Queensland

Parliamentary Debates [Hansard]

Legislative Assembly

WEDNESDAY, 27 SEPTEMBER 1911

Electronic reproduction of original hardcopy

.U6o AdJournment. [ASSEMBLY.] Questio1. s.

LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY.

\VEPNESDAY, 27 SEPTEMBER, 1911.

The SPEAKEH (Ho.n. 'vV. D. Armstrong, Lockyer) took the chair at half-past 3 o'clock.

PAPERS.

The following paper, laid on the table, was o.rdered to be printed :-Report of the Under Secrdary of Home Secretary's Department ·upon Government relief during twelve months ended 30th June, 1911.

The following papers were laid o.n the table:-

Correspondence recommending promotion through transfers of police officers in consequence of the retirement of First-class Inspector J. 'vVhitc.

Report on a visit by l\1r. A. Morry, surveyor of the Department of Agri­culture and Stock, to New South Wales and Victoria.

QUESTIONS. "OswESTHY GuANGE"-PAssAGE :MmmY

PAID ON.

~r. LESINA (Clermont) asked the Chief Secretary-

" 1. vVhat was the average amount of pas­sage money paid by each adult passenger by the "Oswestry Grange'' on her last trip to Brisbane~

" (a) Including the sum paid by passen­gers; and

" (b) The £3,000 by the Queensland Go­vernment?

" 2. Is it true that the " Oswestry Grange" took home on her last trip forty passengers at £1,± 14s. per head, third class, guaranteed equal to accon1modation on other boats? "

The PREMIER (Ron. D. F. Denham, Oxley) replied-

" I could get this information only in a way that is equally open to the bon. gentleman­by applying for it to the shipping company concerned."

TEACHERS IN EDUCATION DEPARTMENT RECEIVING LESS THAN '£3 PER WEEK.

Mr. MULLAN (Charters Towers), in tho absence of Mr Barber, asked the Secretary for Public Instruction-

" 1. vVhat percentage of the total number of all teachers, and what actual number of all teachers in the employ of the Education De­partlnent, are receiving less than £3 per week?

" 2. vVhat percentage of the total number of classified teachers, and what actual number of san1e, are receiving less than £3 per week?

" 3. What percentage of the total number of 1narried teachers, and what actual number of san1e are receiving less than £3 per week?

•· 4. Are the teachers who are paid less than £3 per week classed as unskilled workers or profes..;ional n1en, or what are they classed as?"

The SECRETARY J!'OR PUBLIC IN­STRUCTION (Hon K. M. Grant, Rockhamp· ton) replied-

" As this will entail a great deal of labour and time, I shall be glad if the hon. member for Charters Towers will ask the bon. member for Bundaberg to move for a return."

Mr. MULLAN: I give notice that I -will move accordingly to·morrow.

Suppl!f. [27 SEPTEMBER.] Suppl!f. Il67

PROPOSED COLD STORES.

Mr. BOUCHARD (Brisbane South) asked ·the Secretary for Agriculture-

" 1. Did he send an officer to the Southern States to inquire into and report upon cold stores?

" 2. If so, will he lay upon the table of the House the report of the gaid officer on his investigations?

" 3. Is it a fact, as reported in the daily newspapers, that the Government have decided to convert the railway shops in Roma street. Brisbane, into cold stores'!

" 4. If so, has the officer in question reported upon the suitableness of the Roma-street shops for cold stores?

" 5. What is the estimated cost of convert­ing the premises into cold stores?

" 6. What will be the storage capacity of the premises referred to? "

The SECRETARY FOR AGRICULTURE (Hon. J. Tolmie, Drayton and Toowoornba) replied-

.. 1. The surveyor of the department was sent to the Southern States to ascertain the improvements in farn1 buildings, silos, and

·Cold storage. "2. Yes. "3. Yes. "4. No. " G. Not yet ascertained. " 6. Unable to answer until the working

plans have been completed."

SPRINGSURE RAILWAY-CLAIM OF M. L. DEVITT.

Mr. RYAN (Barcoo) asked the Secretary for Railways, without notice-

:· ·would he have any objection to the ap­pomtment of a Select Committee of this House to inquire into and report upon the claim of Mr. M. L. Devitt in recpect to the construction of the Springsure Rail way? "

The SECRETARY FOR RAIL\VAYS (lion. W. T. Paget. Mackay) replied-

" I understand a claim was made by Mr. Devitt agamst the Railway Department some year~ ago. I will give the matter considera­tion."

Mr. RYAN: Thank you.

SUPPLY.

RESUMPTION OF CoMoHTTEE.

RAILWAY DEPARTMENT-CHIEF OFFICE.

(Mr. J. Stodart, Logan, in the chair.) Question stated-That £56,404 be granted

for "Chief Office," Railway Department.

