A Yes.24

Q That would be logical, also medically logical, right?25

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A Yes, correct, other than the pale mark, and the1

injuries to her, to her mouth or lips. The rest of the2

injuries would be consistent with a fight.3

Q Couldn’t the injuries that were to her mouth, also have4

been caused as a result of being in a fight?5

A Some of the external abrasions, yes. To get the6

imprints of the teeth, and that large laceration on the7

inside of the mouth, it would be, it would be force8

applied to the mouth, for a period of time.9

Q There was also a mark on her forehead, and incised10

wound on her forehead?11

A Yes, correct.12

Q Could that incised wound be as a result of a fight?13

A Yes.14

Q And the marks, or the incised wounds that are inside of15

her mouth, the cuts that are inside of her mouth, could16

she have been punched in the mouth, and those wounds17

been created?18

A A punch in the mouth could have created the large, it19

was a laceration, not incised wound, but the one, the20

large one that was on the left side, inside of her21

mouth, yes.22

Q Okay. And that laceration could have been caused by23

her teeth, correct?24

A Yes.25

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Q And it could have been caused by some outside object,1

other than her teeth?2

A Correct.3

Q And that, those injuries, if she had been in a fight,4

either on the day of the incident, or the day before,5

would be consistent with the freshness of the wounds,6

correct?7

A Yes, the timing of, of the fight would correspond to8

the timing of the injuries that, that I saw.9

Q And when you did the autopsy, you, in your mind, had10

some idea as to what you might be looking for, as a11

result of trying to determine how she died, correct?12

A Yes.13

Q And that’s why you have that information, the Police14

information, correct?15

A Correct.16

Q Now, none of the Police information that you had,17

indicated anything about smothering, correct?18

A That is correct.19

Q And with regards to the, I think you called it, pallor,20

was it?21

A Yes.22

Q Across her nose?23

A Yes.24

Q Nose and cheek area?25

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A And cheeks, yes.1

Q You, you don’t know, or you don’t have any information,2

to indicate what may have taken place with the E.M.S.3

people, in terms of her nose, correct?4

If they --5

A Referring to the, referring to the autopsy report,6

there was an endotracheal tube in, in place. So, that7

would mean that they did put a tube into her mouth, 8

but --9

Q Into her mouth?10

A Yes, but there were no tubes, or tape present, on her,11

on her face, or her nose, or her cheeks.12

Q Okay. But what happens if they put a mask over her13

face? Wouldn’t that cause some displacement of the14

blood in her, in her face?15

A Only she was alive with a beating heart.16

Q Okay. 17

A But that would also be an imprint of the mask, itself,18

and not a band of, of pallor that we saw. It would19

correspond to where the mask contacted her skin.20

Again, if she had a beating heart, when it21

was placed on.22

Q And you’re not one hundred percent sure that she had -- 23

that her heart was not beating when she -- when the24

E.M.S. people came to her, correct?25

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A That is correct. All I know is that she was1

unresponsive when E.M.S. found her, and then she was2

pronounced dead later, in the emergency room.3

Q So, she could have had a beating heart, when E.M.S.4

arrived?5

A She, she could have. I don’t have any independent6

knowledge of that.7

Q And did you speak to anyone, either the Police, or any8

Investigators, with regards to the circumstances of9

Dalona Tillman, before you did the autopsy?10

A Before I did the autopsy, no. After I did the autopsy,11

yes.12

Q Okay. We’ll get to that.13

Did you, did you or someone from your staff,14

do an X-ray of her brain?15

A An X-ray of her brain? No.16

Q Her brain, yes.17

Was, was there any examination of her brain?18

A Oh, yes. 19

Q Okay. 20

A We removed -- we, as part of the standard autopsy, we21

remove the brain, from the head. We examine the scalp22

for injuries, the skull for injuries, and then the23

brain itself, is there any bleeding, bruising,24

swelling, and there were none of these present.25

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Q I’m gonna take a step back, to the injuries in her1

mouth.2

Could the injuries in her mouth cause her,3

prevent her from breathing?4

A The injuries, themselves, meaning the exact abrasions,5

or lacerations, no.6

The totality of them, and it means that there7

was pressure placed on her mouth, that would mean that8

her mouth would be closing, she’d be unable to breathe9

through it.10

Q Okay. Would you please look at your report, look at11

page five of six.12

A Yes.13

Q And would you look in the section marked, respiratory14

system.15

A Correct.16

Q There is a -- would you look at the very third sentence17

there. 18

A Yes.19

Q Starting with, there. 20

A Mm-hmm.21

Q It says: There was a passive congestion in the, and22

please help me with the word, para --23

A Parenkima (phonetic).24

Q I didn’t hear you.25

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A Parenkima.1

Q Parenkima, that was accentuated with dependent2

lividity. 3

What does that mean?4

A What that means is that, the fluid, and blood that is5

normally within your lungs, when you die, it settles6

into the part of the body that your lividity, I guess7

I’m not describing this very well.8

When you die, your blood will settle into one9

half of your body. 10

If you’re lying on your back, it will settle11

into the back half of your body.12

If you die laying forward, the blood will13

eventually all settle in the front half of your body.14

The blood and the fluid in your lungs,15

follows the same pattern.16

So, this was just a normal description of17

lungs, with the blood pooling in the part of her body. 18

In this case, it would be the back part of the lung19

tissue.20

Q And you had indicated that a number of the wounds,21

especially the wounds on her arms, the contusions, and22

the abrasions on her arms, were defensive wounds,23

correct?24

A Yes.25

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Q Okay. And you would agree with me that those defensive1

wounds would be consistent with someone getting into a2

fight, correct?3

A Yes.4

Q And you already had information that she was in a5

fight?6

A Yes.7

Q With regards to, to the toxicology, you indicated that8

she -- that a test came back, and was present of9

cannaboids, right?10

A Her -- yeah, the breakdown products of marijuana, yes.11

Q And that would be, marijuana?12

A Yes.13

Q So, is, it is consistent that she had been smoking14

marijuana, or ingesting marijuana, at some point in15

time?16

A Yes, correct.17

Q Prior to her death?18

A Yes, correct.19

Q And that would have been twenty-four, forty-eight hours20

prior to her death, or --21

A There’s no way to know. If it’s the first time you’ve22

ever used marijuana, we can look at the levels, and23

give an estimate as to when you used it. If it’s even24

your second time using marijuana, it remains in your,25

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in your system longer, and for an unknown length of1

time. 2

So, in this case, all I would know is that3

she had used marijuana, but I don’t know how many4

times, or when her last usage was.5

Q Could the use of marijuana, combined with the injuries6

from a fight, cause her to have these breathing issues?7

A No. Marijuana has never been shown to contribute to,8

or cause a death. It may result in behaviors that will9

end up resulting in death, but not an actual cause of10

death.11

As for the beating itself, there was no brain12

swelling present that would give us an indication that13

there was some survival, but there was significant14

injury from the beating, in order for it to have caused15

or contributed to her death.16

And there was no brain swelling, or any other17

internal injuries present.18

Q Doctor, you would agree with me, that smoking marijuana19

affects your brain, correct?20

A It affects your brain in a behavioral way. But in21

terms of ways that we can define as a cause of death,22

no.23

Q You are not saying, Doctor, that if I was to smoke24

marijuana, and pass out, that that marijuana may not25

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have had an -- may, may have had an effect on my brain,1

correct?2

A That is a difficult question to answer. If you were3

smoking marijuana, and then passed out, I would like to4

know the reason why you passed out. It should not be5

from the marijuana itself, but from something else6

going on in your system.7

Q There are no absolute studies that the marijuana8

doesn’t have an effect on your brain, from that9

standpoint, correct?10

A None that I’m, I’m aware of.11

Q On 12/15/2015, you could not determine what the cause12

of death was, for Dalona Tillman, is that correct?13

A Oh, I performed the autopsy on December 16th. But at14

the conclusion of the --15

Q I’m sorry, right, correct. December 16th, I’m sorry.16

A Yes.17

Q And I didn’t mean to cut you off.18

A At the conclusion of the autopsy, what I knew was that19

the beating did not cause or contribute to her death,20

and that there were injuries present on the face that21

were indicative of smothering.22

As I said, smothering would be a diagnosis of23

exclusion, so I then knew that I had a lot of24

additional steps, and testing to do, at that point.25

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And then, that was also the point at which I1

then asked to contact the Officer in charge of the2

case, to give them an idea of what was going on.3

Q Doctor, could you say, with one hundred percent4

certainty, that Dalona Tillman was smothered?5

A Sitting here right now, yes. 6

The -- my examination excluded all other7

causes of death, and the injuries to her nose and her8

mouth were indicative of those areas being blocked,9

resulting in her inability to breathe.10

Q And smothering is a loss of oxygen to your body,11

correct?12

A Yes.13

MR. HARRIS: No further questions, Your14

Honor.15

THE COURT: Miss Rubio?16

REDIRECT EXAMINATION17

BY MS. RUBIO: 18

Q Is it possible for someone to smother to death, with19

nothing blocking their nose, and mouth, if they’ve20

passed out from a night of drinking, or using drugs?21

A Then they wouldn’t have smothered. If you pass out22

from doing drugs, or drinking, you can sometimes23

collapse in a position that impairs your ability to24

breathe, like you could fall head forward into a25

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situation where you can’t right yourself up. 1

So, there are instances of asphyxia, being2

the cause of death, when it’s the drugs and alcohol3

that sort of puts you into the compromised position.4

But with regards to smothering, itself, you5

would have to pass out, into an object that completely6

blocked your nose and mouth, and you were unable to7

extricate yourself from that position.8

Q Okay. And -- just one second.9

And in your post mortem examination of Ms.10

Tillman, you spoke a moment ago on cross, about, about11

lividity.12

What was the indication regarding the13

lividity?14

A The lividity in her body was on her back side, or it15

was posterior, and it was fixed.16

This is quite common in people who are17

pronounced dead, in the hospital, and then you go to18

the hospital morgue and then transferred to our morgue. 19

And during this entire process, you were on your back20

side.21

So, that frequently, when I examine the body22

the next morning, you will have posterior lividity.23

Q Okay. On, on cross, counsel asked you about whether or24

not the injuries could have been -- injuries to the25

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mouth of Ms. Tillman could have been caused by a, for1

example, a punch to the mouth.2

And I believe you indicated that there was a3

particular mark, I don’t know the work you used for4

that, on the inside of her, of her mouth, that -- where5

that could have been -- that could be consistent with a6

punch, is that correct?7

A Yes, it was the laceration on the inside of the mouth.8

Q The laceration. Okay. 9

You also testified about other injuries to10

the inside of Ms. Tillman’s mouth. What were those11

again?12

A Those were abrasions corresponding to the edges of her13

teeth. We do not typically see that with just a punch,14

but if, if it is a force that is applied for a period15

of time, over the mouth, that’s where we see the16

impressions, or indents from the edges of teeth.17

Q Okay. And why is it that you don’t typically see that,18

from a punch?19

A It’s because of the timing of it, more than the amount20

of force applied.21

So, with a punch, it is a more sudden thing. 22

It would be one hit. And then it, it could tear the23

skin, or abrade the skin, but in order for it to see24

the injuries to the teeth, because there is a lot of25

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movement in your lips, it means that it has to be --1

the pressure has to be applied for some time, and -- in2

order for those impressions to be made.3

Q Okay. Are you familiar with C.P.R.?4

A Yes.5

Q Okay. And are you, are you familiar with the standard6

life saving procedures taken by E.M.S. personnel?7

A Yes.8

Q Okay. Could any of those procedures that E.M.S. may9

have tried to take, if they were at the scene, cause --10

have caused this band of pallor, that you have11

testified to, along with the injuries to the mouth and12

nose, that you testified to?13

A No. The injuries that we do, or typically see, from14

individuals who have been resuscitated, would sometimes15

be the abrasions to the outsides of the lip. Sometimes16

they do dislodge teeth, although in this case, that was17

not there.18

And if the tubes are left in place, we can19

see tape residue where those tubes were.20

There’s nothing in the C.P.R. process that21

would explain the band of pallor, and noting in the22

C.P.R. process that would explain the imprints of her23

teeth, or the larcera -- the large laceration on the24

inside of her mouth.25

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Q You also referred to, on cross, in, in answering a1

question by counsel, you referred to this cause of2

death, asphyxia, or smothering, as a diagnoses of3

exclusion.4

What does that mean?5

A I had alluded to it earlier. There are some forms of6

smothering that there are no injuries present,7

whatsoever, around the nose and mouth.8

So, you have, basically, a negative autopsy.9

So, in those cases, you have to exclude all10

that you have done, and try and exclude every other11

possible cause of death, whether it be natural, drugs,12

or trauma, before you conclude something with a13

negative finding in the cause of death.14

In this case, I had positive findings that15

indicated what was going on, but it is simply policy16

and procedure to hunt down, and again, exclude all17

other possible causes before we conclude smothering, or18

asphyxia, as a cause of death.19

Q Okay. 20

MS. RUBIO: I don’t have any other questions.21

Thank you so much.22


RECROSS-EXAMINATION24

BY MR. HARRIS: 25

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Q Before you conducted your autopsy, and having that1

information that you showed me earlier, in regards to2

your investigation, you’re looking for signs of3

asphyxiation, correct?4

A We perform every autopsy looking for every possible5

finding.6

The information that I received, initially,7

seemed to indicate that this was a death due to a8

beating.9

There was a history of a beating, and least10

eye balling the body, with all of the injuries, that11

seemed to be the most likely.12

When I proceeded to further examine the body,13

I then found the indications of smothering, which were14

not in the circumstances.15

And then, of course, by the end of the16

autopsy, I knew that the beating was almost a red17

herring, and that there were no internal injuries18

associated with it at all.19

So, I knew, at least at the end of the20

autopsy, that it was not the case, this case was not as21

what it initially appeared, at the start of the day.22

Q You are familiar with teens -- teen asphyxiation,23

Doctor?24

A I --25

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Q As in teenagers?1

A I’m aware that they can asphyxiate in many ways, but I2

don’t know the specific way you’re referring.3

Q Okay. Is it possible someone could be asphyxiated as a4

result of having pressure applied to their chest?5

A Yes, if there is pressure applied to your chest, or6

abdomen, that will prevent you from breathing, and can7

result in your death.8

Q And if you get beat up in a fight, and get hit in those9

areas, that could cause you to asphyxiate, correct?10

A It could. It could compromise your breathing. But11

with this form of asphyxia, there are other signs that12

are present, on the body.13

And in this case, that was not present.14


Honor.16


MS. RUBIO: Nor do I, Your Honor.18

THE COURT: Ladies and gentlemen of the jury,19

if any of you have a question, please raise your hand.20

We have one question.21

Would you write it down, sir?22

Counsel, can you approach?23

(Whereupon a discussion was had off the24

record at the bench). 25

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THE COURT: Okay. 1

How much pressure is necessary to cause a2

band of pallor?3

WITNESS: In order to just cause the band of4

pallor, it would be enough pressure placed on that part5

of the body, to blanche the, the skin.6

I think it would depend on the part of, of7

the body. So, I can’t assign a certain, like, pound of8

force, type measurement to it.9



CONTINUING BY MS. RUBIO: 12

Q In this case, since you have rule the cause of death to13

be smothering, or asphyxia, are you able to quantify14

how much pressure it would have taken to cause the, the15

death by smothering?16

A Again, I can’t quantify the amount of force, but I --17

in this location, on the body, the force that would be18

needed to blanche the skin would also be force that19

would block, or close off the nostrils.20

So, the fact that the tip of the nose, and21

the nostrils were within this band of pallor, is what22

tells me that, as opposed to what they -- amount of23

force that I could quantify for you.24

Q Okay. Thank you. 25

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MR. HARRIS: No questions, Your Honor.2

THE COURT: Any further questions from3

members of the jury?4

Seeing no hands.5

You can step down.6

Thank you very much. 7

(Whereupon the witness was excused).8

MS. RUBIO: May counsel and I approach for a9

moment?10

THE COURT: Yes.11


record at the bench).13

THE COURT: Okay. 14

Members of the jury, we are gonna send you15

for an early lunch. It’s eleven twenty. 16

I would like you back here by twenty minutes17

after twelve.18

So, we’re gonna take an hour recess.19

All right. 20

Thank you very much. 21


(Whereupon the jurors were excused for23

lunch).24


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THE COURT: Okay. 3

All right. 4

Ms. Rubio, you intend to play a video tape,5

is that correct?6

MS. RUBIO: Yes. Yes, Your Honor.7

THE COURT: And Mr. Harris, you have some8

objections to the content of some parts of the video9

tape, which I understand is a, a statement?10

MR. HARRIS: Yes.11

THE COURT: And the statement is some three12

hours long. Is that right, Miss Rubio?13


THE COURT: And there is no transcript of the15

statement. 16

MS. RUBIO: Yes, Your Honor, that’s correct.17

I will indicate that, in my twenty year18

career, I’ve never created a, had a transcript created,19

so I apologize.20

It’s -- I would also indicated, just -- I21

just wanted to indicate, for the record, that I do22

think that this is -- that Your Honor has come up with23

the best solution, of course, to -- for us to try to24

view it, ahead of time.25

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But I really take issue with this. This1

should have been a pre-trial motion.2

For me to receive an e-mail, with -- at seven3

at night, on a Sunday, with seven different -- I’m4

sorry, seventeen different spots that are, quote,5

allegedly irrelevant. 6

And then totaling an hour and fifty-three7

minutes out of the three hour video.8

In other words, basically, almost the whole9

video, that counsel now wants excluded. 10

I think it’s just unreasonable. 11

And I would indicate that the -- of the12

seventeen spots, that counsel references, off, off the13

top of my head, in looking at them, there’s perhaps one14

that, that I could see, that may -- I’m gonna double15

check, I’m gonna review it again, it’s five minute16

spot, that I may be able to concede to. I, I’d have to17

look at that again.18

But the rest of it is all interrogation. 19

It’s -- and obviously, Your Honor will see that.20

Sometimes there are things said that may not21

paint his client in the most favorable light. That’s22

how it works.23

It’s called evidence.24

MR. HARRIS: Your Honor, I looked at the25

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video, and I will tell this Court that I did not1

anticipate the Prosecutor using the video, basically2

because my client, throughout the video, denies having3

been involved in the killing of Miss Tillman.4

Well, I learned on Thursday, right at the5

bench, when she -- when the Prosecutor said that she6

was going to play this three hour video.7

So, I looked at the video, a second and third8

time, and realized that there are statements made by9

the Police, that are not relevant; there are statements10

made by my client, that are not relevant; and those are11

the areas in which I want the, the exclusions, in terms12

of those statements.13

The Police are not interrogating this14

witness. They are making statements, in the hopes that15

he says something.16

And you can -- and I think it’s a very good17

idea that you see the video, so that you can see what18

areas, one, I’m talking about, and the fact that, that19

my request, and, and my asking that these items be20

excluded based on relevancy, is, is accurate and, and21

should be excluded based on the fact that the22

statements are not relevant.23

THE COURT: Okay. 24

Let’s fast forward.25

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The jury’s coming back at twelve fifteen, and1

Ms. Rubio, if I’m to review the, the video statement,2

what can we do in terms of presenting evidence to the3

jury before the video will be played?4

MS. RUBIO: Well, I expect Shane Hill, from5

the Michigan State Police, to be here, and we can have6

him testify.7

I believe we can have the Officer in charge8

back on the stand, for the rest of defense counsel’s9

voir dire, in relation to the -- at that point, it10

really wasn’t his cross-examination, it was just the11

voir dire regarding the, the Rights form, signed by his12

client.13

And I could then, I, I -- what I would like14

to do then is then begin to question the Officer in15

charge about the interview.16

I will just question him about various17

statements that his client made -- I’m sorry, that18

counsel’s client makes.19

And then, at that point, I can play , the 20

9 -- the 9-1-1 tape.21

Obviously, counsel could cross-examination22

him, at that time.23

I guess my concern, at this point, is that24

this video has been referenced multiple times, which25

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is, again, why I feel like this is something that1

should have been anticipated, and resolved, prior,2

prior to trial, because you cannot unring a bell, which3

I’m sure Your Honor knows.4

THE COURT: Right. And which would make it5

important, to me, before I made a representation to the6

jury, about watching a video, I would want to make sure7

that the video was going to be in evidence, which you8

didn’t do.9

So, this should have been the subject of a10

pre-trial motion.11

So, you rang the bell. I don’t know what’s12

gonna happen. I haven’t seen the video.13

MS. RUBIO: Well, it’s a statement by the --14

it’s a statement against interest. It’s a statement by15

a party opponent.16

I mean, this is, in my opinion, I mean, no --17

this is not in reference to the Court at all, but this18

is law school 101. When someone -- somebody gives a19

statement, then it is to be anticipated that that20

statement’s gonna be used --21

THE COURT: Okay. 22

All right. 23

MS. RUBIO: Against them.24

THE COURT: Okay. 25

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Fine.1

Mr. Harris, anything else?2

MR. HARRIS: This is not law school 101.3


I am gonna see the -- watch the video. We’re5

gonna have to watch it together, so that I know where6

you believe it -- there’s objections.7

So, I’m not sure we’re gonna have time8

between now and twelve fifteen. Maybe we will.9

Do you have a lap top, that we can play it10

on?11

MS. RUBIO: I can -- the, the lap top that is12

here is attached by some of anchor. I can’t really13

take it off.14

I think I, I could try to go upstairs, and15

see if I can secure one. I don’t own one myself.16

THE COURT: Okay. 17

I, I have a lap top. We’ll see if we can18

figure that out.19

All right. 20

So, we may not -- we may not play this video21

until tomorrow morning.22

MS. RUBIO: That is what I would anticipate.23

THE COURT: Okay. 24

MS. RUBIO: I, I will also indicate, even25

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regardless of how the Court rules, if the Court rules1

even certain portions should be redacted, or something2

of that nature, I wouldn’t be prepared to play it3

today, because I have to then go upstairs, get some4

kind of a tech person to figure out how to do that. It5

wouldn’t be ready today.6

THE COURT: Okay. 7

All right. 8

Anything else you want to say, Mr. Harris?9

MR. HARRIS: No, Your Honor. 10

THE COURT: Okay. 11

Let me see if I can address the, the play12

back issue.13

And can you folks sit tight, and we may or14

may not get to the video, all right, before the jury15

comes back.16

All right. 17

First of all, I have to take up some other18

matters.19

So, we’ll go off the record.20


(Whereupon a recess was had in the22

proceedings from 11:27 a.m. to 12:51 p.m.)23

THE COURT: Okay. 24


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MS. RUBIO: Good afternoon. Mary Rubio for2

the People.3

MR. HARRIS: Good afternoon, Your Honor. 4

Wyatt Harris, on behalf of Treshaun Terrance.5

THE COURT: Okay. 6

Are we ready to bring in the jury?7

MR. HARRIS: Yes.8

MS. RUBIO: I just wanted to indicate that,9

prior to just now, I gave defense counsel a, a copy of10

the next witness’s curriculum vitae, or C.V.11

I don’t plan on introducing it, but I wanted12

him to have it.13

And then I have marked as an exhibit, the14

witness’s report, produced by Michigan State Police. 15

And that is Exhibit No. 6.16

He also, as a part of his analysis, 17

created -- there are photographs. I showed those to18

counsel. I have that marked at People’s 7.19

If there are no objection, the People would20

move for admission of both 6 and 7, at this time.21


THE COURT: Okay. 23

The Court will, will receive Exhibit 6 and 724

into evidence, at this time.25

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MS. RUBIO: And just quickly, anticipating1

the next witness being the Officer in charge, the2

People have the 9-1-1 call marked as People’s 8, and I3

don’t believe counsel has an objection to that.4

MR. HARRIS: No, Your Honor.5

THE COURT: Okay. 6


THE COURT: Exhibit 8 will be received into8

evidence, at this time, as well.9

We ready for the jury?10


THE COURT: Okay. 12



the courtroom).15


THE COURT: Okay. 17

We are back on the record in case number 18


Your appearances, please?20


MR. HARRIS: Good afternoon, Your Honor.22

Wyatt Harris, on behalf of Mr. Treshaun Terrance.23

THE COURT: Okay. 24

Miss Rubio, your next witness?25

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MS. RUBIO: At this time, the People call1

Shane Hill.2

S H A N E H I L L3



MS. RUBIO: Sir, just, just stop right there.6

WITNESS: Oh.7

THE COURT: Yeah, that’s fine.8

Your name, please?9

WITNESS: Shane Hill.10

THE COURT: Can you spell your name?11

WITNESS: S-h-a-n-e, H-i-l-l.12

THE COURT: Can you raise your right hand?13




WITNESS: I do.17

THE COURT: Okay. 18

Please have a seat to my left.19


BY MS. RUBIO: 21

Q Good afternoon. Could you please tell us your name and22

occupation?23

A Yes, my name is Shane Hill, S-h-a-n-e, H-i-l-l. I work24

at the Michigan State Police Bridgeport Forensic Crime25

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Lab. I, I’m in the Biology Unit there.1

Q Okay. And what is your specific job title?2

A Specifically, I am a Forensic Scientist, but as a3

Forensic Scientist, in the Biology Unit, what I do is 4

I process evidence brought in by Agencies, for the5

possible presence of bodily fluids, like, blood, semen,6

saliva, as well as other sources of D.N.A., like7

contact, or touch D.N.A. 8

Q Okay. And what type of schooling do you have to have9

to do this work?10

A I have a Bachelors Degree from Saginaw Valley State in11

Biology, with a minor in Chemistry; as well as on the12

job training, for about nine months was my training13

period.14

And also, I’ve attended numerous work shops,15

and classes, in my discipline.16

Q Okay. Have you testified before?17

A Yes, I have.18

Q And have you been qualified as an expert?19

A Yes, I have.20

Q What have you been qualified -- what area have you been21

qualified in, as an expert in?22

A I’ve, I’ve been qualified in body fluid identification.23

Q Okay. 24

MS. RUBIO: Counsel, do you have any25

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questions?1


MS. RUBIO: Okay. 3

The People would ask that this witness be4

qualified as an expert -- in body fluid5

identifications?6

WITNESS: Yes, ma’am.7

MS. RUBIO: Okay. I just want to make sure I8

got that right.9

Q (By Ms. Rubio): I’m gonna take your attention to a10

specific case, and I’m gonna ask -- I know that you11

have some paper work with you, it looks like in your12

hand, it may be related to this case, is that right?13

A Yes, ma’am.14

Q Okay. 15

A It’s my courtroom folder.16

Q Okay. I’m gonna ask that you -- if you need to refer17

to it, before you do so, you let us know.18

A Absolutely.19

Q Okay. So, I’m gonna ask to draw your attention to a20

specific file, labeled MV156003, in reference to this21

case. Are you familiar with that?22

A Yes, I am.23

Q Okay. Did you do any work in, in relation to that24

case?25

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A Yes, I did do some on MV15-6003.1

Q And what was your role?2

A My role was to process evidence for the possible3

presence, in this case, of blood.4

I was sent some items from the Northville5

Laboratory, to look at, for possibly finding blood6

related to this matter.7

Q Okay. And you said you were sent some items. Did you,8

in fact, look at those items?9

A Yes, I did. When I say, sent items, this is -- was10

actually a case that was brought to the Northville11

Laboratory. I am in the Bridgeport Laboratory, but in12

many instances, in order to speed up the process, what13

we do is we trade cases. If we have capacity, we will14

take cases from other labs.15

In this case, that’s what happened. We16

received the evidence from the Northville Laboratory,17

which was brought in by the Agency.18

Q Okay. And when you receive it, how is it packaged?19

A It is packaged by the Agency, in either Manila20

envelopes, or some other sort of packaging. Whatever21

they package in is the Agency.22

And then our Evidence Techs, our Evidence23

Technicians, will actually do a hand to hand transfer,24

and then bring them back in their original packaging.25

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Q And when you first received the items, are they -- you1

said they’re in Manila envelope. Are they sealed in2

any fashion?3

A Yes. Everything that comes in from the Agency, is4

sealed with evidence tape. It’s tape, it’s got like a5

serrated edge on it, and it’s usually initialed.6

And in this case, all these items were sealed7

in that way.8

Q Okay. And do you recall how many items that you9

received?10

A May I refresh my notes, please?11

Q If that would refresh your recollection.12

A In this case, I received fifteen packages.13

Q Okay. And of those fifteen, as you stated, packages,14

what -- how many of those packages did you do work on?15

Are you referring to your report?16

A Yes.17

Q Okay. 18

A Twelve.19

Q Okay. And why is it that you didn’t do work on the20

other three items?21

A The other three items, after talking with the22

investigating Officer in this case, we want to try and23

send the best evidence possible, for the first round of24

testing.25

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And in this case, I talked to the Officer,1

and we made that decision, collectively, as to what to2

test.3

Q Okay. And can you name the items that you tested?4

A Yes. Can I make sure I have them all correct here?5

Q And to do so, would --6

A From my notes.7

Q Would you look at your report?8

A Yes. Yes, please.9

Q Please do.10

A I received and processed a red brown stained swab from11

a south wall; red brown stained swab from living room12

ceiling; red brown stained swab from a chair; red brown13

stained swab from north dining room wall; a white14

envelope from a desk; piece of paper from a desk; two15

beige tablets; another red brown stain from thank and16

excuse television set; swabs from right hand finger17

nails of the victim; swabs from left hand finger nails18

of the victim; a known buccal swab from a Treshaun19

Terrance; and a known blood card from a Dalona Tillman.20

Q Okay. And can you explain what -- first of all, you21

used the word, swab, a lot, in, in several of the items22

you listed. What is a swab?23

A Swabs are basically, think of, like a Q-tip. They’re24

basically a Q-tip, except they have one end on ‘em. 25

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They’re a cotton tipped swab.1

And in this case, they were packaged by the2

Agencies.3

We did not -- I did not, personally, process4

the scene, so it comes from the Agency, and they will5

take the sample on a swab, and send to the laboratory.6

So, I receive just the swab, and the red7

brown just stain is just indicating the coloring that8

was on the stain, at that time.9

Q Okay. And then the items that you analyzed, were, were10

that -- was that all the items you just named, or were11

there only certain items that you analyzed?12

A Those were all of the ones that I did analyze. There13

were three other ones that I did not analyze, three14

other packages.15

Q Okay. And just to be clear, what, what were those16

three that you did not analyze?17

A I believe it was the -- a package of the victim’s18

clothing; a -- may I refer for my other ones?19

Q Please do.20

A A swab from a cut on the right hand of the victim; and21

a swab of a cut on the left hand of the victim.22

Q Okay. And going back to, then, the items. Walk us23

through the, the items that you analyzed.24

First tell us, how do you analyze these25

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items?1

A When I receive a swab, in this case, and it appears to2

be red brown stained, or possibly blood stain, what I3

will do is, for each item, I will take that item, and I4

will process it on my bench. 5

And what my bench is, is, is basically like a6

black table, like that. And it’s in our laboratory. I7

will disinfect the area, and then I will bring out one8

piece of evidence, at a time. I will test it with9

chemicals, to see if it’s possibly blood, and then do10

further testing to confirm if it’s blood.11

After I do that, I will package that sample12

up for possible -- for future D.N.A. testing, and then13

I will move on to the next sample, so on, and so forth.14

Q Okay. And so, of the, of the items, you said you15

analyzed twelve items?16


Q And what was the result of your analysis, of the twelve18

items you already named?19

A The twelve items -- may I refer to --20

Q If it will refresh your recollection, refer to your21

report.22

A Eight of the samples, which were either a red brown23

stained swab, or in this case, the white envelope, the24

piece of paper, and two beige tablets, as well,25

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indicated that there was human blood on them.1

And those samples were sent on for D.N.A.2

testing.3

And then the other samples, I did finger4

nails swabs, and the swabs were already brought in. It5

was from the finger, finger nails of the victim. And6

those, I don’t have any test for. They’re looking for7

possible contact D.N.A., or touch D.N.A.8

And what that is, is, sometimes when you9

handle thing -- objects, or you’re using an item, you10

have the propensity to leave behind your skin cells on11

it. 12

In this case, swabs of finger nails from the13

victim, in case the victim may have scratched a14

perpetrator, or came in contact with them, possibly15

looking for that D.N.A.16

And then I also received two known samples,17

one from a victim, and one from a listed suspect.18

And those just go for D.N.A., as known19

reference samples, to be put up against evidentiary20

samples.21

Q Okay. So, to be clear, from what you just said, if I22

understood you correctly, you did not receive actual23

finger nail clippings?24


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Q Okay. Sounds like you said that, that you received1

swabs, from the finger nails?2


Q And, and is that typical?4

A Yes. I will -- I get either finger nails, or finger5

nail swabs, very common. The M.E.s generally take the6

cuttings in the finger nails.7

In this case, the Agency swabbed them.8

Q Okay. And I believe you, you indicated that, as far as9

the finger nails, you said that that was sent to be10

analyzed somewhere else, or how does that work?11

A Yes, I have actually a little prop. Can I show, can I12

show it. It’s for, it’s what we send it for D.N.A.13

Q Okay. 14

A When I say, sent for D.N.A.15

Any time I say, sent for D.N.A., this is what16

we send it in. 17

Basically, the swabs that I got from the18

finger nails, in this instance, will get cut and19

packaged into this little 2-M-L-2, and it will be20

placed into a envelope, and sent to the D.N.A. lab.21

We do not have D.N.A. at the Bridgeport22

Laboratory, so we have to send it to a lab that has23

D.N.A. analysis.24

Q And now, and just for the record, you were holding up,25

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a moment ago, a -- is it a, a tube?1

A Yes. What it is, is we get sterile tubes, and it’s a, 2

it’s a 2-M-L-2.3

Q Does that mean, milliliter?4

A Yes.5

Q I’m sorry. Let me --6

A Two --7


Okay. Thank you. 9

WITNESS: Two milliliter tube. And then it10

gets heat sealed, individually, and sent down for11

D.N.A. analysis.12

Q (By Ms. Rubio): Okay. And, and this particular tube13

is also in a plastic bag?14

A Yes.15

Q Is that correct? Okay. 16

A AS heat sealed plastic bag, yes.17

Q Okay. And is that how, how the evidence is normally18

stored?19


Q Okay. So, you indicated, your lab does not do D.N.A.21

analysis?22


Q So, as far as -- so, you didn’t do any work on the24

finger nails. That was sent somewhere else?25

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A That’s correct. I just cut and packaged them into 1

this -- in, the way I showed you how.2

Q Okay. And as far as the -- you indicated that there3

were eight items in which you did do analysis, and that4

you did find the presence of human blood?5

A That is correct.6

Q Okay. You also indicated that there was a known, you,7

you said, buccal swab, from a suspect, Treshaun8

Terrance?9

A That is correct.10

Q Okay. Did you do anything with that?11

A That, much like the swabs that I got for the finger12

nails, in those cases, we just cut and packaged the13

sample into the tubes, and send those down so they can14

be run into the D.N.A. machines, as well.15

Q And, and that’s not at your lab?16

A That is not at my lab, no.17

Q And how about the blood card from Dalona Tillman?18

A The blood card is in the same instance as the buccal19

swab. It’s just, that’s generally how we get samples20

from a decedent, is from a blood card.21

So, we will send, cut and package a small22

sample of that, as well. I don’t do any chemical23

testing on those.24

Q Okay. So, you, in essence, prepare the sample that are25

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going to be tested for D.N.A., and send them on for1

further testing?2


Q And then that’s the end of your role, correct?4

A Yes. In this case, I did do testing, though, for those5

items that do have human blood on them.6

Q What kind of testing did you do?7

A The first test I, I did, on the red brown stained8

items, or, or items that have possible blood on them,9

is I will take a swab of the sample, and I will test it10

with a chemical called phenathaline. Basically what11

phenathaline is, is if it turns pink, it’s a color12

change, and if it turns pink, that means it’s possibly13

blood.14

And then it will go on, after that, to a15

hematrace test. And hematrace test is, basically, like16

a little card, similar to, like, a pregnancy test,17

except it’s looking for human blood, in this case.18

And those were positive, as well.19

Q Okay. And then is any other analysis done on those20

items?21

A No. Once I identify human blood, I will take a sample22

of it, and placed it in storage, just like this, and23

sent it down for D.N.A. with the other samples.24

Q Okay. And when you -- at the conclusion of your work,25

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do you reduce any of this to any, any kind of a report,1

or writing?2

A Yes. I create a laboratory report, and that report3

will be reviewed. And then once it is reviewed, it4

will get released to the investigation Agency, in this5

case.6

Q Okay. 7



Q (By Ms. Rubio): I’m showing you what’s been marked and10

already introduced as People’s No. 6. Do you recognize11

this?12

A Yes, I do.13

Q What is it?14

A People’s Exhibit 6 is a copy of my Laboratory report,15

for all of the work that I did on this case. MV15-16

6003.17


In the course of your analysis, did you also19

look at, and photograph any items?20

A Yes, I did photograph items in this case. When I have21

items that come in, and I want to do some documentation22

on them, I always take photos. 23

And the photos that I took in this case were24

of an envelope, a piece of paper, and two beige colored25

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tablets.1

Q And where did those items come from?2

A Those items were items that were received, that were3

brought in by the investigating Agency.4

Q Okay. 5



MS. RUBIO: Okay. 8

Q (By Ms. Rubio): I’m showing you what’s already marked9

and received into evidence as People’s 7. Do you10

recognize this?11

A Yes, I did -- yes, I do.12

Q What is it?13

A People’s Exhibit 7 is a C.D. that bears MV15-6003. 14

These are photos, all the photos that I took while15

processing the evidence on this case.16

Q Did -- and did you prepare that disk?17

A Yes, I did prepare this disk.18

Q Okay. And did you also print out copies of, of19

everything that was on that disk?20

A Yes, I did. 21


I’m gonna draw your attention here to the23

screen, and just go through the photos that you24

indicated are on the disk.25

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A Okay. 1

Q And, let me make sure -- first of all, can you see the2

screen?3

A Yes, ma’am.4

Q Okay. 5

MS. RUBIO: Can the members of the jury see6

the screen?7

JURORS: Yes.8

Q (By Ms. Rubio): What is this photo, the first photo9

we’re looking at -- oops, sorry, that’s a little big. 10

Okay. What is this photo?11

A This photo is a photograph of the item that was marked12

as a paper envelope, item designated by my number MV15-13

6003-10.14

Q Okay. 15

A And those are my -- any -- the “S”-“H”, those are my16

initials.17

Q Okay. And there appears to be -- there’s a ruler. 18

What’s that for?19

A Yeah, the ruler, for me, is just for, for scale. Any20

time I have any sort of stain, just so I could go back21

and possibly scale it, for later use.22

Q And there appears to be some hand writing. Is that23

yours?24

A No, the hand writing that came on to the, this piece of25

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evidence, I received it with the blue ink hand writing1

on it.2

The only thing I had written on that page is3

my lab number indicator, and my initials.4

Q Okay. And taking your attention to photo number two,5

what are we looking at?6

A This is a close up picture of a red brown possible7

blood stain, that was on the top left of the envelope,8

as it was photographed.9

Q Okay. And did you -- on all these items we’re looking10

at, are these items that you analyzed?11

A Yes, these are all items that I’ve analyzed. However,12

in this case, yet -- I have not tested this, in any13

way, yet.14

Q So, they’re photographed prior to you doing any work on15

them?16

A Correct.17

Q Okay. But then, after you did the work, do, do all the18

items that are pictured in the photographs, did they19

test positive for the presence of human blood?20

A Yes, ma’am, they did.21

Q Okay. And photograph number three, what are we looking22

at?23

A This is the same photograph as before, except you can24

see the short hand up there, in the blue, the “P”“H”25

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plus sign, and the “H”“T” plus sign, that stands for1

phenathaline positive, and hematrace positive. Those2

are those two tests, that in -- together, indicate3

human blood.4

And that is when I did the testing there, on5

that, that blood stain.6

Q Okay. And photograph number four, what is this?7

A Photograph number four is just showing -- there’s no8

more stain there because I have cut and packaged it,9

for D.N.A., into that tube, to be sent for D.N.A.10

analysis.11

Q Okay. And photo five, what are we looking at?12

A Photo five is a picture of item number eleven. This13

was a piece of paper identified as from on a desk. It14

appeared to be a DTE Energy bill, and it appears to15

have possible blood staining on it, as well.16

Q And this was prior to your analysis17


Q Okay. And this is labeled photo six. What are we19

looking at?20

A Photo six is just a closer up view of the staining on21

the piece of paper that was shown right before.22

Q Okay. And photo seven, what are we looking at?23

A Photo seven, I just reoriented my picture. I, I forgot24

to put it in the right orientation. I like to have25

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things in a landscape way, instead of portrait. So, I1

just took and extra picture. It’s the same picture,2

just different angle.3

Q Okay. And photo eight, what is this?4

A Photo eight is, I’m zooming back out, in order to show5

the stain that I’m actually going to test. It is6

circled in blue. 7

Since these stains are all from the same8

general area, on the piece of paper, I decided to just9

test one of the stains, because they were in the10

general area.11

Q Okay. And photo nine, what are we looking at?12

A Photo nine, this is a close up, with the scale, of13

that, that stain that I circled, and it has not yet14

been tested.15

Q Photo ten, what are we looking at?16

A Photo ten is that same stain, and now you can see that17

I did test it, with the same indication of “P”“H” plus,18

“H”“T” plus. Again, that’s the phenathaline positive,19

hematrace positive, combination that indicates human20

blood, in this case.21

Q Okay. And photo eleven, what is here?22

A Photo eleven is of item number twelve. These are the 23

two beige tablets that I received. This is showing the24

two tablets that had possible blood staining on them. 25

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I only received these two tablets.1