Mr. MAUGHAN (Ipswich) : There were fourteen or fifteen different votes under the heading of the Rail way Departmront, in­volving loan and revenue oxrenditure, so that members would have ampk opportu­nity during the discussion to bring radvray matters under review. First of all, he would like tq endorse the remarks made by the deputy leader of the Opposition, more partwul~rly m regard to the necessity of paymg mcrcased wages to employees in the service generally. He did not desire to go into details in that connection, as the de­puty leader of the Opposition dealt very fully with that part of the discussion. In common with other members he would like to· congratulate the railway authorities for presenting to the House such an admirable

report. The report dealt, he supposed, with the most important Government depar•,­rnont that we had, a department which wa" controlled by a Commissioner, with his re­sponsible officers, and which represented no less than £27,000,000 of State capital. \Vhile he congratulated the Minister on the report tabled, yet there was one very im­portant omission from that report, and that was the details which they used to have in connection with the Stores Depart­ment. He noticed that that very important appendix was omitted from this report. It was not in the report this year, and he would be very glad if the Minister would see that in future the report was furnished in the Commissioner's report. It dealt with all railway contracts, involving an enor­mous sum of money. More particularly was he interested in that report in connec­tion with railway coal contract•,, and in that connection alone it was important that they should haYe the fullest information in connection with the Jetting of contracts .

Mr. LENNON: \Ve used to get full infor­mation in connection with the price of coal.

Mr. MAUGHAN: Yes, with regard to the price of coal and contracts generally. However, that was a matter which he was quite sure tho Minister would give attention to later on. Something had been said about the appointment of the new Commissioner, and he took this opportunity, in common with other han. members, of congratulat­ing the Government on appointinv a man alreadv in the service. He quite endorsed the remarks which other hon. members had made with regard to this appointment. It was not so many years ago when there were only a few hundred miles of ra-ilway in Queensland, and the then Government found it necessary to import three com­missioners from the old country, and used to pay them 6,000 sovereigns a year to carrv on the railway system of that date. Then we discovered that we had men in our own departments who could very ably manag<> the railway system, which was now three times the size it used to be when it was •"anaged by those imported commis­sioner-·.

Th<' SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: I think we a:<' very fortunate in that respect.

Mr. ::.\1AUGHAN: He thought that was a subject for congratulation. Of course, ho was not for one moment going to sug­gc·st that it was not a convenient thing sometimes to import experts, oven from the old country-he was not going to condemn the system generally-but all other things h£ing equal, they ought to encourage their own men to obtain the blue ribbon of the ser­vice. He could hardly hear himself speak­ing, owing to the hum of conversation in the Chamber:

The CHAIRMAN: Order, order !

Mr. MAUGHAN: He quit0 endorsed the action of the Government in increasing the Railway Commissioner's salary. He thought if we had had to get the services of an expert to go into the question of relieving the present condition at Roma street and the Central Station and other parts of Bris­bane, and make it more convenient for the officers to control the fast increasing traffic, we should probably have had to pay some expert railway engineer 2,000 guineas for preparing plans, which Mr. Evans and his

Mr. Maughan.]

1168 Sunly. [ASS~MBLY.] Suppl!J.

officers had been able to do. In connection with the appointment of thP Chief E:nginee;· for Railways, he was very glad to see that Mr. Bell had been appointed to that posi­tion, and for the same reasons which he had explained in connection with the appointment of Mr. Evans. There was a rumour some time ago that the GovcrnmPnt had under consideration a proposal to divide the responsibility in connection with the engineering staff-that all construction work was to be pnt under Mr. Bell and all maintenance work under the cont~ol of tho other engineer for railways, but he horwd that the Govprmnent would do nothing of the sort. The public looked to the Chief Engineer for Railways as the man who could give a certificate that. the lines wore all in proper working order. Dual responsibilitv from an engineering point of view with regard to thf' control of the railway system had always proved, as far as he coutd discover, a fail· ure in tho other StatPs, so that he hoped the Government would always realise thP jmportance of making the Chief Engineer tor Ratlways absolukly responsible, not only for the constructiOn of new lines, but also for the maintm;ance of the existing linf's. Thts JUSt led htm to another point: \Vcre we dmng our hPst to train our own Pngi­neers and our sur..-cvors and draftsmen in conn<'ction with the ;ail way service?

The SECRETARY FOH HAlLWAYS: I think so.

:'v1r. ~AUG HAN: Were we giving these' 1nen suflimcnt encouracrclnC'nt to stav here? \Vas it not a fact th~t men werp ·induced from. timo to tiuw by tlt<' offer of higher salanes to go aWfl.V: In tho Lands Depart­mont, O\Vlng to lugher salaries being offered, :·mrY{'y*ors \Vent to Java. Sun1atra, the \Yost Coast of Africa, and other places in differ­ent parts of the world.

Thr· SECHETARY FOR R.\ILWAYS: That larg<'ly owing to the loYe of travel.

lS

:VIr . .YIAUGIIAN: At tho same time, it "."'' a fact that the profc,sional man-the trained I~lan-:vas no!, being paid commen­surak With hts service. vVe had onlv to f·~amine the figures in the other Sta t~s to dtscovcr that the professional men in the railway scrvi~c were not being paid in accordance wtth the scale of salaries paid 111 other States. He had not time to elabo­rate the_ argument, but just uttered a note of warnmg to the Go,-crnment that if they wanted to retam the best brains in their engineering departments, they would have to pay decent salaries, or else they would lose these men. \Vhat about th~ young men? \V ere they training a sufficient number of cadet engineers and surveyors to take the place of thoEe men who either dropped out by ago or who wont awav to other countries? ·

. The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: We are doing it in the Railway Department.

i.\:fr. MAUGHAN: There was some doubt about it, but he must accept the :\1inister's statement. In that connection the fact of having a University established in Brisbane with a man like Professor Gibson presiding over the engineering department there would stand them in good stead for supplying young men ~o take the place of others who left the service. The Commissioner for Railways de­served credit for looking ahead. One of the most serious troubles in years gone by in

[Mr. Maughan.

connection with railways had been with refer­ence to the -station yards. In the country, as well as in the cities, all the stations had been built for a day or for at most five years. hence, whereas they wanted t,o build them so as to be able to accommodate the traffic for· years to come. There was·no member in the· House who had not beE'n inundated with let­ters from business and commercial men who had dealings with the railway stations com­plaining about the want of accommodation at the various station yards. They must look ahead, and it would have to be done much more so in the future than in the past, in view of the policy of railway expansion carried out by the Government. There was enorm­ous railway development going on, and he urged on the Minister the necessity of seeing whether the proposals of the expert~ of the department with regard to the extension of operations at Roma street would meet the· case for twenty-five or thirty years to come. As a matter of fact, it would not hurt the Railway Department to at once resume the whole of Albert Square and the Police Bar­racks for future railway development pur­poses. The i.\:Iinister knew quite well that when he went to Sydney eight or ten years ago that the New South Wales Government there were abused for putting up su<'h a tre­mendous pile of buildings in connection with the new railway station at Redfern, which they were told was years ahead of its time. But, as a matter of fact, when he was in Kydney the other day he noticed that the new station had got too small for requirements. and there was a reg·ular revolt all over Sydney to have a new reorganisation schem0 adopted in connection with the existing rail way sta­tion and yards. He was glad to sec from the Commission<'r's r<'port that the agricultural Lnes of railway were paying well. They were told when some of those lines were being passed through tho House that they v•ould not pay axle grease. but anyone turn­inp; to thn Cotnn1issioner's rC'port, would see from Tablt' ~o. 15 tlwt many of tlw agricul­tnral lines were paying wdl. He remembered a number of lin<'s which mPmbers said would not pay at all. The line from \Vulkuraka to Kannangur ha.d jumped from £3 14s. 7d. in 1906-7 to £5 8s. percentage of nd revenuo to capital in 1910.11. That was a line which t.hey were told was not going to pay at all. 'l,'hen the linn from vVyreema to Pittsworth had jumped from £3 9s. 9d. to £4 16s. per cent.; the line from Warwick to Goondiwindi from £3 15s. 4d. to £5 13s. per cent. in the fin• years. A prominent member of the House said that that line would never pay wlwn it was first introduced into the House. Then ther<' was the line from Dalby to Bell; it had jumped from £1 13s. 2d. per cent. in f906 to £5 3s. 5d. last year.

:'vfr. VoWLES: \Vhy read them 9

:'vir. :\IA UGHAN: Because it was said that those lines would not pay, and he was reading t1wm to show that the Government could not possibly lose by building lines into agricul­tural districts.

The bell indicated that the hon. member's time had t>xpired.

Mr. MAUGHAN: He would take another five minutes. They were told that the Labour party were opposed to the construc­tion of railway lines into farming districts,

Supply. [27 SEPTEMBER.] Suprl.!f. 116S

but there was no truth in that statement at all, as the Labour party had always sup­ported those lines.

Mr. CORSER: But you object to the loans. to construct them.

Mr. MAUGHAN: The hon. member was wrong. The Labour party always favoured borrowing money to be spent on reproduc­tive works, and hon. members had only to look up the discussions in Hansard for years past to prove that. He would leave the dis­cussion on the details of the traffic, mainten­ance, and locomotive departments until those items came forward for discussion. He hoped that the time had come when the Minister and Commissioner would take into considera­tion the necessity of doing something in con­nection with the age limit. Just fancy tell­ing mechanics that they were too old for railway work at thirty-live and forty. Men who had been working for the Midland Rail­way Company in England, when they came to Queensland, although they had excellent credentials, were told that they were too old to be employed, because they were over forty years of age. lYien who were employed in the great engineering works of Sir Wm. Armstrong, in England, when they came to Queensland, were told they were too old be­cause they were forty-three and forpy-four years of age.

Mr. D. HuNTER: They should not be brought out here if they cannot be given employment.