Q As opposed to several tablets?2

A As opposed to -- yeah, more tablets. I only received3

these two.4

Q Okay. And photo twelve, what is this?5

A Photo twelve is a close up of the tablet. You can see6

the other tablet, on the left. I chose this tablet7

because it appeared to have more possible blood to8

test, and to send on forward for sample. So, this is9

just a closer up view.10

Q Okay. And photo thirteen?11

A Photo thirteen, this is, again, indicating “P”“H” plus,12

“H”“T” plus, those are my shorthand notes for13

phenathaline positive, hematrace positive. Again,14

indicating human blood on that stain.15

Q Photo fourteen?16

A And photo fourteen, that is just an after shot of,17

after I swabbed it, I swab it with one wet swab,18

followed by a dry swab, to get as much of the sample19

off as I can. And I just took a picture of that one,20

because as you can see, it kind of disrupted the21

surface of the tablet, so I wanted to make sure I22

documented that, as well.23

Q Okay. Thank you. In the course of, initially, when24

you first started testifying, you indicated that you’re25

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qualified as an expert in bodily fluid identification,1

correct?2

A That is correct.3

Q Okay. And you testified, for a while now, today,4

regarding blood. So, is blood one of those body5

fluids, that you’re an expert in?6

A That is correct.7

Q Okay. Okay. And you also, in the beginning of your8

testimony, indicated that you, aside from formal9

education, for example, a Bachelors, you’ve also had10

several -- you had course work, in relation to your11

job, correct?12

A That’s correct, both on the job, through our personnel,13

at the Michigan State Police Lab, as well as external14

sources from, from mass conferences, and such.15

Q Okay. Have you also had any specific court work as it16

relates to blood?17

A Yes, I have. I’ve had a body fluid identification18

screening course, which was about forty hours.19

I have had numerous hours of training in20

blood stain pattern, recognition, and documentation; as21

well as other crime scene -- excuse me, crime scene22

courses, where we deal with blood, as well.23

Q Okay. What is blood stain pattern recognition?24

MR. HARRIS: Objection, Your Honor. May we25

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approach?1



THE COURT: Go ahead, Miss Rubio.4


Q (By Ms. Rubio): Can you tell us a little bit more6

about the blood stain -- I’m sorry. And I don’t7

remember when, when we left off. 8

Did you tell us, you indicated that you had9

some course work regarding blood stain pattern10

analysis, and blood stain pattern recognition. Did I11

get that right?12

A That’s correct. I have had course work in blood stain13

pattern analysis, recognition, and documentation. 14

Basically what that is, is course work where you are15

able to identify possible blood stains, and the --16

what, the force to which, what makes those blood17

stains.18

I am just qualified to recognize it, and19

document it. I do not author blood stain pattern20

reports. I don’t have quite enough training yet, so I21

just do the documentation, and recognition of it.22

Q Okay. What does that mean, you’re qualified to23

document, and recognize it? What does that mean?24

A So, there are different type of blood stain patterns25

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that can be from a blood stain pattern analyst, that1

can be, you know, they can draw information from. 2

And what the documentation part of it is,3

photography, taking notes on the size, shape, pattern,4

distribution, so that they, if they were -- they, when5

I say, they, a blood stain pattern analyst, issuing a6

report, could go and look at photographs, and possibly7

see and make their own conclusions, and render their8

own conclusions, about what possibly made those blood9

stains.10

Q Okay. And in the course of your work, how often have,11

have you had the opportunity to review and analyze12

blood stains?13

A I actually get to view blood stains quite frequently. 14

I am part of the Crime Scene Response Team, at our15

Laboratory, and we go out on many crimes scenes where16

blood shed is involved.17

So, I get to see different blood stains, and18

different blood stain patterns.19

However, it has never been -- I have never20

issued a report, or it has never been reviewed. 21

Again, I just do the documentation and22

recognition of it, so somebody else could do that,23

later on, down the line.24

Q Does your office -- I’m sorry, you said you’re part of25

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the Crime Scene Response Team, is that --1


Q Okay. Does -- and that is through the Bridgeport3

office?4

A Yes. Through the Bridgeport Laboratory. All the other5

laboratories, as well, have a Crime Scene Response6

Team. And people, they are, there are qualified blood7

stain pattern analysts, who can issue full blood stain8

pattern reports.9

Q Do you have one in your office?10

A We do have, more than one in our office.11

Q And does, does one of those people res -- is one of12

those people on the Crime Scene Response Team?13

A Yes. Everybody, actually, is on the Crime Scene14

Response Team, that go -- that is a blood stain pattern15

analyst.16

Q Okay. And when you respond to a crime scene, do you17

work in tandem with the blood stain analyst?18

A That’s correct. The recognition and documentation part19

is just for their benefit. We always work in teams, on20

a crime scene, and generally there are more than one21

people, in each, in each discipline, that go out on the22

scene.23

Q Okay. Counsel, you have questions?24

MR. HARRIS: Yes.25

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VOIR DIRE EXAMINATION1

BY MR. HARRIS: 2

Q I’m looking at your Curriculum Vitae.3

A Yes, sir.4

Q You indicate that in November 18th to November 19th,5

you had a sixteen hour course in Blood Stain Pattern6

Recognition and Documentation?7


Q Was that in 2015?9

A Yes, that was in 2015.10

Q Okay. And with regards to Blood Stain Pattern11

Analysis, you attended a work shop in July 27th through12

the 31st, 2015, for that workshop, correct?13


Q That was a forty hour work shop?15


Q You have never been certified as a Blood Stain Pattern17

Recognition, or Analyst, as an expert, in court,18

correct?19


Q And you’ve never testified to that, is that correct?21


Q No further questions, Your Honor.23

MS. RUBIO: Your Honor, I, I believe the24

witness indicated he’s qualified in Blood Stain25

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Recognition and Documentation.1

I would ask that I be allowed to ask the, the2

one question I indicated a side bar.3

THE COURT: Go ahead.4

Repeat your question.5

MS. RUBIO: What was it --6

MR. HARRIS: Your Honor, may I -- may I make7

a record?8

I object to him being certified as an expert.9

THE COURT: I’m asking her to ask the10

question.11

MR. HARRIS: Okay. 12

MS. RUBIO: I believe I asked, did, did he13

have an opportunity to review all, all of the14

photographs, and, and form any opinion, based on his15

personal work, as, as he’s testified, so far, as to the16

nature of the particular blood stain.17

MR. HARRIS: I object, Your Honor.18

MS. RUBIO: And there was one particular19

photograph I wanted to show --20

THE COURT: What do you mean by, the nature21

of the blood stain?22

MS. RUBIO: Was there anything that he could23

conclude, from looking at, at that particular24

photograph?25

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I could show the photograph to Your Honor.1

THE COURT: Okay. 2

No -- all right. 3

Sir, do you consider yourself an expert in4

Blood Pattern Analysis?5

WITNESS: No, not in Blood Stain Pattern6

Analysis.7

THE COURT: Okay. 8

Any further questions?9

MS. RUBIO: I -- actually, no, I don’t have10

any further questions, regarding that. I just wanted11

to reiterate that he indicated he is qualified to12

testify, in Blood Stain Pattern and Documen -- Pattern13

Recognition and Documentation, I believe is what he14

said.15

Q (By Ms. Rubio): Is that -- I’m sorry, was I correct in16

that?17

A Blood Stain Pattern -- I have had courses in18

Recognition and Documentation, yes, but not -- yes, but19

not full Blood Stain Pattern Analysis.20

Q Right. And you indicated you’re not an expert?21

A Right.22

Q But that you’re qualified, correct?23

A Yes.24

Q Okay. 25

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MS. RUBIO: That’s all I have.1

THE COURT: Okay. 2

MS. RUBIO: May I ask a follow up question?3

THE COURT: I’ll be honest with you, I don’t4

remember what your last question was.5

MS. RUBIO: Okay. I, I just wanted to ask6

what -- I wanted to show him a particular photograph,7

and ask whether -- what it signifies, if anything, to8

him, based on his personal experience?9

MR. HARRIS: I would object, Your Honor.10

THE COURT: Well, I mean, can you be more11

concrete? I don’t know what -- I have no idea what,12

what that question means.13

Are you asking him to offer an opinion14

dealing with Blood Pattern Analysis, or does he15

recognize something as blood, or what are you asking16

him?17

MS. RUBIO: I believe the witness has already18

indicated, all of the items testified to, so far, in19

the photographs, were -- he tested them, and they are,20

in fact, blood.21

And then I wanted to ask, in -- I wanted to22

be able to show him a particular photograph, with more23

than one blood stain on it, what that signifies to him,24

if anything.25

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MR. HARRIS: I would object, Your Honor. He1

is --2

THE COURT: The foundation hasn’t been laid3

for that testimony.4

MR. HARRIS: Thank you. 5

THE COURT: Anything further, counsel?6

MS. RUBIO: Just one second.7

I don’t have any other questions.8

THE COURT: Okay. 9

Mr. Harris?10

MR. HARRIS: Your Honor, I have no questions11

of this witness.12


do any of you have a question? If so, please raise14

your hand.15

Seeing no hands.16

Sir, you can step down.17

WITNESS: Thank you, Your Honor. 18

MS. RUBIO: Thank you so much. 19

THE COURT: Ms. Rubio, can you tell us who20

your -- who do you anticipate your next witness will21

be.22

MS. RUBIO: The Officer in charge, Officer23

Mason.24

THE COURT: Okay. 25

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I would like to take a ten minute recess, at1

this point in time, to take care of another matter.2

Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, we’re going3

to take a, just a brief recess.4

I’m gonna ask that you retire to the jury5

room, okay? Thank you. 6



proceedings from 1:30 p.m. to 1:45 p.m.)9

THE COURT: Okay. 10





Wyatt Harris, on behalf of Mr. Terrance.15

THE COURT: Okay. 16

I am going to bring the jury back in, now,17

and I’m going to excuse them for the day.18

And then we’re gonna go back on the record19

and discuss why we are excusing them.20

And then, that’s what we agreed to, is that21

right?22


MR. HARRIS: Yes, Your Honor.24

THE COURT: Okay. 25

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Want to bring he jury out?1



the courtroom).4


THE COURT: Okay. 6

We’re back on the record in 16-001235-FC,7

People versus Terrance.8

Your appearances?9



Treshaun Terrance.12

THE COURT: Ladies and gentlemen, for the13

reasons I won’t trouble you with, we are going to --14

I’m going to send you home now, to retire tomorrow --15

to return tomorrow.16

Be here before nine o’clock, ‘cause we’d like17

to start at nine o’clock tomorrow morning.18

Okay?19

So, we’re gonna let you return your note20

pads, and what not, in the jury.21

However, before I send you out, please22

remember not to discuss this case with anybody, okay?23

Have a good afternoon.24


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(Whereupon the jurors were excused for the1

day).2




THE COURT: Okay. 6

We’re back on the record in case number 7

16-001235-FC -- oh.8

MR. HARRIS: Judge, can I move my seat, so I9

can get closer to the --10

THE COURT: Sure.11

MR. HARRIS: Camera, so that I can see the12

time.13

Okay. 14

We’re on the record in case number 15


Your appearances?17


MR. HARRIS: Wyatt Harris on behalf of Mr.19

Terrance, Your Honor. 20

THE COURT: Okay. 21

Ms. Rubio, can you engage the video, and22

which I understand is the statement and interrogation23

of Mr. Terrance, is that correct?24


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I have, I have it in the computer now, and I1

will indicate that the interrogation, the video itself,2

show it from two different angles.3

The angle that I have now, which is the4

straight on angle. 5

There’s another angle that they show, the6

same interrogation, that looks like it’s from the --7

you’re lookin from the ceiling.8

So, I chose this one, ‘cause the other --9

this one, you can see their faces, and --10

THE COURT: Okay. 11

What, what’s the date and time?12

MS. RUBIO: It is, 1/27/2016. It starts, it13

started seconds ago, it started to roll, and then I14

paused it.15

So, right now, it’s at twelve twenty-one p.m.16

I will indicate, in the e-mail I received17

from counsel, he -- his first area that he objects to18

starts at one o’eight. So, I could forward it, because19

that’s a good forty plus minutes, so that -- I can at20

least forward it to, to that.21

THE COURT: Is that --22

MR. HARRIS: Yeah, that’s not a problem,23

Judge. There was a Constitutional rights taken of24

that. I, I don’t have any --25

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THE COURT: Okay. 1

So, go ahead and forward, fast forward to --2

MS. RUBIO: Okay. 3

THE COURT: One o’eight, which is the point4

of the first objection, is that right?5


THE COURT: Mr. Harris.7

MS. RUBIO: But first, let me figure this8

out.9

It might be a tiny bit of trial and error10

here, for a second. I apologize.11

THE COURT: I understand that.12

And Mr. Harris, just to set the table for me,13

is this gonna be a continuing objection, for a period14

of time, or is it just -- this just a limited question,15

and a limited answer, or something like that?16

MR. HARRIS: Judge, what I anticipated on17

doing was, to identify the objection at the beginning18

of the section --19

THE COURT: Okay. 20

MR. HARRIS: And then indicate to the Court,21

that’s the end of my objection for that section.22

THE COURT: Okay. 23

MR. HARRIS: Now, I think it would be easier24

if the Court knew that -- well, if the Court knew the25

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timings of the sections --1

THE COURT: Okay. 2

MR. HARRIS: Then that, that might be easier3

for the Court.4

MS. RUBIO: You mean, ahead of time?5

MR. HARRIS: Ahead of time.6

MS. RUBIO: Because I will indicate, counsel,7

the e-mail that I referenced earlier, that counsel sent8

to me, at approximately seven last night, it has all9

the, all the times.10

So, I don’t know if --11

MR. HARRIS: Yeah, I think it would be easier12

for the Court to have all the times.13

THE COURT: Okay. 14

So, the first section --15

MR. HARRIS: Is one o’eight twenty-one to one16

eleven thirty.17

MS. RUBIO: So, that has seconds, as well?18

THE COURT: Yeah.19

MR. HARRIS: And then --20

MS. RUBIO: Well, did you want to just print21

out a, a copy --22

MR. HARRIS: I can’t print these -- that’s23

what I tried to do.24

MS. RUBIO: Oh, I wish you’d told me. I25

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could have made a copy for you, or I can have someone1

go make a copy right now.2

MR. HARRIS: Do you, do you have a copy of3

the times?4

MS. RUBIO: Yeah, mine, that I need, but I5

can have someone go make a copy.6

MR. HARRIS: Why can’t we just ask the Court7

to --8

THE COURT: Yeah, we can --9

MR. HARRIS: Copy it.10

MS. RUBIO: But I think it’ll, might be a11

little easier, for Your Honor to have it.12

MR. HARRIS: Let me see --13

MS. RUBIO: Hold on. Let me just make sure.14

Yep, see, it goes, you have this, and this.15

Right?16

MR. HARRIS: Yeah, Judge, if you just had a17

print out of this, I don’t know that it’s gonna make a18

difference with the other stuff, but you at least have19

the times.20

MS. RUBIO: It might help, yeah.21

MR. HARRIS: Yeah.22

MS. RUBIO: In the mean time, I’m gonna try23

to get this to that one o’eight.24

THE COURT: While we’re on the record, what25

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is your, the nature of your objection, on this section?1

MR. HARRIS: Relevance.2

THE COURT: Okay. 3

Will that be the objection through most of4

your --5

MR. HARRIS: For the majority of it, yes,6

Your Honor. 7


MS. RUBIO: Ah, I think I figured it out. 9

Sorry.10

Okay. So, I have it at one o -- oh, I’m11

sorry.12

Okay. It’s at one o’eight o’five. So we’ll13

get about fifteen seconds, and then we’ll get into the14

first portion.15


(Whereupon the video taped interrogation was17

played in open court).18

THE COURT: What time are we at now?19

MS. RUBIO: Almost there, one eleven.20

(Whereupon the video taped interrogation21

continued to be played in open court).22

MS. RUBIO: Okay. That consists of the first23

portion, correct, counsel?24

MR. HARRIS: Yes.25

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MS. RUBIO: Okay. 1

THE COURT: So, your objection is, Mr.2

Harris?3

MR. HARRIS: My objection is, it’s not4

relevant. They’re talking about the fact that these5

young people were trying to get together, and they had6

this prior relationship. They talk about a homicide7

that took place in this house, a year ago. 8

All of that colloquy by the Officer, is not9

relevant.10

THE COURT: I agree, you can go back to the11

point, just a few seconds ago, where he says, let me12

get to my point.13

I think everything before that is just a long14

narrative by the Investigator. 15

So, can you find that, just a few seconds16

ago, he goes: Let me get back to my point.17

The squatting issue, I don’t see how that’s18

relevant. 19

I don’t see how, who’s got the deed, and the20

prior murder being there, I don’t see how that is21

relevant to this case.22

So, does that make sense, Ms. Rubio?23


I think, basically --25

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THE COURT: This starts at: Let me get back1

to my point. Let me --2

MS. RUBIO: Yes.3

THE COURT: Let me begin -- let me get back4

to my point, I think that’s fine.5

MR. HARRIS: Yes.6

THE COURT: So, I’m going to sustain the7

objection.8

MS. RUBIO: And then the next portion that9

counsel indicates, that’s almost starting, it’s10

starting within twenty seconds, so I’m just -- if I11

could, I’m just gonna hit, play, again.12

THE COURT: That’s fine.13

MR. HARRIS: I would ask the Court, though,14

before you start that, I would ask the Court to listen15

to the twenty seconds between, so that the Court can16

then understand why, that, that it’s relevant to keep17

that in.18

THE COURT: Yeah, you can, you can run it19

from where we are.20

MR. HARRIS: Okay. Thank you, Judge.21



THE COURT: What’s your objection?24

MR. HARRIS: Relevance, and hearsay. They’re25

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talking about what Germaine might have said to the1

Officer.2

My client indicates, what he allegedly heard3

from Germaine.4

And the Officer talks about what he, what5

Germaine had said to him, regarding these cigarette6

butts, and their investiga -- and the Officer’s7

investigation.8

THE COURT: Counsel?9

MS. RUBIO: I think it goes to, to two10

relevant points.11

One is, Detective, the Officer in charge,12

indicates to me that they did receive an anonymous tip13

about someone named Germaine.14

So, obviously, they’re gonna follow up on15

that, with the person who is accused of the murder.16

Additionally, it’s also relevant because the17

defendant, himself, says, that’s not true. And there18

wasn’t anyone at -- anyone else there.19

MR. HARRIS: This is one of those cases, Your20

Honor, where I don’t think relevance is the issue.21

I think it’s hearsay. Here is a third party22

saying things to the Police, and the Police are, the23

Police are repeating what this third party said.24

And he’s not even a witness in this case.25

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They wanted Germaine to come in, and have him1

testify, they should have him bring in -- bring him in2

to testify.3

MS. RUBIO: Well, Your Honor, it’s -- I’m4

sorry, may I respond to that?5

THE COURT: Yeah.6

MS. RUBIO: I would just indicate that, this7

is an interrogation. This is not a court proceeding.8

Police often talk with suspects about what9

other people said, so they can get the, the suspect’s10

reaction to it.11

MR. HARRIS: That doesn’t mean it’s12

admissible in evidence.13

THE COURT: Well, what purpose is it being14

offered for?15

MS. RUBIO: Who, I’m sorry, me?16

THE COURT: Whoever wants to answer the17

question.18

MS. RUBIO: Well, obviously, counsel’s19

indicated he doesn’t want it in.20

I, I’m indicating that the Police indicate21

that this was information that they received, and so22

they were following up on it, with the defendant, to23

see how he would respond.24

Additionally, it’s also important to25

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establish that, and this, the defendant continues to1

acknowledge, throughout this interview, that there was2

no one else in that house, other than he, and Ms.3

Tillman.4

And that is very important to the People’s5

case.6

MR. HARRIS: And I’m not objecting that that7

shouldn’t be heard by the jury. I think the jury --8

they’re, they’re entitled to hear that.9

What I’m objecting to is the fact of what the10

Officer, and what my client Germaine said. That’s11

hearsay, and there’s no, there’s no exception to that.12

MS. RUBIO: Well, Your Honor, in, in an13

interrogation, typically a jury will hear the questions14

that Police Officers ask, to put it in context. 15

If we were to follow what counsel says, then16

every single thing that the Officer says should be17

redacted, and his statement will have no context.18

The -- as the Court is well aware, and as the19

jury will be instructed, they -- the only thing that20

will be evidence will be the statements made -- well,21

as it relates to this, this -- the statements made by22

the defendant.23

Obviously, questions asked of the Police,24

just like questions asked by counsel and I, are not25

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evidence.1

THE COURT: Okay. 2

I’m gonna overrule the objection.3

So, we’ll play all of one eleven fifty-one4

through one thirteen fifty-five.5

MS. RUBIO: Now, the next point that counsel6

lists, on his sheet here, just for clarification from7

counsel. It indicates, I take it to mean, it starts at8

one, one sixteen and twenty-six seconds?9

MR. HARRIS: Yes, and it’s a very short --10

the statement is, you all got into it a lot, and that’s11

by the Officer.12

MS. RUBIO: And that’s the only things that13

you’re -- so, it’s just that one statement, that you,14

you wanted out, counsel?15

MR. HARRIS: Correct.16

MS. RUBIO: Is that correct?17

MR. HARRIS: That’s correct.18

MS. RUBIO: I would indicate, to -- I mean,19

I, I can play that one little thing, but it sounds like20

if counsel’s indicating, it’s just the fact that the21

Officer says that, which is probably a couple seconds22

long, that: You all got into a lot.23

I would indicate to the Court that the24

statements, again, the statements that Police make,25

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are, are not evidence.1

And specifically, as far as interrogations2

go, the Police often use psychological tactics, during3

an interrogation; they -- that is from Haynes v4

Washington, 373 U.S. 503, that’s a 1963 case --5

THE COURT: Well, I’ll listen to this. The,6

the question is --7


THE COURT: You all got into it a lot. 9

That’s a question from a Police Officer, to the10

defendant?11

MR. HARRIS: A statement made by the Police12

Officer --13

MS. RUBIO: A statement.14

THE COURT: To the defendant. It’s not a15

question, Your Honor.16

MS. RUBIO: I mean, that doesn’t even mean17

it’s true. That, that’s obviously --18

THE COURT: Okay. 19

I’ll listen to it. I’m inclined to overrule20

the objection, but I want to hear it.21

MR. HARRIS: Also, Your Honor, the reason,22

the other reason why I want to prevent that from 23

coming -- there’s been no 404B motion by the Prosecutor24

to talk about any kind of previous activity that my25

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client had, or involvement that my client had, from a1

physical altercation standpoint with Ms. Tillman.2

MS. RUBIO: And the Police -- I’m sorry.3

MR. HARRIS: And they -- and the Police are4

obviously trying to base some unfounded statements5

about, you all got into it a lot, to justify their6

position.7

‘Cause you’ll note, one nineteen goes into it8

a lot in terms of the volatile relationship.9

So, I just wanted to let the Court know that.10

MS. RUBIO: And I would just indicate that,11

of course we did not -- the Court is well aware that we12

did not submit a 76A, or 404 notice, nor are we13

contending that, as it were, that this defendant has14

been previously convicted of domestic violence.15

Again, this is a Police investigation,16

interrogation tact, that they’re entitled to take,17

pursuant to case law. 18

That would be my, my argument.19

THE COURT: Okay. 20

Let me hear it. 21

MS. RUBIO: Okay. 22

I’m sorry, Wyatt, one sixteen?23

MR. HARRIS: One sixteen twenty-six.24


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MS. RUBIO: That’s the statement, I believe. 2

Am I right, counsel?3

MR. HARRIS: Right.4

THE COURT: Okay. 5

I’m gonna overrule the objection.6

MS. RUBIO: And then the next portion is at7

one nineteen and eighteen seconds, through one twenty-8

one and twenty-five seconds?9


MS. RUBIO: And counsel, did you indicate11

that it’s the same objection?12

MR. HARRIS: Well, yes, along with relevance,13

because there’s some other statements made.14

One nineteen and eighteen seconds.15

MS. RUBIO: Okay. This starts -- right now,16

it’s at one nineteen and ten, but --17



MS. RUBIO: Do you -- I just stopped it.20

Counsel actually had -- that was the second,21

that went into the, into another portion, that was just22

about to start, another portion that counsel objected23

to, so I stopped it.24

So, this was the, the one, from one nineteen25

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to one twenty-one.1

THE COURT: Your objection, counsel?2

MR. HARRIS: Is that it’s not relevant. He’s3

talking about, he’s making commentary about young,4

young people, and my client being young, and not being5

able to care for himself, and it’s -- it’s not6

relevant, and, and he doesn’t know whether that’s true7

or not.8

And he specifically says, I’m gonna stop9

makin’ commentary about that.10

I don’t see it as a tactic, as the Prosecutor11

would like to say it is. It’s his commentary.12

THE COURT: Well, counsel, I’m gonna disagree13

with you.14

It seems clear to me that the tactic, that15

this is a tactic that the Detective is utilizing.16

So, I’m going to permit the question, or 17

the -- it’s actually a colloquy, the whole --18

MR. HARRIS: Judge, see, I looked at this and19

said, you know, if this Officer was up on the witness20

stand, would we allow this kind of commentary.21

And the answer to that question is, I can’t22

imagine anybody would do that.23

And I understand, you trying to use a, a24

tactic, and what have you, but you can’t just allow him25

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to go on, and go on, and, and make statements that,1

one, are not founded, because from that standpoint,2

then anybody could get up there on the witness stand,3

and just say whatever they wanted to say.4

THE COURT: Okay. 5

Next.6

MS. RUBIO: The next, I’ll just hit play,7

because it’s already at counsel’s next point that he8

contends, it’s -- and it just started with, I know9

you’re not a cold blooded killer.10

And that will go up through one twenty-seven,11

so it’s a few minutes.12



MS. RUBIO: I think that’s the end, of that15

section, Mr. Harris.16

THE COURT: That’s one twenty-one thirty-one17

through one twenty-seven forty-three?18

MR. HARRIS: That’s correct, Your Honor.19

MS. RUBIO: Yes, it is.20

THE COURT: And your objection, counsel?21

MR. HARRIS: It is, none of it was relevant. 22

They talked about the Twelfth Precinct, they talk about23

the subculture, they talk about my client, the Officer24

talks about my client gettin’ his hustle on, then the25

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Officer goes and gets colloquy about his past history1

with his baby mama.2

THE COURT: People?3

MS. RUBIO: Well, I contend that, I think4

it’s, it’s this Detective’s way of conducting an5

interrogation. Obviously, it sounds like he’s trying6

to, sort of, create an atmosphere as if he’s building a7

rapport, and talk to his -- talk to his suspect, that8

way. 9

And I think I -- the jury can glean something10

from the defendant’s reaction, or lack thereof.11

I will indicate, I took note that it was12

somewhere around one twenty-two, where he does mention13

something about, I talked to the people from the14

Twelfth Precinct, which, although he doesn’t indicate,15

specifically, what he’s talking about, any particular16

crimes, nor am I aware of any specific crimes. 17

It could have that connotation. I wouldn’t 18

have any issue with taking out that portion, where it19

says something about, I talked to people from the20

Twelfth Precinct.21

But I think the rest of it, him talking22

about, you gettin’ your hustle on, and again, this is23

just his take on it, while he -- and how he approaches24

this suspect.25

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THE COURT: In other words, you’re saying1

that this is just a tactic he’s -- an interrogation2

tactic he’s using to build up rapport, and get a3

statement from the defendant?4

MS. RUBIO: I believe so.5

THE COURT: Counsel, anything further?6

MR. HARRIS: It’s not relevant, Your Honor,7

none of that conversation’s relevant.8

THE COURT: I’m going to permit and -- with9

the exception that the reference to the Twelfth10

Precinct is to be deleted.11


Here’s the next section, starts at one13

twenty-nine, and that is -- looks like it’s about14

twenty minutes.15



MS. RUBIO: Oh, sorry.18

Okay. That’s right. That’s at one fift --19

MR. HARRIS: Judge, I think I made a mistake20

on this section. You’ll there that I talk about, they21

did not want the same thing. I think it continues a22

little bit further there, for Officer Detrick Mott says23

that to him.24

There are some things that are not relevant. 25

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The discussion of the Facebook, the discussion of 1

the -- that the Officer was not supposed to be in the2

building, and the contact with my client, in terms of3

him going to court, should not be heard, because it’s4

not relevant.5

THE COURT: What was the testimony about6

going to court?7

MS. RUBIO: I didn’t hear that.8

THE COURT: I didn’t hear it either.9

There, there was, I’m not sure if it was in10

this section or a prior section, I thought I, I may11

have heard something about court, but I wasn’t12

listening for that.13

MR. HARRIS: For some reason, Judge, I14

thought it was in this section.15

I could be wrong.16

Here, wait a minute. I have -- 17

THE COURT: Well, as it relates to this point18

in time, through this point in time, if the court was19

mentioned, it was something that was in passing, and I,20

I don’t, I don’t know what your objection would be.21

MR. HARRIS: Just went to court that day, is22

what my client said, at one fifty and zero seconds.23

MS. RUBIO: Let’s go back.24

Okay. Let’s start.25

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MS. RUBIO: The defendant himself says, I had3

just went to court that day.4

That is at one fifty and maybe three seconds.5


The Detective said, yesterday, that he saw7

him at a court. There was no discussion of what the8

court was.9

What’s the basis of the objection?10

MR. HARRIS: It’s not relevant, Your Honor. 11

Not relevant at all. And I don’t want --12

THE COURT: So, what, what’s the -- I don’t13

understand why -- there’s already been testimony that14

they met at a court, and parenthetically, there was --15

MR. HARRIS: But that --16

THE COURT: It was just at a court, and it --17

MR. HARRIS: One, that was --18

THE COURT: Why wouldn’t the jury assume that19

it was on this situ -- on this case?20

I mean, I don’t, I don’t really know.21

I don’t, I don’t see any prejudice to a, a22

passing reference, that they saw each other at a court.23

MR. HARRIS: Well, obviously, the jury can24

deduce, based on this statement, that it couldn’t have25

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been for a court hearing regarding this matter.1

MS. RUBIO: I just would submit that someone2

saying something about going to court, could be, he3

went for a traffic ticket, he went with his sister, 4

he -- it was his mom’s case.5

It could be a million different things.6

THE COURT: Yeah, and the Detective already7

testified, and I don’t know if you objected yesterday8

or not, but the jury has heard that the Detective had a9

communication with him, at a court.10

So, anyway, just to put that into context.11

MR. HARRIS: Still not relevant, regardless,12

it’s not relevant.13

THE COURT: Okay. 14

Anything else?15

MR. HARRIS: Nothing further, Your Honor.16


I don’t see anything objectionable to the18

period of time, one twenty-nine p.m. and twenty-five19

seconds through one fifty p.m. and fifty-five seconds.20

MS. RUBIO: The next point raised by counsel21

starts at one fifty-two point forty-nine, but he22

doesn’t indicate -- if -- is that just like a brief23

second, or is it --24

MR. HARRIS: It -- there -- it, it is a very25

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short window, where the Officer says, that the Dalona1

Terrance had a physical altercation, in that house.2

MS. RUBIO: Okay. 3

That’s one fifty-two what?4

MR. HARRIS: One fifty-two forty-nine.5

MS. RUBIO: Thank you.6



MR. HARRIS: Judge -- 9

MS. RUBIO: I’m sorry. 10

MR. HARRIS: Judge, all right, all right. 11

We’ll withdraw that objection.12

THE COURT: Okay. 13

MS. RUBIO: Now we go to one fifty-three and14

forty-five seconds, I think.15



MR. HARRIS: Judge, I’m gonna withdraw that,18

although I don’t want the colloquy about the truth test19

played. I don’t know that that is relevant, and I20

don’t know that it’s -- they’re not asking him a21

question.22

He says, let’s run the truth test. I don’t23

know what that means.24

MS. RUBIO: I would indicate, that was in25

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response to the defendant saying, run whatever test you1

want, I didn’t do this. 2

And then the Detective says, let’s run the3

truth test, meaning, tell me the truth, I don’t believe4

you, it’s obvious that the Detective doesn’t believe5

him.6

THE COURT: I don’t find anything7

objectionable to that line of questioning.8

MS. RUBIO: The next one is at one fifty-9

seven and thirty seconds.10



MS. RUBIO: That’s it, for that one, end at13

two o’, two o’one.14

THE COURT: The objection?15

MR. HARRIS: Relevance. The Officers talk16

about these other guys, and my client talked about17

these other guys.18

And excuse me, with the word, fucking Dalona.19

That’s not relevant here, and it shouldn’t be played,20

just out of pure respect for the woman.21

THE COURT: Go ahead, Ms. Rubio.22

MS. RUBIO: Your Honor, I, I believe that,23

actually, they ask him, I think they’re trying to24

establish if there is anyone else who could have done25

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this.1

And then the defendant, himself, says, none2

of those guys ever came to my home. That’s not true.3

MR. HARRIS: And the Officer says, one of ‘em4

fuckin’ her, something to that effect.5

MS. RUBIO: Askin’ a question.6

THE COURT: Well --7

MR. HARRIS: That’s not relevant.8

THE COURT: It’s very crude, to say the9

least, but in terms of a tactic of interrogation, the10

Court will overrule the objection.11

MS. RUBIO: The next one is at two o’two and12

forty-five seconds, going through two o’eight.13

THE COURT: Let me take a five minute break14

here.15

MS. RUBIO: Okay. 16



THE COURT: Okay. 19


16-001 -- excuse me, 235-FC, People versus Treshaun21

Terrance.22

Your appearances?23



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Treshaun Terrance, Your Honor.1

THE COURT: Okay. 2

MS. RUBIO: I think the next one that we were3

going to listen to is, starts at two o’two forty-five,4

is that correct, counsel?5


MS. RUBIO: Okay. 7



MS. RUBIO: So, Your Honor, the -- I assume10

Your Honor noticed, we just played two sections; the11

one from two o’eight forty-five to two o’eight and12

twenty seconds; and then by the time I realized, those13

other fifteen seconds had passed. Mr. Harris and I14

just said, let’s just play.15

So, then we played the two o’eight and forty-16

five seconds to the two sixteen and thirty seconds.17


MR. HARRIS: Yes, Judge. With regards to the19

two o’two to the two o’eight section, there are several20

issues here.21

One, there’s a hearsay, in terms of what22

Tyler, what -- that my repeated, Tyler told him, that23

the Dalona was -- died as a result of an aneurism. 24

There was discussion, I think, horrible25

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discussion by the Officers about Dalona suckin’1

somebody else’s dick, which I don’t think is relevant.2

And that somebody would fill in her spot,3

meaning, Tyler would fill in the spot, after her death.4

THE COURT: Those are questions, right?5

MR. HARRIS: They -- no, they were statements6

made.7

And, trying to read my own hand writing here,8

Your Honor.9

THE COURT: Well, here, here’s a question.10

Is there reference of his brother in prison11

relevant?12

MR. HARRIS: No.13

THE COURT: Ms. Rubio?14

MS. RUBIO: I don’t, I don’t think so.15

THE COURT: Okay. 16

Would you agree to take out the brother in17

prison statement?18

MS. RUBIO: I will, I was just -- do you know19

exactly where that was, Mr. Harris?20

MR. HARRIS: I --21

THE COURT: It’s, it’s somewhere in, I22

thought it was in the two o’eight to two sixteen part.23

MS. RUBIO: Okay. 24

THE COURT: I heard something about the other25

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case involving a gun, pointing a gun. 1

MS. RUBIO: I was --2

THE COURT: About him having a case.3

And he had a case involving domestic4

violence. Is that relevant?5

MS. RUBIO: I didn’t hear anything about the6

defendant having a case for domestic violence. I can7

indicate he does not, or did not.8

However, there is a portions from two o’six,9

approximately thirty-three, to two o’seven,10

approximately twenty-five, in which there is11

conversation about the defendant’s other case, that I12

could take out.13

MR. HARRIS: He says, at two o’five point two14

five, when I was locked up.15

MS. RUBIO: Well, I -- that, I believe, is16

different. The defendant just randomly volunteers that17

information, when I was locked up. 18

That could be for anything, but obviously,19

that’s in the court’s discretion. That was the20

defendant’s own statement.21

THE COURT: Yeah, the, the references to22

being locked up, to having a case, the other case23

regarding a gun, pointing a gun, should all be taken24

out, as well as the brother, prison -- the brother in25

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prison.1

And I have a note here, there was a reference2

to locked up when, somebody was kicked out of Section3

8. Maybe that’s all in the same --4

MR. HARRIS: Yeah, that’s --5

MS. RUBIO: I didn’t hear that.6

MR. HARRIS: What did I say, two o’five, when7

I -- two, at two o’five twenty-five, Your Honor. 8

That’s what I’m referring to, when he says, when I was9

locked up, I didn’t think should be in there.10

THE COURT: So, the brother in prison, locked11

up, or -- and it was in the context of being kicked out12

of Section 8, the other case involving a gun, and13

pointing a gun.14

And then whatever discussion there is about15

having a case, should be stricken.16

That’s what I heard, that I thought was17

worthy of being stricken.18

MS. RUBIO: I agree.19

MR. HARRIS: Your Honor, with regards to this20

next section two o’eight forty-six to two sixteen21

thirty, the discussion of the mama havin’ a boyfriend,22

and niggers pull up to my grandmother’s house to visit,23

allegedly visit the mom, I don’t think should be -- is24

not relevant, and shouldn’t be included.25

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The discussion about being raised by a single1

woman, and being abandoned, in a fatherless community,2

by Det -- by Officer Detrick, I think should be3

removed, and -- as both of them not being relevant to4

this case.5

MS. RUBIO: Your Honor, may I?6

THE COURT: Yeah.7

MS. RUBIO: I would just indicate that,8

obviously, the Court is aware that that we’re not9

watching the video, in its entirety.10

And so, some of this is a little bit out of11

context.12

The statements that the defendant uses, and13

brings up his own mother, I would indicate, is relevant14

in response to the Officers indicating that he has no15

concern about Ms. Tillman being with other men.16

At, at a point earlier in the video, that17

Your Honor did not hear, Mr. Terrance indicates that18

Ms. Tillman was, in fact, with other men.19

So, I think that that is relevant.20

Obviously, the idea being that that’s21

ludicrous, that you don’t care that your own22

girlfriend, who you lived with, would be with be23

someone, would be with someone else.24

So, I think it sort of puts it in context.25

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MR. HARRIS: Well, it puts it in context. I1

still don’t think that it’s relevant.2

THE COURT: Well, I’m only ordering that3

those parts I’ve already mentioned be stricken.4

MR. HARRIS: Well, Judge, the parts that you,5

you already mentioned were in two o’two, and two -- to6

two o’eight.7

I move to two o’eight to two sixteen.8

THE COURT: Okay. 9

My notes were just, I didn’t separate them.10

MR. HARRIS: Oh, okay. So, you didn’t11

separate them.12

THE COURT: So, I can’t even tell what time13

it was.14

MR. HARRIS: I apologize.15

In two o’eight to two sixteen, Mr. Terrance16

refers to his mother having a boyfriend, and have17

niggers pull up to my grandmother’s house, while she18

visit -- while these other guys come and pick, pick her19

up.20

That, that was in the area of two o’eight to21

two sixteen, and I’d like that to be stricken, as being22

not relevant.23

THE COURT: And Ms. Rubio, you addressed24

that, saying that it was referenced in another part of25

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the, the interview?1


THE COURT: Okay. 3

We’re gonna keep that in. 4

I have to bring this up, now.5

It’s four o’clock. 6

MS. RUBIO: Oh.7

THE COURT: I want to keep going, if8

possible.9

MS. RUBIO: Yes.10

THE COURT: Can -- are -- Mr. Terrance,11

Deputy, you’ve got to get them back?12

Can we continue this without your client’s13

presence?14

MR. HARRIS: Would you swear my client, Your15

Honor?16

THE COURT: Sure.17

Sir, can you tell me your name?18

DEFENDANT: Treshaun Terrance.19

THE COURT: Can you raise your right hand for20

me?21




DEFENDANT: Yes.25

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THE COURT: Okay. 1

Mr. Harris, you have some questions for your2

client?3

MR. HARRIS: Mr. Terrance, you understand4

that we have been going through you interview, all5

afternoon, the Judge, myself, and the Prosecutor,6

correct?7

DEFENDANT: Correct.8

MR. HARRIS: And it’s been recorded through9

this court hearing, correct?10


MR. HARRIS: And I’ve identified some areas12

that I’m gonna ask the Court to exclude, from being13

presented to the jury. You understand that?14

DEFENDANT: Yes.15

MR. HARRIS: We are at a point where you have16

to be returned to the jail, but we’ve got probably,17

one, two, three, four, five, six --18

MS. RUBIO: Another hour.19

MR. HARRIS: Six sections, probably another20

hour, to go.21

Would you have any objection to us22

continuing, and finishing this, without you being23

present, because you have to be returned back to the24

jail?25

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DEFENDANT: No, sir. 1


Judge, I leave him for voir dire for you.3

THE COURT: I, I don’t have any further4

questions.5

All right. 6

Deputy, you can take him back.7

We will see you tomorrow.8

(Whereupon the Defendant is taken out of the9

courtroom).10

MS. RUBIO: The next one is --11

THE COURT: I’m ready when you are.12

MS. RUBIO: Okay. The next one is at two13

seventeen fifty-five, on page two.14



MR. HARRIS: Hold it.17

The commentary by Officer Detrick, about, I18

think he should regret killing the girl, I don’t see19

how that could that -- one, it’s not relevant; and two,20

that’s -- I don’t even see how you could -- it’s a21

statement made without any kind of investigative tenet22

to it.23

And I would ask that that be stricken.24


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MS. RUBIO: The entire purpose, everything,1

every statement made, in this three hour interrogation,2

is in -- with the idea to elicit what the -- to elicit3

truth from the defendant, elicit statements from the --4

THE COURT: In the context of that statement,5

isn’t that just a gratuitous --6

MR. HARRIS: Remark.7

THE COURT: Statement by your -- which,8

whichever Detective was -- made it?9

MS. RUBIO: I’m, I mean, I’m not certain,10

‘cause we cut it off, so I’d have to hear the, hear the11

rest of what was said after that, but --12

THE COURT: I, I don’t -- I don’t find that13

that was any part of a interrogation technique, but14

rather just a gratuitous statement.15

So, I’m gonna order that that be stricken.16

MS. RUBIO: Next is two nineteen and ten17

seconds.18




MR. HARRIS: Judge, Officer Detrick says this22

word, not kill her.23

And I also don’t think that that is in the24

response of trying to get an investigation. I think25

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it’s another one of his gratuitous remarks.1

THE COURT: Okay. 2

I’m gonna disagree with you on that. That3

statement is in.4

MS. RUBIO: And the next is the two nineteen5

and fifty-five seconds.6



MR. HARRIS: Judge, I think that the only9

thing -- I withdraw this, with the exception of the10

discussion of, I think that you’re an inexperienced kid11

trying to pull the wool over my eyes.12

I think that should be eliminated.13

But the rest of it, I think, should stay in.14


MS. RUBIO: I think it’s just, it’s just part16

of the conversation.17

THE COURT: As do I.18

I’m gonna keep it in.19

MS. RUBIO: And then the next is two twenty-20

two fifty-nine, and it’s about five minutes.21

THE COURT: And Mr. Harris, I should pay22

attention to the context where the word, warrant, is23

being used?24


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THE COURT: Okay. 1



MR. HARRIS: I want to include, Judge, I4

think I, I overstepped my bounds a little bit.5

The last question, about were you angry, I6

want to keep that, because his answer was, about his 7

girlfriend coming to the door.8

THE COURT: Well, if you’re not objecting to9

it, you don’t have to explain to me why.10


THE COURT: So, that, that’ll stay in.12

MR. HARRIS: But there are a couple of 13

things --14

THE COURT: I am concerned about the15

discussion about court dates, I could have arrested16

you. You had warrants.17

He said, he didn’t have warrants.18

And a discussion about tickets.19

And the issue of his real name.20

Is that relevant?21

MS. RUBIO: The real name is very relevant. 22

I’ll tell you why.23

Let me -- but I just wanted to start,24

chronologically.25

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There’s something that is literally about, I1

heard it, as two or three seconds, talking about, I2

think what Mr. Terrance meant, was probably that, I’m3

guessing, that he might have been a person of interest4

in a previous case. I think that should be redacted,5

and I’m sorry, I didn’t -- that was very fast, so I6

never caught it the first time.7

That, to me, should be out, obviously.8

THE COURT: Mr. Harris doesn’t disagree?9

MR. HARRIS: No objection, because I want it10

out, too.11

MS. RUBIO: Then there is reference to, yes,12

warrants, and I think that his name, this could cut a13

couple different ways.14

When Officer Johnson testified, already, that15

the defendant, when he was first arrested, for this16

crime, when they stopped him, he gave a different name.17

I think that the trier of fact can listen to18

that, and decide why they think he was giving a19

different name. Because he was trying to evade being20

arrested for this case? Or it’s possible that he gave21

a different, and a lot of people do this, because he22

had some kind of warrant out, and didn’t want to get23

arrested, and he didn’t know why the Police were24

stopping him.25

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If -- frankly, I would leave that up to1

defense counsel, obviously, and the Court, as to2

whether or not you want that in.3

As far as him giving another name, I think4

that should stay in, it’s already been testified to.5

MR. HARRIS: Judge, I think what can happen6

is, I’d like to, to keep that out, about the name. 7

The Prosecutor can argue, and I hadn’t8

objected, that he gave another name the night when he9

was arrested.10

And she can make that argument.11

But, with him saying, he always gives the12

Police a different name when they stop him. I don’t13

think that that’s relevant.14

MS. RUBIO: He’s the one who said it.15

MR. HARRIS: I know he said it, but I don’t16

think it’s relevant.17

THE COURT: Well, I think it’s permissible to18

keep in, this statement about him giving, always giving19

the incorrect name.20

I do think that testimony should be redacted21

that deals with, he’s got warrants and court dates.22

And I can’t tell you, specifically, what the23

discussion was, but that discussion about warrants,24

court dates --25

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MR. HARRIS: And homicide, Judge?1

MS. RUBIO: We already discussed that.2

MR. HARRIS: Oh, yeah, that’s right.3

THE COURT: All right?4

MS. RUBIO: Yes, Your Honor. 5

The next section is two thirty-two to two6

fifty-two. So, it’s about twenty minutes.7

THE COURT: What should I be paying attention8

to?9

MR. HARRIS: They’ll talk about Dalona bein’10

like her -- like his mama, she’s a cancer. They’ll11

talk about the fact that these women are cancer, and12

that they’re emotional, and all of that, fascinated13

with astrology.14

The Officer goes back to, this is what15

happens in our community.16

THE COURT: Okay. 17

MR. HARRIS: They talk about, if this wasn’t18

a classic case of denial.19

We go to two fifty-two.20

They ask, and I know the Court should pay21

close attention to this: They ask Mr. Terrance, what22

do you think should happen to a person that killed23

someone?24

Obviously, that is not relevant, in terms of25

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what he thinks should happen.1

THE COURT: Okay. 2

Miss Rubio, go ahead.3

MS. RUBIO: Two thirty-two and what?4

MR. HARRIS: Two thirty-two -- two thirty-two5

and zero zero.6

MS. RUBIO: Okay. 7




MR. HARRIS: There’s a reference to the11

Officer, I believe Officer Moses, talking Moses,12

talking about the E.M.S. -- no --13

MS. RUBIO: Detective --14

MR. HARRIS: No, who’s this Officer?15

MS. RUBIO: Mason.16

MR. HARRIS: Mason, I’m sorry.17

Officer Mason -- sorry, Officer Mason.18

Officer Mason saying, that he spoke to the19

E.M.S., and the antennas went up.20

There was a discussion of, of my client, and21

Detrick, talking about each other, being cowards.22

Detrick says, which I don’t think is23

relevant, Detrick says, the joker in the room is you.24

They talk about, Detrick also said that there25

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was two years worth of bruises on Dalona’s body. And1

there’s no evidence of that.2

And that, I don’t think it -- it, it’s3

disingenuous to the jury, in terms of, there’s no4

evidence that supports that.5

He talked about this whole business of6

fatherless communities again, and, and saying that my7

client was a man girl.8

He responded to this straight -- he made,9

Detrick made a statement of my client being straight10

blooded, cold blooded killer.11

Foregone conclusion that most people in the12

community think you killed her. That’s not relevant.13

And that whole business of Facebook pages, I14

think should be eliminated.15

And even Detrick said that, that whole point16

of the astrology, and this whole Facebook business is,17

is a moot point, which I agree.18

I’d ask that it all be stricken.19

THE COURT: Go ahead.20

MS. RUBIO: Well, I’ll indicate that my take21

on the astrology, was that it was the defendant who was22

saying, his mother and the deceased shared the same23

birthday, and thus, are and were both cancers, meaning24

the astrological sign of cancer.25

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And then goes on to make various statements1

about what that means.2

He -- and that is also, he also talks about3

telling the Officers to look up Gemini, what, what that4

means.5

So, he’s the one who brings all that up.6

THE COURT: Isn’t this all just a, a manner7

of utilizing, and trying to manipulate the defendant in8

their interrogation techniques, to try to get him to9

address the relevant issue here.10

MS. RUBIO: Yes. I, I would submit that it,11

it definitely is. It’s, again, an interrogation12

tactic.13

THE COURT: I, I agree, and, and Mr. Harris,14

though you protected the record, I disagree, and I’m15

not going to strike those parts that you requested.16

MS. RUBIO: And I think there’s one more17

section, that starts at two fifty-three thirty-five. I18

think that’s the last section at issue.19

MR. HARRIS: Judge, if I might, I think it20

was helpful the last time, and probably should be21

helpful to you this time, before we start it.22

These are the areas that I would ask the23

Court to pay attention to.24

Mr. Terrance invokes God, and they talk about25

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a colloquy, with regards to, you know, who’s Christian,1

and who’s not Christian, and I thought that that’s2

relevant.3

The Officer talks about Mr. Terrance saying4

that the, that the Police are always to blame for5

various things that go on. 6

And I don’t think that that’s relevant.7

THE COURT: Is that his statement? He says8

that?9

MR. HARRIS: That’s a Police statement, yes.10

Officer says, I know what your type of11

element will do.12

Well, that whole type of element business is,13

I think, one, disingenuous; and two, not relevant.14

But I think it’s used to demean Mr. Terrance,15

and, and, and is not used in terms of trying to elicit16

any information from him, with regards to this17

particular murder.18

Then there is a reference, and the -- kind of19

an interesting comments.20

My client, I think, refers to an individual21

by the name of Trick Trick. 22

He supposedly, based on what I’ve learned23

from this video, today, this video that you’re looking24

at, he is allegedly a rapper, and they go into a25

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diatribe about this. And I don’t think that anything1

with regards to this man, Trick Trick, should come in.2

I know, I recall my client saying that Trick3

Trick doesn’t let everybody come into the City of4

Detroit to do whatever they do, in terms of their5

workings in the City of Detroit, with regards to rap,6

and that. 7

So, I’d ask the Court to pay particular8

attention to that.9




MS. RUBIO: I think that’s it.13

MR. HARRIS: Yeah, I think so.14

MS. RUBIO: Okay. 15

MR. HARRIS: Judge, I don’t think that that 16

conversation about my client, or anybody, would be17

regarding this black on black crime, and that whole18

colloquy that took place after that, with regards to19

rap, and Trick Trick, is relevant.20

I don’t think that will help the jury’s21

determination, the elements of this particular case.22

That --23

THE COURT: I’m, I’m going to strike the24

testimony, the dialogue --25

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MR. HARRIS: Okay. 1

THE COURT: That begins where he says,2

something like, where he mentions he’s a rapper, too.3

MR. HARRIS: Okay. 4

THE COURT: And then I’m going to strike it,5

we’re going to continue to strike the discussion about6

Trick Trick. All of that is just a waste of time, up7

until the point where he says, that he’s intelligent,8

and he’s got a twelfth grade reading. Then we get back9

on track.10

So, I’m gonna keep that, through the end.11


MS. RUBIO: May I just make a record, Your13

Honor.14

THE COURT: You can, but do you --15

MS. RUBIO: Oh.16

THE COURT: Do you understand where I’m,17

where I’m --18

MS. RUBIO: From the moment that, that the19

defendant says, he’s a rapper, out -- until he says,20

I’m sorry, what did you say, again?21

THE COURT: Something like --22

MR. HARRIS: Six years old and has a twelfth23

grade education -- twelfth grade reading.24

THE COURT: Where he brings up, he’s got a25

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twelfth grade reading level. That is appropriate. So,1

I would keep the -- everything between those two points2

of reference, out.3

So, it is -- he does say he’s got a twelfth4

grade reading level. That’s fine.5

And thereafter is fine.6

MS. RUBIO: Okay. 7

I just would indicate that, I feel that it’s8

relevant because he is -- in its totality, the whole9

section, because the defendant, it is very poignant,10

because the defendant is being interrogated as, after11

having been arrested for the murder of his girlfriend,12

and he, of his own volition, the, the Detectives don’t13

bring this up, decides that it is an important and good14

time to sit and talk about the fact that he’s a rapper,15

and that he knows some guy named Trick Trick. 16

I think that is something that the trier of17

fact should be able to evaluate, in deciding whether or18

not they think that that’s the -- in, in deciding his19

credibility, as they do assess every witness’s20

credibility.21

THE COURT: Okay. 22

Well, I’ve made my ruling.23


THE COURT: Is that it for the day?25

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MR. HARRIS: That’s it for the day, Judge.1

MS. RUBIO: I -- it’s it for the day, as far2

as that, but I just wanted to tell Your Honor kind of3

what I’m thinking, and see what Your Honor thinks.4

Obviously, the Court can see it’s five5

o’clock. I’m on a Board, and I have a Board meeting. 6

I need to leave immediately.7

THE COURT: Sure.8

MS. RUBIO: So, I won’t be able to stay after9

work. 10

And frankly, unfortunately, even if I could11

stay late tonight, I’m embarrassed to admit, I’m not12

very tech savvy. I will need the help of someone 13

else --14

THE COURT: Tell me what you want?15

MS. RUBIO: What I want, what I’m thinking,16

is that we’ll start in the morning, back with the17

Officer in charge, where we left off.18

We do have some questioning that we can get19

into. I can play the 9-1-1 call.20

I am hoping, when I get here in the morning,21

I can beg someone to help me, and work on this, while22

I’m here.23

However, I don’t have, you know, my own24

staff. 25

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So, I, I’m really hoping that that can1

happen, but I’m just saying, I might need a, a brief2

break before -- I want to be able to stop at some3

point, and then find out what’s going on with the4

video, and then come back.5

Now, it’s possible, I could come in in the6

morning, and someone can work all of -- off - on all of7

this for me, and then it will be seamless. They’ll8

bring it in.9

But the issue is, and I’m not sure how Your10

Honor or counsel would feel about it, that would mean11

that, what I would be doing is, and trusting someone12

else, a tech person, to go through all the notes that I13

just took, from everything that Your Honor has14

indicated, that should be stricken, I’d be putting it15

on a disk, and then we’d all be seeing it for the first16

time, as it plays.17

So, I don’t know how counsel feel about that,18

or, or what any, what anybody suggests.19

THE COURT: Okay. 20

Can you just hit a, a mute button, while that21

is being -- while the disk is -- that we just watched,22

is being played?23

MS. RUBIO: Uhm, instead of -- I’m sorry.24

THE COURT: And what -- we don’t have a25

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transcript, though.1

MS. RUBIO: And instead of cutting portions2

out, I -- I could -- I, I think I could. I’m not --3

usually we’ll, we’ll redact portions out, entirely. 4

But I think I could probably hit mute, and then -- what5

do you think, counsel? Is that okay to you, or what6

were your thoughts?7

THE COURT: Well, why don’t you both think8

about the most efficient way of doing this.9

MS. RUBIO: Yes. Okay. Thank you. 10

THE COURT: And we’ll take it up in the11

morning.12

The jury’s gonna be here at nine. Can we be13

here at eight thirty?14

MR. HARRIS: We can.15

THE COURT: Maybe you can, maybe you can get16

a -- somebody that’s more tech savvy, and get their17

input, at that time.18



All right. 21

We will see you tomorrow.22

MR. HARRIS: Judge, I won’t have the name 23

of --24

THE COURT: What, we’ll fax him a letter, if25

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you, if you have his name, and fax number?1

Can I -- thank you, Deputy.2

MS. RUBIO: Okay. 3

(Whereupon the proceedings were concluded for4

the day at 5:03 p.m.)5

- - -6

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(Jury Trial).


Dated:________________________

Detroit, Michigan



Suzanne Kinsey

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-vs- Case No. 16-01235


Defendant. /

JURY TRIAL


Tuesday - May 17, 2016

APPEARANCES:




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C O N T E N T S

Page

May 17, 2016................................... 4

Jury Trial

WITNESSES:

RYAN MASON (Recalled)Voir Direct Examination Continuing by Mr. Harris 13Direct Examination Continuing by Ms. Rubio 16Cross-Examination by Mr. Harris 52

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E X H I B I T S

Marked Admitted

People’s Proposed Exhibit No. 3(Constitutional Rights Form) 9

People’s Proposed Exhibit No. 9(Interrogation Video) 6

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May 17, 20161

Detroit, Michigan2


THE COURT: Okay. 4



Your appearances?7



Harris on behalf of Mr. Terrance, who is to my left.10

THE COURT: Okay. 11

We have a jury ready.12

Do we have anything further to take up before13

we bring the jury back?14

MS. RUBIO: Two quick things.15

One, I just wanted to advise the Court that I16

have spoken to, sort of our tech person, in our unit,17

and she has indicated that this video, there’s no way18

to, technically, redact it, as in, snip portions out.19

So, I think Your Honor had suggested, you20

know, us muting, at the appropriate sections.21

So, what I have her doing, right now, is22

upstairs, I had taken notes as to what I thought the23

times were, but I asked her if she could go through24

those sections, and just double check the times.25

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And then, obviously, when we play it, I’ll1

have to stand there and mute, each time.2

But I want to make sure I have the, the times3

correct.4

So, she’s checking that.5

And I feel like we have -- we still have the6

Officer in charge, and other questions that we can ask7

him.8

So, I think that the -- we’ll be able to9

make, to make use of our time, that way.10

THE COURT: Okay. 11

MS. RUBIO: I also wanted to, then, now, move12

for the admission of People’s No. 9, which would be the13

interrogation, but I have a question, now that I’m14

about to do that:15

If, since we’re not able to clip sections16

out, then I’m thinking, normally, I know I’m getting17

ahead of myself, but with the particular exhibit, we18

won’t be able to send it back, by itself, with the19

jury, later, if they ask for that exhibit.20

I think we have to play it for them.21

THE COURT: I, I thought the same thing.22

Mr. Harris, do you have anything to say?23

MR. HARRIS: Your Honor, I agree with both of24

you.25

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THE COURT: Okay. 1

I’m, I’m not tech whiz, but I, I think, under2

the circumstances, we have no choice, other than to3

mute the areas of the video where -- pursuant to my4

order, yesterday.5

And I suppose we will jump off the bridge6

when we get to it, should the jury want to --7

MS. RUBIO: Yes.8

THE COURT: See, see the video, while they’re9

deliberating.10

MS. RUBIO: So, with those caveats, then the11

People would move for the admission of People’s No. 9.12

MR. HARRIS: Your Honor, with the exceptions,13

with the exceptions of what the Court has agreed, or14

has indicated muting, from this video, we have no15

objection to the admission of it.16

THE COURT: Okay. 17

MS. RUBIO: And then, another thing --18

THE COURT: And of course, your objections19

have been preserved.20

Do we want to deal with No. 9 -- No. 8, now,21

which I wrote down as the 9-1-1 call?22

MS. RUBIO: Oh, yes. I, I am gonna play it. 23

I know that I already moved for its admission, but I24

wasn’t sure --25

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THE COURT: Oh, I think you did. I’m sorry,1

I’m re -- reviewing my note -- Mr. Harris, we did --2

MR. HARRIS: Yeah, we did admit it, Your3

Honor.4

THE COURT: Okay. 5

MR. HARRIS: I didn’t have any objections.6

MS. RUBIO: The only one I’m unsure of, is, I7

have marked as People’s Exhibit No. 3, and I know that8

we were in the midst of counsel cross-examining the,9

the witness, Officer Mason, about it, but I don’t know10

if it was admitted, People’s Exhibit No. 3.11

THE COURT: My notes don’t reflect that it12

was.13

MR. HARRIS: Mine don’t either, Judge.14

MS. RUBIO: Okay. So, we’ll deal with that,15

still.16

MR. HARRIS: You want to --17

MS. RUBIO: Oh, we can? Okay. 18

Then the People would move for the admission19

of People’s No. 3, which is the Constitutional Rights20

Certificate of Notification.21



So --24

MS. RUBIO: Uhm --25

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THE COURT: Now, just for clarity, Exhibits 11

through 9 have been received into evidence, by2

agreement of the parties.3

MS. RUBIO: Yes, Your Honor. 4

And I’m sorry, lastly, I would just ask that,5

obviously it’s up, up to Your Honor how to handle it.6

My suggestion would be, prior to us playing7

the Interrogation video, that there be some kind of a,8

explanation to the jury, that there have been -- as to9

why we’re -- why there’s certain things that are being10

muted. I don’t know exactly how Your Honor would want11

to word that, but, obviously, they’re gonna wonder, but12

there just be things that are not admissible in court,13

or something of that nature.14

THE COURT: Okay. 15

Mr. Harris?16

MR. HARRIS: I leave it to the Court’s17

discretion.18

THE COURT: I, I’m inclined just to say that19

we are about to play an audio tape for you. It is20

close to three hours in length. We will take a break,21

probably half way through it.22

And I’m going to indicate that you may note23

that some parts of the audio have been muted for24

periods of time. You’re not to concern yourself with25

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why those portions have been muted.1

MS. RUBIO: Oh, perfect.2

MR. HARRIS: That’s perfect, Your Honor.3

MS. RUBIO: Better than I would have thought4

of.5

And I’m sorry, just one last thing, for6

efficiency purposes.7

I wanted to ask Your Honor, and I know it is8

within Your Honor’s discretion, pursuant to, I think9

it’s MRE 611, my, my suggestion is, because this video10

is so long, and because we have all had the11

opportunity, yesterday, to observe it, outside of the12

presence of, of the jury, my suggestion was that the --13

we continue with the Officer in charge, now. 14

Obviously, counsel is still voir diring, as15

to the Rights form.16

But then after that, I’ll, I’ll do direct.17

I’m -- I have a series of questions I want to18

ask him, basically, about the video.19

And then counsel, my suggestion is that20

counsel do cross, about whatever issues, obviously he21

wants.22

And then, and then we play the video, because23

it’s three hours long.24

MR. HARRIS: Judge, I would prefer to cross-25

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examine the Officer, after the video.1

THE COURT: Okay --2

MR. HARRIS: There’s some things within the3

video that I’d like the jury to see, and then cross-4

examine.5

THE COURT: Okay. 6

MS. RUBIO: That’s up to Your Honor.7

THE COURT: Well, I, I have no problem with8

Mr. Harris saving his cross-examination until,9

subsequent to the playing of the tape.10

MS. RUBIO: Okay. Thank you. 11

THE COURT: Anything else before we bring in12

our jury?13

MS. RUBIO: No, Your Honor.14



MR. HARRIS: Oh, Your -- let me ask one quick17

question, before we -- 18


record). 20

THE COURT: You know, nothing that has been21

stricken, in my memory, was very long. I don’t even22

think anything that was ever stricken was even as long23

as a minute, or maybe five at the most, I’m thinking.24

MR. HARRIS: Yeah, as I think about it,25

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you’re right.1

MS. RUBIO: It --2

THE COURT: So, I -- recognizing the3

temperamental nature of the machine --4

MR. HARRIS: Right.5

THE COURT: If there’s a five minute pause,6

that, at least that’s --7

MR. HARRIS: Okay. 8

THE COURT: Gonna be consistent with what the9

Court ruled.10

So --11

MR. HARRIS: Okay. No problem.12

MS. RUBIO: I appreciate that.13

THE COURT: I’m, I’m a little afraid of fast14

forwarding, and then messing up.15

MR. HARRIS: I, I think the only that --16

never mind. That’s, we’ll, we’ll just deal with it in17

the way she wants to do it.18

THE COURT: Okay. 19

Let’s bring out the jury.20



(Whereupon the jury was brought into the23

courtroom).24


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THE COURT: Calling case number 16-001235-FC,1

People versus Treshaun Terrance.2

MS. RUBIO: Good morning. Mary Rubio for the3

People.4

MR. HARRIS: Good morning, Your Honor, good5

morning, ladies and gentlemen of the jury. Wyatt6

Harris on behalf of Treshaun Terrance.7

THE COURT: Okay. 8

Good morning, ladies and gentlemen.9

We are going to continue, at this time.10

Attorney Rubio?11

MS. RUBIO: I believe --12

THE COURT: Is it you or Mr. Harris?13

MR. HARRIS: It’s me, Your Honor.14

MS. RUBIO: I just believe that Detective --15

the Officer in charge was on the stand, and Mr. Harris16

was in the process of questioning.17

THE COURT: Okay. 18

Go ahead.19

R Y A N M A S O N20

Recalled as a witness and having been first duly sworn by21

the Court, was examined, and testified as follows: 22

THE COURT: Sir, can you tell us your name,23

one more time?24

WITNESS: Detective Ryan Mason.25

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WITNESS: Yes, sir.5

THE COURT: Please have a seat.6

Go ahead, counsel.7

MR. HARRIS: Thank you, Your Honor.8

VOIR DIRE EXAMINATION9

CONTINUING BY MR. HARRIS: 10

Q Good morning, Detective.11

A Good morning, sir.12

Q Detective Mason, the Constitutional Rights and13

Certificate of Notification form, Exhibit 3, that has14

been admitted, line number three states: I have the15

right to have an attorney, in parentheses, lawyer,16

present before and during the time I answer any17

questions, or make any statements.18

And as you well know, Mr. Treshaun Terrance19

initialed that, correct?20

A Yes, sir.21

Q And he was asked, did he understand that particular22

statement, correct?23

A Yes, sir.24

Q And his initials, would you agree with me, that his25

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initials indicated that he understood that?1

A Yes.2

Q And that’s why you had him initial?3

A Yes.4

Q Okay. Now, before any questions were put to him5

regarding the substance of the reason he was here --6

there, did you specifically say, do you want a lawyer?7

A No.8

Q Okay. Did Detective Detrick Mott, is it?9


Q He was present, right? Pardon?11

A Detrick Mott.12

Q Detrick Mott. Did he ask Mr. Terrance if he wanted a13

lawyer?14

A No, sir. 15

Q Now, then, the interview then proceeds with various16

questions, correct?17

A Correct.18

Q And at some point, after questions have been answered,19

did you ask Treshaun if he wanted a lawyer?20

A No.21

Q Did Detrick Mott ask Treshaun if he wanted a lawyer?22

A Further, towards the end of the interview, your client23

mentioned, lawyer. He said, lawyer, and then that’s24

when my partner, Detrick Mott, brought a lawyer.25

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Q Did he say, lawyer, at number three?1

A Your client, or --2

Q Yes.3

A My partner?4

Q You had him read the Constitutional Rights form,5

correct?6

A Yes.7

Q And in that line, it says, attorneys, in parentheses,8

lawyer, correct?9

A It does, but he did not request that one be present.10

Q Well, But you, you are now saying, though, you’re11

telling this jury, that he said the word, lawyer, after12

this particular interview, and that’s all he said was,13

lawyer, right? The word, lawyer, correct?14

A Correct.15

Q And then, at that point in time, Detrick Mott asked him16

if he wanted a lawyer, correct?17

A Correct.18

Q But he did say, lawyer, earlier, before he was even19

asked any questions, correct?20

A Correct, would you like me to explain?21

MR. HARRIS: No. No further questions, Your22

Honor.23

THE COURT: Okay. 24

Miss Rubio?25

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MS. RUBIO: Just a follow up on that.1

Well, actually, I would just ask that, is2

counsel satisfied. 3

I think we had left --4

MR. HARRIS: Oh, Your Honor, I apologize. 5

Yes, I am satisfied with the voir dire, and I leave it6

to the Court’s discretion, with regards to his taking7

of the rights, and what his rights were.8

THE COURT: Okay. 9

You may continue.10



CONTINUING BY MS. RUBIO:13

Q Just a follow up on some of the, those questions.14

As far as, is there a, a particular process,15

or procedure, that is followed by the Detroit Police16

Department, as to how to, how to read the rights, to a17

defendant?18

A There are -- excuse me. There are instructions on the19

back of this particular form, that we generally follow. 20

We have them read them out, and then initial.21

Q Okay. And after -- and there’s already been testimony22

that you -- that the rights are read out loud; and then23

after the rights are read out loud, you have, in this24

case, you have the defendant in this case, that being25

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Treshaun Terrance, initial next to each right?1

A Yes, ma’am.2

Q Okay. And I believe you, you testified a moment ago3

that you have the defendant initial next to each right,4

indicating that he understood?5

A Correct.6

Q Okay. That he understood each right, correct?7

A Correct.8

Q All right. Are, are you required, then, to, after that9

happens, to go to explain, in painstaking terms, what10

every word means on the form?11

A Not at all.12

Q Oh --13

A That’s why Detrick Mott aksed if he understood, after14

every --15

Q Okay. And in -- then after you went over the initial16

rights, did the defendant say to you, I want a lawyer?17

A No, not at all.18

Q Okay. At any point, during this three hour19

interrogation, did the defendant say, hey, I want a20

lawyer?21

A No.22

Q Okay. What if a defendant does say, I want a lawyer?23

A At that point, you cut off every line of questioning,24

and the interview is over, at that point.25

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Q Okay. Did this defendant seem, at all, developmentally1

disabled?2

A No.3

Q Okay. Is there a particular policy in the Detroit4

Police Department, in the Homicide Division, regarding5

the video recording of statements?6

A That every interview, with a in custody prisoner, be7

video taped.8

Q Okay. Are you required to advise a defendant that that9

person is being video taped?10

A No.11

Q And in fact, was, was this particular interview, or12

interrogation of the defendant, video taped?13

A Yes, ma’am.14

Q Okay. And once you are com -- done with the interview,15

is there an actual disk, or tape, that’s created?16

A Yes.17

Q Okay. And do you, as the Officer in charge, do18

something with that?19

A After we complete the interview, after I get back to20

the Homicide base, I’m able to actually down load the21

video, onto a D.V.D. 22

That D.V.D. is then entered into a, the23

number, is then entered into our reporting system,24

which is the Crisnet reporting system, and also into25

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our evidence tracker system, that you heard one of the1

Techs speak about earlier.2

After that, we enter that into both of those3

systems, then a report is generated.4

Q You said, a report is generated?5

A Yes.6

Q So, basically, to break it down, does -- that means7

that you created a Police report, indicating what you8

just said, that you created a, a video?9

A Yes.10

Q Okay. 11

A Simply for chain of custody.12

Q I’m sorry?13

A Simply for --14

THE COURT: Can you speak louder, sir?15

WITNESS: Yes, sir. I’m sorry, I got a cold.16

Simply for chain of custody issues.17

Q (By Ms. Rubio): Okay. Just kind of back tracking, for18

a minute. I know we’ve been speaking a, for a little19

bit, regarding this interrogation of the defendant.20

But I kind of want to back track for a21

minute.22

As the Officer in charge, did -- was there23

any other evidence that you collected, that, that we24

haven’t discussed so far, in relation to the defendant?25

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A The D.V.D., as well as a buccal swab, which is the swab1

where I have to swab the inside of the defendant’s2

swab, for testing against other evidence collected,3

within the case.4

Q Okay. And in addition to that, is the Officer in5

charge in any case, when you investigate the case, do6

you -- is it your job, or someone else’s job, to see7

whether there were any 9-1-1 calls made?8

A Yes, right at the beginning of every case, I go through9

all the reports, and any other necessary evidence. 10

And in this case, there were 9-1-1 calls, a11

9-1-1 call that was made.12

Q Okay. And then, when you found that out, then what do13

you do?14

A I then requested those be downloaded onto a D.V.D. And15

then I get those calls, or I, I request that they be16

sent from our headquarters, to my e-mail. And then I17

then download those 9-1-1 calls.18

Q Okay. And in this case, you said there was just one?19

A Yeah, I believe so.20

Q Okay. 21

MS. RUBIO: At this time, the People -- we,22

we already have admitted People’s Exhibit No. 8, and23

the People would like to play People’s 8.24


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MR. HARRIS: No objection, with the1

exception, with the objection to the stipulation.2

THE COURT: Okay. 3

MS. RUBIO: I’m sorry, this was just the 4

9-1-1 call.5

MR. HARRIS: Oh, I’m sorry. I apologize. No6

objection.7

THE COURT: Okay.8

MS. RUBIO: I’m having small technical9

difficulties, so let me just ask the Officer some other10

questions.11

Sorry about that.12

Q (By Ms. Rubio): Kind of going -- okay, now we’re going13

back to the interrogation.14

We’ve already talked about the fact that you15

read the rights first?16

A Mm-hmm.17

Q The interrogation that we’re talking about, has already18

been admitted as People’s No. 9. So -- and this is the19

video that you downloaded?20

A Yes, ma’am.21

Q Okay. So, this People’s No. 9, the jury will see in a22

little bit, there are two Detectives on it, I believe23

you testified. You were there?24

A Yes.25

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Q And Detective Mott?1

A Yes.2

Q Okay. Is that unusual to have two Detectives, in an3

interview?4

A No, not at all.5

Q Okay. And are there -- can you explain to the jury, if6

there are different -- what interrogation techniques7

are, or what interrogation you use?8

A Uhm, obviously, everybody, every Detective is9

different. 10

As far as the line of questioning, we all11

generally have some sort of training, or formal12

training, before we even get to do interrogations.13

In my case, it was Ziplander and Zalowski,14

Whipland and Zalowski (phonetic), a while ago.15

Q I’m sorry, what does that mean? I don’t --16

A It’s a firm that actually trains any investigative17

entity, from retail stores, all the way up to18

Detectives. I’m assigned Detective.19

Q Okay. 20

A Mm-hmm.21

Q And in -- how do you decide how you’re gonna approach a22

particular suspect?23

A Uhm, I watch body language, how they speak, small talk,24

that has nothing to do with the investigation itself,25

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the type of language he uses with me, how he speaks to1

me, and just generally, just to sit down and get a feel2

for him, before I even start anything.3

Q Okay. And, and again, the jury is gonna get an4

opportunity to watch this video, but I want to ask you,5

now, ahead of time, there, at times, are raised 6

voices --7

A Mm-hmm.8

Q And there’s some cursing?9

A Yes.10

Q Is that unusual?11

A Not at all. Like I said, I’m a Homicide Investigator. 12

Lord, you know, God willing, something happens to13

anybody, I go just as hard as your case, as I would on14

anybody else’s. 15

If I’m lookin’ for the truth, that’s what I16

do. 17

Sometimes it -- voices get raised, bad18

language gets used.19

In fact, when the tape is played, there is20

some language on there that I do apologize for, before,21

beforehand, in terms of my victim, and in terms of just22

the defendant himself.23

Q And it -- is that something that you would classify as24

an interrogation technique?25

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A Absolutely. There are, uhm -- in, in some cases, you1

are -- well, in any case, you are allowed to use2

triggering lying, on an effort to get the truth out of3

the defendant, or suspect.4

Q Okay. There are also times on the video, that the jury5

will see, where it appears that the two of you, you and6

Detective Mott, are speaking to one another?7

A Yes.8

Q Okay. Is that unusual?9

A No, not at all.10

Q Okay. And what’s the purpose of doing that?11

A Just communicating, back and forth, to make sure we’re12

on the same page.13

Q Okay. And it also appears, on the video, that there14

are times when, at least Detective Mott, appears to be15

sort of just talkin’ about his life, to the defendant,16

telling stories to the defendant. 17

A Mm-hmm.18

Q Are you -- do you recall that?19

A Absolutely. It’s --20

Q Is that unusual?21

A No, not at all.22

Q What’s the purpose of doing that?23

A Some time you’ll hear short anecdotes, in an effort to24

draw out the truth, from the defendant, or the suspect. 25

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They may be true sometimes, some time they may, they1

may not, but it’s all in an effort to make the person2

that we’re talking to, feel comfortable with speaking3

to us, as opposed to just thinkin’ that we’re just a4

brick wall, that they can’t converse with.5

Q Okay. At any time during the interrogation, did the6

defendant offer you any type of possible explanation,7

as to the death of Ms. Tillman?8

A Yes, ma’am.9

Q Which was what?10

A Uhm --11

Q I realize you’ll be paraphrasing.12

A Uh-huh.13

Q What was it?14

A That my victim, Miss Tillman, had gotten into a fight15

with two girls, and she got beat up pretty bad. 16

But as we all know, she didn’t die as a17

result of that.18

Q Well --19

MR. HARRIS: Objection.20

Q (By Ms. Rubio): I’m -- I just want you to tell me21

what, right now, what the defendant offered as an22

explanation.23

And I believe you just stated that, he24

indicated that -- and I’m sorry, I kind of agree with25

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the Judge, you’re speaking softly, so I just want to1

make sure that I heard you correctly.2

I believe you indicated, that the defendant3

told you, that Ms. Tillman had been beaten up by two4

girls, is that right?5

A Yes, ma’am.6

Q And that she were -- or that she had gotten into a7

fight. Which words did you use?8

A Yeah, she had gotten into a fight, and had gotten beat9

up. I, I apologize. My voice, my voice is low because10

I have a cold, and my throat is really sore. Normally,11

I’m very loud, but that’s why.12

Q Okay. 13

A That she had gotten into a fight, and she had got14

beaten up.15

Q Okay. And did the defendant indicate to you when that16

had happened?17

A I got two stories. One was, the day before. And one18

was, the day of.19

Q Were both of those explanations offered to you during20

this interrogation?21

A I believe so, yes.22

Q Okay. And did, did the defendant offer you any names23

of these -- I’m sorry, you said it was two girls?24

A Yes.25

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Q Of these, of these females?1