Mr. M.\UGHAN: That was quite true. They had an cxcel!ent PerYice and some physical test was perhaps necessary. but they should be careful before setting· these men aside because they '"ere over forty years of age, especially ,vhen their services \Yere re­quirecl. If they could not be giyen employ­ment, then the Agent-General should be told not to send any more out. (Hear, hear !) He "as glad that the clay-labonr system had been a suc\_'ess in connection \\tith tho raihvav construct.ion works. He had had an oppor­tunity of going through a number of rail· way camps in Queensland, and everything seemed to be going on in excellent order. They had a body of f1rst-class engineers and good staffs evcrywhm·e, and, so far as he could learn, there were few c·omplaints. A return had been prepared hy the officers of the department which showed that under the day-labour s;.-stem 730 miles were constructed. The estimate for this work was £2,135,942. an a,·erage of £2,927 per mile, while the work \Yas actually carried out at a cost of £1,864,562, or £2,565 per mile, thus result­ing in a saving of £271,352 to the State, or a saving by the clay-labour principle of 12.7 per cent.

Mr. FORSYTH: Bunkum.

Jl.lr. MAUGHAN : It was not bunkum. as there were the figures to prove it, and that saving of £271,000 repre•.ented the construc­tion of 100 miles of rail way into agricultural districts at a cost of £3,000 per mile.

The bell indicated that the han. member's further time had expired.

Mr. ::\IAUGHAN: He would take his further five minutes. He would like the re­presentatives of farming districts to note that 100 miles of railway could be built with that saving under the day-labour system.

Mr. D. HUNTER: Don't you think they made the estimate higher on purpose? ·

1911-4c

Mr. MAUGHA~: The hon. member for W oolloongabba understood figures, and was an expert with the rule, and he knew that the responsible officers of the department prepared the correct fig·urcs in making out their estimates, and that saYing of £271,000 showed the practicability of the Labour party's platform, which was to build lines by day labour.

Mr. COLLES: And the work was better done.

Mr. FORSYTH: How can you prove that that saving was effected, as tenders were not called for any one of those lines, and you could not make a comparison?

i'dr. i\IA UGHAN: He endorsed the remarks of the deputy leader of the Opposition with regard to the wages paid to the railway men. There was now a better feeling existing· be­tween the various railway associations and the officers in the sen-ice. There was a time when the unions could not get satisfaction from the responsible officers, but now that the Minister and Commissioner recognised the various unions there was a better feeling in the service generally. While he gave credit to the Con11nissionor and Mini­ster for rectifying grievances, still there were some, as mentioned by the deputy leader of the Opposition, which required prompt atten­tion. Having regard to the enormous revenue capabilities and the splendid work done by the men of all ranks, he hoped that

the wages of the men would be [ 4 p.m.] brought up to "hat they were in

::;in1ilar dcpa.rtn1ents in the rail­way scnicc in otlwr States of Australia. vVith regard to certain matters discussed the other night by the junior member for :Mary­borough in connection 'vith State vvorkshops, he should leaYc his remarks in that connec­tion until the vote on the Locomoti,-e De­partment. One point more. He thought the tin1o has come ,..,-hc·n the rail·n:ay a('' Junts should be kept absolutelv separatu from the Treasury. ·

Nlr. MuRPHY: \Yh;c·?

:'.Ir. MAUGHAN: The Raih.ay Department v,as respcmsible for a large sum of loan monev ---something like £27,000.000-and as far a"s he could discover there v, as nothing to show that the department allowed for depreciation in connection with the accounts. At the pre­sent time the taxpayers of Queensland were paying interest-and had been paying interest all along-on the money borrowed to build, say, the Indooroopilly Bridge, which was washed away years ago. No business firm would stand that sort of thing. And the same remark applied to the Logan Bridge, rolling­otock, and rails. 'fhey were paying interest on things that really did not exist. Tliere were more people than himself who believed that the railway accounts should be kept abso­lutely separate from the other accounts of the TrNsury. Our railways should get credit for the tremendously enhanced value they put mv the lands of the State.

The bell indicated that the han. member's third allotment of time had expired.

J\Ir. l\IORGAK (,tiurilla) thought members on his side would agree with him that the !peech delivered by the senior member for Ipswich was quite refreshing after so many of the speeches they had heard from members on the other side who advocated the "go slow" policy. The han. member advocated'

Mr. Morgan.]

J.l70 [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

·increased expenditme as far as railway facili­ties were concerned; and members on the Government side agreed with him in some .respects; but he tho,11ght the hen. member . must have some motive for advocating in­.. creased expenditure. As far as our railways .were concerned, the State, the Government, and the officers of the department were to be

, congratulated on the splendid results of the ·past twelve months. While the capital ex­pended here was not so great as in other States, our railways paid £3 18s. lOd. per

•-cent. as compared with 4~ per cent. in Vic-.. toria. In the Commissioner's report he found that the railways were divided into

, sixty-two sections, of which twenty-nine were ·not paying 3 per cent. on the capital invested, while there were some sections being run at a loss. He thought these sections deserved special consideration from the Commissioner w;th a view of not allowing them to become -a burden on the rest of the State. No less than four sections in the city and suburbs of ·Brisbane were not paying; and one of them was run at a considerable loss. At repeated intervals deputations waited on the Commis­Bioner with the view of getting passenger fares reduced on these suburban lines, notwithstand­

-ing the fact that a number of them were not paying. On these lines passengers -had to PitY at the rate of ld. a mile, while pas­sengers in country districts had to pay at the rate of l~d. per mile; and he wished ·to emphasise the fact that until they cou!a re­--duce freights on the necessaries of life in the country districts it was not fair to carry pas­sengers at a lower rate simply because they happened to live in the mort' thickly populated centres. On the city and suburban lines it was no uncommon. thing to see trains with G__carcely any passengers. while in the country districts passengers very often had to stand hours and hours, not being able to get a seat. If on any occasion a few passengers -in the suburbs were compelled to stand, they saw letters in the paper next morning draw­ing attention to the fact, and later on there were deputations to make inquir-ie~; but

,people in the country practically went on --s.ufl'<Jring all kinds of inconveniences and

-seldom made a complaint. There was a big uiscrepancy between the freights and fares in Queensland and those charged in the other States. As far as passenger fares and stock rates were concerned, we compared favourably with other States, but when it came to high­class freights, which included the necessaries of life to the farmers in the country districts, we were considerably ahead of any other State. In New South Wales, on high-class freights, the rate for 200 miles was £3 18s. 2d. a ton; in Victoria, £4 17s. a ton; in South Australia. £4 17s. lld. a ton; in Western Aus­tralia, £4 17s. 6d. a ton; in Tasmania, £4 16s. a ton; while in Queensland the, rate was as much as £6 13s. 4d. a ton. The only way to encourage people to go out into the country was to make the cost of living as cheap as possible; and he would rather see passenger fares and the rates on stock go up, provided the freight on the necebsaries of life could be reduced. Though he agreAd that it was desirable for the Commissioner to keep up the revenue, he thought it should be done in such a way that the freights to which he referred might be cheapened. As far as accom­modation was concerned, he was pleased that during the past two or three weeks better facilities had been provided as far as the Southern and Western line was concerned. Another train had been put on, and the

[Mr. Jlforgan.

people in' the Western district were very thankful to the Commissioner ; but he would like again to draw attention to the fact t_!J.at 'they wanted more lavatory accommodatiOn and better sleeping accommodation .

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: Cars are being built all the time.

Mr. MORGAN: During his visit to the Ipswich Workshops with other members he was pleased to note that s~ven or eight cars were in course of constructwn, and he hoped that one of those cars would be put on the Western line. It was the first opportunity he had of visiting the Ipswich Workshops, and he wished to say he thought . they were a credit to any State. He now Wished to refer to the crowd of people assembled on the Toowoomba platform when the Western m_ail arrived. (Hear, hear !) It was c;owded w.Ith young people who made a pra~tiCe of go:ng there to meet one another without havmg any special business, and. a person had to be pretty strong to force Ius way through the crowd to get a little refreshment. It was time that the Commissioner took steps to prevent people going on to that or any other platform out of mere curiosity. The station platforms should be reserved for travellers. He knew that many women going W e't could not get a cup of tea at the Toowoomba Station because of the crowd on the plat­form, and he contended that such a thing should not be tolerated. A charge of 3d. or 6d. each would be quite sufficient to prevent 90 per cent. of those people going on to the platform. There was another matter that he wished to mention, and that was that porters should be instructed to sing out the names of the stations at which trains arrived. This might seem a small matter to some hon. members, but it was not a small matter to passengers, particularly to those who travelled over a line for the first time, and had to leave the train at eleven or twelve o'clock at night, when perhaps they had settled themselves down for a short snooze, and run the risk of being carried beyond their destination. In the other States the porters sang out the names of stations, and he thought that they should do the same in Queensland.

The bell indicated that the hon. member's time had expired.

Mr. HAMILTON (Gregory): With regard to the argument of the last speaker and of previous speakers that the members of the Labour party were against borrowing money for constructing railways and other repro­ductive works, he would point out that that accusation had been repudiated times out of number by tho leader of the party, Mr. Bowman, and by other members. They had sense enough to know that if they wanted to go in for a policy of public works they must have the money to carry out those works, and that there was only one way of getting that money. When speaking on the Address in Reply, members on that side, as well as the hon. member for :Moreton and other members on the Government side, had ad­vised the Government to go slow in the ex­penditure of loan money. All that members of the Opposition objected to was spending money lavishly on works which, in their opinion, would not be reproductive. Last year the House gave the Government authority to spend £10,000,000 on railways, and now members were getting up and say­ing different routes from those marked out

Supply. [27 SEPTElLBER.] Supply. 1171

;;hould be chosen for those railways, the people of the districts concerned were ~rying out that different routes should be chosen, as the routes proposed were in the wrong direc­tion. Last session he voted against some of those railways, he even voted against a rail­way in his own district, simply because he .believed it was not a profitable proposition.

Mr. MANN: I did the same thing.

Mr. HAMILTON: He was still of opmwn that the spending of money on the trans­-continental, or trans-State, railway would prove a white elephant. If the money that was to be spent on that railway was used in building lines in agricultural districts, those lines would bP the means of settling ten times more people on the land than would be settled by the trans-State railway. (Hear, hear!) It was sometimes said by members opposite that members of the Labour party were oppvsed to the building of railways in agricultural districts, but he defied anyone to point to one line in agricultural districts which had been opposed by the Labour party .since the passing of the Act of 1900.