A Yes, ma’am. And if I, if I may, counsel. This story,2

beforehand, I gleaned, I got from reports, from the3

E.M.S. --4

Q Okay. I appreciate that.5

Okay. So, you had --6

MR. HARRIS: So -- I’m gonna object, because7

based on what he just said, that would be hearsay.8

Now, the question was asked of him, is what9

did the defendant tell you.10

MS. RUBIO: That, that was --11

MR. HARRIS: And so, and so, for him to12

testify as to what the E.M.S. told him, would be13

hearsay, and should be stricken.14


What is your exact question, counselor?16

MS. RUBIO: My question was, what, what 17

did -- I’m sorry. My initial question was, did the18

defendant offer any explanation for the death of Ms.19

Tillman, during this interrogation.20

WITNESS: Yes.21

THE COURT: And he answered that.22


THE COURT: He answered that?24

MS. RUBIO: Yes. And he initialed -- he25

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answered -- okay. 1

If I could, he answered, initially that 2

they -- she had gotten into a fight --3

THE COURT: I heard what he said.4

MS. RUBIO: Okay. 5

THE COURT: I want, I want you to ask your6

precise question, once again, to the Officer, that Mr.7

Harris objected to.8

MS. RUBIO: Oh. Then the next question was,9

did the defendant give any names of, of these females,10

that he said she had gotten into a fight with.11

THE COURT: Okay. 12

And I don’t think we got an answer.13

So, you’re -- can you answer that question?14

WITNESS: Absolutely, Your Honor. 15

Yes. One was Isis (phonetic), and the I16

believe the other one was Monique, or Jada Monique, or17

something.18

MR. HARRIS: Now, the question before that,19

that the Officer was asked --20

THE COURT: I, I understand.21

MR. HARRIS: So, I would ask that that --22

that that testimony, in terms of what E.M.S. told him,23

be stricken, because that would be hearsay.24

THE COURT: Frankly, I don’t know that he25

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answered the question, but to the extent, ladies and1

gentlemen, that the Officer indicated what an E.M.S.2

person said, you are to disregard that.3

I didn’t hear that, but if he did say4

something, you are to disregard that answer.5


Q (By Ms. Rubio): So, just, just right now, in reference7

to this interview, in which you were a part of, with8

the defendant, is what I’m referring to.9

A Okay. 10

Q Okay. So, you indicated, now, just leaving off where,11

where we left off, was -- or I’m sorry, picking up12

where we left off, were names given?13

Then you indicated that there was a name of14

Isis, and a name of, I think you just said, Jada15

Monique?16

A Yes.17

Q Okay. And had you ever heard those names in reference18

to this investigation before?19

A No.20

Q Okay. Had the defendant ever offered those names to21

you, prior to the, the date of this investigation?22

A No.23

Q Okay. And -- I’m sorry, prior to the date of this24

interrogation, is what I meant to say.25

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Did, after you received those names, did you1

attempt to look into those, those females?2

A Yes, ma’am.3

Q Or investigate them?4

A Yes.5

Q Okay. And what did you find out, if anything?6

A I was able to locate a black female by the name of7

Isis. I was able to produce, or locate, two addresses8

where Miss Isis was supposed to had lived.9

One was an abandoned home.10

And two, I encountered a female at the door,11

who said that she hadn’t heard from Isis in over two12

years.13

Q And then, as far as Jada Monique?14

A I couldn’t find anything on that, there was too many15

possibilities.16

Q Okay. And what -- do you have particular data bases,17

that you, as law enforcement, have access to?18

A Yes, ma’am.19

Q Okay. And so, are you able to enter a person’s name20

in, into that data base?21

A Yes, ma’am.22

Q Okay. And when you entered the name, Jada -- I’m23

sorry, did you enter the name, Jada Monique?24

A Yes.25

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Q Anything come up?1

A Yes.2

Q Okay. And did anything come up that was -- that lead3

you further in this investigation?4

A No, ma’am. 5

Q Did you, during this interrogation, did the defendant6

offer specific in, information as to where these two7

females could be located?8

A Yes, it was very vague. Just on the one, though.9

Q Okay. But so, you said it was vague?10

A Mm-hmm.11

Q So, it wasn’t specific?12

A No, not at all.13

Q Did the defendant offer up any other explanations, or14

possible people, who could have been involved in the15

death of Ms. Tillman, during this interrogation?16

A No, ma’am. 17

Q And this interrogation -- I’m sorry, do you recall the18

date that it took place?19

A January the 27th, 2016.20

Q Okay. And I believe the last time you were on the21

stand was last week?22

A Yes.23

Q I believe you previously testified that this took place24

after the defendant was arrested?25

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A I can’t recall.1

Q Do you know where, where the interview took place?2

A Absolutely.3

Q Where?4

A At the Detroit Detention Center.5

Q Okay. And is that where people are housed, initially,6

when they’re arrested?7

A Yes, ma’am.8

Q Okay. And do you recall when the defendant was9

arrested?10

A Yes.11

Q When?12

A On the -- January the 26th.13

Q Okay. So, prior to January 27th, had you ever heard of14

this name, Isis, or this name, Jada Monique?15

A No.16

Q Okay. 17

MS. RUBIO: I don’t have any further18

questions, at this time.19

I believe the People -- I would be ready to20

play People’s 9. I need to get it from my colleague21

upstairs, which if, of course, the interrogation.22

And then --23

MR. HARRIS: Mr. Harris, were you going to24

continue your cross-examination, after the playing of25

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the --1


THE COURT: Okay. 3

All right. 4

Ladies and gentlemen, we’re gonna take a5

short break, at this time.6

All right. 7

Retire to the jury room.8



courtroom at 10:08 a.m.)11


THE COURT: So, you’ll contact that person13

assisting you?14

MS. RUBIO: Yep. I’ll just hop up there. It15

should be five minutes, I, I’m hoping.16

MR. HARRIS: Judge, do you know if that17

document got sent to --18

MS. RUBIO: I can check, and we will give you19

a copy -- we will give you the original. All right. 20

So, you’ll have a copy, and --21


proceedings from 10:08 a.m. to 11:06 a.m.)23

THE COURT: Okay. 24


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Your appearances?2

MS. RUBIO: Good afternoon. Mary Rubio for3

the People.4


Wyatt Harris on behalf of Mr. Terrance.6

THE COURT: Okay. 7

Let’s bring in the jury.8



the courtroom).11

DEPUTY: You may sit.12

THE COURT: Okay. 13

We, are back on the record, the jury is14

present.15

I have already called the case. The16

attorneys have already made their appearances.17

Ladies and gentlemen, at this time, the18

People are going to play a video tape, that takes about19

three hours.20

And we are going to watch approximately half21

of that, before lunch.22

So, I’m gonna break for lunch at about twelve23

thirty.24

And then we will take an hour lunch, and come25

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back and hear the rest of the tape.1

I want to let you know that, on a few2

occasions, the sound will be muted, for a period of3

time. 4

You are not to be concerned with why the tape5

will be muted, for whatever period of time it is muted.6

Okay?7

Ms. Rubio?8


MR. HARRIS: And I’m gonna ask if I can move?10


MS. RUBIO: Can everyone see that, members of12

the jury?13

THE COURT: I should indicate, for the14

record, and counsel, correct me if I’m wrong, that this15

video has been previously and admitted as Exhibit No.16

9, is that correct?17


MR. HARRIS: Yes, Your Honor. 19


(Whereupon People’s Exhibit No. 9 was played21

in open court).22

MS. RUBIO: I’m sorry, did you want --23

THE COURT: We’re gonna take our lunch24

recess.25

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MS. RUBIO: Oh, okay. Thank you. 1

THE COURT: Ladies and gentlemen, it’s twelve 2

thirty, so please be back and ready to begin again at3

one thirty.4

Okay?5

Thank you. 6



courtroom for lunch).9



THE COURT: Counsel, Sarah, Sarah is giving12

you the jury instructions.13


THE COURT: So, please review those.15

And before the end of the day, I want to go16

over them with you. Maybe there’s something that you17

want added, or something you want deleted.18

I would want -- I do want to get all of the19

instructions finalized before we end today.20

I’m not sure we’re gonna get to closings.21

We’ll see how that plays out.22

But I do want to -- I definitely want to have23

these instructions in the can, before we leave today.24

MS. RUBIO: Yes.25

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MR. HARRIS: Okay. 2

THE COURT: And review the verdict issue.3

MS. RUBIO: Yes.4

THE COURT: How you think the verdict form5

should appear, all right. And we can talk about that6

later.7



See you at -- before one thirty.10



THE COURT: Okay. 13



Your appearances?16



Wyatt Harris on behalf of Treshaun Terrance.19

THE COURT: Okay. 20

We ready for the jury?21

MR. HARRIS: Ready.22



(Whereupon the jury was brought back into the25

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courtroom).1


THE COURT: Okay. 3



Your appearances?6

MS. RUBIO: Mary Rubio for the People. Good7

afternoon.8


Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen of the jury. 10

Wyatt Harris on behalf of Mr. Treshaun Terrance.11

THE COURT: Okay. 12

Ms. Rubio, why don’t you continue the video.13


Is this a good angle for everyone?15

Okay. 16

(Whereupon People’s Exhibit No. 9 continued17

to be played in open court).18

MR. HARRIS: Your Honor, may we approach?19




THE COURT: Okay. 23

Ladies and gentlemen, you are to disregard24

the last statement made, that referred to any court25

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date, or warrant.1

Disregard that testimony.2



MS. RUBIO: Do you want to approach?5

Can we approach, Your Honor?6






THE COURT: Can you mute that now, please.12

Okay. 13

Ladies and gentlemen, we’re gonna take a14

short recess at this time.15

So, I’m gonna ask you to retire to the jury16

room.17



courtroom).20




THE COURT: Okay. 24


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Treshaun Terrance, Your Honor. 5

THE COURT: Okay. 6

And we are outside the presence of the jury.7

Ms. Rubio?8

MS. RUBIO: And obviously, we just -- the9

Court knows, we just finished a lengthy, watching of10

lengthy interrogation video, in the presence of the11

jury.12

And we went through this video, yesterday,13

and didn’t end ‘til, I think it might have been14

slightly after five o’clock, as I’m sure the Court15

recalls.16

At that time, there were multiple portions,17

which I needed to review, and try to redact. 18

And I found -- at that -- I indicated,19

unfortunately, I had a meeting that I had to leave, so20

I couldn’t stay late.21

Anyway, today, I had gave -- I gave all my22

notes to our admin person in our, in our unit, who is23

sort of the tech person, in our unit.24

And she went through everything.25

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I do know, we heard it in -- during the play1

back of the interrogation, there was a mention of2

warrants, albeit, I believe it was pretty brief.3

I wanted to apologize, and indicate to4

everyone, this was, of course, not any intention on my5

part.6

Additionally, at side bar, I believe we7

agreed to -- that -- to a stipulation, that I had the8

Officer in charge look into it, and the warrant, or9

warrants in question were civil infractions, for10

traffic.11

And so, we’ve agreed to have that -- have,12

have Your Honor instruct the jury as such, with all the13

instructions, at the end of the trial.14

Is that correct, counsel?15

MR. HARRIS: That’s correct.16

THE COURT: Okay. 17

MS. RUBIO: And then, lastly, I just wanted18

to indicate, I, I know we’re gonna continue with the19

Officer in charge.20

This is the last witness that I intend on21

calling.22

I, I do have other witnesses endorsed.23

I wanted to find out, now, from counsel, if24

counsel agrees to waive the -- my requirement to25

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produce the rest of the witnesses, as cumulative.1

MR. HARRIS: Your Honor, I’ve talked with my2

client, and he’s indicated to me that he was willing to3

waive the remaining witnesses, that have not testified.4

THE COURT: Okay. 5

MS. RUBIO: Okay. 6

So, at this time, I would move to strike any7

additional witnesses, and I’ll be finishing with8

Officer Mason.9


THE COURT: There is the issue of the 9-1-111

call.12

MS. RUBIO: Actually, I’ve decided not to13

play it in my case in chief. I know that it’s already14

been entered into evidence. I’m going to reference it,15

and play it in my closing.16

MR. HARRIS: Wait a second.17

If she’s gonna play -- we agreed to admit it. 18

I think it should be played in her case in chief.19

MS. RUBIO: I can do that, but I will20

indicate that there’s -- I can do that. There’s no way21

to -- there’s no human to question, about, about the22

calls.23

The Officer certainly cannot be questioned24

about the 9-1-1 call, that the defendant made, to the25

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dispatcher.1

So, there’s no questions to be asked. 2

I think --3

THE COURT: So, Mr. Harris, do you have any4

objection if, without foundation, she just says, by --5

that she is moving the Court -- she is calling the6

Exhibit No. 8, or 9, or whatever it is --7

MS. RUBIO: Eight.8

THE COURT: Which is the 9-1-1, that is her9

last evidence in the case.10

And after that, she’s going to rest?11

MR. HARRIS: Right. That’s how I think it12

should go, Your Honor.13

THE COURT: Okay. 14

MS. RUBIO: I’m --15

MR. HARRIS: You’re saying that she’s gonna16

play the 9-1-1?17

THE COURT: Yeah. 18

I mean, I -- my guess is, when you agreed to19

the admission of that Exhibit, it was, I would assume,20

with the understanding that it was gonna be played in21

her case in chief.22

MR. HARRIS: Correct. That was the23

assumption I had.24


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MS. RUBIO: I -- it’s fine. I’ll obviously,1

I defer to the Court, but I would just indicate, 2

it’s -- respectfully, it’s my evidence, and so it would3

be how I choose to enter, to enter it. 4

Under normal circumstances, for example, the5

interrogation video, I can entirely understand that6

defense counsel has a myriad of questions he wants to7

ask, after --8

THE COURT: Okay. 9

You’ve, you’ve represented to the Court that10

you were gonna play a 9-1-1 call.11

MS. RUBIO: Right.12

THE COURT: And I assumed, and I’m not gonna13

assume for Mr. Harris, that it was during your case in14

chief.15

MS. RUBIO: And I -- and that I --16

THE COURT: And if he, and if he felt that he17

was willing to admit it in your case in chief, and now18

feels like, well, I wouldn’t have admitted it, if it’s19

in rebuttal.20

I don’t know what’s on the 9-1-1, and I don’t21

know what it would rebut. I have no idea. I haven’t22

heard it.23

So, if he is saying, I’m only stipulating to24

its admission during the case in chief, not to25

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rebuttal, I’m gonna consider that.1

So --2

MS. RUBIO: It’s fine. I’ll play it once the3

Officer in charge is done testifying.4

THE COURT: After Mr. Harris is done?5

MS. RUBIO: Yes.6

THE COURT: Okay. 7

And that will be your last piece of evidence?8

MS. RUBIO: Yes, that’s it.9

THE COURT: Okay. 10

MS. RUBIO: And I will, I will indicate, it’s11

approximately ten minutes.12

THE COURT: Okay. 13

So, we may not get to that until tomorrow14

morning?15

Okay. 16

Are we ready to bring in the jury?17



MR. HARRIS: Yes, Your Honor. 20

THE COURT: Okay. 21



the courtroom).24


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THE COURT: Okay. 1



Your appearances?4



Treshaun Terrance.7

THE COURT: Okay. 8

Ms. Rubio, did you want to continue with9

Detective Mason?10

MS. RUBIO: I will. Thank you so much.11

Recalling Officer Mason.12

THE COURT: Detective, you are still under13

oath, do you understand that?14

WITNESS: Yes, sir.15


You can continue, Miss Rubio.17


Q (Continuing by Ms. Rubio): Detective, you just sat19

here with us while we watched that rather lengthy20

interrogation video.21

A Yes, ma’am.22

Q And you also took place at -- you were one of the23

people in the interview room, correct?24

A Correct.25

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Q Okay. In watching the video, taking you back to the1

very beginning. In the very beginning, there were, I2

don’t know exactly how long, but a good couple minutes3

where there’s nothing on the screen, no one in, in the4

room. Why is that?5

A Generally, when I download the video, I go6

approximately, maybe five to ten minutes before, and7

make sure that there’s no improprieties that happened,8

before the video, before we bring the suspect in9

question, into the room.10

Q Okay. And I don’t know if anyone noticed, or yourself,11

but when I first pulled the video up, it looked as if12

there were kind of a, it looks like two screens,13

simultaneously, next to each other. What was that?14

A I downloaded two views. One from the top, that the15

room as a whole; and one from a side view, which the16

one that we watched.17

Q Okay. And are -- you said, two views?18

A Yes, ma’am.19

Q Okay. And -- but is it the same interview?20

A Yes.21

Q Okay. Also, in the very beginning, there was a portion22

where it looked like the defendant was on one side of23

the table, you were on the other side, and I think we24

saw a little portion of Detective Mott, throughout the25

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interview?1

A Mm-hmm.2

Q But then, there’s a very brief number of seconds, where3

there’s nobo -- you can’t see anyone, in, in the4

beginning of the video. Why is that?5

A When we directed the defendant into the room, he sat on6

the side that we generally sit on. So, then, we then7

made him to go, walk around the opposite side, to where8

he was sitting, for the duration of the interview.9

Q Okay. Also, in the beginning of this interrogation,10

it’s -- I’m sorry, it’s Detective Mott, who’s asking11

questions in the beginning, is that right?12

A Yes, ma’am.13

Q Okay. And in the beginning of the interrogation, it --14

Detective Mott appears to be asking a lot of questions15

about the defendant’s family history, whether he has16

siblings, whether he has tattoos. Why is that?17

A Just to get a general understanding of who you’re gonna18

be, who you’re gonna be talkin’ to. So, we aks general19

questions, so he kind of feels sort -- more comfortable20

than what he is. And that’s to get a brief family21

background on him, where he came from.22

Q Is there any kind of a, a form affiliated with that?23

A Yes.24

Q And did you and or Detective Mott follow the questions25

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on the form?1

A Yes, ma’am.2

Q Okay. And it sounded like I heard, writing. Was that3

you or Detective Mott?4

A That was Detective Mott.5

Q Okay. And what was, what was he writing on?6

A That form that he was writing on, is what we call a --7

it’s noted as a Interrogation Record. That form has8

those questions that you heard Detective Mott asking,9

as well as physical description, for the defendant, any10

tattoos that he may have, and where he grew up, where11

he lives.12

Q Okay. There was also a, kind of, several minutes13

towards the end of the interrogation, when the14

defendant indicated, something about a lawyer. I don’t15

remember his exact question, or statement.16

And at, I believe Detective Mott asked him,17

several times, if he wanted a lawyer. Why is that?18

A During questioning, if at any point the person in19

questions request a lawyer, then we have to stop, and20

cease all questions at that time. There’s no more21

questions involved, once he requests to see a lawyer.22

Q Okay. Is -- you indicated, a moment ago, during the23

questioning, if a suspect requests a lawyer --24

A Yes.25

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Q You are required to stop questioning, correct? That’s1

what you just said?2

A Yes, ma’am.3

Q Are you required to continually ask a suspect, if he or4

she wants a lawyer?5

A Not at all.6

Q Okay. Other than the rights that you already went7

over, on the -- on People’s Exhibit 3, which is the8

called the Constitutional Rights Certi -- Certificate9

of Notification.10

Other than the reading of those rights with a11

suspect, or defendant, are you required to talk about12

the defendant having the right to have an attorney13

present, during, during the time that he or she answers14

questions, are you required to, to say that any more,15

throughout the interview?16

A No, ma’am. 17

Q During the, the interview, there was mention of someone18

named Germaine. Do you recall that?19

A Yes.20

Q Okay. Was that a real person?21

A Germaine actually was a real person. Yes.22

Q And how, how did you, without telling us -- without23

saying hearsay, telling what someone else said, how is24

it you came upon somebody named Germaine?25

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A I receive an anonymous tip, a phone call.1

Q Okay. And did you follow up on that?2

A I did.3

Q Okay. And was it fruitful?4

A No.5

Q Okay. There was also mention of -- I’m sorry. Did6

you, did you hear the mention of someone named Tyler,7

during that interview?8

A Yes, ma’am.9

Q Did you know who that was?10

A No.11

Q Had you ever heard of someone named Tyler, in the12

course of this investigation?13

A No.14

Q And did you learn anything more about Tyler, from the15

defendant?16

A No.17

Q Did -- based on statements that the defendant made, did18

you view Tyler as a suspect in this case?19

A No, ma’am. 20

Q Okay. 21

MS. RUBIO: I don’t have any, any other22

questions, and I’ll just play People’s 8, after cross-23

examination.24

THE COURT: Okay. 25

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Mr. Harris?1

CROSS-EXAMINATION2

BY MR. HARRIS: 3

Q Detective, did I hear you say, this morning, when you4

were being asked questions by the Prosecutor, on 5

direct examination, that you hadn’t heard the name,6

Isis, or Jada Monique, prior to January the 27th, 2016?7

A Yes, sir.8

Q And that would be the truth?9

A Absolutely.10

Q Now, you recall, and the video, when you asked Mr.11

Terrance to describe Isis, you said, little short light12

skinned girl, correct?13

A Yes, sir.14

Q Okay. So, would you agree with me that you had heard15

of Isis prior to January the 27th, 2016?16

A I absolutely would not agree.17

Q Okay. Well, how were you able to describe Isis, on18

January the 27th, 2016, if you hadn’t heard of her,19

prior to that?20

A If I may?21

Q Please.22

A On --23

Q Please answer my question.24

A Absolutely. Well, I was sittin’ there, and, and you25

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saw, on the phone, a lot of times, I was on my phone.1

Q Okay. 2

A He gave Isis’, while I was on the phone, I was doin’ an3

internet search of Isis Terrell. 4

I was able to located a black female, short5

in stature, light skinded (as spoken), by the name of6

Isis.7

She had something else under her name, so I8

was not able to make a direct determination of being9

the Isis that we were lookin’ for.10

But that’s where I got that from.11

Q Okay. You also heard that, in that video, that she had12

been in, or released from placement, correct?13

A Yes.14

Q Do you recall that, right?15

A Yes.16

Q Okay. Now, you did do subsequent, subsequent17

investigations, regarding Isis, correct?18

A Yes, sir.19

Q Okay. Did you check the Juvenile records, regarding20

Isis?21

A No, sir. 22

Q Did you check to find out where she had been placed?23

A No, sir. 24

Q Did you check to see if Isis had any outstanding25

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warrants?1

A I did, sir.2

Q You did?3

A Yes.4

Q And what was your result?5

A She did not.6

Q Okay. Did you check to see if Isis had a Social Worker7

assigned to her, through Department of Human Services8

A I didn’t.9

Q Did you check to find out where the placement was --10

placements were for Isis?11

A I did not.12

Q And when we say, placements, just so the jury, and you13

and I understand what we’re talking about, when you14

say, placement, meaning placing a Juvenile in a15

facility that’s not their home, correct?16

A Yes, that’s usually what --17

Q Okay. You, you’d understand that, and you’d agree18

that’s, that’s what placement means?19

A Yes, sir.20

Q Okay. So, for example, I think one of the placement21

facilities might be Wolverine?22

A Yes.23

Q You’ve heard of that. Okay. And so, you didn’t check24

any of the location where a placement would have been25

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for Isis, correct?1

A Correct.2

Q You know that the Juvenile facility is right across the3

street from this building, correct?4

A Uh --5

Q One of the Juvenile facilities?6

A Yes.7

Q Right across the street from this building?8

A Yes.9

Q And you didn’t check there to see if she, she had any10

records out of there, that you could find?11

A No, sir. 12

Q Did you a look up of Jada Monique?13

A Yes, I did. 14

Q Okay. And were you successful in -- and -- strike15

that.16

Did you do a look up like you did with Isis,17

while you were sitting there, in the interview, either18

in the interview, or some time after that, I don’t care19

when, but did you do that type of a look up for Jada20

Monique?21

A Yes, sir.22

Q Okay. And were you able to successfully find any23

information out about Jada Monique?24

A No.25

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Q Nothing at all?1

A Nothing.2

Q Okay. Now, you also heard the name, Germaine3

mentioned, correct?4

A Yes.5

Q And you talked to Germaine, Germaine, correct?6

A No.7

Q You did not?8

A I did not.9

Q You never had contact with Germaine?10

A No.11

Q Did anybody on your staff have contact with Germaine?12

A No, sir, not to my knowledge.13

Q So, when Detrick Mott, I believe it was either Detrick14

Mott, or yourself said, in that video, that we talked15

to Germaine, they were lying?16

A Yes, sir.17

Q Oh, okay. Okay. Okie dokie.18

So, did you do any kind of investigation,19

like you did with Isis, regarding Germaine?20

A Besides a, what we call a -- yes.21

Q Okay. And what did you do?22

A What we call a L.E.I.N. inquiry, the -- which is the23

computer system that the cops use, when they pull you24

over, and they punch in the keys, in the computer. 25

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That, that’s how I located a Germaine.1

Q Okay. So, you were able to locate a Germain, correct?2

A Yes, sir.3

Q Okay. And what -- you were able to get address?4

A Yes, sir.5

Q Of Germaine? Were you able to get his driver’s license6

number?7

A Yes.8

Q If he was a driver?9

A Yes.10

Q You were able to determine that he’s a driver.11

Were you able to get his social security12

number?13

A No, I don’t think I got his social security --14

Q Okay. But you were able to get pertinent information?15

A Yes.16

Q Okay. Did you act on that information, by trying to17

contact Germaine, through that information?18

A I did.19

Q You did?20

A Yes, sir.21

Q Okay. And in getting that information, you still chose22

not to contact him?23

A No, it was all -- the tip that I got was all hearsay. 24

It just didn’t make sense.25

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Q But did you contact Germaine?1

A I was unable to.2

Q And what did you do to contact Germaine? What efforts3

did you make?4

A The address that I had for him, I went out to the5

location. Both times there was nobody there.6

Q Okay. 7

A Yes.8

Q And you went out there twice?9

A Yes, sir.10

Q Have you recently run a L.E.I.N. to see if Germaine had11

any other warrants, prior to today’s date?12

A No, sir. 13

Q Now, let’s talk, talk about Tyler.14

Did you do any investigation to find out who15

this Tyler is?16

A I did, but a lot of Tylers came up.17

Q Okay. You ran Tyler through the L.E.I.N.?18

A I entered him into what we call our Police reports,19

Crisnet, which is a reporting system that the Detroit20

Police Department uses. There were -- just a matter of21

entering in names, into the internet, you get a22

thousand hits.23

Q Okay. Please answer my question. Did you enter him24

into L.E.I.N.?25

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A No, I was unable to, sir.1

Q Why were you unable to enter him into L.E.I.N.?2

A You need more than just a first name.3

Q Okay. Did you canvass the neighborhood to see if you4

could get some information about Isis, further5

information about Isis?6

A Once the -- yes.7

Q And who did you, who did you have come in contact with,8

in the neighborhood, that --9

A On the day that this -- that the crime happened, on the10

15th, one of my team members, I had him do a canvass of11

the neighborhood. 12

But during that time, we didn’t know anything13

about Isis. So, we couldn’t come up with that.14

Now, when I did finally get a, a name for15

Isis, as I stated earlier, there was, the house that I16

went to, the first house was abandoned. 17

And then, the second house, nobody had seen18

Isis for two years.19

Q Okay. 20

THE COURT: Mr. Harris, I’m gonna have to21

stop for today.22

MR. HARRIS: Okay, Judge.23

THE COURT: At this time.24


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THE COURT: Ladies and gentlemen, it’s five1

after four.2

So, I’m going to excuse you for the day. 3

I’m gonna ask that you be back here before4

nine o’clock, so that we can start at nine o’clock5

tomorrow morning.6

Have a good evening.7

And please remember, do not discuss this case8

with anybody.9

Thank you. 10


(Whereupon the jurors were excused for the12

day).13




THE COURT: Okay. 17

Can you be back here at eight thirty tomorrow18

morning, so we can go over the instructions?19

MS. RUBIO: Yes.20

MR. HARRIS: Thank you, Judge. I, I was21

gonna ask if we could do that.22

THE COURT: Okay. 23

We’ll do that.24

MS. RUBIO: I just wanted to state to the25

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Court, now, I just mentioned to defense counsel, I1

think it’s only logical that 4.1 should be added.2

MR. HARRIS: I’ll look at 4.1, Judge.3

THE COURT: Yeah, we’ll go over all of ‘em,4

back in chambers.5


THE COURT: And then we’ll put together a7

final product.8






- - -14

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(Jury Trial).


Dated:________________________

Detroit, Michigan



Suzanne Kinsey

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STATE OF MICHIGAN



-vs- Case No. 16-01235


Defendant. /

JURY TRIAL


Wednesday - May 18, 2016

APPEARANCES:




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C O N T E N T S

Page

May 18, 2016................................... 4

Jury Trial

WITNESSES:

RYAN MASON (Recalled)Cross-Examination Continuing by Mr. Harris 9Redirect Examination by Ms. Rubio 22Recross-Examination by Mr. Harris 26Redirect Examination Continuing by Ms. Rubio 29Recross-Examination Continuing by Mr. Harris 31Redirect Examination Continuing by Ms. Rubio 34

Closing Argument by Ms. Rubio 44

Closing Argument by Mr. Harris 56

Rebuttal Argument by Ms. Rubio 70

Jury Instructions 78

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E X H I B I T S

Marked Admitted

( NO EXHIBITS MARKED OR ADMITTED )

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May 18, 20161

Detroit, Michigan2


THE COURT: Okay. 4



Your appearances?7



Harris on behalf of Mr. Terrance, who sits to my left.10

THE COURT: Okay. 11

Before we bring out the jury, I do have a12

couple questions.13

Off the record, we did go over proposed jury14

instructions, and I believe that those instructions15

have been prepared consistent with what the parties16

felt was appropriate under the circumstances.17

I don’t believe any of you object to any of18

the instructions, which you’ve been handed.19

And have you had ample time to review them,20

or do you want me to bring this up, subsequently, after21

you read, read the instructions?22

MR. HARRIS: Judge, if you could give us a23

mome -- give me a moment.24


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Ms. Rubio, something --1

MS. RUBIO: I’m so sorry. I just will2

indicate, at first blush, when I look at the new3

instructions, drawing the Court’s attention to4

instruction 510, with -- regarding expert witness, I5

see regarding Dr. Leigh Hlavaty.6

I don’t see any mention of Shane Hill.7

THE COURT: Okay. 8

MS. RUBIO: So, if --9

THE COURT: What number is that, again?10

MS. RUBIO: 510.11

MR. HARRIS: I think I saw --12

MS. RUBIO: I’m sorry, am I look -- maybe I13

looked at it --14

MR. HARRIS: You have also heard testimony15

from --16

THE COURT: It’s in there.17

MS. RUBIO: Oh, sorry.18

THE COURT: Okay. 19

MS. RUBIO: Oh, yes, there it is. Sorry. 20

Sorry about that.21

That’s all I see, at first blush.22

THE COURT: And the stipulation, we’ve talked23

about, I am going to read.24


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THE COURT: Well, I forget what page that’s1

on.2

MR. HARRIS: Page seven, Your Honor.3

THE COURT: And you have a copy of what I’m4

going to read?5

MR. HARRIS: Yes, I have a --6


All right. 8

Any objections to the instructions that9

you’ve -- you’re reviewing?10



THE COURT: Okay. 13

As I mentioned, after I read the14

instructions, I will call you forward, and you can tell15

me if I missed anything.16

Okay. 17

Anything else we need to bring up outside the18

presence of the jury?19

MS. RUBIO: I just wanted to indicate two20

things, regarding jurors, to the Court.21

I rode up on a crowded elevator, this22

morning, and I was talking to somebody, you know, co-23

worker or someone, just benign, casual talk, and then I24

realized one of the jurors was on there. 25

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It really was not much, just like, good1

morning. But everybody -- I just wanted to indicate,2

we were on the same elevator, and I didn’t realize it3

at first.4

And then also, as it relates to juror 5

number --6

THE COURT: And did you not discuss the case?7

MS. RUBIO: Oh, not at all.8

THE COURT: Okay. 9

MS. RUBIO: Not at all.10

As it relates to juror number twelve, when11

juror was coming in, I saw other jurors were already in12

the jury room, but when that juror was coming in, I13

realized I had to push the cart back, so he could get14

through.15

And he laughed, and said, oh, I see you’re16

gettin’ a work out there.17

I didn’t respond, but just wanted to indicate18

that.19

THE COURT: Okay. 20

All right. 21

Anything else, Mr. Harris?22

MR. HARRIS: Nothing, Judge.23


So, all right, Mr. O’Donnell, can I talk to25

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you one second, off the record.1

MR. O’DONNELL: Yes, Your Honor.2


Okay. 4

So, if I -- my memory serves, Detective Mason5

is gonna be back on the stand?6



Are we ready for the jury?9


MR. HARRIS: We’re ready, Your Honor.11


You can bring the jury out.13



the courtroom).16


THE COURT: Okay. 18



MS. RUBIO: Good morning. Mary Rubio for the21

People.22

MR. HARRIS: Good morning, Your Honor, and23

good morning, ladies and gentlemen of the jury. Wyatt24

Harris on behalf of Treshaun Terrance, who is present25

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at this time.1

THE COURT: Okay. 2

I believe when we left off, Mr. Harris was3

cross-examining the Detective.4

Sir, can you please return to the witness5

stand?6

R Y A N M A S O N7



THE COURT: One more time, your name?10

WITNESS: Detective Ryan Mason.11

THE COURT: Can you raise your right hand for12

me.13




WITNESS: Yes, sir.17

THE COURT: Thank you. 18

Have a seat to my left.19

CROSS-EXAMINATION20


Q Good morning, Detective Mason.22

A Good morning, counsel.23

Q You feelin’ better today?24

A Absolutely.25

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Q Good. Detective Mason, just to refresh my memory, and1

refresh maybe some of the memories of the jury. When2

you testified yesterday, and correct me if I’m wrong,3

you testified that, while you were in the interview4

with Mr. Terrance, you looked Isis Terrell’s name up,5

is that correct?6

A Yes.7

Q Through your computer -- or through your cell phone,8

really?9

A Yes.10

Q Right. And what system did you go to, the --11

A That was just through Facebook.12

Q Through Facebook?13

A Mm-hmm.14

Q Okay. And when you looked her up, through Facebook,15

did you see -- was that the only time you looked her16

up, through Facebook?17

A Yes.18

Q Okay. So, when you looked her up through Facebook, did19

you see any of her Facebook friends?20

A No, I was -- I couldn’t.21

Q Pardon?22

A I couldn’t. It depends on how the profile is set up if23

you have a social media. Some people allow you to see24

friends, and some people don’t.25

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Q Okay. And do you know if she allowed people to see1

friends? Or, or if -- strike that.2

Let me correct it.3

Do you know if, when you looked her up, on4

her Facebook page, were you able to see if there were5

friends posted?6

A I was not able to.7

Q Okay. Okay. Now, you told this jury yesterday, I8

believe on direct, and on cross, that you took two9

opportunities to look for Miss Terrell, and one you10

went to a -- was it a former residence?11

A Yes, sir.12

Q Okay. And no one was at that residence?13

A No, sir. 14

Q When did you do that?15

A One was -- I can’t remember the exact date. Earlier16

this year. And then other, the other time was just17

before the trial started, just to make sure.18

Q And the second time, or the -- and the second time that19

you tried to find her, did you talk to some people, and20

they’d indicated to you that they hadn’t seen her in a21

couple years?22

A Yes. 23

Q Okay. Do you know what locations -- just give me the24

City that you were -- that you went to?25

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A On was, I believe, the Township, Royal Oak Township,1

and the other one was in Ferndale.2

Q Okay. The -- and the people that you talked to, were3

they in Royal Oak Township?4

A Ferndale.5

Q Okay. In Ferndale. Okay. And you had learned, in6

the video that Mr. Terrance had indicated to you that,7

something about Royal Oak Township, as it relates to8

Miss Terrell, correct?9

A Yes.10

Q Okay. When you, when you talked to the people in11

Ferndale, did they give you -- did you ask ‘em for12

information as to who she might have associated with?13

A No.14

Q Did you establish any relationship, in terms of the15

people in Ferndale, as to how they were related to her? 16

To Isis?17

A No, I didn’t. First of all, it was a very elderly18

woman.19

Q Okay. 20

A And I don’t want to say she was out of her mind,21

because she wasn’t. She was, she remembered Isis, and22

it took her a long time to remember exactly the -- what23

I was talkin’ about, when I, when I aksed her, have,24

have you -- when’s the last time you seen Isis. And25

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then she didn’t remember, then she said, yeah, I do1

remember Isis, but she hasn’t -- I haven’t seen her in2

over two years. Very older, older woman.3

Q So, you didn’t identify, with the elderly woman, her tp4

with Isis?5

A No.6

Q If any?7

A No, I did not.8

Q You didn’t say, well, were, were you guys former9

neighbors, correct?10

A Correct.11

Q You didn’t say, were you an actual biological relative,12

correct?13

A Correct.14

Q Grandma, what have you?15

A Yes.16

Q None of that, right?17

A None of that.18

Q Okay. Why didn’t you do that?19

A That’s just the way I, I performed my investigation. 20

If I was actually lead to believe that I needed to21

investigate further, I would have. But due to the22

circumstances in this case, I just -- she gave me --23

the info that I got from her was sufficient.24

Q And when you say, due to the circumstances of this25

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case, you had already decided that Mr. Terrell -- Mr.1

Terrance, was the individual that’s culpable in this,2

and so there’s no need to talk, or, or discover3

anything about Miss Terrell, correct?4

A No, those are your words, counsel.5

Q I’m asking you that?6

A Those are your words, counsel, not --7

Q I’m asking you that, sir.8

A And I’m answering you, those are your words, not mine,9

counsel.10

Q Okay. So, you hadn’t made a predetermination when you11

were looking for Miss Terrell, that Mr. Terrance is the12

individual that committed this crime, correct?13

A Correct.14

Q Now, did you tell this jury yesterday that you did not15

talk to Germaine, even though in the video it indicates16

that some communications, Police communications, was17

with Germaine?18

A Yes, I did. 19

Q Okay. And you also canvassed the neighborhood,20

correct? Over there, by where -- on Mendota, correct?21

A I did not canvass the neighborhood.22

Q Okay. Well, but let me ask you this, did you canvass23

the neighborhood, in looking for Isis?24

A Over there?25

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Q Yes, on Mendota?1

A No.2

Q Okay. Did you canvass the neighborhood, in looking for3

Isis, in Ferndale?4

A I did not.5

Q Did you canvass then neighborhood in looking for Isis,6

in Royal Oak Township?7

A I did not.8

Q Did you try to identify what schools Isis may have went9

to, as it relates to Ferndale, and as it relates to10

Royal Oak Township?11

A No, sir. 12

Q Why?13

A I didn’t think that I needed to, sir.14

Q Well, now, you have evidence as of January the 27th,15

that someone may have beaten Dalona Thomas -- Tillman,16

excuse me, correct?17

A Correct.18

Q Okay. And you have evidence from Mr. Terrance that19

Isis is the one that did that, correct?20

A From your -- from the defendant?21

Q Yes, that’s what he told you in that video, right?22

A Absolutely.23

Q Okay. So, wouldn’t you want to follow through on that,24

to see if there’s some truth to that?25

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A Truth, after he lied to me?1

Q Do you want to follow through and see if there’s some2

truth to that?3

A I determined that I didn’t need to, after he had lied.4

Q Okay. Because you had already made a determination5

that Mr. Terrance was the one that committed this6

crime, correct?7

A I made the determination that he had lied.8

Q Well, let me ask you this: People lie to you, you a9

Police Officer?10

A Yes.11

Q People lie to you, but don’t you still follow up, to12

see if some of what they’re saying to you is truthful?13

A Yes, I do.14

Q Okay. Why didn’t you do that in this case?15

A Because he had lied multiple times.16

Q Okay. So, so, when somebody lies to you multiple17

times, in your opinion, still follow up to see if some18

of what they’re saying is truthful, correct?19

A Correct.20

Q And you didn’t do that in this case, right?21

A Not in this case.22

Q Thank you. Okay. With regards to Tyler, you heard23

about Tyler, in that interview, correct?24

A Yes, sir.25

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Q Did you do any investigation of Tyler?1

A I did, sir.2

Q You did?3

A Yes.4

Q What did you do?5

A I entered his name into our Detroit Police Crime6

reporting unit. I entered first name, because that’s7

all I had. And like I said yesterday, there were8

thousands of names, you know, that came up with, Tyler.9

Q Now, you would agree with me that in that interview,10

you talked to Mr. Terrance about Tyler, right?11

A Yes.12

Q You didn’t ask him for his last name, did you?13

A No.14

Q You didn’t ask him for where he might live, did you?15

A No.16

Q You didn’t ask him, how old is Tyler, did you?17

A No.18

Q You didn’t ask him, do you know what school Tyler19

attends, if any, correct?20

A Correct.21

Q You didn’t ask him, when was the last time you saw22

Tyler, correct?23

A Correct.24

Q You didn’t even ask him, do you know if Tyler knows25

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Isis, did you?1

A No.2

Q Why?3

A We’re talking about a gentleman who did not tell me4

that there was an Isis involved, over the two times5

that I encountered him, that I chased him down, to his6

court dates. He didn’t mention anything about anybody7

beating up his girlfriend.8

Q Now, you would agree with me -- I’m gonna stop you9

here. 10

You would agree with me that you stopped11

someone out on the street, and you want to talk to ‘em,12

they do not have to talk to you, is that correct?13

A Absolutely.14

Q They have a Constitutional right not to say one word to15

you, correct?16

A Absolutely.17

Q So, while you’re in the interview with him, and he is18

talking to you, you don’t ask him any questions, any19

particular questions about the other, about the20

individuals that he’s brought up to you, namely, Tyler,21

Isis, and Germaine, correct?22

A If Mrs. Tillman died as a result of an assault, I would23

have. 24

But she died as a result of asphyxiate.25

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Q You would agree with me that when you look at those1

autopsy pictures, just particularly with regards to the2

bruising on Miss Tillman, a crime was committed,3

correct?4

A Absolutely.5

Q And you, as Police Officer, sworn to uphold the law,6

correct?7

A Absolutely, sir.8

Q And in upholding the law, you want to identify people9

who have been alleged to have committed a crime, to10

make sure that you can either eliminate them, or in --11

or submit them for prosecution, correct?12

A Absolutely, counsel.13

Q And you were told by Mr. Terrance, that Miss Tillman14

was beaten by Isis, correct?15

A Yes.16

Q But yet, you don’t do any follow up, any significant17

follow up, on trying to iden -- locate Isis, and18

company, correct?19

A Correct, sir.20


Honor.22

Oh, now, I do have a question.23

Q (By Mr. Harris): With regards to going to Ferndale,24

and with regards to going to Royal Oak, did you create25

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a Crisnet report with regards to that?1

A No, sir. 2

Q Why?3

A Because we are not -- it’s not something that we have4

to do.5

Q It’s not something that you have to do?6

A Yes.7

Q Okay. You interviewed this young man, correct?8

A Correct.9

Q You created a Crisnet report with regards to that,10

correct?11

A Not because we interviewed him.12

Q That’s not what I said. What I said is, you created a13

Crisnet report with regards to that interview, correct?14

A With regards to the interview, yes, I did.15

Q Okay. So, you selectively choose, pick and choose,16

when you want to do a Crisnet report, is that correct?17

A Not at all, sir.18

Q Okay. Well, you would agree with me that, if you had19

created a Crisnet report, that it indicated that you20

went to Ferndale, and that you went to Royal Oak, to21

find Isis, that would be a part of the discovery that22

you got to turn over to the defense, is that correct?23

A Not at all.24

Q Oh, it wouldn’t? 25

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A No, sir. 1

Q A Crisnet report that you created, in a murder case,2

would not be turned over to discovery, to the defense?3

A Crisnet report, with regards to a case, yes.4

Doing follow up on the investigation, no.5

Q You would also agree with me, that there is follow up 6

a -- follow up on an investigation, and Crisnet reports7

are created, correct?8

A In return -- in regards to what, evidence, or --9

Q Yes.10

A Definitely in terms of evidence.11

Q You --12

A If I’m placin’ something on evidence, absolutely, I13

have to generate a Crisnet report. 14

Q Okay. How about if you investigated, and had -- and15

interviewed a witness? Can’t you create a Crisnet16

report with regards to that, after the investigation is17

completed?18

A I could.19

Q Yes.20

A Yes.21

Q And you, like you said, you did not create a Crisnet22

report, with regards to Isis, and her -- your23

investigation of Isis, correct?24

A Correct, sir.25

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MR. HARRIS: No further questions.1

THE COURT: Okay. 2

Ms. Rubio?3



BY MS. RUBIO: 6

Q At one point during the questioning, on cross-7

examination, when asked about Germaine, you indicated,8

I believe, correct me if I’m wrong, but in response to9

defense counsel’s question, you indicated that10

something that you said to the defendant, about11

Germain, in the interview, was not true. Do you12

remember that?13

A Yes, ma’am.14

Q Okay. So, let me ask you this: Are you allowed, by15

law, during an interrogation of a defendant or a16

suspect, to lie, in certain situations?17

A Yes, ma’am.18

Q Okay. And why is that?19

A During an interrogation, sometimes we come across20

information that we are able to use, to extract 21

infor -- information from a suspect, i.e., lying, or22

triggered. Those are allowed.23

That’s what I did, in terms of this24

interview. 25

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I then interjected a Germaine, into the1

conversation, to get a reaction from the de -- from the2

defendant.3

He played well into it, and excluded4

Germaine, totally, from the investigation, as well as5

the, the other people that brought up.6

Q Okay. Counsel asked you multiple questions about Isis7

Terrell, and Tyler, who you only have a first name for.8

A Yes, ma’am.9

Q If you recollect, talking about Tyler first, what was10

it that the defendant said about Tyler?11

A I can’t recall exactly, but it was after another name12

that he said, that Germaine, his boy, Tyler. But13

that’s the extent --14

Q Do you recall if the, if the defendant said anything to15

you, that would lead you to believe that Tyler was a16

part of this crime?17

A No.18

Q No, you don’t recall; or no, you don’t believe he would19

have been part of the crime?20

A Uhm, going back -- no, I don’t, I don’t think he was a21

part of the crime. I don’t think he was part of the22

crime.23

Q Okay. And the defendant -- was the defendant the 24

per -- the only person to bring up the name, Tyler?25

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A Yes.1

Q Okay. Did you come across the name, Tyler, anywhere2

else in your investigation?3

A No, ma’am. 4

Q Okay. And during that three hour interview, did the5

defendant give you a last name, an address, a phone6

number, for Tyler?7

A No, ma’am. 8

Q Oh, okay. And during that interview, you -- I believe9

you testified that, on more than just today, I believe10

you testified, this was the first time you’d ever heard11

the name, Isis Terrell, is that what you said?12

A Yes, ma’am.13

Q Okay. During that three hour interview, did the14

defendant give you a last known address, a phone15

number, for Isis Terrell?16

A No, ma’am, not at all.17

Q Okay. Did the defendant indicate that he saw Isis18

Terrell beat up Dalona Tillman?19

A No, ma’am. 20

Q Did the defendant indicate that any of these people,21

Isis, Germaine, Tyler, had ever -- had, had come into22

his home, on the day of the murder of Dalona Tillman?23

A No, ma’am. 24

Q No, he did not indicate that?25

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A No, he didn’t indicate that at all.1

Q Okay. Did you ask him about that?2

A Yes.3

Q What did he say?4

A No. He said they never -- he didn’t allow any of them5

to come into the house, and they were not there on that 6

day.7

Q Okay. Regarding the Mendota neighborhood -- I’m sorry,8

let me back up.9

First, can you explain what the, the term,10

canvass, means, in, in Police terms?11

A Canvass is a term that we use in an effort to, let’s12

just say a crime happens in one particular location. 13

There is some -- there’s a surrounding area, around14

that particular location. Myself, or either someone15

that I work with, will then go to each, a certain area16

around the, surrounding, that we believe that may or17

may not be involved, around the crime scene. 18

So, that’s what canvassing is.19

Q Is that typical to do in a homicide investigation?20

A Yes, ma’am.21

Q Okay. And to your knowledge, was that done around the22

Mendota address, in this case?23

A Yes, ma’am.24

Q Okay. But you weren’t the one to do it?25

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A No.1

Q Okay. During the course of a homicide investigation,2

do -- is there often more than one homicide Detective3

working the case?4

A Yes.5

Q If the defendant tells you something, in your mind,6

does that make it true?7

A No.8

Q Okay. And what division of the Detroit Police9

Department are you assigned to?10

A Homicide.11

Q Okay. And so, does that mean that you basically12

investigate homicide cases?13

A Yes, ma’am, just homicide cases.14

Q Thank you. 15


THE COURT: Mr. --17


By MR. HARRIS: 19

Q Detective Mason, you would agree with me that, in that20

interview, you did not ask Mr. Terrell -- Terrance, to21

give you the address of Tyler, correct?22

A Correct, sir.23

Q You did not ask him to give you an address for Isis, is24

that correct?25

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A Correct.1

Q You did not ask for Mr. Terrance to give you the2

address for Jada, correct?3

A Let me back track. I did not. My partner, in turn,4

did ask for any additional information for Isis.5

Q Okay. You nor your partner asked for any additional6

information with regards to Jada, correct?7

A I did not. My partner did.8

Q You nor your partner didn’t ask for any additional --9

for the address for Jada, correct?10

A I did not, sir.11

Q You or your partner asked for the address of Germaine12

is that correct?13

A I did not, sir.14

Q And let’s get this straight, when you bring Mr.15

Terrance in for an interview, your objective is to get16

him to confess to a crime, is that correct?17

A Absolutely.18

Q That’s the whole purpose of you doin’ this, correct?19

A Absolutely.20

Q And if he does that, all bets are off, correct?21

A If he confesses to the crime, then I --22

Q It’s done?23

A Yes.24

Q Right?25

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A Yes.1

Q He did not confess to a crime, correct?2

A No.3

Q And since your objective is to get him to confess to a4

crime, any other additional information that you learn,5

i.e., about a Jada, getting into a fight, or anything6

of that nature, would be irrelevant to you, correct?7

A Repeat that, sir?8

Q You would agree with me that, since your objective was9

to get Mr. Terrance to admit to a crime, and if he10

doesn’t do that, any other information that he supplies11

to you, with regards to somebody that could have done12

the crime, is irrelevant to you, correct?13

A If they have direct involvement, the way she died,14

absolutely. 15

Q Well, you were told that she was kicked, and that the16

deceased had indicated that Isis did this to her,17

correct? That’s what you were told?18

A That Isis did what, sir?19

Q Beat her up, put her in the position that she was in,20

on December the 15th, 2016 --21

A I was --22

Q Or -- strike that. 2015?23

A I was told that she got beat up by Isis.24

Q Correct. Correct. But since your mind set, and your25

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direction, and your objective -- excuse me, your1

objective was to get Mr. Terrance to admit to a crime,2

the fact that you learned that somebody else could have3

beat her up, was irrelevant to you, correct?4


Q Thank you. 6


THE COURT: Anything further, Ms. Rubio?8



Q Who told you that the deceased said that Isis beat her11

up?12

A Who told me that the deceased said that? Oh, Mr.13

Terrance.14

Q Oh, thank you. And is it safe to say, this is not your15

first homicide trial?16

A Yes, ma’am, safe to say.17

Q All right. Have you participated, as an Officer in18

charge, in trials where there have not been19

confessions?20

A Yes, ma’am.21

Q Have you participated in homicide trials where there22

have been confessions?23

A Yes, ma’am.24

Q Oh, okay.25

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I do want to play People’s Exhibit 8, and2

then I wanted to --3

THE COURT: That’s premature, counsel.4

MS. RUBIO: Oh, I’m sorry.5

THE COURT: Mr. Harris, do you have any6

further questions?7


THE COURT: Members of the jury, do any of9

you have any questions for the witness?10

If so, please raise your hand?11

Okay. 12

I see a hand. Can you write your question,13

please?14

Counsel, you can approach.15



THE COURT: Okay. 18

Why wasn’t Germaine, Tyler, and Isis brought19

to be questioned, regardless of hearsay?20

WITNESS: As a result of the way that Miss21

Tillman died, one reason I didn’t bother -- well, I did22

attempt to contact Germaine, as I stated yesterday.23

She died as a result of asphyxiation, for24

one.25

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And two, Mr. Terrance, himself, eliminated1

all of those people as being involved.2

So, I didn’t bother.3

He said, nobody had come into the house. 4

They weren’t there that day, and she died -- not being5

beat up.6


Q (Continuing By Ms. Rubio): Just to be clear, what8

information did you have regarding Tyler?9

A A first name.10

Q Okay. So, not a last name, no phone number, no11

address?12

A Correct.13

Q Okay. And you indicated, just a moment ago, you said14

that you did attempt to locate Germaine?15

A Yes.16

Q Okay. And I believe you previously testified that you17

did also attempt to locate Isis Terrell, is that, is18

that right?19

A Yes, ma’am.20

Q Okay. 21

MS. RUBIO: No other questions.22




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Q You would agree with me that your assumption was that1

the injuries that occurred to Miss Tillman, occurred2

inside that house, correct?3

A No, sir. 4

Q Did you just say, no?5

A You’re talkin’ about the assault that supposedly6

happened, outside?7

Q Yes.8

A Yeah, your client told me that they happened outside of9

the house. They didn’t happen inside.10

Q No, but you assumed they happened inside the house,11

correct?12

A No, I didn’t assume that. I was told that, by your13

client.14

Q Well, let me ask you: Before my client told you that,15

did you assume that she had been injured inside the16

house?17

A That she had been smothered, and then, and there was18

blood inside there?19

Q Let’s talk about her injuries. Did you -- about the20

injuries of the bruising, and the, and the cut over her21

head. Did you assume that that occurred inside the22

house, prior to talking to my client?23

A I didn’t assume that.24

Q Okay. Was that your theory?25

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A Because there was blood inside the house?1

Q Please answer my question, sir. Don’t ask me a2

question. I’m asking you a question.3

A Well, I’d have to --4

Q Now, would you please --5

A Completely understand it --6

Q Answer --7

A In an effort to answer your question.8

Q Well, would you please answer my question?9

Did you make an assumption, prior to talking10

to my client, that her injuries, the bruising, and the11

cuts on her forehead, and the cut in her mouth,12

occurred inside the house?13

A I didn’t make an assumption.14

Q Okay. So, your answer would be, no, right?15

So, given that your answer would be, no, and16

then you later learned that -- of this person named17

Isis, and this person named Jada Monique, wouldn’t it18

make sense to bring those individuals -- try to bring19

those individuals in, to question them?20

A I would, had he been -- had she died as a result of21

being assaulted.22

Q You just told the jury, though, that the reason, in23

answer to juror number four’s question, the reason you24

didn’t bring those individuals in, is because you25

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eliminated all of those people as, as being -- that 1

Tie -- that Terrell Terrance -- strike that. Let me2

rephrase.3

You told juror number four, you told this4

jury, in answer to juror number four’s question, that5

you -- that Terrance -- Terrell -- excuse me. That6

Terrance eliminated all of those people as being7

involved? 8

And that’s based on the assumption, correct9

me if I’m wrong, that those injuries occurred inside10

the house?11

A I base my investigation on the Doctor’s ruling, as well12

as Mr. Terrance, statement to me. That’s all I had to13

go on.14





Q When you’re assigned to a case, as an Officer in19

charge, do you make assumptions about anything that20

occurred?21

A I can assume, but I have to disprove it.22

Q You have to disprove?23

A Mm-hmm.24

Q Do you also try to prove?25

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A Mm-hmm.1

Q Yes?2

A Yes, ma’am. I’m sorry.3

Q Okay. 4



Honor.7


are there any more questions?9

If so, please raise your hand.10

Seeing no hands.11

You can step down, sir. Thank you. 12

WITNESS: Thank you. 13

(Whereupon the witness was excused).14


MS. RUBIO: At this time, I just want to,16

wanted to place a stipulation on the record.17

Defense counsel and I have agreed to18

stipulate that, during the interview video, of19

defendant Treshaun Terrance, there was mention of a20

warrant.21

The warrant referenced during that video22

interview was in reference to a civil traffic offense.23

MR. HARRIS: Yes, so stipulated.24

THE COURT: Thank you, counsel.25

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Anything further, Ms. Rubio?1

MS. RUBIO: Yes, at this time, the People2

would like to play People’s No. 8.3




And is Exhibit 8 already in evidence, I7

believe. Is that true?8

MS. RUBIO: Yes, it is.9

MR. HARRIS: It is, Your Honor.10



You may play the video, or the audio.13

(Whereupon People’s Exhibit No. 8 was played14

in open court).15

MS. RUBIO: I think that’s an unrelated call. 16

I apologize.17

MR. HARRIS: That’s okay.18

THE COURT: Okay. 19

Ms. Rubio?20


THE COURT: Any further witnesses?22

MS. RUBIO: No. At this time, the People23

have no further witnesses, and the People rest.24

THE COURT: Okay. 25

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Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, we are1

gonna take a short recess, at this time, okay?2

So, I’m gonna ask you to retire to the jury3

room.4



courtroom).7


MR. HARRIS: Your Honor, may I take a brief9

rest room break?10


MR. HARRIS: Pardon?12



proceedings from 10:35 a.m. to 10:58 a.m.)15

THE COURT: Okay. 16



Deputy, can we get Mr. Terrance, or is he19

being -- 20

Counsel, you want to come forward, briefly?21

MS. RUBIO: Okay. 22



THE COURT: Okay. 25

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All right. 1

Once again, we’re on the record in 2


Your appearances?4



Harris on behalf of Mr. Terrance, who is present in the7

courtroom, Your Honor. 8

THE COURT: Okay. 9

I don’t think I asked you this, on the10

record, but it is my recollection that the parties have11

reviewed the jury verdict form, and agree that the jury12

verdict form that has been prepared and provided to13

you, is the appropriate verdict form. Is that correct?14




Inasmuch as the People have rested, Mr.18

Harris, let me ask you: Do you intend on calling any19

witnesses?20

MR. HARRIS: No, I do not.21


So, I’m assuming you are not going to call23

your client. Do you wish to voir dire your client?24

MR. HARRIS: Yes, I do, Your Honor.25

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Sir, can you tell us your name?2

DEFENDANT: Treshaun -- 3

MR. HARRIS: Stand up.4

DEFENDANT: Treshaun Terrance.5

THE COURT: Okay. 6

Mr. Harris?7

MR. HARRIS: Your Honor, could you swear Mr.8

Terrance?9

THE COURT: Sure.10

Sir, can you raise your right hand?11



and nothing but the truth?14

DEFENDANT: Yes.15

THE COURT: Okay. 16

Mr. Harris?17

MR. HARRIS: Mr. Terrance, I have been your18

lawyer throughout this particular case, is that19

correct?20

DEFENDANT: Yes.21

MR. HARRIS: Since its except -- since its22

except -- inception, correct?23

DEFENDANT: Yes.24

MR. HARRIS: And you and I have talked about25

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many aspects of this case, during the time that we’ve1

been together, correct?2


MR. HARRIS: One of the aspects we’ve talked4

about is your right to testify in this trial, correct?5

DEFENDANT: Yes.6

MR. HARRIS: You do understand, you have a7

Constitutional right to testify in this trial, correct?8

DEFENDANT: Yes.9

MR. HARRIS: You also understand that if you10

do not testify in this trial, the jury cannot hold that11

against you, meaning, they can’t say that because you12

didn’t testify, you must be guilty, right?13

DEFENDANT: Right.14

MR. HARRIS: Now, you and I have talked15

extensively about your right to testify, correct?16

DEFENDANT: Yes.17

MR. HARRIS: And you have indicated to me18

that you do not want to testify, is that correct?19


MR. HARRIS: And is that your position today,21

in front of this Court?22

DEFENDANT: Yes.23

MR. HARRIS: Judge, I leave him for any24

further voir dire.25

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THE COURT: Mr. Terrance, do you understand1

that is your decision, and your decision alone, as to2

whether or not to testify in this case?3

DEFENDANT: Yes.4

THE COURT: And today, you are deciding that5

you do not wish to testify, is that true?6

DEFENDANT: Yes.7

THE COURT: Okay. 8

Mr. Harris?9

MR. HARRIS: I have no further questions.10

THE COURT: Okay. 11

Thank you. 12

You can have a seat.13

Anything else before we bring out the jury?14

MR. HARRIS: Yes, Your Honor. I’d like to15

make a motion.16

THE COURT: You -- the record should reflect17

that you have made your motion.18

We will take it up -- I want to --19

MR. HARRIS: May we approach, Your Honor?20

THE COURT: Yeah.21



MR. HARRIS: Your Honor, on behalf of Mr.24

Terrance, I make a motion for directed verdict in this25

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particular matter.1

I know the Court knows the case law in2

accordance with People versus Hampton.3

I would indicate to this Court, as a matter4

of law, the Prosecutor has not proven, one, the element5

of first degree murder, in terms of premeditation; and6

second, with regards to count two, the element of7

torture, as it relates to felony murder.8

I would ask this Court, as a matter of law,9

to direct a verdict in favor of Mr. Terrance.10

Thank you. 11


MS. RUBIO: Your Honor, I would just13

indicate, pursuant to People v Hampton, 404 Mich 354,14

in the -- taken in the light most favorable to the15

People, the People submit that we have presented16

evidence on each material element of each offense, and17

that now it would be in the province of the jury, and18

it’s a question of fact for the jury.19

THE COURT: The Court is going to deny the20

defendant’s motion, inasmuch as I do believe that,21

reviewing the evidence in the light most favorable to22

the non-moving party, that a -- that there has been23

some amount of evidence, with respect to each of the24

elements, and that a question of fact does exist, which25

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will be determined by the jury.1

Anything further?2



THE COURT: Okay. 5

Let’s have the jury.6


(Whereupon the jury was brought back into the8

courtroom).9


THE COURT: Okay. 11

We are back on the record in case 12




MR. HARRIS: Good morning, Your Honor, and16

good morning, ladies and gentlemen of the jury. Wyatt17

Harris on behalf of Treshaun Terrance. 18

THE COURT: Okay. 19

Mr. Harris, the People have rested. 20

MR. HARRIS: Yes. 21

Your Honor, I’d waive my opening statement,22

and defense rests.23

THE COURT: Okay. 24

Thank you for that.25

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Ladies and gentlemen, at this time, you are1

going to hear from the People. Miss Rubio will deliver2

her closing argument, at this time.3

Go ahead.4


CLOSING ARGUMENT BY MS. RUBIO6

When both myself and Mr. Harris are done7

giving what we call our closing argument, the Judge8

will read a lot of law to you, that you’re to follow. 9

They’re called instructions.10

So, the Judge is the finder of the law, but11

you are the finders of the fact.12

It is up to you to decide, and deliberate, in13

that room, about the facts that you have heard over the14

past several days.15

I want to highlight some of the evidence, and16

first I want to highlight some of the instructions,17

regarding the elements of each offense, that I’m18

required to prove to you beyond a reasonable doubt.19

First, you’re gonna get instructions20

regarding murder in the first degree.21

You’re going to hear, and again,22

highlighting, so you’ll hear it at length, from the23

Judge.24

The Judge will basically say that you’re to25

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find that I’ve proven each element beyond a reasonable1

doubt.2

And the first thing is that the defendant3

caused the death of Dalona Tillman. That’s the first4

element.5

Next, it would be that the defendant intended6

to kill Dalona Tillman.7

Then, one of the elements is that there was8

no justification for killing Dalona Tillman, and that9

the defendant had a chance to think twice.10

You will hear, when you listen to that11

instruction, there is no set amount of time for12

premeditation.13

You may recall, during voir dire, when we14

were selecting a jury. I spoke briefly about, gave an15

example of, myself, being on various diets. And then16

that odious moment when the cake is set on the table,17

with a bunch of forks, and I have a second to decide.18

Am I gonna blow my diet right now, or am I19

gonna have some cake?20

That’s enough time to deliberate.21

I just took about ten to fifteen second to22

walk around what, what’s called the galley, of this23

courtroom.24

Obviously, I knew what I was doing. And I, I25

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decided to walk to the end of the galley, and then back1

in front of you.2

You will recall the testimony of the Medical3

Examiner, as to the cause of death regarding this4

woman, Dalona Tillman.5

You will recall that she, aside from the6

multiple injuries, that the Medical Examiner testified7

to, she indicated that the cause of death of8

suffocation.9

You heard that a lot throughout this trial.10

The cause of death was asphyxia, or11

smothering, kind of a -- in laymen’s terms, smothering.12

And she explained to you how she knew,13

definitively, that’s how Dalona Tillman died. No other14

way.15

She said, all of those injuries, literally16

from head to toe, did not, were not attributable to her17

cause of death. 18

It was smothering, as was evidenced by what19

she referred to as, a band of pallor.20

You will have the opportunity to take all of21

the Exhibits with you, and review them. 22

I will indicate to you, when you do that, you23

will see the skin, in the area of her nose and mouth,24

is literally a different color than the rest of her25

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skin.1

Also, there are various photographs of teeth2

imprints, all along, on the inside of her mouth, which3

she said cannot be caused by a punch. 4

She said that there is one abrasion inside 5

of -- or a tear, inside the mouth, that can be caused,6

could possibly have been caused, by a punch.7

And this, when you think about it, and you8

are allowed to use your common sense and reasoning. 9

The Judge will in, instruct you as to that, too.10

When you think about it, this makes sense,11

because if someone punches someone, the fist does not12

contact the face, and sit there for a long time.13

There’s a punch, and a with -- and, and the14

fist is immediately withdrawn.15

Common sense.16

Now, what the Medical Examiner said is that17

the length of time that it takes to smother someone to18

death, as in this case, is a minimum of ninety seconds,19

all the way up to three minutes.20

So, the last moment of this young woman’s21

life, was her being smothered to death.22

It took me ten to fifteen seconds to walk23

around this courtroom. And all of you probably24

thought, why is she silent? Why is she talking? What25

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is she doing?1

That was ten to fifteen seconds. 2

Think about a minute and a half to three3

minutes.4

So, that is plenty of time for a5

premeditation.6

Plenty of time to think about what you’re7

doing, while you’re smothering this person, to death.8

The other infor -- the other information that9

the Court will give you, he will give you an10

instruction on what’s called, felony murder.11

Felony murder has several of the same12

elements: That the defendant caused the death; and13

that the defendant, at the time, intended to kill14

Dalona Tillman; or intended to do great bodily harm,15

knowing that death was likely.16

And again, there’s no justification.17

And, here’s some -- the only thing that’s18

different:19

When he was killing her, that he either20

committed the offense of, or tried to commit the21

offense of torture.22

Now, and the Judge will also instruct you,23

give you the law, regarding torture.24

I just want to highlight, regarding the crime25

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of torture. 1

That would be that the defendant had physical2

control over her; 3

And that this was without her consent.4

Additionally, that there was -- that he5

intentionally caused great bodily harm, and or extreme6

physical pain.7

Again, I refer you to the testimony of the8

Medical Examiner, who testified that this young woman9

had over seventy abrasions, she was injured, her words10

were, Medical Examiner, literally from head to toe.11

And she said that the number of bruises she12

had were innumerable. 13

You saw the photos. You can look at them14

again.15

And she also had seven incised wounds.16

I submit to you that the only issue you may17

have, in your mind, at the, at this moment, the only18

element that you will have to deliberate when you go19

back into that room, is whether or not you think the20

defendant did it.21

She was killed. There is nothing to the22

contrary. We know she was killed. We know she had a23

horrible end of her life. That is obvious.24

We know she was smothered to death. That is25

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the testimony of the Medical Examiner; that is the1

cause of death. We know that. You don’t have to think2

about that.3

So, those elements have been met.4

We also know, at the very end of her life, if5

that’s not torture, I have no idea what is. We know6

that that happened.7

We also know, there was no justification for8

the brutal murder of this poor woman.9

So, when you go in the back, to deliberate,10

all of these things are things, you can just check11

those little boxes off. You don’t even have to12

consider it.13

I submit to you that the only thing that you14

might debate, at this moment, in your mind, as to,15

well, are you sure the defendant did it?16

I’m gonna tell you why we’re sure the17

defendant did it.18

Now, let’s -- I just want to highlight some19

of the testimony that I think is important.20

Starting with the E.M.S. drivers. 21

There is -- you heard testimony from two, the22

two E.M.S. drivers, who responded to the scene.23

And you may recall, there was testimony that24

when they arrived, they saw the defendant, kind of25

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outside, trying to wave ‘em down.1

Then, they come in, and they say that when2

they arrive, that Ms. Tillman is on the couch.3

And they say that, they ask, the only other4

person in the house, that being the defendant, well,5

what happened?6

And he says, at first, well, she wasn’t7

feeling good, so she smoked some weed, and then laid8

down.9

That’s his explanation, as to what happened10

to her.11

Then, upon further questioning, he says, oh,12

well, she got in a fight yesterday.13

Okay. These are two wildly different things. 14

Already, he has contradicted himself.15

Then he goes, with the E.M.S. drivers, in16

their vehicle. We hear that one of the drivers is in17

back, trying to do whatever he can, even though he did,18

he did also testify that there was no heart beat or19

pulse of, of this young woman, at the scene.20

And the driver says that the defendant is in21

the cab, in the front, with him. So, of course, we22

know the driver’s in the driver’s seat, and then that23

means the defendant’s in the passenger’s seat.24

And at one point, he says, he looks over and25

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sees the defendant on the phone. And he’s holding up1

his hand, that would face the driver. And he sees2

something that he suspects to be dried blood, on his3

hand.4

I submit to you that he has a good memory. 5

He also remembers seeing a tattoo on the defendant’s6

hand.7

And then he says that the defendant8

indicates, that he actually indicated to him, that he9

didn’t want to take her last breath.10

And I submit to you, that is definitely11

something anyone would remember, ‘cause it’s an unusual12

thing for someone to say.13

So, of course, you’re gonna remember that. 14

That’s gonna stick in your mind, as an E.M.S. driver.15

We also heard some testimony, brief, but from16

the mother of the deceased, that being Narvetta17

Tillman.18

Now, Ms. Tillman indicates that, at the19

hospital, you know, she confronted the defendant. She20

accused him of doing it. You’re the one who did this.21

And he leaves, walks out of the hospital, and22

he is standin’ there, talkin’ on the phone, she23

indicates that she sees him talkin’ on her daughter’s24

phone. Her daughter, who’s lying dead, in the25

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hospital.1

So, she feels she has the right to go up and2

get the phone.3

You know what his response is? Not, I am so4

sorry that this woman died. I wish I could have5

helped. Nothin’. 6

Hey, guess who did it? These are the two7

women.8

You know what he says? I paid for the phone. 9

That’s your response? 10

That should tell you volumes about not only11

what he did, that he did, that he did this. What kind12

of person he is. 13

That’s what he says to her.14

I paid for the phone.15

And we know he said this because he also says16

the same thing, in the interrogation.17

That’s his response.18

Six weeks later, he’s still fixated on that.19

Well, she wanted the pone back, but I paid20

the bill, and I paid for the phone.21

Really? That’s what we’re talking about22

right now? That’s what you’re focused on?23

Your girlfriend is dead, but you paid for the24

phone. 25

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Then we hear from Officer Johnson, who 1

testifies about the arrest of the defendant.2

And we hear that, he gives a different name. 3

He gives a false name.4

Why?5

Glean from that what you may.6

We ultimately hear from the Officer in7

charge, who is one of the members who participated in8

the interrogation, or the interview of the defendant.9

You obviously saw the interview. Very long.10

About, about three hours.11

And -- but before that, we heard from this12

Officer in charge, that this wasn’t the first time that13

he met up with him, in relation to this case.14

He indicated, it took a while for the Medical15

Examiner to ultimately declare the cause of death. 16

You heard the Medical Examiner say, and17

that’s because this is routine in smothering cases. 18

They like to -- they have to, actually rule all kinds19

of other things out.20

She said, that is the procedure.21

That is, is a diagnosis of exclusion. Those22

were her words.23

So, it took approximately six weeks.24

During that time, Officer in charge tracked25

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the defendant down, not once, but twice.1

And, you heard from -- on cross-examination,2

the defend -- defense counsel did elicit testimony from3

the Officer in charge that the defendant was not4

required to talk to him. He wasn’t under arrest.5

That’s exactly true.6

But, if what the defendant says is true, you7

know, Sally Sue and whoever else, beat her up, this is8

information you would immediately want the Police to9

have, to get justice for your girlfriend, of two years,10

who you loved and cared about.11

No. So, the firs time, nothin’.12

Second time, nothin’.13

Third time, when he’s singing like a canary,14

telling all kinds of things, for three hours straight,15

this is after he’s under arrest, for the murder of16

Dalona Tillman.17

Now, he’s got a bunch of things to say. Now,18

it was, Isis Terrell. Now it was, Jada Monique, who19

doesn’t exist, who nobody could find, including the20

Officer in charge.21

Now, Tyler, first name, no last name, no22

address, no phone number. Tyler, who he heard, said23

that she died from a brain aneurysm, not that she had24

anything to do with the death, but there’s the mention25

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of Tyler.1

And then there’s, Germaine.2

But, as we heard from the defendant, nobody3

needs to worry about any of those people, because the4

defendant said, multiple times, nobody was in the house5

on the day of her death.6

In fact, nobody comes to our house. Nobody.7

He says it, multiple times. I can’t even8

count how many times.9

So, none of those people are relevant.10

But, I do submit that it’s very interesting11

that six weeks later, all these names are coming up,12

out of the mouth of the defendant.13

So, I would say to you that when you think14

about the death of Dalona Tillman, and when you go in15

the back, and look, and think about the elements, I16

would submit to you that I have proven this case beyond17

a reasonable doubt.18

And I ask for a verdict of guilty as charged.19



CLOSING ARGUMENT BY MR. HARRIS22

Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, you saw an23

interview yesterday. 24

And I will tell you, right now, that anything25

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that the Police said, any questions, or statements that1

they made, are not evidence, and you are totally ignore2

it, and the Judge is gonna give you that, that3

instruction.4

That simple. Whatever the Police said in5

that interview, you are not to consider.6

Now, here’s the reason why they want to play7

the video, because it sets, in your mind, what their8

theory of the case is.9

That’s all the reason they want to play it.10

Because what else did you hear?11

You heard Mr. Terrance say that he did not12

kill Dalona, didn’t smother her, didn’t beat her.13

That’s evidence. That’s what you should14

listen to.15

And quite frankly, that’s reasonable doubt.16

That’s your reasonable doubt.17

Now, what did he tell you?18

He told you that she left the home. 19

She was going to her father’s to get food,20

for them.21

She comes back shortly, she’s out of breath.22

She falls into his arms. She set -- he sets23

her on the couch.24

She tells you, I think I’m finnin’ to die.25

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She comes back with these marks on her face,1

and her mouth all messed up.2

That’s what he tells you.3

He tells you he did not smother her.4

He tells you he did not put those marks on5

her body.6

And he did not put those marks on her face.7

Folks, truth is stranger than fiction.8

I know, you can sit here and say, well, he9

was the only one there.10

Well, wait a second. Evidence you heard is,11

these incident -- this incident occurred before she12

came back to the house.13

You heard the Medical Examiner say, breathing14

problems can occur from getting hit in the mouth.15

And when you think about it, just think about16

it. Think about what this young man did. 17

He told you, in that interview, he called his18

mama. That’s what a seventeen year old does.19

Mama, I don’t know what the hell’s goin’ on. 20

Help me.21

That’s not unreasonable.22

He calls 9-1-1. 23

You heard that 9-1-1 tape. 24

This man was emotionally spent by what was25

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goin’ on.1

Wasn’t making any excuses about what was2

happening with her.3

Told the 9-1-1 operator, yes, he didn’t4

follow everything she said. He was not calm.5

I wouldn’t expect a seventeen year old to be6

calm, in that situation.7

That is the woman that he loved, and she8

comes in, lookin’ like that, and in that kind of9

condition.10

He told the E.M.S. people that she scared me11

so bad.12

He’s definitely in agony, trying to do the13

chest compressions. Doesn’t know what the hell he’s14

doin’, but he’s tryin’.15

He is just as much in shock as she is.16

And see, you gotta pay attention to some17

things, ‘cause see, E.M.S. got up there and they sat,18

and sat, yeah, there was a man, on a porch, over there19

on Mendota, jumpin’ up and down. I don’t know if they20

were on the phone or not.21

Now, what did you hear in that 9-1-1 call? 22

You heard the operator, the 9-1-1 operator telling him23

to do chest compressions. Do thirty, and let me know24

what’s goin’ on.25

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And what’s the next thing you hear? You hear1

the E.M.S. come in, and say, hi, how are you doing?2

I asked them about, when you saw this3

individual on the porch, did you see him with a phone?4

They couldn’t tell you that.5

Why?6

Because they didn’t see that.7

They did not see that. And yes, that’s8

crucial because that’s how people make up stories.9

And if you don’t catch it, believe me, you10

can miss that. And you can just, oh, well, okay,11

that’s what happened.12

That’s not what happened, ‘cause you got the13

9-1-1 operator’s vid -- audio.14

He came inside that house. He was already15

inside that house.16

He was with Dalona. He wasn’t on a porch,17

jumpin’ up and down.18

So, now, let’s talk about blood on the hands,19

because I got somethin’ for that, too.20

You tellin’ me there’s blood on the hands,21

and you don’t tell anybody.22

You don’t tell a soul.23

You don’t go to the security and say, hey,24

this girl has been brought in, she’s been horribly beat25

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up, and this man’s got blood on his hands.1