::\lr. MANN: Some of those passed should not have been built.

:::Vlr. HAMILTON: It was quite true that some of the lines passed should not have 'been built. It was well known that the routes mapped out for some of the lines were not giving satisfaction to the people in the districts which those railways would serve. The route mapped out for the line in his own district was not giving satisfac­tion. He believed that the Government were sending out a surveyor to investigate the matter, and report as to which was the best route to adopt. By the Act passed last year they were tied down to a 25-mile limit for deviations, and he thought that was a mis­take. vVe had had a succession of good seasons, and consequently a large railway revenue last year, but if the drought in the far \Vest extended the chances were that we should not have such a big railway revenue during the current year. With regard to the new appointment in the Railway Depart­ment, he was very pleased to notice that the Government were able to fill the vacancy caused by the death of the late Railwav Commissioner from the ranks of the men already in the service, and he should like to see that done in eYery department of the public service, so that wheneyer a vacancy in the higher positions occurred, young men who had been trained in the State would be appointed to the office, instead of going outside for such oflicers. He was not against paying men good salaries in those positions, because he knew that if they were to get the best talent they must pay good salaries, otherwise the o.ther States would take our men away, as they had done in the past. At the same time he thought that the men in the lower ranks were not receiving fair play. Every adult of twenty-one years of age in the railway service should receive a minimum wage of Ss. a day. If a man was not worth Ss. a day when he was twenty-one, he would not be worth Ss. a day when he was twenty years older. There was one matter that he should like to speak about particularly. It had been repeatedly men­tioned in the House by the hon. member for Flinders, the hon. member for Mitchell, him­self, and others, and that was the necessity <Of providing decent accommodation for the

lengthsmen on the far Western downs. He noticed that the department were providing good accommodation for guards, firemen, and others in the city, and he had no objec­tion to that, but he thought that anyone who had travelled on the railways over the far Western downs would admit that the humpies in which lengthsmen out there had to live during the heat of summer were miserable habitations, and that they should be replaced by more suitable accommoda­tion. The Government compelled pastoral­ists and persons engaged in the sugar indus­try to provide good accommodation for their employees, and they themselves should set the example by giving comfortable accom­modation to lengthsmen on the far Western downs, where there was no material for building, and such material had to be brought from a great distance at consider­able expense. Considering that the 'railways were paying so well and that the higher paid officials were getting increases, also that the higher paid officers were in many instances provided with houses or house-rent, he thought the department might reasonably spend a few pounds in providing accom­modation for lengthsmen. The people in the West and North, and in fact all over the State, had been asking, for years and years, that a connection should be made between the Northern and Central railway systems, and it was about time that the Go­vernment took some action in that direction. This connection was one of the lines men­tioned by Mr. Amos, but no reference had been made to it this year in the speeches made by Ministers and other me>;pbers of the House, and it was not known whether they had any intention of making that con­nection. It would be too late to talk about it when another drought came, and we had great losses of stock, similar to those suffered in tho last drought, which would not have occurred if we had had those two railway systems connected. The Minister for Agri­culture had made the Gulf journey, and he would no doubt agree with him that a line connecting the Northern and Central Rail­ways could be cheaply constructed, as there was no great bridging to be done or engi­neering difficulties to overcome. If it was only fo; an assurance against drought, that connectiOn should be made.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS; vVhich con­nection?

Mr. HAMILTON: The connection between the Northern and C'<mtral railway systems.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: There are three routes spoken of.

!\'lr. HAMILTON: The hon. gentleman pro­mised to send i\Ir. Greensil up to go. over the different routes, and make a recommenda­tion as to which was the best to adopt.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS; He has been there two months.

Mr. HAMILTON: Ho was satisfied to leave the decision as to the route to the' ex­perts of the department, but some move sho.uld be made in the direction of connecting those two railway system,. He noticed that there was a loss on the working of the rail­way from Julia Creek to Selwyn. He did not wonder at that, because exemptions had been granted to a lot of the mines out there. He was glad to notice that the new warden was making some alteration in that respect,

Mr. Hamilton.}

1172 '

Suppl,y. [ASSEMBLY.] Suppl,y.

and was refusing an extension of exemptions. Exemption was granted in respect of a mine lying within a mile or two of the railway, and when that kind of thing was done it was not likely that the railway wonld become profitable. He felt sure that when the line was constructed as far as the Duchess the revenue would be v·ery greatly increased. They were storing up a great deal of o.re at the Duchess, and when tho line was con· structed from Malbon to the Duchess it would bring a lot of traffic to the main line, and he was very confident that the whole of that extension would pay then. He had asked the Minister if he was going to call upon the lo,cal authorities to pay up any deficiency in the earnings of the railway. He did not know whether the department were making the local authorities in the Southern division pay up when there was a deficiency.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYR: We do not call upm~ the local authoritie~; we call upon the landowners.

Mr. HAMILTON: Well, the landowners through the lo,cal authoritie'. who really acted as collectors.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: The local authorities .from Julia Creek to Cloncurry refused to appoint a valuator, and we have appointed a valuator.