You don’t tell the Police, hey, you need to2

detain him. This girl’s been brought in, she’s got3

blood on his hands.4

Your partner doesn’t say, he sees blood on5

her hand -- on his hands.6

Just the one E.M.S. driver.7

And let’s talk about the E.M.S. driver, and8

the activities that went on with Dalona, and just the9

E.M.S. driver.10

We don’t know what kind of treatment he11

applied to her, back in the back of that truck. And we12

don’t know what treatment caused her to have this13

pallor issue.14

They want you to believe the, the opinion of15

the Medical Examiner. And the Judge is gonna give you16

an instruction, and that instruction will tell you,17

with regards to the Medical Examiner, you don’t have to18

believe the expert’s opinion. 19

You know, it’s real easy, okay, yeah, I’m a20

Medical Examiner, so I’m gonna believe everything she21

says.22

You don’t have to believe that.23

Could there have been other ways in which24

this person’s face got pallor?25

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And here’s what I find really interesting: 1

Do any of the E.M.S. people that come into that house,2

and immediately see her, say that her face had pallor3

on it? That it appeared to palloric? Not at all.4

Does the E.M.S. driver that is with her, in5

the back of that truck, say, her face appeared with6

pallor?7

Not at all. Nobody says that.8

And you talkin’ about a discoloration of an9

African American’s face. We don’t know what happened10

there, from that standpoint.11

Now, they gonna get up and say, oh, yeah, we12

do. We do. We know that he put somethin’ over her13

face. 14

Did they find anything in that house that15

would give you some suggestion that he put somethin’16

over the face?17

Any kind of instrument, any kind of anything?18

Did they see any kind of finger prints over19

her face and nose?20

None.21

Did anybody testify to that?22

They don’t have any kind of documentation, or23

any kind of evidence for you, to suggest of what he24

did, ‘cause they don’t know.25

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And let me tell you somethin’, here’s the,1

here’s the real deal, folks: When the Police want to2

talk to you, they just don’t want to have a happy3

conversation with you, because they know what happened.4

‘Cause when you think about it, if they know5

what happened, they don’t need to talk to you, do they?6

They don’t need to say one word to you, if7

they know what happened.8

And I can tell you, one hundred percent of9

the time, if they come on a scene, they can’t tell you10

they know what happened, ‘cause guess why? They11

weren’t there. They didn’t see for themselves.12

There’s a crime that could be committed,13

right down the hall. Somebody could get beat up, beat14

the hell up out, out in the hall there.15

None of you, nobody in this room, could say16

they knew what happened.17

Why is that?18

‘Cause none of us are there to see it.19

So, when the Police want to talk to you, oh,20

yeah, there’s a couple things they got goin’ on there. 21

One, with regards to Mr. Terrance, they’re predisposed22

to say, he’s the man. All we gotta get him to do is23

say, he smothered this woman. That’s all we got to get24

him to do.25

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And once we do that, case closed.1

And surprise, what does Mr. Terrance do? At2

every turn, every question, everything that they ask3

him, he said, no, I did not do that.4

Problem, ‘cause he ain’t playin’ their game.5

He ain’t goin’ around -- along with the6

theory that they have, for how she died.7

And this is what supports it.8

He gives them the name of Isis Terrell. 9

And what does the Officer in charge do? 10

Well, I looked her up on Facebook, I couldn’t identify11

any kind of friends that she had.12

I went to Ferndale, talked to an old lady. 13

Didn’t ask the old lady any further questions, other14

than, after the old lady told me, hadn’t seen her in15

two years. 16

Didn’t ask her, well, do you know anybody17

that she associates with?18

How do you know her?19

How is she related to you, in any way?20

Doesn’t ask all those questions.21

There’s a reason you don’t ask those22

questions, folks, because that opens up the door,23

possibly.24

And if you have already decided, this is what25

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happened, you don’t want that door open.1

Oh, excuse me, wait a minute, wait a minute,2

wait a minute. We don’t want to create a Crisnet3

report, either. Oh, we don’t want to do that at all,4

because they know a fool like me is gonna get that, and5

we do a little investigation.6

And maybe we just might find Isis Terrell.7

Excuse me, the Detroit Police Department8

can’t find a seventeen year old girl. Give me a break.9

They don’t want to find her.10

That’s why they don’t have conversations with11

Germaine.12

That’s why they don’t have conversations with13

Tyler.14

Don’t want to meet Tyler.15

And yeah, she’s gonna get up here and say,16

well, you know, he couldn’t find this, and he couldn’t17

do this.18

Give me a break. This the government. They19

can find whoever the heck they wanna find.20

And we not gonna make any efforts to find21

her.22

We not gonna do that, because that then23

destroys our theory of the case, and it supports his.24

And we don’t want to do that. We just wanna25

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leave these fourteen people to believe he’s the one1

that did it.2

And as long as we don’t bring anybody else in3

this, there you are. You got it.4

You can tell, oh, no, we want you to do a5

thorough investigation.6

We want you to eliminate all suspects.7

We’re talking about a person’s life here.8

We’re talking about Dalona Tillman’s family9

here.10

I’m sure they don’t want to see someone11

suffer, if they didn’t commit the crime.12

I’m positive of that.13

Now, Mr. Terrance does, if you don’t want14

someone to know that you committed a crime, and let’s15

take the facts in this particular case.16

One of the last things you gonna do is call17

your mama.18

Really, the one thing you are going to do,19

which is reasonable, is leave the scene.20

I would just leave her there, and then I21

could be able to say, I don’t know how she died. I22

don’t have a clue. I don’t know.23

But if you’re up front, and you’re being24

honest, you do the things he did. Call your mother. 25

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Call 9-1-1. Ride with the E.M.S. worker. Be a part of1

the situation. Go to the hospital.2

Excuse me? Why are you goin’ on 9-1-1, you3

called the victim’s mom, and tell her. We’re at the4

hospital. Your daughter’s taken a turn for the worst,5

if you got nothing to be afraid of, and he doesn’t.6

And he did that.7

But if you afraid, if you strangle -- if you8

smothered her, oh, yeah, you not gonna -- you’re not9

gonna hang around to see that part. No way.10

Your innate sensibility said, I, no, I -- I’m11

not gonna be here. I don’t want them to identify me.12

Then the Officer makes a big deal about, I13

tried to contact him, and tried to talk to him. 14

Let me tell you, folks, free bit of legal15

advice: Never talk to the Police.16

And I know that’s against all our, our17

instinct -- innate sensibilities. I understand that.18

But as a matter of law, never talk to the19

Police, because you can wind up like this man, being20

charged with crimes for which he did not do.21

Do I think it’s wise that he was in that22

interview, and being questioned by these guys?23

No, I don’t think it’s wise.24

But he did it. 25

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And like I told you, he held up his own.1

But you don’t have to talk to the Police. 2

You have a Constitutional right.3

And I know every United States citizen says,4

oh, well, you know, I talk to the Police, and tell ‘em5

my side of the story.6

No, no, no, no, no.7

No, no, no, no, no.8

They got to prove your side -- they gotta9

prove their side of the story.10

That’s what the Constitution’s all about.11

Let ‘em prove it.12

Let ‘em prove it.13

Now, the Prosecutor has already told you the14

elements of felony murder, and the elements of first15

degree murder.16

And you’re gonna get the instructions from17

the Judge.18

Prosecutor didn’t prove their case beyond a19

reasonable doubt.20

And these are the elements that will show21

that:22

Number one, there’s no evidence that Mr.23

Terrance caused the death of Dalona Tillman. 24

And both of those elements are in both felony25

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murder, and first degree murder.1

Let me reverse it, so it makes it easier for2

you, when you get the, the jury instruction, and easier3

for you when you get the verdict form.4

Count one is first degree murder; count two5

is felony murder.6

So, let’s look at it from that standpoint.7

Now, with regards to first degree murder: 8

There’s no premeditation here. None whatsoever.9

The evidence you from Mr. Terrance is that10

she came into the house, and passed away, or at least11

was not breathing.12

Prosecutor wants to say, yeah, well, he13

smothered her in that time, caused you to have14

premeditation.15

Well, that’s not what, what’s -- that’s not16

the evidence that’s in front of you.17

That’s an assumption.18

And that’s all it is, an assumption.19

Now, with regards to felony murder: No20

torture here, on the part of Mr. Terrance. No torture21

at all.22

No torture in the least bit.23

And that’s one of the elements of felony24

murder, gotta be able to show that there was torture. 25

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And the Medical Examiner told you that none1

of the bruising that she had, the seventy-one injuries,2

and the seven incised wounds that she had, none of3

those caused her death.4

None of those caused her death.5

As I told you before, truth is stranger than6

fiction.7

And if you believe, which I ask that you do8

believe, that Mr. Terrance did not commit the crimes9

that he’s charged.10

Don’t let this -- you send a message to the11

Prosecutor, you send a message to the Police, do a12

thorough investigation of a case, and we’re not gonna13

allow you to impact this man’s life negatively. 14

Period.15

Thank you very much for your time and16

attention.17


REBUTTAL ARGUMENT BY MS. RUBIO19

I think the defense, defense counsel said a20

moment ago, you know, we don’t know what happened. We21

weren’t there.22

Well, if we were there, we’d be witnesses, so23

none of us would be sittin’ here.24

So, I am required, not to prove beyond all25

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doubt, one hundred percent.1

I’m required to prove beyond a reasonable2

doubt that the defendant is the one who committed these3

crimes against Ms. Dalona Tillman.4

The Judge will read to you the law, the5

instruction, as to what reasonable doubt is.6

But it pretty much is, what I just said, a7

reasonable doubt. Not any doubt.8

And certainly, I’m not, not required to prove9

this beyond all doubt.10

So, please, do not hold me to that standard.11

And another thing that counsel indicated was12

that, well, you know, anything that the Detective said,13

is not evidence.14

The Judge will read you an instruction that15

any questions, by anyone, questions are not evidence. 16

It’s -- the evidence is anything that has been admitted17

into evidence, or any testimony that is from the18

witness chair, sworn testimony.19

And then it’s for you to decide. You are the20

finders of the fact.21

Just because it, it’s admitted as evidence,22

doesn’t mean it’s so.23

So, okay, the defendant said, I didn’t do it.24

Oh, well, case closed. Let’s all go home.25

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Well, he said it, so, hmm, that’s gotta be1

true.2

Can any of you think, when you go back in the3

jury room, for a moment, why someone might not admit to4

a murder?5

I think you can.6

So, there are various ways that people may7

behave after murdering someone.8

Someone might, with resources, get on a plane9

and go to Mexico, and never come back.10

Someone might, all of a sudden, panic, and11

think, oh my God, I’ve got to cover this up. I’ve got12

to come up with a story.13

There’s not telling that, that -- how someone14

will act, after murdering another person.15

And there’s no book about it.16

So, people behave in different ways.17

And I submit to you that, this defendant18

murdered Ms. Tillman, and then quickly thought, what is19

he gonna try to do?20

Granted, in my opinion, his cover up was not21

very good.22

And, if in -- again, I submit to you, that23

the defendant basically tells you, he committed this24

crime.25

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You might think, for -- right now, when I1

just said that, wait a minute, did I miss something? I2

know we’ve been here for a few days, maybe I nodded off3

at one point. I’ve been tired, but did he actually say4

he did it?5

I’ll tell you why he said he did it.6

Okay. 7

Let’s talk about the 9-1-1 call, that counsel8

referred to, in his closing. This is very important.9

So, I want you to think about this when you10

go back there.11

The 9-1-1 call came in at one thirty-seven12

p.m., on the date of Ms. Tillman’s death.13

Go back to the interview, if you want, or use14

your collective memories.15

The defendant says, in this version of16

events, it’s him, his own mouth. So you don’t have to17

believe that somebody said, he said this.18

He says, in his interrogation, that she left19

the house between eleven and twelve a. -- between20

eleven a.m. and twelve p.m., on the day of her murder,21

because she was gonna go down, using his words, to her22

daddy’s house, to get somethin’ to eat.23

And that she was back in no more than five24

minutes. He said four to five minutes. 25

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So, let’s just assume, best case scenario,1

that it was almost noon.2

But he says, she’s only gone for a few3

minutes.4

That she comes back, knockin’ on the door to5

her own house. I’m sure not sure why, but that’s what6

she’s doing.7

Knocks on the door to her own house, and that8

he says, she’s, you know, just falls out, whatever.9

And just, just falls down.10

And then, so, believing his own words, he11

waits over an hour and a half, to call 9-1-1.12

What’s going on all that time? What is he13

doing?14

And then let’s talk about the 9-1-1 call15

itself.16

Yeah, he sounds all panicked, and upset, and17

then the dispatcher, the whole time, is trying to talk18

to him, and tell him what to do, and you know, I need19

you to remain calm, trying to explain C.P.R. to him.20

And at one point, she says to him, and this21

is almost to the end of the 9-1-1 call. It’s at, like,22

nine and a half minutes.23

She says, you know, I need you to do chest24

compressions. She explains how, to remove any pillows,25

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all that kind of stuff.1

And I need you to do thirty chest2

compressions, and then tell me when you’re done.3

Listen to it. Two seconds pass. He says4

he’s done.5

And then, with two seconds later, guess who’s6

there? The E.M.S.7

So, you decide, could he do thirty chest8

compressions in two seconds?9

And could the E.M.S. drivers be there,10

talking to him, two seconds later?11

And you -- it’s also for you to decide. Do12

you think that the E.M.S. drivers got on the stand, and13

decided to lie about Treshaun Terrance being on the14

porch, waving them, waving them down?15

Or do you think it’s more plausible that the16

defendant’s version is not true?17

You are allowed to consider, and the Judge18

will give you a, an instruction on witness credibility,19

and as to whether someone has a motive to lie, a20

reason.21

And you also can consider, do you think that22

the Deputy Chief Wayne County Medical Examiner, since23

1998, has a reason to lie on the stand, about Treshaun24

Terrance?25

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Or do you think that this woman actually died1

from being smothered to death.2

If you believe that she was smothered to3

death, based on her testimony, her evidence, her4

report, which you can look at and read, the autopsy5

photos, which you can look at.6

Then it is impossible for his version of the7

events to be true.8

That would mean, she was beat up, and somehow9

either smothered herself to death, or somebody else10

smothered her, and then she woke up, came back to life,11

and came home.12

The cause of death was smothering.13

So, she died in that house.14

Additionally, on the 9-1-1 call, the15

defendant says that -- I’m sorry, in the interrogation,16

the defendant says that, when she came in, he placed17

her on the couch, and she rolled onto the floor.18

That’s in his own, in, in the videos. His19

words, out of his mouth.20

When the E.M.S. drivers arrive, she’s on the21

couch.22

He can’t keep his stories straight.23

When you lie, it’s hard to remember all your24

lies.25

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So, I just would submit to you that this1

woman was in the fight of her life.2

And the end of her life was horrid, and it3

happened, in this house, on Mendota, in Detroit, on4

December 15th.5

The defendant, one last thing I want to leave6

you with, is to talk about this blood in the home.7

The defendant said that, initially, he denied8

knowing anything about any blood in the home, and9

indicates that this blood, you know, on -- all over the10

house, on the ceiling, the walls, the -- there’s a11

chair, there’s on the T.V., all over the house, is from12

three dogs that used to live in the house, before he13

and Ms. Tillman.14

Then he said -- changes his story, oh, well,15

you know, she did have some kind of cut on her16

forehead, and I took a shirt. He calls it a gray17

beater.18

I take that to mean a tank top. You can take19

that to mean whatever you think it is, but he says he20

takes a gray beater, and goes to wipe her forehead with21

it.22

And maybe that’s how the blood got all over.23

So, you don’t have to be any kind of an24

expert about anything, but if there’s actual wet blood,25

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it’s gonna be soaked up. 1

That’s for you to decide. 2

However, he also indicated, moments before,3

that that blood was dry.4

So, what’s he trying to soak up?5

Is it dry? Is it wet?6

He also indicated, he observed no injuries on7

her arms. His words. It’s on the video.8

That -- so, I guess we’re to believe, he9

takes that gray beater, takes it, dabs her forehead,10

this, this little small, incised wound, and then11

apparently waves it all over the house, trying to get12

blood off of it.13

So, you can think if that’s logical to you.14

I submit, when you go back, and you15

deliberate, it will be painfully obvious to you that16

the defendant committed these crimes, and I ask you to17

come back with a verdict of guilty.18


JURY INSTRUCTIONS20

THE COURT: Members of the jury, the evidence21

and the arguments in this case are now finished, and I22

will now instruct you on the law.23

That is, I will explain the law that applies24

to this case.25

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Remember that you have taken an oath to1

return a true and just verdict, based only on the2

evidence, and my instructions on the law.3

You must not let sympathy or prejudice4

influence your decision.5

As jurors, you must decide what the facts of6

this case are. This is your job, and nobody else’s.7

You must think about all the evidence, and8

then decide what each piece of evidence means, and how9

important you think it is.10

This includes whether you believe what each11

of the witnesses said.12

What you decide about any fact in this case13

is final.14

It is my duty to instruct you on the law. 15

You must take the law as I give it to you.16

If a lawyer says something different about17

the law, follow what I say.18

At various times, I have already given you19

some instructions about the law.20

You must take all of my instructions together21

as the law you must follow.22

You should not pay attention to some23

instructions, and ignore others.24

To sum up, it is your job to decide what the25

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facts of the case are; to apply the law as I give it to1

you; and in that way, to decide this case.2

A person accused of a crime is presumed to be3

innocent.4

This means that you must start with the5

presumption that the defendant is innocent.6

This presumption continues throughout the7

trial, and entitles the defendant to a verdict of not8

guilty unless you are satisfied beyond a reasonable9

doubt that he is guilty.10

Every crime is made up of parts called11

elements. 12

The Prosecutor must prove each element of the13

crime beyond a reasonable doubt.14

The defendant is not required to prove his15

innocence, or to do anything.16

If you find that the Prosecutor has not17

proven every element beyond a reasonable doubt, then18

you must find the defendant not guilty.19

A reasonable doubt is a fair, honest doubt,20

growing out of the evidence, or lack of evidence. It21

is not merely an imaginary, or possible doubt, but a22

doubt based on reason and common sense.23

A reasonable doubt is just that, a doubt that24

is reasonable after a careful and considered25

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examination of the facts and circumstances in this1

case.2

Every defendant has an absolute right not to3

testify.4

When you decide the case, you must not5

consider the fact that Mr. Terrance did not testify. 6

It must not affect your verdict in any way.7

When you decide the case, and decide on your8

verdict, you may only consider the evidence that has9

been properly admitted in this case.10

Therefore, it is important for you to11

understand what is evidence, and what is not evidence.12

Evidence includes only the sworn testimony of13

the witnesses, the exhibits admitted into evidence, and14

anything else I told you to consider as evidence.15

Evidence includes -- I’m sorry. Many things16

are not evidence, and you must be careful not to17

consider them as such.18

I will now describe some of the things that19

are not evidence:20

The fact that the defendant is charged with a21

crime, and is on trial, is not evidence.22

Likewise, the fact that he is charged with23

more than one crime, is not evidence.24

The lawyers’ statements, and arguments, and25

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any commentary, are not evidence.1

They are only meant to help you to understand2

the evidence, and each side’s theories.3

You should only accept things the lawyers say4

that are supported by the evidence, or by your own5

common sense, and general knowledge.6

The lawyers’ questions to the witnesses, your7

questions to the witnesses, and my questions to the8

witnesses, are also not evidence.9

You should consider these questions only as10

they give meaning to the witness’s answers.11

My comments, rulings, questions, and12

instructions are also not evidence.13

It is my duty to see that the trial is14

conducted according to the law, and to tell you the law15

that applies to this case.16

However, when I make a comment, or give an17

instruction, I am not trying to influence your vote, or18

express a personal opinion about the case.19

If you believe that I have an opinion about20

how you should decide this case, you must pay no21

attention to that opinion.22

You are the only judges of the facts, and you23

should decide this case from the evidence.24

At times during this trial, I have excluded25

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evidence that was offered, or stricken testimony that1

was heard.2

Do not consider those things in deciding 3

your -- this case.4

Make your decisions only on the evidence that5

I let in, and nothing else.6

Your decision should be based on all the7

evidence, regardless of which party produced it.8

You should use your own common sense, and9

general knowledge, in weighing and judging the10

evidence, but you should not use any personal knowledge11

you may have about a place, person, or event.12

To repeat once more, you must decide this13

case based only on the evidence admitted during this14

trial.15

As I said before, it is your job to decide16

what the facts of this case are.17

You must decide which witnesses you believe,18

and how important you think their testimony is.19

You do not have to accept or reject20

everything a witness said. You are free to believe21

all, none, or part of any person’s testimony.22

In deciding which testimony you believe, you23

should rely on your own common sense, and every day24

experience.25

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However, in deciding whether you believe a1

witness’s testimony, you must set aside any bias, or2

prejudice you may have, based on the race, gender, or3

national origin of the witness.4

There is no fixed set of rules for judging5

whether you believe a witness, but it may help you to6

think about these questions:7

Was the witness able to see or hear clearly?8

How long was the witness watching or9

listening?10

Was anything else going on that might have11

distracted the witness?12

Did the witness seem to have a good memory?13

How did the witness look and act while14

testifying?15

Did the witness seem to be making an honest16

effort to tell the truth, or did the witness seem to17

evade the questions, or argue with the lawyers?18

Does the witness’s age and maturity affect19

how you judge his or her testimony?20

Does the witness have any bias, prejudice, or21

personal interest in how this case is decided?22

Have there been any promises, threats,23

suggestions, or other influences that affected how the24

witness testified?25

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In general, does the witness have any special1

reason to tell the truth, or any special reason to lie?2

All in all, how reasonable does the witness’s3

testimony seem when you think about all the other4

evidence in this case?5

Sometimes the testimony different witnesses6

will not agree, and you must decide which testimony you7

accept.8

You should not think -- I’m sorry.9

You should think about whether the10

disagreement involves something important, or not; and11

whether you think someone is lying, or is simply12

mistaken.13

People see and hear things differently, and14

witnesses may testify honestly, but simply be wrong15

about what they thought they saw or remembered.16

It is also a good idea to think about which17

testimony agrees best with the other evidence in the18

case.19

However, you may conclude that a witness20

deliberately lied about something that is important to21

how you decide the case.22

If so, you may choose not to accept anything23

the witness said.24

On the other hand, if you think the witness25

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lied about some things, but told the truth about1

others, you may simply accept the part you think is2

true, and ignore the rest.3

The Prosecutor must also prove beyond a4

reasonable doubt that the crime occurred on or about5

December 15, 2015, within Wayne County.6

When you go to the jury room, you will be7

provided with a written copy of these final jury8

instructions.9

In fact, when you go in the jury room, they10

will -- there will be two binders that contain all the11

instructions that I am now reading to you.12

You should first choose a Foreperson.13

The Foreperson should see to it that your14

discussions are carried out in a businesslike way, and15

that everyone has a fair chance to be heard.16

During your deliberations, please turn off17

your cell phones, or other communications equipment,18

until we recess.19

A verdict in a criminal trial, in a criminal20

case, must be unanimous. In order to return a verdict,21

it is necessary that each of you agrees on that22

verdict.23

In the jury room, you will discuss the case24

amongst yourselves, but ultimately, each of you will25

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have to make up your own mind.1

Any verdict must represent the individual2

considered judgment of each juror.3

It is your duty to talk -- as jurors, to talk4

to each other, and to make every reasonable effort to5

reach agreement.6

Express your opinions, and the reasons for7

them, but keep an open mind as you listen to your8

fellow jurors.9

Rethink your opinions, and do not hesitate to10

change your mind, if you decide you were wrong.11

Try your best to work out your differences.12

However, although you should try to reach13

agreement, none of you should give up your honest14

opinion about the case just because other jurors15

disagree with you, or just for the sake of reaching a16

verdict.17

In the end, your vote must be your own, and18

you must honestly -- I’m sorry. And you must vote19

honestly, and in good conscience.20

If you have any questions about the jury21

instructions before you begin deliberations, or22

questions about the instructions that arise, that might23

arise during deliberations, you may submit them, in24

writing, in a sealed envelope, to the Deputy.25

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Possible penalty should not influence your1

decision. It is the duty of the Judge to fix the2

penalty within the limits provided by law.3

If you want to communicate with me while you4

are in the jury room, please have your Foreperson write5

a note, and give it to the Bailiff -- to the Deputy.6

It is not proper for you to talk directly7

with the Judge, lawyers, Court Officers, or other8

people involved in the case.9

As you discuss the case, you must not let10

anyone, even me, know how your voting stands.11

Therefore, until you return with a unanimous12

verdict, do not reveal this to anyone outside the jury13

room.14

When you go to the jury room to deliberate,15

you may take your notes, and full instructions.16

If you want to look at any -- I’m sorry. If17

you want to look at any or all of the referenced18

documents or exhibits that have been admitted, just ask19

for them.20

When you go to the jury room, you will, as I21

mentioned, you’ll be given two copies of the22

instructions. 23

As you discuss the case, you should think24

about all my instructions together, as the law you are25

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to follow.1

The defendant is charged with two counts. 2

That is, with premeditated murder; and felony murder. 3

These are separate crimes, and the Prosecutor4

is charging that the defendant committed both of them.5

You must consider each crime separately, in6

light of all the evidence in the case.7

You may find the defendant guilty of both, or8

either of these crimes, or not guilty.9

I have prepared a verdict form listing the10

possible verdicts, and that verdict form is in the jury11

room.12

The Prosecution has introduced evidence of a13

statement that it claims the defendant made.14

Before you may consider such out of court15

statement against the defendant, you must first find16

that the defendant actually made the statement as given17

to you.18

If you find that the defendant did make the s19

statement, you may give the statement whatever weight20

you think it deserves.21

In deciding this, you should think about how22

and when the statement was made; and about all the23

other evidence in he case.24

You may consider the statement in deciding25

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the facts of this case. 1

Facts can be proved by direct evidence from a2

witness or an exhibit. 3

Direct evidence is the evidence about what we4

actually see or hear.5

For example, if you look outside, and see6

rain falling, that is direct evidence that it is7

raining.8

Facts can also be provided by indirect, or9

circumstantial evidence.10

Circumstantial evidence is evidence that11

normally, or reasonably leads to other facts.12

So, for example, if you see a person come in13

from the outside, wearing a rain coat, covered with14

small drops of water, that would be circumstantial15

evidence that it is raining.16

You may consider circumstantial evidence.17

Circumstantial evidence by itself, or a18

combination of circumstantial evidence and direct19

evidence can be used to prove the elements of a crime.20

In other words, you should consider all the21

evidence that you believe.22

When the lawyers agree on a statement of23

facts, these are called stipulated facts.24

You may regard such stipulated facts as true,25

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but you are not required to do so.1

During the interview of Treshaun Terrance,2

which was shown as a video, which was played during3

this trial, there was reference to a warrant.4

And the Court instructed you to disregard5

that testimony.6

The parties have stipulated, and agreed, that7

you should be advised that the warrant referenced was8

in relation to a civil traffic offense.9

You may consider whether the defendant had a10

reason to commit the alleged crime, but a reason by11

itself is not enough to find a person guilty of a12

crime.13

The Prosecutor does not, does not have to14

prove that the defendant had a reason to commit the15

alleged crime. She only has to show that the defendant16

actually committed the crime, and that he meant to do17

so.18

The defendant’s intent may be proved by what19

he said, what he did, how he did it, or by any other20

facts and circumstances in evidence. 21

You should not decide this case based on22

which side presented more witnesses.23

Instead, you should think about each witness,24

and each piece of evidence, and whether you believe25

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them.1

Then, you must decide whether testimony and2

the evidence you believe proves beyond a reasonable3

doubt that the defendant is guilty.4

You have heard that a lawyer, or a lawyer’s5

representative talked to one of the witnesses.6

There is nothing wrong with this.7

A lawyer or a lawyer’s representative may8

talk to a witness, to find out what the witness knows9

about the case, and what the witness’s testimony will10

be.11

You have heard testimony from a witness,12

Leigh Hlavaty, M.D., who has given you her opinion as13

an expert in the field of Anatomic and Forensic14

Pathology.15

You have also heard testimony from a witness,16

Shane Hill, who has give you his opinion as an expert17

in the field of Blood Fluid Identification.18

Experts are allowed to give opinions, in19

court, about matters they are experts on.20

However, you do not have to believe an21

expert’s opinion.22

Instead, you should decide whether you23

believe it, and how important you think it is.24

When you decide whether you believe an25

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expert’s opinion, think carefully about the reasons and1

facts he or she gave for that opinion, and whether2

those facts are true.3

You should also think about the expert’s4

qualifications, and whether his or her opinion makes5

sense to you, when you think about the other evidence6

in the case.7

You have heard from a witness who is a 8

Police -- I’m sorry. You have heard testimony from a9

witness who is a Police Officer.10

That testimony is to be judged by the same11

standards you use to evaluate the testimony of any12

other witness.13

The defendant is charged with the crime of14

first degree premeditated murder. 15

To prove this charge, the Prosecutor must16

prove each of the following elements beyond a17

reasonable doubt:18

First, that the defendant caused the death of19

Dalona Tillman. 20

That is, that Dalona Tillman died as a result21

of being smothered, or asphyxiated.22

Second, that the defendant intended to kill23

Dalona Tillman. 24

Third, that his -- that this intent to kill25

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was premeditated. That is, thought out beforehand.1

Fourth, that the killing was deliberate,2

which means that the defendant considered the pros and3

cons of the killing, and thought about, and chose his4

actions, before he did it.5

There must have been real and substantial6

reflection for long enough to give a reasonable person7

a chance to think twice about the intent to kill.8

The law does not say how much time is needed. 9

It is for you to decide if enough time passed under the10

circumstances of this case.11

The killing cannot be the result of a sudden12

impulse, without thought or reflection.13

Fifth, that the killing was not justified,14

excused, or done under circumstances that reduce it to15

a lesser crime.16

The defendant is also charged with first17

degree felony murder.18



reasonable doubt: 21

First, that the defendant caused the death of22

Dalona Tillman. 23

That is, that Dalona Tillman died a -- died24

as a result of being smothered or asphyxiated.25

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Second, that the defendant had one of these1

three states of mind.2

He intended to kill;3

Or, he intended to do great bodily harm to4

Dalona Tillman;5

Or, he knowingly created a very high risk of6

death or great bodily harm, knowing that death, or such7

harm, would be the likely result of his actions.8

Third, that when he did the act that caused9

the death Dalona Tillman, the defendant was committing,10

or attempt to commit the crime of torture.11

For the crime of torture, the Prosecutor must12


reasonable doubt:14

First, that the defendant had custody or15

physical control over Dalona Tillman. 16

This means that the defendant used force, or17

threat of force, either to confine Dalona Tillman, by18

interfering wit her liberty, or rest -- or to restrict19

Dalona Tillman’s freedom of movement.20

Second, that the defendant exercised custody,21

or physical control, over Dalona Tillman, without her22

consent, or without lawful authority to do so.23

Third, that at the time the defendant had24

custody or physical control over Dalona Tillman, he25

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intentionally great bodily injury to Dalona Tillman.1

Great bodily injury means, internal injury,2

poisoning, serious burns or scalding, severe cuts, or3

multiple puncture wounds.4

Fourth, that the defendant intended to cause5

Dalona Tillman to suffer cruel, or extreme physical6

pain, or mental pain and suffering.7

The Prosecutor does not need to prove that8

Dalona Tillman actually suffered any pain.9

Lastly, that the killing was not justified,10

excused, or done under circumstances that reduce it to11

a lesser crime.12




THE COURT: Okay. 16

Ladies and gentlemen, we are going to take a17

brief recess.18

At this time, I’m gonna ask that you retire19

to the jury room.20



courtroom).23



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THE COURT: Okay. 2

We’re back on the record in case 3

16-001235-FC, People versus -- yeah. 4

MS. RUBIO: Oh.5

THE COURT: Okay. 6


16-001235-DC, People versus Treshaun Terrance. 8

Your appearances?9



Terrance., Your Honor. 12

THE COURT: Okay. 13

When I finished -- when I thought I’d14

finished the instructions, I asked counsel to approach15

the bench, and we had a discussion, outside the16

presence of the jury.17

And to summarize our discussion, during the18

discussion, Mr. Harris did ask for the instruction on19

second degree murder, is that correct?20

MR. HARRIS: That is correct, Your Honor.21


And do the People have any objection to that?23


THE COURT: Okay. 25

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Accordingly, the Court will now read1

instruction 3.08 about less serious crimes; 3.112

deliberations and verdict; and then 1605 on second3

degree murder.4

Is that your request, Mr. Harris?5


Any objection to same, counsel?7


THE COURT: Okay. 9

And I also indicated that, after we excuse10

two jurors, and swear the Deputies, I will instruct the11

jury to go to lunch, come back, and not to deliberate12

until that time.13

And I also said that, during that lunch time,14

we will amend our jury instructions, for the binders,15

and the verdict form, consistent with our discussion.16

Is that agreed?17



THE COURT: Okay. 20

We can bring back the jury.21



the courtroom).24


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THE COURT: Okay. 1

We’re back on the record in 16-001235-FC,2

People versus Treshaun Terrance.3



MR. HARRIS: Good afternoon, Your Honor, and6

ladies and gentlemen of the jury. Wyatt Harris on7

behalf of Mr. Terrance. 8

THE COURT: Okay. 9

To continue, ladies and gentlemen.10

You may also consider whether the defendant11

is guilty of a less serious crime known as second12

degree murder.13

In this case, there are several different14

crimes that you may consider.15

Regarding count one, premeditated murder, you16

must consider the crime of premeditated murder first.17

If you believe that the defendant is not18

guilty of premeditated murder, or if you cannot agree19

about that crime, you should consider the less serious20

crime of second degree murder.21

You decide how long to spend on premeditated22

murder, before discussing second degree murder.23

You can go back to premeditated murder, after24

discussing second degree murder, if you want to.25

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Regarding count two, felony murder.1

You must consider the crime of felony murder2

first.3

If you believe that the defendant is not4

guilty of felony murder, or if you cannot agree about5

that crime, you should consider the less serious crime6

of second degree murder.7

You decide how long to spend of felony murder8

before discussing second degree murder.9

You can go back to felony murder, after10

discussing second degree murder, if you want to.11

You may also consider the lesser charge of12

second degree murder.13



reasonable doubt:16

First, the defendant caused the death of17

Dalona Tillman. 18

That is, that Dalona Tillman died as a result19

of smothering, or asph -- asphyxiation.20

Second, that the defendant had one of these21

three states of mind:22

He intended to kill;23

Or he intended to do great bodily harm to24

Dalona Tillman; 25

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Or he knowingly created a very high risk of1

death, or great bodily harm, knowing that the death or2

such harm would likely -- would be the like results of3

his actions.4




THE COURT: Okay. 8

At this time, Madame Clerk, can you please9

draw two names, so that we can excuse two of our10

jurors.11

CLERK: Seat number eleven; seat number12

fourteen. 13

THE COURT: Eleven and fourteen?14

CLERK: Yes, sir.15

THE COURT: Thank you, Ms. Faunce, and Ms.16

Coleman.17

You can take your items from the jury room.18

Thank you very much for your service.19

The Deputies will meet up with you out in the20

hallway, okay?21

Madame Clerk, can you please swear in the22

Deputies, at this time?23

CLERK: Do you swear to keep this jury in the24

manner -- you do swear to keep the jury in the manner25

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and form as prescribed by law?1

DEPUTY: I do.2

THE COURT: Okay. 3

Ladies and gentlemen, I’m going to excuse you4

to the jury room.5

However, because it’s the lunch hour, I want6

you to drop off your notes, and your booklets with you,7

in the jury room, and then I’m going to excuse you to8

go to lunch.9

All right?10

So, please be back at one thirty, to begin11

your deliberations.12

However, even though the trial’s now over,13

and even though I have instructed you on the law, one14

of those instructions says, you are not to deliberate15

on this case until you are all together, deliberating.16

So, please do not begin your deliberations17

until such time as you all return here from our lunch18

recess.19

Okay?20

So, we’ll see you back here at one thirty.21

Thank you. 22


(Whereupon the jurors were excused for24

lunch).25

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DEPUTY: When everybody’s ready, knock on the1

door, and I’ll let everybody go.2




THE COURT: Okay. 6



Your appearances?9



Terrance, who sits to my left, Your Honor. 12

THE COURT: Okay. 13

We have a question from the jury, asking,14

quote, can we see the Exhibits, specifically, the15

photos and the blood test results.16

So, there was photos on Exhibit 1, photos on17

Exhibit 2. I believe Exhibit 5 had photos. Exhibit 718

had photos.19

That’s according to my records.20

Do we have those?21


THE COURT: Do we have those?23

MS. RUBIO: Yes.24

I kind of took them out to make, can we see25

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Exhibits, specifically -- I thought it meant he wanted,1

wanted all the Exhibits, but obviously, I leave that in2

the Court’s discretion.3

And then, quote, I interpreted, I could be4

wrong, blood test results, to mean, the lab report,5

which is Exhibit 6.6

Exhibit 7, it was testified to, that Shane --7

THE COURT: Just -- here, can we just do this8

a little bit more systematically.9

MS. RUBIO: Okay. 10

THE COURT: Do we have the photographs,11

Exhibit 1?12

MS. RUBIO: Yes, I have it in my hand.13

THE COURT: Okay. 14

Do we have the photos on disk, was Exhibit 2.15

MS. RUBIO: Yes.16

THE COURT: What, what photographs were17

those? Can you remind me?18

MS. RUBIO: They’re photographs of the19

deceased at the hospital, as well as photographs of the20

scene, at the Mendota address.21

THE COURT: Okay. 22

So, to be seen, they would -- for the jury to23

see them, they would need to have a lap top, to see24

them?25

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MS. RUBIO: And I’ve just -- I’ve already1

communicated with a colleague, asking someone to bring2

me a lap top down.3

THE COURT: Okay. 4

MS. RUBIO: Down to the courtroom.5

THE COURT: The, the autopsy photos, we do6

have those, as well?7

MS. RUBIO: Those are People’s 5, and they8

are not on a disk.9

THE COURT: Right.10

And then Exhibit 7, photos. Were those11

photos by Mr. Hill?12

MS. RUBIO: They, they are. They are on a13

disk, but they have also been printed out.14


So -- all right.16

So, for -- leave the disk out of the it, the17

equation, for right now.18

Does -- do -- does anybody have objection to19

giving the photos that we have, right now, that don’t20

need a computer to show, to presenting those to the21

jury?22

MR. HARRIS: No, Judge.23

MS. RUBIO: I -- I do not. That would be24

Exhibits 1, 5, and 7.25

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MR. HARRIS: No objections.1

THE COURT: Okay. 2

I supposed we should bring out the jury, and3

ask them if they want the photographs on the disk,4

Exhibit 2.5

And which one -- what, what are the photos6

that on a disk?7

MS. RUBIO: On Exhibit 2?8

THE COURT: Well, there’s photos on a disk,9

and is there any other photos on a disk, other than Mr.10

Hill’s photos, which we have copies of?11

MS. RUBIO: Mr. Hill’s photos are, are on12

People’s 7.13

And then, of course, as Your Honor just14

stated, the other photos are People’s 2.15

THE COURT: Okay. 16

MS. RUBIO: The scene photos.17

THE COURT: So, I propose we bring the jury18

out, and tell them, we have all of the photographs,19

that were the Exhibits, with the exception of Exhibit20

2, which those photographs are on a disk, and will21

require a lap top, to show to the jury.22

MS. RUBIO: That’s right. And the lap top23

is, is here. My colleague is present.24


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Can they, can they -- can the disk be1

inserted, in the lap top?2

MS. RUBIO: Absolutely.3

THE COURT: And booted up, so that they can4

just press a button, and see the photos?5

MS. RUBIO: Abs -- typically, what, what will6

happen is, you insert the, the disk in, and then go to7

the proper drive, drive “D”, and then --8

THE COURT: So, can, can you do all that,9

and, and have those photographs available to be seen,10

with a click of a button? 11

Can you go to the right drive? 12

Can you --13

MS. RUBIO: Can I, myself do it?14

THE COURT: Yeah.15

Yeah.16

MS. RUBIO: Okay. 17

Do you know -- is the, is the computer18

charged up? I’m asking my colleague, already? It --19

usually, it needs to be plugged in. Or is it charged20

up?21

COLLEAGUE: I believe it’s charged.22

MS. RUBIO: Okay. 23

It should probably be plugged in, though,24

when -- once, once they get into, into the room, so it25

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won’t die.1

THE COURT: Do you want to whatever --2

MS. RUBIO: I’m just waiting for it to boot3

up.4


If it was up to me, I couldn’t do it. That’s6

why I’m asking if you can.7

MS. RUBIO: Okay. 8

I apologize.9

THE COURT: Exhibit 2, which I think you’re10

looking at, those are photographs of what?11

MS. RUBIO: Those are photographs from the --12

taken by the Evidence Technicians, at -- of the13

deceased, at the hospital, as well as scene14

photographs, from the Mendota address.15


Why don’t I do this: I will, I will tell 17

the -- we’ll bring the jury out. I will tell them that18

we can give them Exhibit 1, Exhibit 5, Exhibit 7, that19

being the photos, the photograph of Miss Tillman, the20

autopsy photos, and the photos from the M.S.P. lab.21

I can give 1, 5, and 7.22

I can give 3 and 4.23

That is a Constitutional Rights.24

And I can give the Medical Examiner’s report.25

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With respect to Exhibit 2, which is the1

photos you’re trying to boot up, 8 and 9, we can2

provide them with those Exhibits, but 2 and 8 need to3

be set up on a D.V. -- on a computer to play.4

And that 9 would have to be played out in5

this courtroom.6

MS. RUBIO: Yes.7

2 and 8, we’ll get them a lap top,8

momentarily.9

9 will have to be played out here.10

And I’m so sorry, did Your Honor mention11

Exhibit 6? I didn’t hear it.12

THE COURT: Oh, and we can do 6, also.13

Yeah, which is the report generated by the14

Michigan State Police.15


THE COURT: Mr. Harris, are you comfortable17

with that?18

MR. HARRIS: I’m comfortable with that.19


So, let’s bring out the jury.21



the courtroom).24


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THE COURT: Okay. 1






Terrance, Judge.7

THE COURT: Okay. 8

Ladies and gentlemen, the Court did receive a9

question from the jury, which indicates: Quote, can we10

see the Exhibits, specifically the photos and the blood11

test results?12

In response to your question, let me tell you13

this:14

We can provide you, and will provide you,15

with Exhibit 1, which is the photograph Ms. Tillman;16

Exhibit No. 5, which are photographs from the17

autopsy;18

Exhibit No. 7, which are photographs of the19

Michigan State Police Lab.20

We can also give you, right now, Exhibit No.21

3, which is the Constitutional Rights form;22

Exhibit No. 4, which is the Medical23

Examiner’s report;24

And Exhibit No. 6, which is the report25

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produced by the Michigan State Police.1

With respect to Exhibit No. 2, which is2

photographs taken by the Evidence Technician, which3

show photographs of Ms. Tillman, at the hospital, and4

of the Mendota scene, those will require to be shown to5

you on a lap top. 6

And we can do that, if you want to see those7

photographs. We can have the lap top set up.8

Same with respect to Exhibit No. 8, the 9-1-19

call.10

With respect to Exhibit No. 9, which is the11

interview, we can show you, that can be seen, but it12

only can be seen out here, in this room. All?13

So, what I will do is, I will give you14

Exhibit -- at this time, I will give you Exhibit 1,15

Exhibit 5, Exhibit 7, Exhibit 3, 4, and 6. And you can16

have those in the jury room.17

If you want the other Exhibits, that being 2,18

8, and 9, I would like you to ask, by way of a more19

specific question. Because if that’s the case, we can20

deal with the lap top issue, which we’re not prepared21

to deal with, precisely, at this moment.22

Does everybody understand?23

All right. 24

You can retire to the jury room.25

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courtroom to continue deliberations).3


(Whereupon the record ends for the day at5

2:22 p.m.)6


the day).8

- - -9

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(Jury Trial).


Dated:________________________

Detroit, Michigan



Suzanne Kinsey

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STATE OF MICHIGAN



-vs- Case No. 16-01235


Defendant. /

JURY TRIAL


Thursday - May 20, 2016

APPEARANCES:




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C O N T E N T S

Page

May 20, 2016................................... 3

Jury Trial

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May 20, 20161

Detroit, Michigan2


THE COURT: Okay. 4






Treshaun Terrance, Your Honor. 10

THE COURT: Okay. 11

As you know, we have a question from the12

jury, which indicates: We cannot come to a verdict13

without one or more of us violating our judgment.14

You’re aware that we discussed this at the15

bench, correct?16



At this time, I don’t see any recourse other19

than concluding that, despite their best efforts, this20

jury is unable to make a decision in this case.21

It’s my -- in my discretion, I’m going to22

discharge the jury, after first going through a voir23

dire of the Foreman. 24

You folks understand that?25

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THE COURT: And I have gone through with you,3

off the record, what I proposed to do, in terms of my4

voir dire of the jury Foreman, and you have no5

objection to same, is that correct?6

MS. RUBIO: I do not.7

MR. HARRIS: No. No, Your Honor.8


All right. 10

So, without further ado, can you bring the11

jury in?12



the courtroom).15


THE COURT: Okay. 17



Your appearances?20



Harris on behalf of Mr. Terrance.23

THE COURT: Okay. 24

You may be seated.25

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Members of the jury, I have received a1

question from you, a few moments ago, which indicates: 2

Quote: We cannot come to a verdict without one or more3

of us violation our judgment.4

All right. 5

May I ask, who is the jury Foreperson?6

All right. 7

Can you tell me your name?8

JUROR RUST: Isaac Rust.9

THE COURT: Why don’t, why don’t you stand up10

for a minute.11

I’m sorry, your name, once again?12

JUROR RUST: Isaac Rust.13

THE COURT: Okay. 14

Good morning, Mr. Rust.15

I’m going to ask you a few questions here,16

and I don’t -- I want you to pay very precise attention17

to what I’m about to ask you, okay?18

So, I’m gonna ask you for some one word19

answers.20

JUROR RUST: Okay. 21


And I want to preface my question, by saying,23

I don’t want to know how your voting stands, all right.24

Mr. Rust, has the jury reached a verdict on25

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either count one, or count two?1

JUROR RUST: Uhm --2

THE COURT: Have you reached a verdict on3

count one?4

JUROR RUST: Yes.5

THE COURT: Okay. 6

Have you reached a verdict on count two?7

JUROR RUST: No.8

THE COURT: Okay. 9

Okay. 10

You can, you can have a seat.11




THE COURT: Okay. 15

Once again, sir, can you stand up?16

All right. 17

Have -- has the jury reached a unanimous18

verdict as to count one? Yes or no?19

JUROR RUST: Yes?20

THE COURT: Okay. 21

However, judging from your earlier answer, it22

appears that you have not reached a unanimous verdict23

as to count two, is that correct?24

JUROR RUST: We have not.25

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THE COURT: Okay. 1

Again, I don’t want to know how your voting2

stands, as to count two.3

Okay?4

However, with respect to count two, do you5

believe that appears that it is impossible for this6

jury to reach a verdict on count two?7

JUROR RUST: Uhm, at this time, I do think8

that it’s not possible for us to --9

THE COURT: Okay. 10

As to count two, then, is it your belief that11

the jury is deadlocked? I’m referring only to count12

two?13

JUROR RUST: Yes.14

THE COURT: And has it been -- has the jury15

been deadlocked, on count two, for a substantial period16

of time?17

JUROR RUST: Yes.18

THE COURT: Okay. 19

JUROR RUST: Would you like me to elaborate,20

or --21

THE COURT: No. Let me -- just answer my22

question.23

JUROR RUST: Okay. 24

THE COURT: Have you been deadlocked on count25

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two, for some period, since yesterday?1

JUROR RUST: Yes.2

THE COURT: If not longer?3

JUROR RUST: Yes.4

THE COURT: I’m assuming that you believe5

that there has been a fundamental differences of6

opinion, that cannot be resolved, as to count two, is7

that correct?8

JUROR RUST: Yes.9

THE COURT: Okay. 10


Based on the information provided from the12

jury Foreperson, as it relates to count two, the Court13

feels it necessary to utilize its discretion, and this14

Court finds that there is no reasonable probability of15

agreement, by this jury, on count two.16

As such, pursuant to MCR 2.514C4, I’m gonna17

hold off on that.18

Ladies and gentlemen, at this time, I’m going19

to excuse you, and ask you to return to the jury room,20

for a short period of time.21



courtroom).24


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THE COURT: Okay. 1

Of course, counsel, the jury has been sent to2

the jury room.3

It was my expectation, wrongfully, probably,4

that, that there was a deadlocked jury on both count5

one and count two.6

Under the circumstances, I am inclined,7

inasmuch as the Foreperson has said that there has been8

a unanimous verdict on count one, to take the jury’s9

verdict on count one.10

Any objection from the People?11



THE COURT: Okay. 14

Now, if one or the other polls the jury,15

which you have a right to ask, as it relates to count16

one, depending on what the decision is, should there17

appear to be non-unanimity, I will stop the person who18

says that it is not their verdict, and I will ask the19

jury to retire immediately to the jury.20

We will -- I will not poll any pers -- any21

other people, is that understood?22



THE COURT: Any objection to that?25

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THE COURT: Okay. 3

All right. 4

Are you ready?5

Okay. 6

We’re gonna take a verdict, only on -- well,7

on count one.8

All right?9

Right, Mr. Harris?10

MR. HARRIS: That’s correct, Your Honor. 11

THE COURT: ‘Cause they’ve already said that12

there has been a deadlock on -- I’m sorry, we’re gonna13

take a verdict on count one. They’re already14

deadlocked on count two.15


MS. RUBIO: I guess we need to know, did they17

fill out the verdict form?18

THE COURT: Well, when they, when they come19

back out here, as per routine, the Deputy will hand,20

hand me the jury verdict form. I will look at it.21

There’s never been a problem.22

I’ll give it back. 23

If there seems to be some problem, we will24

take it up, at the bench.25

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MS. RUBIO: Okay. 1

MR. HARRIS: Judge, the assumption you’re2

making, though, is that they filled it --3

THE COURT: That’s my assumption.4

MR. HARRIS: Okay. 5

THE COURT: And if it -- if they have --6

MR. HARRIS: If it hasn’t been, you’ll send7

them back?8

THE COURT: I’ll send them back.9




MS. RUBIO: Yes.13


You can send back the jury.15



the courtroom).18


THE COURT: Okay. 20

We are still on the record in case number 21





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Treshaun Terrance, Your Honor.1

THE COURT: Okay. 2

Madame Clerk?3

CLERK: Members of the jury, you have agreed4

upon a verdict. Who shall speak for you?5

THE COURT: Mr. Rust.6

You want to stand again, please.7

CLERK: Juror nine, how do you find the8

defendant, Treshaun Terrance, of count one, first9

degree premeditated murder?10

JUROR RUST: We find the defendant not11

guilty.12



Anything further, from the People?15

I’m sorry, you’re -- you’re gonna have to16

swear the jury in, now.17

CLERK: Please stand.18

Members of the -- members of the jury, listen19

to your verdict as recorded by the Court.20

You say upon your oath that you find the21

defendant, Treshaun Terrance, not guilty of count one,22

first degree premeditated murder, say you Mr. Foreman,23

say you all members of the jury?24

JURORS: Yes.25

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CLERK: You may be seated.1

THE COURT: Anything further from the People?2

MS. RUBIO: Yes, Your Honor. I would like3

the jury polled.4


CLERK: Juror number one, was that and is6

that your verdict? 7

JUROR GRAMMATICO: Yes.8

CLERK: Juror number two, was that and is9


JUROR HAMILTON: Yes.11

CLERK: Juror number three, was that and is12


JUROR COLLIER: Yes.14

CLERK: Juror number four, was that and is15


JUROR LINDSEY-ROGERS: Yes.17

CLERK: Juror number five, was that and is18


JUROR CROCKETT: Yes.20

CLERK: Juror number six, was that and is21


JUROR DRAKE: Yes.23

CLERK: Juror number seven, was that and is24

that your verdict?25

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JUROR HANNAH: Yes.1

CLERK: Juror number eight, was that and is2

that your verdict?3

JUROR MILLS: Yes.4

CLERK: Juror number nine, was that and is5

that your verdict?6

JUROR RUST: Yes.7

CLERK: Juror number ten, was that and is8

that your verdict?9

JUROR CHAMI: Yes.10

CLERK: Juror number twelve, twelve, was that11

and is that your verdict? 12

JUROR JOHNSON: Yes.13

CLERK: Juror number thirteen, was that and14

is that your verdict? 15

JUROR CILIA: Yes.16

THE COURT: Okay. 17

Anything further from the People?18

MS. RUBIO: No, Your Honor. Thank you. 19




Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, I must23

thank you for your dedicated service to this case. 24

I am going to discharge you from your25

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service, in this case.1

At this time, I’m gonna ask that you retire2

to the jury room, and I’ll be in there, with you, in3

just a few moments.4

Okay?5


(Whereupon the jurors were excused from7

further jury service on this case).8


THE COURT: Okay. 10

As I mentioned before, as it relates to count11

two, the Court does find it necessary to utilize its12

discretion.13

Finding that there’s no reasonable14

probability of agreement by this jury, as it relates to15

count two, as such, pursuant to MCR 2.514C4.16

The Court discharged the jury, as to count17

two, as they have deliberated, and could not agree.18

All right?19

So, the Court will -- we can talk about it20

today, or if you want to come back next week, and we’ll21

schedule another date for a new trial?22


THE COURT: What’s your pleasure on that?24

MS. RUBIO: Counsel?25

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MR. HARRIS: We’re here, Judge. If you want1

to give us another trial date. 2

I can tell you, I have my trial calendar.3

MS. RUBIO: As do I.4

THE COURT: You do have it with you?5

MS. RUBIO: Just, just so we know, what month6

is Your Honor --7

THE COURT: August 1st is what I’m looking8

at. It’s a Monday.9

MR. HARRIS: Judge, I can tell you, August is10

a disaster month for me.11

THE COURT: Okay. 12

MR. HARRIS: I’m out of the country, for a13

good portion of it.14

THE COURT: How about the 29th?15


THE COURT: Monday, August 29th?17

MR. HARRIS: Uhm --18

MS. RUBIO: One second. Why do I think that19

that’s a bad day?20

MR. HARRIS: That would work for me. That,21

that, if you’re gonna do that, that would be fine.22

MS. RUBIO: I think I just set another23

homicide trial for that day, yesterday.24

THE COURT: How about Monday, September 12th?25

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MS. RUBIO: The 5th is Labor Day.1

THE COURT: The 5th is Labor Day.2

But the 6th is available.3

MS. RUBIO: I have a trial scheduled for that4

day, that will go all week.5

MR. HARRIS: Okay. 6

I’m available the 12th. I was just trying 7

to --8

MS. RUBIO: The 12th is fine. 9


Okay. 11

All right. 12

I am ordering, then, that we return on13

September 12, at nine a.m., for a trial in this matter,14

a new trial in this matter.15

You folks will be provided with a firm trial16

date contract order, which I will sign, Mr. Terrance17

will sign, and counsel will sign.18

So, anything further?19

MS. RUBIO: Not at this time.20

MR. HARRIS: Not at this time, Judge.21

I may come to the Court, at some point in22

time, between obviously, between now and September,23

with some type of pre-trial --24


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Yeah.1

MR. HARRIS: If we try to resolve this.2

THE COURT: All you have -- all you, and you3

folks know this --4

MR. HARRIS: Right.5

THE COURT: That if you want to come to the6

Court, and schedule a pre-trial, for any reason,7

between now and then, you’re invited to do so.8

MR. HARRIS: Okay. 9


MR. HARRIS: And the only, and the only other11

thing I wanted to do was to have the transcript of this12

trial ordered, now, so --13

MS. RUBIO: Oh, good idea.14

THE COURT: Okay. 15

All right. 16

MS. RUBIO: Also, I know that Mr. Harris and17

I have spoke. I don’t know how Your Honor handles18

this, but we were kind of curious, to get a chance to19

speak to the jury, if they’re willing.20

THE COURT: I, I will tell the jury that, as21

I always do, that they have the option of speaking with22

you, or not.23

MS. RUBIO: Perfect.24

THE COURT: It’s completely up to them.25

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MS. RUBIO: Perfect.1


Anything further before we go off the record?3

MS. RUBIO: No.4

MR. HARRIS: Nothing further, Your Honor.5


That concludes this proceeding.7



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(Jury Trial).


Dated:________________________

Detroit, Michigan



Suzanne Kinsey

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STATE OF MICHIGAN



-vs- Case No. 16-01235


Defendant. /

PLEA


Monday - September 12, 2016

APPEARANCES:




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C O N T E N T S

Page

September 12, 2016............................. 3

Plea

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1 September 12, 2016

2 Detroit, Michigan

3 (Proceedings commencing at 10:24 a.m.)

4 THE COURT: Okay.

5 We are on the record in case number


7 Your appearances?

8 MS. RUBIO: Good morning. Mary Rubio for the

9 People.


11 Harris, P-54891, on behalf of Treshaun Terrance, who

12 sits to my left, Your Honor.

13 Can I have him join me at the podium?

14 THE COURT: Yes, you may.

15 MR. HARRIS: Mr. Terrance, will you join me.

16 THE COURT: On your left side.

17 Okay.

18 The Court has been presented with a signed

19 settlement offer and notice of acceptance, signed by

20 the Prosecutor, attorney Harris, and Mr. Terrance.

21 Madame Prosecutor, can you please recite the

22 terms of this plea and sentence agreement?

23 MS. RUBIO: Yes. In exchange for the

24 defendant’s plea of guilty to a reduced count one of

25 murder in the second degree, the People would agree to

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1 a sentence agreement of twenty-eight to forty-five

2 years in the Michigan Department of Correction.

3 Obviously, that is a reduction from homicide,

4 felony murder, which carries life without parole.

5 THE COURT: Is that accurate, Mr. Harris?



8 Mr. Terrance, can you tell us your full name?

9 DEFENDANT: Treshaun Terrance.


11 me?




15 DEFENDANT: Yeah.

16 THE COURT: How old are you, sir?

17 DEFENDANT: Seventeen.


19 Have you had a, a full opportunity to speak

20 with your lawyer today, and prior to today, about your

21 case, which is set for trial today; and this plea

22 offer, this plea and sentence agreement?

23 DEFENDANT: Yes.

24 THE COURT: Has your attorney answered all

25 your questions, to your satisfaction?

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1 DEFENDANT: Yes.

2 THE COURT: Do you feel like you completely

3 understand all the terms and provisions of this plea

4 and sentence agreement?

5 DEFENDANT: Yes.


7 Are you asking the Court to accept this plea

8 and sentence agreement?

9 DEFENDANT: Yes.

10 THE COURT: Now, do you understand that if

11 the Court accepts your plea, you won’t have a trial of

12 any kind, so you’re giving up important rights you

13 would have had, if you had gone to trial, do you

14 understand that?

15 DEFENDANT: Yes.

16 THE COURT: Do you understand you’re giving

17 up the right to be tried by a jury, to be presumed

18 innocent until proven guilty, and to have the

19 Prosecutor prove beyond a reasonable doubt that you are

20 guilty?

21 DEFENDANT: Yes.

22 THE COURT: Do you also understand that

23 you’re giving up the right to have witnesses against

24 you appear at the trial, to question those witnesses

25 against you, and also to have the Court order any

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1 witnesses for your defense to appear at trial?

2 DEFENDANT: Yes.

3 THE COURT: Do you also understand you’re

4 giving up the right to remain silent throughout the

5 trial, to not have your silence used against you, and

6 to testify at the trial, if you wish to do so?

7 DEFENDANT: Yes.

8 THE COURT: Further, do you understand that

9 if the Court accepts your plea, any appeal you would

10 have would be by leave to the Court of Appeals, which

11 means you would not have an automatic right to the

12 Court -- an appeal to the Court of Appeals, but rather

13 it would be in their discretion to take your appeal, do

14 you understand that?

15 DEFENDANT: Yes.

16 THE COURT: Now, other than what Ms. Rubio

17 and Mr. Harris have said here today in court, has

18 anyone promised you anything else to induce you to

19 enter a plea today?

20 DEFENDANT: No.

21 THE COURT: Has anyone threatened you in any

22 way to induce you to enter a plea today?

23 DEFENDANT: No.

24 THE COURT: Is it your choice and decision,

25 and your choice and decision alone, to enter a plea

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1 today?

2 DEFENDANT: Yes.


4 Ms. Rubio, can you please establish the

5 factual basis behind this plea?


7 Sir, I’m going to ask you some questions,

8 okay?

9 I’m gonna take your attention back to

10 December 15th of 2015. Do you recall that day?

11 DEFENDANT: Yes.

12 MS. RUBIO: On that day, were you at 20170

13 Mendota, in the City of Detroit?

14 DEFENDANT: Yes.

15 MS. RUBIO: And were you also there with

16 Dalona Tillman?

17 DEFENDANT: Yes.

18 MS. RUBIO: And on that day, did she die, in

19 that location?

20 DEFENDANT: Yes.

21 MS. RUBIO: And did you cause her death?

22 DEFENDANT: Yes.

23 MS. RUBIO: Did she die as a result of being

24 smothered?

25 DEFENDANT: Yes.

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1 MS. RUBIO: And at that time, did you intend

2 to kill her, or intend to cause her great bodily harm?

3 DEFENDANT: Yes.

4 MS. RUBIO: Okay.

5 I think that’s it.

6 The People are satisfied.

7 MR. HARRIS: Defense is satisfied, Your

8 Honor.

9 THE COURT: Okay.

10 Mr. Terrance, how do you wish to plea in this

11 matter?

12 DEFENDANT: Guilty.


14 The Court does accept the defendant’s plea,

15 finding that his plea has been made knowingly, and

16 volunarily.

17 Madame Clerk, when can we return for a

18 sentencing date?

19 CLERK: September 28th.


21 September 28th is a Wednesday.

22 MS. RUBIO: Oh, okay. That should be fine.

23 MR. HARRIS: Your Honor, I would tell the

24 Court that I start a murder trial that, that week, so

25 I’ll come on a break.

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1 THE COURT: That’s fine.

2 All right.

3 We will see you here on September 28th.


5 THE COURT: You’re welcome.

6 Is Mr. Harris still here?

7 Did you want to make reference of -- is there

8 an amended felony --

9 MS. RUBIO: Oh --

10 THE COURT: Amended Information?

11 MS. RUBIO: Yes. I did, actually, give a

12 copy to Madame Clerk, as well to defense counsel. I

13 filed a second amended Information to reflect the

14 changes, after the first trial date, which was that the

15 defendant was acquitted on count one, which was

16 originally murder, first degree, premeditation.

17 So, that only left us with one count.

18 THE COURT: Okay.



21 This concludes the hearing.

22 (Whereupon the proceedings were concluded for

23 the day at 10:30 a.m.)

24 - - -

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Treshaun Lee Terrance, Case No. 16-01235, on September 12,

2016 (Plea).


Dated:________________________

Detroit, Michigan



Suzanne L. Kinsey

January 20, 2017

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:02:1

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MRECEIVED by MSC 4/30/2019 9:58:35 PM594a

Order_031218_Judge Kevin Cox

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STATE OF MICHJGAN THIRD JUDICIAL CIRCUIT

WAYNE COUNTY

ORDER DENYING/GRANTING

MOTION

CASENO. 17-005253-01-FC

ORI Ml• 82109SJ Co11rt Addres1 1'41 St. A11tolnr, Detroit MI ~22~ Courtroom 604 Co11rt Telephone No. 313-ll'-2'4 l

THE PEOPLE OF fflE STATE OF MICHIGAN

vs.

Treshaun Lee Terrance Defendant

At a Session of Said Court held in Toe Frank Murphy Hall of Justice

at Detroit in Wayne County on MAR 1 2 2018

PRESENT: Honorable KevinJ. Cox --~--'------------

A Motion for: Defense motion to dismiss

----------------------------- having been filed; and

the People having filed and answer in opposition; and the Court having reviewed the briefs and records in the Cause and being fully advised in the premises;

IT IS ORDERED THAT the Motion for SAME ~;..=..=-----------------------be and

-i-s-hcr-cb_y __ 'f) ____ d_en-i-ed--0---flr_an_t-ed-.---------------

KevinJ. Cox

1014-JCC (D8/Q7)-0aDER DENYING/GRANTING MOTION

~ a6ed

If this opinion indicates that it is “FOR PUBLICATION,” it is subject to revision until final publication in the Michigan Appeals Reports.

S T A T E O F M I C H I G A N

C O U R T O F A P P E A L S PEOPLE OF THE STATE OF MICHIGAN, Plaintiff-Appellee,

UNPUBLISHED March 5, 2019

v No. 343154 Wayne Circuit Court


LC No. 17-005253-01-FC

Defendant-Appellant.

Before: SHAPIRO, P.J., and SERVITTO and GADOLA, JJ. PER CURIAM.

Defendant appeals by leave granted the trial court’s order denying his motion to dismiss a charge of torture, MCL 750.85. Defendant argues that the charge violates the issue-preclusion component of the Double Jeopardy Clause and constitutes an impermissible exercise of prosecutorial vindictiveness. We agree with the trial court’s ruling regarding prosecutorial vindictiveness, but hold that defendant may not be tried for torture after a jury necessarily decided in a prior trial that defendant did not commit the assault against the victim culminating in her death. Accordingly, we reverse and remand.1

I. BACKGROUND

The charges in this case arise out of the killing of defendant’s girlfriend, Dalona Tillman, by suffocation, preceded by a severe beating, at their home on December 15, 2015. Defendant denied the charges and told police that when Tillman returned to their home after what was to be a trip to the grocery store, she was badly beaten on her body and face and said she was dying. Defendant called 911, and first responders found Tillman unresponsive; she was later pronounced dead. The cause of death was asphyxiation. It was determined based on injuries to and discoloration around Tillman’s mouth that she had been “smothered.” The autopsy revealed

1 We review de novo questions of constitutional law. People v Leblanc, 465 Mich 575, 579; 640 NW2d 246 (2002).

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extensive injuries on Tillman’s body, including 71 abrasions, 7 incision wounds, and bruising over much of her body. According to the medical examiner, the great majority of Tillman’s injuries were “fresh.”

Defendant was tried before a jury on charges of first-degree premeditated murder and first-degree felony murder. The predicate felony for the felony-murder charge was torture, though it was not charged as a separate individual crime. The jury was instructed on second-degree murder as a lesser included offense for both charges. After two days of deliberation, the jury acquitted defendant of first-degree murder and the lesser offense of second-degree murder. The jury was unable, however, to reach a verdict on the felony-murder charge.

The prosecution then charged defendant a second time with felony murder, and defendant pleaded guilty to second-degree murder. However, after appointment of appellate counsel, defendant filed a motion to withdraw his plea, vacate his conviction, and dismiss the charge against him. Defendant contended that, because he was acquitted of second-degree murder in his first trial, he could not have been recharged with felony murder or second-degree murder and so his conviction of the latter constituted a double jeopardy violation. The prosecutor conceded that defendant was entitled to this relief under United States Supreme Court precedent, and the trial court granted the motion.2

The prosecutor then charged defendant with torture, and defendant again moved to dismiss, arguing that the charge constituted (1) a violation of double jeopardy and (2) a vindictive prosecution. With respect to double jeopardy, defendant argued that the jury necessarily decided that he was not the perpetrator of the assault against Tillman and therefore he could not be tried on that issue again. In response, the prosecution contended that the torture charge did not implicate double jeopardy concerns because defendant had only been acquitted of murder, leaving open the possibility that defendant tortured Tillman but did not kill her. The trial court denied defendant’s motion, concluding that the jury’s acquittal of murder did not necessarily imply a finding that defendant was not guilty of torture. The court also found that defendant failed to meet his burden of demonstrating prosecutorial vindictiveness.

II. ANALYSIS

A. DOUBLE JEOPARDY

Defendant argues that the current torture charge against him violates the issue-preclusion component of the Double Jeopardy Clause. He asserts that the jury in the first trial necessarily

2 The prosecution nevertheless appealed arguing that Yeager v United States, 557 US 110; 129 S Ct 2360; 174 L Ed 2d 78 (2009), was wrongly decided and we affirmed. People v Terrance, unpublished order of the Court of Appeals, entered August 24, 2017 (Docket No. 338938). The prosecution then filed for and was denied leave to appeal to the Michigan Supreme Court before also being denied certiorari by the United States Supreme Court. People v Terrance, 501 Mich 911 (2017), cert den ___ US ___; 138 S Ct 1334; 200 L Ed 2d 515 (2018).

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decided that he was not the perpetrator of the assault on December 15, 2015, that involved the victim’s beating and suffocation. We agree.

The Double Jeopardy Clause of the Fifth Amendment to the United States Constitution provides, “[N]or shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb.” US Const Amend V. See also Const 1963, art 1 § 15. The Double Jeopardy Clause serves “two vitally important interests.” The first interest is to protect against multiple prosecutions, and the second interest is to preserve “the finality of judgments.” Yeager v United States, 557 US 110, 117-118; 129 S Ct 2360; 174 L Ed 2d 78 (2009) (quotation marks and citation omitted). The Double Jeopardy Clause includes the concept of issue preclusion, also known as collateral estoppel. People v Garcia, 448 Mich 442, 497; 531 NW2d 683 (1995). Thus, in criminal proceedings, “when an issue of ultimate fact has once been determined by a valid and final judgment of acquittal, it cannot again be litigated in a second trial for a separate offense.” Yeager, 557 US at 119. To determine what a jury necessarily determined in the first trial, a court must “examine the record of a prior proceeding, taking into account the pleadings, evidence, charge, and other relevant matter, and conclude whether a rational jury could have grounded its verdict upon an issue other than that which the defendant seeks to foreclose from consideration.” Ashe v Swenson, 397 US 436, 444; 90 S Ct 1189; 25 L Ed 2d 469 (1970) (quotation marks and citations omitted).

For example, in Ashe a jury acquitted the defendant of robbing a participant in a poker game, and the prosecution then charged the defendant with robbing a different participant at the same game and obtained a conviction. Id. at 437-440. The United States Supreme Court held that the second conviction was barred by the issue-preclusion aspect of the Double Jeopardy Clause because, under the facts of that case, the first jury necessarily determined that there was a reasonable doubt that the defendant was one of the robbers. Id. at 443-446. In Bravo-Fernandez v United States, ___ US ___; 137 S Ct 352; 196 L Ed 2d 242 (2016), the Supreme Court reaffirmed the principle of issue preclusion in criminal cases but held that it did not apply in that case.

The record provided to us establishes that the jury was asked to find that defendant murdered Tillman in his home on December 15, 2015, as the final act of an assault in which he also inflicted a severe beating and that the extensive beating and suffocation constituted the crime of torture.3 The prosecution emphasized that point during closing argument, referring to the beating and killing as a single attack: “I submit to you that the only issue you may have, in your mind, at the, at this moment, the only element that you will have to deliberate when you go back into that room, is whether or not you think the defendant did it.” (Emphasis added). Throughout the trial, the prosecution’s evidence and argument were directed toward a finding that defendant was the victim’s sole assailant, that the assault was a continuous or near-

3 The elements of torture are as follows: (1) the defendant had custody or physical control over the victim, (2) the defendant exercised custody or physical control over the victim without consent or lawful authority, (3) the defendant intentionally caused great bodily injury and/or severe mental pain or suffering to the victim. MCL 750.85(1); M Crim JI 17.36.

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continuous event, beginning with a beating and culminating in defendant suffocating the victim. The defense asserted that defendant was not the party responsible for either the beating or the murder. The question, therefore, as presented by both sides, was whether defendant was the victim’s assailant on December 15, 2015; neither side suggested that defendant committed only the murder or only the beating. Accordingly, we conclude that the prosecution’s claim that defendant tortured the victim on that day is barred under the doctrine of issue preclusion by the jury’s verdict acquitting defendant of murder.

The prosecution argues that the acquittal on the first- and second-degree murder charges does not exclude the possibility that the jury might have convicted defendant of torture had it been separately charged. To a large degree, this argument rests on the fact that the jury did not reach a verdict on felony murder. The prosecution argues from this fact that the question of whether defendant committed torture was not answered. Were this a question of the more typical double jeopardy concept controlled by Blockburger,4 we would agree because the charges on which defendant was acquitted did not contain torture as an element. However, the issue preclusion-aspect of double jeopardy is governed by different rules which are intended to protect the finality of judgments. When applying issue preclusion, we may not consider the meaning or effect of the jury’s failure to reach a verdict on a charge.5 Yeager, 557 US at 122. The question turns not on the elements of the charged crimes, but rather on the actual evidence and factual arguments made at trial. Id. at 120. In other words, following his acquittals, defendant may only be charged with torture in a second trial if there was evidence or argument at the first trial from which the jury could have concluded, even by inference, that defendant was guilty of torture despite the fact that he did not commit the murder. In this case, there was none.

The prosecution also argues that by acquitting defendant of murder, the jury did not necessarily find that defendant did not kill Tillman because the jury was not asked to consider whether defendant committed involuntary manslaughter. This argument fails for several reasons. First, the prosecution may not rely on speculation about the basis for the acquittals. Rather it must show evidence to support its theory. Second, a rational view of the evidence does not support a theory of accidental killing or involuntary manslaughter. Involuntary manslaughter is

4 Under Blockburger v United States, 284 US 299; 52 S Ct 180; 76 L Ed 306 (1932), two offenses are not the same for double jeopardy purposes if they pass the “same elements” test, i.e., each requires proof of a fact that the other does not. People v Nutt, 469 Mich 565, 576; 677 NW2d 1 (2004). 5 Thus, the fact that the jury was hung on felony murder is wholly irrelevant to our analysis. Instead, we must focus on the jury’s verdict of acquittal, “which represents the community’s collective judgment regarding all the evidence and arguments presented to it.” Yeager, 557 US at 122. Our dissenting colleague notes this principle, but nonetheless relies on the fact that the jury was instructed to consider the crimes of murder and felony murder separately and concludes that “the jury did not necessarily determine that defendant did not torture the victim.” Thus, it is clear to us that the dissent is relying on the jury’s inability to reach a verdict on felony murder.

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“the unintentional killing of another, committed with a lesser mens rea of gross negligence or an intent to injure . . . .” People v McMullan, 284 Mich App 149, 152; 771 NW2d 810 (2009) (quotation marks and citations omitted). In this case, the medical examiner testified that “it can take anywhere from ninety seconds, up to two and a half to three minutes” to smother an adult. Thus, the evidence is this case is inconsistent with an unintentional killing. Moreover, the prosecution elected not to seek an instruction on the lesser-included offense of involuntary manslaughter. It may not forfeit its right to such an instruction in the first trial and then rely on the absence of that charge to speculate about what the jury might have done had it received such an instruction.

In sum, the record establishes that the prosecution asked the jury to find that defendant was the perpetrator of the assaultive acts against Tillman on the day of her death. The record at trial provides no basis to conclude that a rational juror could have decided that defendant did not suffocate the victim but did commit the beating immediately preceding that act. As the prosecution argued, the ultimate issue of fact in the first trial was whether defendant was the one who perpetrated the entire assault, i.e., whether defendant “did it.” The jury’s decision to acquit defendant of murder in light of the record evidence cannot support a conclusion that defendant committed the assault culminating in that murder. Accordingly, the prosecution is barred by issue preclusion from relitigating that issue in a second trial.6

Our dissenting colleague suggests that we are improperly prohibiting the prosecution from adjusting its trial strategy upon retrial after a hung jury. This argument puts the cart before the horse. Certainly, when there is a retrial following a hung jury, the prosecution may alter its strategy and introduce different evidence on retrial. See Yeager, 557 US at 118. However, that does not mean that a retrial is necessarily permissible; it is a rule that comes into play only if a retrial is not barred by some other rule of law such as issue preclusion. See id. at 118-119. The dissent speculates that on retrial the prosecution may have evidence from which a torture conviction could be obtained. This view ignores the fact that we must determine the question of

6 We note that this does not preclude new charges based upon assaults that were not part of the beatings that culminated in the victim’s death. At trial, the medical examiner testified that while the majority of the injuries she found on Tillman’s body were “fresh,” meaning that they could have occurred anytime within a 24-hour period before her death, several injuries were more than a day old. The prosecution clearly relied on the victim’s most recent injuries in trying to prove to the jury that defendant tortured the victim. For the reasons discussed, the jury’s verdict shows that it found at least a reasonable doubt as to whether defendant caused those injuries. However, at least at this point, we cannot dismiss the possibility that the prosecution may be able to prove that some of the victim’s injuries occurred before the acts for which defendant has already been tried. To the degree the new charge of torture is based upon alleged acts that occurred prior to the day on which the victim was killed, it is not barred by issue preclusion. To be clear, however, no evidence concerning any assaultive behavior at issue in the first trial may be admitted as direct evidence of guilt or as other bad acts evidence.

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issue preclusion based on the record of the first trial, not by what might be done differently at a second trial. Thus, the dissent miscomprehends the purpose of the issue-preclusion component of double jeopardy, which is to ensure the finality of the jury’s verdict. See id.

B. PROSECUTORIAL VINDICTIVENESS

Defendant also argues that the torture charge constitutes prosecutorial vindictiveness. We disagree.