:Hr. ·H.A:MILTOi'\: At any rate, m YJew of the large revenue \V·P are now rece1v1ng from the railwaye, he hoped that the Go­vernment wonld establi,h a minimum wage of Ss. for all adults in the rail way service, as he believed that would reoult in more con. tent and satic·faction an1ong tho en1ployces all ronnel.

The bell indicated that the hon. member's time had expired.

:\Ir. WELSBY (Brisbane Xol'th), who was re­ceived with ''Hear, hears!" said he had much pleasure in congratulating the Commissioner for Railways on the very excellent report with which he had furnished the citizens of Queensland. No doubt, to a large extent, the present position had been brought abont by the splendid seasons during the last few years, but he thought every credit should

be given to the Commissioner on [4.30 p.m.] the report which he had put be-

fore the House on this occasion. (Hear, hear!) HB was under the impr•·ssion v.hen he first came in the House that mem­bers on the Opposition side were all of one mind as to what they should do, but to him the most pleasing thing this afternoon was to hBar the remarks of the han. senior member for Ipswich; in fact, he thought the han. mem­ber should be on this side of the House from the way he had spoken. He cordially agreed with the hon. member in what he said with regard to the Commissioner in every respect. It was not his intention to speak at length re­garding the general details of the Railway Department, but he wished to refer particu­larly to the accommodation sheds on the Brisbane to J'l·layne line. On 21st November, last year, a deputation went from the Bris­bane Chamber of Commerce-he wished to say here that he held no brief on behalf of the Chamber of Commerce-a deputation waited on the late Commissioner for Railways, nlr. Thallon, and asked for certain things. If he rHight be allowed, he would read very briefiy what happened on that occasion-

" A deputation representing the Brisbane Chamber of Commerce waited on the Commis-

[J-f r. H arm:Zton.

sioner for Railways yesterday afternoon with reference to the accornn1oclation at the Roma­street goods-shed, and also to put before Mr. Thallon grievances of the merchants of the city with regard to the lack of facilities for the despatch of goods from that station and the Woolloongabba goods-yards.

"Mr. Hertzberg, in introducing the deputa­tion, said that they thought that some better method might be devised for handling goods at Roma street. The existing sheds had been erected about a quarter of a century ago, and, though they might have been adequate then, they Were practically obsolete now. They were not there to find fault. but they felt that the tirne for econon1ics had passed, and son1ething better should be provided. He felt sure that the Con1n1b~_;;ioner rnust he aware of the present state of affairs, and, as a nratter of fact,_ carriers were dernanding higher rates owing to, the amount of time lost at Roma street. There was also a great deal of trouble owing to a lot of things going astray, and the deputation wi~hed to strengthen the hands of the Cmnmis­~ioner in s0curing better accomn1odation."

'fhen :\lr. Thurlow, one of the leading mer­chants of Brisbane, spoke in thr following strain:-

" Mr. Thurlow said that the whole building which dealt with despatehing of goods at Ron1a stre€t '\'aR badly in need of reorganisation."

:\Ir. :\lA:-iN: You should see the Korth.

Mr. \YELSBY (continuing): " :VIerchant.s could not under the ure~ent

c mdition get their boods ;;nvay, and their custon1ers 'vere constantly lJlllplaining. The \vag~·: of the carriers had been increased by the v,rages bo<-lrd.~, and the 111atter of tin1e wb=ch waR lo::-;t at RomH strr-et had become a f;erious consideration. At \Voolloongabba the loading '\ ~ls a serious QUE- .tion. The carters had to load the packagrs dirc:·t into the trucks."

After :\Ir. Thurlow followed Yl:r. Mackenzie, another leading merchant of the city of Bris­bane-

" l\Ir. 1lackenzie said the accolninodation at the Roma-street gJods-shed had been a source of annoyance for son1e lime paHt. He had the honour to b.; the pr.::3ident of the l\ierchants' Association, and in that capacity he had re­ceiYcd reprc--;t:lL,tions fron1 the Carrier.._;' A,so­eiation and the ::\Taster Carriers' Association, asking the T\'Ierchants' A~ ~:ociation to help the1n in the matter."

He came now to the response of Mr. Thallon, and he would now add his expression of sympathy towards hi5 good widow on the dt"ath of her husband. nir. Thallon and him­self 'l'ere friends of many years, he could honestly say that he was a very good friend indeed, and he deeply sympathised with the widow in her sad bereavement.

" lVIl'. Thallon, in reply, C'aid that he was glad to see the representatives of the Chamber of Comn1erce, because they ·were all responsible men who knew what they were talking about, and who had come to hin1 because they had smncthing to say."

That was one for the Chamber of Commerce.

" Mr. ).-iackenzie had ~mnuned the whole thing up when he said there was not sufficient room. There was not the >"lightest doubt that there was too little accon1n1odation. \Vhat he was telling then1 was not silnply because of the present deputation to the, Con1Inissioner­he had been pointing it out for son1e consider­able tilne. This year the traffic had oYer­whehned then1. It was simply enorn1ous. There had been a bigger trade this year than there had Pver been before."