Prosecutorial vindictiveness occurs when a person is punished for exercising a statutory or constitutional right. People v Ryan, 451 Mich 30, 35-36; 545 NW2d 612, 616 (1996). Such punishment constitutes a violation of due process. Id. “[T]here are two types of prosecutorial vindictiveness, presumed vindictiveness and actual vindictiveness.” Id. Actual vindictiveness exists only when there is “objective evidence of an expressed hostility or threat suggests that the defendant was deliberately penalized for his exercise of a procedural, statutory, or constitutional right.” Id. (quotation marks, citation, and footnote omitted). Presumptive vindictiveness, on the other hand, has been found “in certain cases in which action detrimental to the defendant has been taken after the exercise of a legal right . . . .” United States v Goodwin, 457 US 368, 373; 102 S Ct 2485; 73 L Ed 2d 74 (1982). In order to prove presumptive vindictiveness, a defendant must show a reasonable likelihood of vindictiveness. Id. “[T]he appearance of vindictiveness results only where, as a practical matter, there is a realistic or reasonable likelihood of prosecutorial conduct that would not have occurred but for hostility or a punitive animus towards the defendant because he has exercised his specific legal rights.” United States v Gallegos-Curiel, 681 F2d 1164, 1169 (CA 9, 1982).

Defendant argues that the prosecution’s decision to charge him with torture after he was acquitted of first- and second-degree murder, and only after he successfully challenged his plea, establishes a presumption of prosecutorial vindictiveness. We decline to hold that a presumption of vindictiveness arises when the prosecution charges the defendant with an equivalent or lower offense after exercising a legal right. When the prosecution brings a more severe charge, this indicates a high likelihood that the new charge was intended to punish the defendant for asserting his rights and to discourage assertion of those rights. However, when the new charge carries the same or lesser punishment as the original charge, it is difficult to see how this punishes a criminal defendant for exercising a legal right or deters future defendants from asserting that right. Absent some additional proof of vindictiveness, we see no basis for concluding that a new charge that does not carry the possibility of greater punishment is a vindictive prosecution.

Reversed and remanded for proceedings consistent with this opinion. We do not retain jurisdiction.

/s/ Douglas B. Shapiro /s/ Deborah A. Servitto

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If this opinion indicates that it is “FOR PUBLICATION,” it is subject to revision until final publication in the Michigan Appeals Reports.

S T A T E O F M I C H I G A N

C O U R T O F A P P E A L S PEOPLE OF THE STATE OF MICHIGAN, Plaintiff-Appellee,

UNPUBLISHED March 5, 2019

v No. 343154 Wayne Circuit Court


LC No. 17-005253-01-FC

Defendant-Appellant.

Before: SHAPIRO, P.J., and SERVITTO and GADOLA, JJ. GADOLA, J. (dissenting)

As summarized by the majority, based on allegations that defendant brutally beat and then suffocated the victim, defendant was charged with first-degree premeditated murder, MCL 750.316(1)(a), and first-degree felony murder, MCL 750.315(1)(b), premised on the underlying felony of torture, MCL 750.85. At trial, the jury was additionally instructed regarding the lesser included offense of second-degree murder, MCL 750.317. The jury acquitted defendant of the first- and second-degree murder charges but was unable to reach a verdict with respect to the felony-murder charge. The prosecution now seeks to charge defendant with torture. The majority reverses and remands the trial court’s order denying defendant’s motion to dismiss the torture charge on the ground that double jeopardy protections prevent retrial on an issue necessarily decided by the jury in a previous trial. Specifically, the majority holds that, by acquitting defendant of first- and second-degree murder, the jury necessarily determined that he did not commit any of the charged acts of violence against the victim, including torture. I respectfully dissent and would affirm the trial court’s order.

Under the Double Jeopardy Clauses of the United States and Michigan Constitutions, a criminal defendant may not twice be placed in jeopardy for a single offense. US Const, Am V; Const 1963, art 1 § 15; see also People v Ford, 262 Mich App 443, 447; 687 NW2d 119 (2004). The prohibition against double jeopardy protects against multiple punishments for the same offense and against successive prosecutions for the same offense after acquittal or conviction. Ford, 262 Mich App at 447. However, when prosecution of an offense results in a mistrial due to the jury’s inability to reach a verdict, double jeopardy protections do not preclude reprosecution and retrial of that offense. Yeager v United States, 557 US 110, 118; 129 S Ct

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2360; 174 L Ed 2d 78 (2009). Rather, a jury’s inability to reach a verdict is treated as a “nonevent” that does not bar retrial. Id.

Although a criminal defendant generally may be retried for an offense on which the jury was unable to reach a verdict, this principle may be undercut by the doctrine of collateral estoppel. Double jeopardy protections encompass the doctrine of collateral estoppel and thus preclude relitigation of any ultimate issue of fact that was “necessarily decided” by a jury’s acquittal in a previous trial. Id. at 119, citing Ashe v Swenson, 397 US 436, 443; 90 S Ct 1189; 25 L Ed 2d 469 (1970); see also People v Wilson, 496 Mich 91, 99; 852 NW2d 134 (2014), abrogated on other grounds by Bravo-Fernandez v United States, __ US __; 137 S Ct 352; 196 L Ed 2d 242 (2016). Accordingly, “when an issue of ultimate fact has once been determined by a valid and final judgment of acquittal, it cannot again be litigated in a second trial for a separate offense.” Id. (quotation marks and citation omitted). In evaluating whether an issue has been necessarily decided, courts may not consider or draw any inferences from the fact that a jury was unable to reach a verdict on any count during the first trial. Id. at 122-123. Rather, courts must “examine the record of a prior proceeding, taking into account the pleadings, evidence, charge, and other relevant matter, and conclude whether a rational jury could have grounded its verdict upon an issue other than that which the defendant seeks to foreclose from consideration.” Ashe, 397 US at 444.

Before the jury in the present case began its deliberations, the trial court delivered instructions regarding the elements necessary to prove the first- and second-degree murder charges, as well as felony murder premised on an underlying felony of torture. Of relevance to the present discussion, the elements necessary to prove second-degree murder are “(1) a death, (2) the death was caused by an act of the defendant, (3) the defendant acted with malice, and (4) the defendant did not have lawful justification or excuse for causing the death.” People v Smith, 478 Mich 64, 70; 731 NW2d 411 (2007). “Malice” is defined as “the intent to kill, to cause great bodily harm, or to do an act in wanton and willful disregard of the likelihood that the natural tendency of such behavior is to cause death or great bodily harm.” People v Woods, 416 Mich 581, 627; 331 NW2d 707 (1982). First-degree murder incorporates the same elements as second-degree murder but requires the heightened mens rea of a premeditated and deliberate intent to kill. See People v Dykhouse, 418 Mich 488, 502; 345 NW2d 150 (1984); see also People v Oros, 502 Mich 229, 240; 917 NW2d 559 (2018) (elements of first-degree murder are “(1) the intentional killing of a human (2) with premeditation and deliberation.”).

In light of the jury’s acquittal on the first- and second-degree murder charges, the prosecution now alleges that defendant tortured the victim by severely beating her but does not allege that defendant suffocated her. The elements necessary to prove torture are as follows: (1) the defendant had custody or physical control over the victim through force or use of force, (2) the defendant exercised custody or physical control over the victim without consent or without lawful authority to do so, and (3) the defendant intentionally caused great bodily injury or severe mental pain or suffering to the victim. MCL 750.85(1); M Crim JI 17.36.

By acquitting defendant of first- and second-degree murder, the jury did not necessarily determine that defendant did not commit any acts of violence against the victim. Rather, the jury could have grounded its acquittal on a finding that defendant was not the ultimate cause of the victim’s death or that defendant lacked the requisite intent to commit murder. Such findings

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would be consistent with the prosecution’s theory at trial, and with the evidence demonstrating that the victim’s death was caused by suffocation, as opposed to the injuries sustained from the beating. And although convictions for both second-degree murder and torture may be premised on a defendant’s intent to cause great bodily harm, the jury’s acquittal of defendant was not necessarily predicated on the absence of this element. Nor is a finding of the intent to do great bodily harm necessary to a conviction for torture, which may also be based on the intent to cause severe mental pain and suffering. The torture charge is therefore not premised on any common issue of fact necessarily decided in the first trial and does not constitute the “same offense” as either of the murder charges. See Yeager, 557 US at 119 (“The proper question, under the [Double Jeopardy] Clause’s text, is whether it is appropriate to treat the insider trading charges as the ‘same offence’ as the fraud charges.”).

This conclusion is consistent with Yeager’s directive that, in determining whether double jeopardy protections preclude retrial on a charge on which a jury was hung, courts may not consider or draw any inferences from the fact that a jury was unable to reach a verdict on that charge. See id. at 122-123. My analysis of this case does not draw any inferences from the fact that the jury could not reach a verdict on the felony murder charge premised on the underlying felony of torture. Rather, the above analysis is limited to an examination of whether, in acquitting defendant, the jury necessarily decided any issues of fact that the prosecution must establish in order to convict defendant of torture. I conclude that it did not.

The present case is unlike Ashe, which involved the armed robbery of six men engaged in a poker game. Ashe, 397 US at 437. In Ashe, the defendant was initially charged and acquitted of the armed robbery of one of the players but was subsequently tried a second time and found guilty of the robbery of another player in the same game. Id. at 438. During the first trial, the jurors were instructed by the trial court that a conviction would be sustained if they determined that the defendant was one of the armed robbers, even if he had not personally robbed that particular participant in the poker game. Id. at 439. The United States Supreme Court determined that the second prosecution violated principles of double jeopardy, as “[t]he single rationally conceivable issue in dispute before the jury was whether the [defendant] had been one of the robbers. And the jury by its verdict found that he had not.” Id. at 445. In the present case, by contrast, the jury’s verdict could have been grounded upon an issue other than defendant’s identity as the perpetrator.

The majority holds that the prosecution presented the alleged beating and subsequent suffocation of the victim as a single assault and submitted to the jury that the only factual question at issue was “whether or not you think the defendant did it.” Likewise, the majority observes that the defendant denied the charges in their entirety. However, the parties’ positions at trial are unremarkable. In virtually every criminal case that proceeds to trial, the prosecution will seek convictions on all charges, while the defendant will deny all charges. More significantly, and in stark contrast to Ashe, the trial court’s jury instructions emphasized that the charges were to be treated as separate and independent:

These are separate crimes, and the Prosecutor is charging that the defendant committed both of them.

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You must consider each crime separately, in light of all the evidence in the case.

You may find the defendant guilty of both, or either of these crimes, or not guilty. [(Emphasis added).]

Thus, the jury was not instructed to resolve the sole issue of defendant’s identity as the perpetrator of a single assault consisting of a beating and suffocation. Rather, the jury was instructed to consider the murder charges (premised on the allegation that defendant suffocated the victim) independently from the felony murder charge based on an underlying felony of torture (premised on the allegation that defendant brutally beat the victim). Given that a jury is presumed to follow its instructions, People v Armstrong, 490 Mich 281, 294; 806 NW2d 676 (2011), it may be assumed that the jury separately considered the charges and the underlying factual allegations. As such, by acquitting defendant of the murder charges, the jury did not necessarily determine that defendant did not torture the victim.1

The majority additionally suggests that the prosecution’s theory and evidence advanced at trial – that defendant severely beat and then suffocated the victim – is inconsistent with the theory that defendant tortured the victim but did not murder her. Specifically, the majority notes that the evidence does not indicate that more than one person harmed the victim or that the victim’s death could have been unintentional. However, the majority cites to no authority preventing the prosecution from adjusting its factual theory or evidence on reprosecution of one count in order to accommodate an acquittal on a separate count. Indeed, it is well-settled that the prosecution may reprosecute criminal charges on which a jury was unable to reach a verdict, given “society’s interest in giving the prosecution one complete opportunity to convict those who have violated its laws.” Arizona v Washington, 434 US 497, 509; 98 S Ct 824; 54 L Ed 2d 717 (1978). To preclude the prosecution from modifying its theory or evidence on retrial would significantly hamper its ability to reprosecute any charges on which a jury was unable to reach a verdict when the jury also acquitted the defendant on another charge. Applying such a rule would additionally burden courts with reviewing and comparing the evidence and arguments presented during subsequent trials for the slightest deviation.

I would thus affirm the trial court’s order denying defendant’s motion to dismiss the torture charge.

/s/ Michael F. Gadola

1 By considering the jury instructions, I draw no inferences from the fact that the jury was unable to reach a verdict on the felony-murder charge. Rather, these instructions simply rebut the majority’s own position that the jury treated defendant’s alleged torture and subsequent murder of the victim as a single offense such that, by acquitting defendant of the murder charges, the jury necessarily determined he also did not commit torture.

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Photograph of Dalona Tillman

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SC 11/27/2019 2:41:26 PMOFFICE of the WA.YNE COUNTY MEDICAL EXAMINER

1300 East Warren Avenue Detroit, Ml 48207

POST MORTEM REPORT

M E CASE NUMBER

15-13848

COUNTY OF DEATH

WAYNE

TOWN OF DEATH

DETROIT

DATE PRONOUNCED DEAD

Dec 15, 2015

THIS IS TO CERTIFY THAT PERFORMED A POSTMORTEM EXAMINATION ON THE BODY Leigh Hlavaty, M.D., Deputy Chief Medical Examiner DELONA TILLMAN AT ON

Wayne County Medical Examiner's Office Dec 16, 2015

SUMMARY & OPINION

It is my opinion that death was caused by smothering. Investigation revealed multiple stories of how · e iniur es were inflicted onto the decedent, including an assault from a group of girls the day prior to death and the decedent being "tortured" by two males the day of death. She was found unresponsive in her home by EMS and was conveyed to the hospital where she was pronounced dead about 45 minutes after arrival.

A fairly well delineated band of pallor was present across the nose and both cheeks, indicating that pressure was placed across her face and blocked both nostrils. Multiple small abrasions and a small laceration were on the lips, multiple abrasions were on the inside of the upper lip that corresponded fo the edges of teeth, and a large laceration was also on the inside of the left corner of the mouth. These abrasions and lacerations appeared fresh with no evidence of healing, and indicate that pressure was also placed on the mouth.

Innumerable contusions or bruises, numerous (at least 71) abrasions, and 7 incised wounds or cuts were on the body in addition to the injuries described above. There were no internal injuries to any of the body's organs or vital structures, so although these injuries indicate an extensive assault they did not cause or contribute to the death. When on the extremities, these injuries were predominantly on the lateral aspects of the limbs and indicate that a struggle had occurred ('defensive-type' injuries).

The abrasions were on right lateral upper eyelid, medial to the right eye, beneath the left lateral brow, left bridge of the nose, left cheek, right lateral neck, left anterior lower neck, both shoulders, both upper arms, both elbows, both forearms, both hands, bilateral upper back, mid back, both buttocks, both thighs, both lower legs, and left ankle and foot. The abrasions were mostly linear or irregular in shape, and the smaller abrasions were· frequently grouped or clustered. A few abrasions on the left cheek and right upper arm were small and round, and could represent superficial cigarette burns.

The contusions ranged from more discrete to becoming confluent and were thus innumerable. The more discrete bruises were on the right forehead, both cheeks, both sides of the jaw, left upper chest, left anterior "'!~fat, left upper back, right lateral hip, right anterior and lateral thigh, right lateral and posterior lower leg, left posterior thi;h, and lateral left foot. Numerous discrete to near-confluent bruises were on the right dorsal wrist and hand, lateral atpect of the left thigh, anterior and lateral aspects of the left knee, and lateral aspect of the left lower leg. Confluent bruises diffusely involved the lateral aspects of both shoulders, posterior and laterals aspects of both upper arms, posterior and lateral aspects of both forearms, and the left dorsal wrist and hand.

The seven incised wounds or cuts were on the mid forehead, beneath the right lateral brow, bridge of the nose, left chin, back of the right hand, back of the left hand, and right anterior thigh. These cuts injured the skin only with no internal injuries present.

Most of the abrasions, contusions, and incised wounds appeared fresh with no evidence of healing. However, injuries that appeared to be healing and were thus older included: abrasions on the face beneath the left lateral brow and on the left cheek, right upper arm, right elbow, left posterior thigh , right lateral lower leg, and left medial ankle; the bruise on the left posterior thigh; and the cut on the dorsal left hand.

Autopsy did not reveal any diseases that caused or contributed to death. Comprehensive postmortem toxicology revealed only products of marijuana in the decedent's blood and was thus noncontributory.

Smothering is an inability to breathe (asphyxia) due to external blockage of the nose and mouth. Asphyxia is a diagnosis of exclusion, and a complete autopsy did not disclose any diseases or drugs that caused or contributed to death.

(Printed Tuesday, January 26, 2016 3:16:58 PM) Page 1 of6

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OFFICE of the WAYNE COUNTY MEDICAL EXAMINER 1300 East Warren Avenue

Detroit, Ml 48207

POST MORTEM REPORT

M.E. CASE NUMBER

15-13848

COUNTY OF DEA TH

WAYNE

TOWN OF DEATH

DETROIT


Dec15, 2015

Although the decedent was extensively beaten about her body, there were no internal injuries and this assault or "torture" did not contribute to death. Smothering may result in injuries on or around the nose and mouth, and the decedent had a mark across her face and nose and injuries to her mouth that indicated these areas were obstructed.

The manner of death is homicide .

. , Deputy Chief Medical Examiner

(report continues on next page)


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Detroit, Ml 48207

POST MORTEM REPORT

Cause of Death:

SMOTHERING

Other Significant Conditions:

Manner of Death:

Homicide

NARRATIVE SUMMARY

Case Number: 13848 - 15 Name: Delena Tillman Date of Pronounced Death: December 15, 2015 Date of Postmortem Examination: December 16, 2015

EXTERNAL EXAMINATION:

M.E. CASE NUMBER

15-13848

COUNTY OF DEATH

WAYNE

TOVvNOFDEATH

DETROIT


Dec 15, 2015

The body was that of a normally developed black female appearing about the recorded age of 21 years. The body measured 5 feet 8 inches in length and weighed 150 pounds. The body was cool, rigor mortis was fully developed, and liver mortis was present posteriorly and fixed. No clothing was received with the body. The head was normocephalic and was not congested. The scalp hair was black, short, and curly. The eyes had white sclerae, pale conjunctivae, and brown irides. No petechia were present. The dentition was natural. No lesions of the oral mucosa were identified. There were no masses discernable in the neck and the larynx was in the midline. The thorax was symmetrical and unremarkable. The abdomen was rounded. The external genitalia were those of a normal adult female with no injuries present. The extremities and back showed no significant deformities or other abnormalities. Tattoos consisted of a heart with a name on the right shoulder, a name with a star on the right upper arm, a flower on the right forearm, a name with stars on the left forearm, "RIP" with a name and two dates across the upper chest, a butterfly on the right lower abdomen, and two hearts with "est" and a date on the left lower abdomen. The fingernails were too short to be clipped.

EVIDENCE OF TREATMENT:

An endotracheal tube was in place. There was a 1 inch open surgical incision on the lateral left chest that extended through the left lateral fifth intercostal space. There was an intraosseous line in the right lower leg. Defibrillator and electrocardiograph pads were in place.

EVIDENCE OF INJURY:

Smothering: A fairly well delineated band of pallor that measured 4 inches wide by 1 inch long was present on the nose and both cheeks and encompassed the entire tip of the nose (including both nostrils). Multiple small (1/16 inch to 1/4 inch) abrasions were on the upper and lower lips and beneath the lower lip. A 1 /2 inch laceration was on the left upper lip. Multiple abrasions were on the inside of the upper lip and corresponded to the edges of teeth, and a 1 inch laceration was on the inside of the left corner of the mouth. These abrasions and lacerations appeared fresh with no evidence of healing.

Blunt Force Injury:


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Detroit, Ml 48207

POST MORTEM REPORT

M.E. CASE NUMBER

15-13848

COUNTY OF DEATH

WAYNE

TOWN OF DEATH

DETROIT


Dec 15, 2015

Innumerable contusions and at least 71 abrasions were on the body in addition to the injuries described above.

The abrasions ranged from 1/16 inch to 1 inch in maximum dimension. These abrasions were mostly linear or irregular in shape. The smaller abrasions were frequently grouped or clustered, and each cluster was counted as one abrasion in order to count the minimum number of abrasions on the body. When on the extremities, the abrasions were predominantly on the lateral aspects of the limbs. The abrasions were on the right lateral upper eyelid (1 ), medial to the right eye (1 ), beneath the left lateral brow (1 ), left bridge of the nose (1 ), left cheek (6), right lateral neck (1 ), left anterior lower neck (2), right shoulder (5), right upper arm (5), right elbow (3), right forearm (5), right anterior wrist (1 ), right dorsal hand (2), left shoulder (5), left upper arm (5), left elbow (1), left forearm (3), left dorsal hand (1), right upper back (3), left upper back (2), mid back (2), right buttock (1 ), left buttock and beneath (2), right lateral thigh (1 ), right lateral lower leg (1 ), left lateral thigh (2) and left posterior thigh (1 ), left anterior lower leg (1) and left lateral lower leg (1 ), left medial ankle (1 ), and left lateral ankle and foot (4).

Most of these abrasions appeared fresh with no evidence of healing. A few abrasions showed evidence of healing with scab formation present, and these were on the face beneath the left lateral brow and on the left cheek, and also on the right upper arm, right elbow, left posterior thigh, right lateral lower leg, and left medial ankle. A few abrasions were round, measured 1/4 inch in diameter, and could represent superficial cigarette burns, and these were on the left cheek and right upper arm.

The contusions ranged from 0.25 inch in maximum dimension to becoming confluent and were thus innumerable. The more discrete contusions were on the right forehead (1 inch by 1/2 inch), right cheek (2 inch by 2 inch), left cheek (2 inch by 1 1 /2 inch), right jaw (1 /4 inch, 1/4 inch, and 1 3/4 inch), left jaw (2 inch by 1 1/2 inch), left upper chest (1 inch), left anterior wrist (2 inch by 2 inch), left upper back (1 inch and 2 inch), right lateral hip (1 inch and 1 inch), right anterior thigh (1/2 inch and 1/2 inch) and right lateral thigh (1 inch and 2 inch), right lateral lower leg (four, ranging from 1/2 inch to 2 inch), right posterior lower leg (3 inch by 3 inch), left posterior thigh (7 inch by 6 inch), and lateral left foot (1 1/2 inch). The coalescing contusions diffusely involved the lateral aspect of the right shoulder, posterior and laterals aspect of the right upper arm (maximally measuring 8 inches), posterior and lateral aspects of the right forearm (maximally measuring 6 inches), lateral aspect of the left shoulder, posterior and latera_ls aspect of the left upper arm (maximally measuring 6 inches), posterior and lateral aspects of the left forearm (maximally measuring 10 inches), and left dorsal wrist and hand (maximally measuring 6 inches). In addition, there were numerous near confluent contusions on the right dorsal wrist and hand (maximally measuring 6 inches), lateral aspect of the left thigh (maximally measuring 6 inches), anterior and lateral aspects of the left knee (maximally measuring 4 inches), and lateral aspect of the left lower leg (maximally measuring_4 inches).

Most of these contusions appeared fresh and were predominantly red in color. Several of the coalescing contusions clustered around areas with central absence of color. At least one.area of contusion showed evidence of healing with central yellow discoloration of the skin, and this was located on the left posterior thigh.

Subsequent internal examination revealed multiple contusions on the reflected bilateral frontal and parietal scalp that ranged from 0.25 inch to 1 inch in greatest dimension. There was also a 0.75 inch contusion on the parietal pleura overlying the right posterior ninth rib without associated fracture. There were no internal head, neck, chest, abdominal, or pelvic injuries present.

Sharp Force Injury: There were seven incised wounds or cuts on the face and body. The incised wounds injured the skin only, the subcutaneous tissue and deeper tissues were intact. These incised wounds were on the mid forehead (3/4 inch in length), beneath the right lateral brow (3/4 inch), bridge of the nose (1/2 inch), left chin (1 /2 inch), back of the right hand (1 /4 inch), back of the left hand (3/4 inch), and right anterior thigh (3/8 inch). Most of these cuts appeared fresh with no evidence of healing, however the incised wound on the dorsal left hand showed evidence of healing with early granulation of the wound edges.

INTERNAL EXAMINATION:

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OFFICE of the WAYNE COUNT¥ MEDICAL EXAMINER 1300 East Warren Avenue

Detroit, Ml 48207

POST MORTEM REPORT

M.E. CASE NUMBER

15-13848

COUNlY OF DEATH

WAYNE

TOWN OF DEATH

DETROIT


Dec 15, 2015

An autopsy was performed utilizing the normal thoraco-abdominal and posterior coronal scalp incisions. The pleural, pericardia!, and peritoneal cavities had smooth serosal surfaces and the viscera were in their normal anatomical positions. An anterior neck dissection with internal examination of the underlying muscles, vessels, and structures was performed. Except for the above previously described injuries, the internal systems were as follows:

Head: No other abnormality was noted in the reflected scalp, calvarium, dura, meninges or the base of the skull. The 1275 gm brain was free of any edema, neoplastic and other focal lesions, infarcts, and hemorrhages. The cerebral vascular system was unremarkable.

Neck: No abnormality was noted in the cervical muscles, hyoid bone, laryngeal cartilages, trachea, or the cervical vertebral column.

Cardiovascular System: The 275 gm heart had a normal configuration with an unremarkable epicardial surface and a moderate amount of epicardial fat. The coronary arteries had no significant atherosclerotic disease. No acute thrombi were present. Both ventricles were of normal size and their walls were of normal thickness. No focal endomyocardial lesions were present. The papillary muscles and chordae tendineae were not thickened, and the heart valves were unremarkable. The aorta had no significant atherosclerosis. The major arteries and great veins showed normal distribution.

Respiratory System: The larynx and trachea were unremarkable. The right and left lungs weighed 275 gm and 250 gm, respectively. There was passive congestion in the parenchyma that was accentuated with dependent lividity. No pulmonary emboli were identified.

Hepatobiliary System: The 1300 gm liver had firm dark tan surfaces and an unremarkable parenchymal pattern. The gallbladder and biliary tracts were unremarkable.

Hemolymphatics: The 100 gm spleen had smooth surfaces and dark purple firm pulp. There was no significant lymphadenopathy.

Alimentary System: The tongue, esophagus, stomach, small bowel, appendix and colon were unremarkable. The lining of the stomach had an intact and unremarkable rugal pattern and the contents of the stomach consisted of approximately 150 ml of liquid.

Pancreas: The pancreas showed an unremarkable tan lobulated pattern.

Endocrine System: The thyroid gland had a normal bilobed configuration. The adrenal glands were each unremarkable with golden-yellow cortices.

Genitourinary System: The right and left kidneys weighed 125 gm and 175 gm, respectively. Each kidney had smooth cortical surfaces, normal cortico-medullary regions and no changes in the calyceal systems, pelves, ureters, or bladder. The non-gravid uterus was of normal size and had a smooth, glistening, tannish-pink serosal surface and an unremarkable cervix and endometrium. The fallopian tubes were patent and the ovaries were unremarkable.

Musculoskeletal System: Except for the above noted injuries, all the muscles and axial skeleton were free of any significant abnormalities.

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Detroit, Ml 48207

POST MORTEM REPORT

M.E. CASE NUMBER

15-13848

COUNTY OF DEATH

WAYNE

TOWN OF DEATH

DETROIT


Dec 15, 2015

Routine tissue specimens were retained in formalin for one year after autopsy in accordance with the current record retention schedule.

MICROSCOPIC DESCRIPTION

Cassette Summary: 1. Brain 2. Kidney 3. Kidney 4. Lung 5. Lung 6. Lung 7. Lung 8. Heart 9. Heart 10. Liver

Sections showed no significant histopathologic abnormalities.

ANATOMIC DIAGNOSES

1. Fairly well delineated band of pallor on the nose and both cheeks that encompassed the entire tip of the nose 2. Multiple small abrasions on the upper and lower lips and beneath the lower lip, and a laceration on the left upper lip. 3. Multiple abrasions on the inside of the upper lip that corresponded to the edges of teeth, and a laceration on the inside of the left corner of the mouth. 4. Numerous abrasions on the right lateral upper eyelid, medial to the right eye, beneath the left lateral brow, left bridge of the nose, left cheek, right lateral neck, left anterior lower neck, both shoulders, both upper arms, both elbows, both forearms, both hands, bilateral upper back, mid back, both buttocks, both thighs, both lower legs, and left ankle and fa~ . 5. Innumerable contusions on the right forehead, both cheeks, both sides of the jaw, left upper chest, both shoulders, both upper arms, both forearms, both wrists, backs of both hands, right hip, right lower leg, both thighs, left knee, both lower legs, and left foot 6. Seven incised wounds on the mid forehead, beneath the right lateral brow, bridge of the nose, left chin, back of the right hand, back of the left hand, and right anterior thigh 7. Multiple contusions on the reflected bilateral frontal and parietal scalp without other internal injuries 8. Contusion on the parietal pleura overlying the right posterior ninth rib without fracture or other injuries 9. No diseases present

(End of Report)


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NMS r --,-. rT··--1 L __ • _!~ __ _j

Supplemental Report

NMS Labs 3701 Welsh Road, PO Box 433A, Willow Grove, PA 19090-0437

Phone: (215) 657-4900 Fax: (215) 657-2972 e-mail: [email protected]

Robert A. Middleberg, PhD, F-ABFT, DABCC-TC, Laboratory D(rector

CONFIDENTIAL

Report Issued 12/31/2015 13:59

Patient Name Patient ID Chain

TILLMAN, DELONA 15-13848 11940870

Last Report Issued 12/23/2015 12:59

To: 10373 University of Michigan - Wayne County Attn: Dr. Carl J. Schmidt 1300 East Warren Detroit, Ml 48207

Positive Findings:

Compound

11-Hydroxy Delta-9 THC Delta-9 Carboxy THC Delta-9THC

Result

2.9 100 7.5

See Detailed Findings section for additional information

Testing Requested:

Analysis Code Description

Age 21 Y Gender Workorder

Page 1 of 4

.1Jnits. ng/mL ng/mL ng/mL

DOB Not Given Female 15379262

Matrix Soucce 001 - Peripheral Blood 001 - Peripheral Blood 001 - Peripheral Blood

80578

87568 95608

Postmortem Toxicology - Expanded with Vitreous Alcohol Confirmation, Blood - University of Ml (CSA) Novel Psychoactive Substances (NPS) Screen 1, Blood Synthetic Cannabinoids Screen, Blood (Forensic)

Specimens Received:

ID Tube/Container

001 Gray Top Tube 002 Gray Top Tube 003 Red Top Tube 004 \Miite Plastic Container

Volume/ Mass

8.25ml 5.25ml 3.8ml 14.66 g

All sample volumes/weights are approximations.

Specimens received on 12/17/2015.

Collection Matrix Source Date/Time

12/16/2015 Peripheral Blood 12/16/2015 Peripheral Blood 12/16/2015 Vitreous Fluid 12/16/2015 Liver lissue

Miscellaneous lnfonnation

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NMS CONFIDENTIAL Workorder 15379262

Chain 11940870 Patient ID 15-13848

L .t; 31 ··· -· ; Page 2 of4

Detailed Findings: Rpt.

Analysis and Comments Result Units Limit Specimen Source Analysis By

11-Hydroxy Delta-9 THC 2.9 ng/mL 1.0 001 - Peripheral Blood LC-MS/MS

Delta-9 Carboxy THC 100 ng/mL 5.0 001 - Peripheral Blood LC-MS/MS

Delta-9 THC 7.5 ng/mL 0.50 001 - Peripheral Blood LC-MS/MS

Other than the above findings, examination of the specimen(s) submitted did not reveal any positive findings of toxicological significance by procedures outlined in the accompanying Analysis Summary.

Reference Comments:

1. 11-Hydroxy Delta-9 THC (Active Metabolite) - Peripheral Blood:

11-Hydroxy Delta-9 THC is an active intermediate metabolite of tetrahydrocannabinol (THC) the active component of marijuana. Usual peak levels: Less than 10% of THC levels after smoking.

2. Delta-9 Carboxy THC (Inactive Metabolite) - Peripheral Blood:

Delta-9-THC is the principle psychoactive ingredient of marijuana/hashish. Delta-9-carboxy-THC (THCC) is the inactive metabolite of THC. The usual peak concentrations in serum for 1.75% or 3.55% THC marijuana cigarettes are 10 - 101 ng/mL attained 32 to 240 minutes after beginning smoking, with a slow decline thereafter. The ratio of whole blood concentration to plasma concentration is unknown for this analyte. THCC may be detected for up to one day or more in blood. Both delta-9-THC and THCC may be present substantially longer in chronic users. THCC is usually not detectable after passive inhalation.

3. Delta-9 THC (Active Ingredient of Marijuana) - Peripheral Blood:

Marijuana is a DEA Schedule I hallucinogen. Pharmacologically, it has depressant and reality distorting effects. Collectively, the chemical compounds that comprise marijuana are known as Cannabinoids.

Delta-9-THC is the principle psychoactive ingredient of marijuana/hashish. It rapidly leaves the blood, even during smoking, falling to below detectable levels within several hours. Delta-9-carboxy-THC (THCC) is the inactive metabolite of THC and may be detected for up to one day or more in blood. Both delta-9-THC and THCC may be present substantially longer in chronic users. THC concentrations in blood are usually about one-half of serum/plasma concentrations. Usual peak levels in serum for 1. 75% or 3.55% THC marijuana cigarettes: 50 - 270 ng/mL at 6 to 9 minutes after beginning smoking, decreasing to less than 5 ng/ml by 2 hrs.

Unless alternate arrangements are made by you, the remainder of the submitted specimens will be discarded two (2) years from the date of this report; and generated data will be discarded five (5) years from the date the analyses were performed.

Analysis Summary and Reporting Limits:

Workorder 15379262 was electronically signed on 12/31/2015 13:25 by:

~~ll~ Susan Crookham, Certifying Scientist

All of the following tests were performed for this case. For each test, the compounds listed were included in the scope. The Reporting Limit listed for each compound represents the lowest concentration of the compound that will be reported as being positive. If the compound is listed as None Detected, it is not present above the Reporting Limit. Please refer to the Positive Findings section of the report for those compounds that were identified as being present.

Acode 500138 - Cannabinoids Confirmation, Blood {Forensic) - Peripheral Blood

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NMS CONFIDENTIAL


-Analysis by High Performance Liquid Chromatography/ TandemMass Spectrometry (LC-MS/MS) for:

Compound Rpt Limit

11-Hydroxy Delta-9 THC 1.0 ng/ml Delta-9 Carboxy THC 5.0 ng/ml

Workorder Chain Patient ID

Page 3 of 4

15379262 11940870 15-13848

Compound

Delta-9 THC

Rpt Limit 0.50 ng/ml

Acode 8057B - Postmortem Toxicology - Expanded with Vitreous Alcohol Confirmation, Blood - University of Ml (CSA) -

-Analysis by Enzyme-Linked lmmunosorbent Assay (ELISA) for:

Compound

Barbiturates Cannabinoids

Rpt. Limit

0.040 mcg/ml 10 ng/ml

-Analysis by Headspace Gas Chromatography (GC) for:

Compound

Acetone Ethanol

Rot Limit

5.0 mg/dL 10 mg/dl

-Analysis by High Performance Liquid Chromatography/

Compound

Salicylates

Compound

lsopropanol Methanol

Rpt Limit

120 mcg/ml

Rpt Limit

5.0 mg/dl 5.0 mg/dl

lime ofFlight-Mass Spectrometry (LC/TOF-MS) for: The following is a general list of compound classes included in this screen. The detection of any specific analyte is concentration-dependent. Note, not all known analytes in each specified compound class are included. Some specific analytes outside these classes are also included. For a detailed list of all analytes and reporting limits, please contact NMS Labs. Amphetamines, Anticonvulsants, Antidepressants, Antihistamines, Antipsychotic Agents, Benzodiazepines, CNS Stimulants, Cocaine and Metabolites, Hallucinogens,. Hypnosedatives, Hypoglycemics, Muscle Relaxants, NonSteroidal Anti-Inflammatory Agents, Opiates and Opioids.

Acode 8756B - Novel Psychoactive Substances (NPS) Screen 1, Blood - Peripheral Blood

-Analysis by High Performance Liquid Chromatography/ lime ofFlight-Mass Spectrometry (LC/TOF-MS) for:

Compound Rpt Limit Compound Rpt Limit

25B-NB0Me 1.0 ng/ml Butylone 10 ng/mL

25C-NB0Me 1.0 ng/mL DBZP 10 ng/mL

25H-NB0Me 1.0 ng/mL DET 10 ng/mL

251-NBOMe 1.0 ng/ml DMAA 50 ng/mL

2C-B 10 ng/ml DMT 10 ng/mL

2C-H 10 ng/ml Ethylene 10 ng/mL

2C-N 10 ng/ml Etizolam 10 ng/mL

3-FMC 10 ng/ml Flephedrone 10 ng/mL

4-MEC 10 ng/ml MDPV 10 ng/mL

5-MeO-DMT 10 ng/ml MPBP 10 ng/ml

5-MeO-DiPT 10 ng/ml Mephedrone 10 ng/mL

AMT 10 ng/ml Methedrone 10 ng/mL

Alpha PBP 10 ng/ml Methoxetamine 2.0 ng/mL

Alpha PPP 10 ng/ml Methylone 10 ng/mL

BZP 10 ng/ml Mitragynine 10 ng/mL

Buphedrone 10 ng/ml Pentedrone 2.0 ng/mL

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·· ..

NMS CONFIDENTIAL


Compound Rpt Limit Pentylone 10 ng/mL Phenazepam 10 ng/mL Salvinorin B 2.0 ng/mL

Workorder Chain Patient ID

Page 4 of 4

Compound TFMPP alpha-PVP

15379262 11940870 15-13848

Acode 95608 - Synthetic Cannabinoids Screen, Blood (Forensic) - Peripheral Blood


Compound Rpt Limit Compound SF-AB-001 1.0 ng/mL JWH-018 5F-APICA 1.0 ng/mL JWH-081 5F-APINACA (SF-AKB-48) 2.0 ng/mL JWH-122 SF-MN-18 0.10 ng/mL JWH-210 SF-PB-22 0.10 ng/mL MDMB-CHMINACA AM-2201 0.10 ng/mL MN-18 APICA 0.20 ng/ml MN-25 APINACA (AKB-48) 1.0 ng/mL PB-22 88-22 0.10 ng/mL THJ-018 FUB-AKB-48 0.20 ng/ml THJ-2201 FUB-PB-22 0.10 ng/mL UR-144 FUBIMINA 0.10 ng/ml XLR-11


Compound Rot. Limit Compound SF-ADB-PINACA 1.0 ng/mL AD8-CHMINACA 5F-ADBICA 1.0 ng/mL AD8-FUBINACA AB-CHMINACA 1.0 ng/mL ADB-PINACA AB-FUBINACA 1.0 ng/mL ADBICA AB-PINACA 0.20 ng/mL

Rpt Limit 10 ng/mL 2.0 ng/mL

Rpt Limit 0.10 ng/mL 0.10 ng/mL 0.10 ng/mL 0.20 ng/mL 0.10 ng/mL 0.10 ng/mL 0.10 ng/ml 0.10 ng/mL 0.10 ng/mL 0.10 ng/mL 0.20 ng/mL 0.20 ng/mL

Rpt limit 0.10 ng/mL 1.0 ng/mL 0.20 ng/mL 1.0 ng/mL

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STATE OF MICHIGAN IN THE MICHIGAN SUPREME COURT …...2 to a trial, not by one person, but by a jury...

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