He was very pleased incl<>cd to find from the Commissioner's report that the recommenda­tions then made by the Chamber of Com--

Supply. [27 SEPTEMBER.] 8upp1.1f.

merce Committee had borne good fruit. He had had the pleasure of seeing "the work which was being done at Roma street, and .also at Mavne. He believed it was the in­tention of the Government to cut down the who!<' of the hill on the right-hand side of the station. It was the intention of the Government to take the locomotive shed and the carriage slwd down to Mayne, and in due course put a place on the left-hand side, and give more .approaches to the railway station for the b0rwflt of passengers. He saw from the paper last week that an dfort "\Yas h-'ing n1adc l>y tlH" Govcrn1nent to estab­lish cokl stores in Roma street, and that to his mind """" an excellent id<:'a. It did not n1ean entirely pulling down the bui:.c1ings on the ldt-hand side. but underg-round accom­modation for co:d storage. He really thought t}w net ion of thH Govnrnn1ent in carrving out the wishP'l of the Chamber of Comnierce, as expressed on 21st November last, reflected credit on the Chamber of Commerce.

Mr. FOLEY: Who Is the Chamber of Com­nlercc?

:Ylr. \VELSBY: Tlw Chamber of Com­nwrce \\as composed of the leading body of nwrchants in Brisbane, and he might say that the Chambers of Commerce in the State of Queensland numbered more than the whole of the Chambers of Commerce in the Southern States.

.:VIr. FOLEY : Who elects these gentlemen?

Mr. WELSBY: They were a body of men who elected their own representatives, and if members of the Opposition had had the privilege which he had had for many years past of meeting theso m0rchants, their views would be change<cl on many subjects.

Mr. MAI;GHAN: \Ve are meeting them all tho time.

Mr. WELSBY: Not in the same way that he was. He would now refer to the visit which was paid last Friday to the Ipswich ·workshops. It was the first occasion that he had received an invitation to go there, and his eyes were completely opened in going through the various <:lepartments. He felt that it was a gr0at benefit to the little town of Ipswich to have these workshops, with so many men employed. He believed there were 1,200 men employed, and the wages came to £11,000 a month. That money was distribut8d in Ipswich, and he thought there was ·a great deal of growth ir, that town as the re<;ult of the workshops. He hoped that for manv vears to come these workshops i\·ould rDmiin there, and that they would IWYPr be taken away.

.:VIr. FOLEY: \\'e want one at Townsville.

::'llr. WELSBY: He was pleased to find that. certain mmnbers of the Opposition were agreed as to the appointment of Mr. Evans <tnd the salary pa1d to him. He \vas not thoroughly au fait with the procedure· of the House. but he believed that on the left hand of tho Speaker a gentleman spoke last Wed­nesday night regarding tho saJ,ary paid to Mr. Evans. He heliovod in the principle "the labourer is worthv of' his hire." He believed in .a .rnan beillg paid for physical

. or mental strength. After the .many years' service which he had given to the State of Qu<'cnsland, surely l\>1r. Evans was worthy of £2,000 •a vcar. Tho fact was that evcrv .appointment 'made by the Minister for Rail-

ways had received the admiration and ap­proval of the citizens of Brisbane and the State gencrallv. He believe-d in the appoint­ment of Mr. Bell, :Mr. Pagan, .and Mr. Steer, and he thought Mr. Steer was the right man for the position he was now occupying. He would like to refer to an old friend of his­the late· Mr. Tmn Pratten-whom he knew for many years, and to a very large extent he was tho tBacher of Mr. Steer. What struck him as peculiar. on going round the lpswich worbhops, and then being taken over to tho refreshment-rooms, was this: He found-<wd it. was sL1ted he thought by the Minister himself-that the men working at the raih.-ay wmkshops on J\llonday, Tuesday, W<>dnesda::, Thursday, and Friday were re­eeivino- tlwi1· meals for ls 9d. a week. That nwan( 4 l/5d. per meal. He did not know whether the Go\'ernrnent w·ere desirous of sweating the man who had to find the meals. He was to:d that these workshops had a certain amount of money sBt apart for them, but the man who served the meals had to find e.-erything· himself, for which he re­ceived 4 1 f 5d. l"'r diem for a one-course meal.

The SECHETARY FOR RAILWAYS: That was his own offer.

Mr. WELSBY: There was sweating some­where. He would like to know whether it was sweating on the part of the men who bought the meals, or the man who sold them .

Mr. O'SuLLIVAN: Collectivism can do it so cheaply. . Mr. WELSBY: He should be very sorry indeed to feed anybody on 4 1/5d. 'a meal. There was another thing which ha-d attracted his attention. HB had had a certain amount of education in .connection 1vith cngineer,ing, and when he saw the .picture of the first engine built by that wonderful man, Steven­son, it struck him, seeing the mechanical appliances and the machines of the various departments, that it might be a very good thing if the Government would recognise the inventive ability of the men in the workshops: He -did not altogether believe in receiving our best machinery from thB old country, and if the Minister would give a permanent or yearly bonus to any lad or man who during the course of his work-no matter what de­partment he might be in-found out some useful invention, it would be· a remarkCLbly good thing for them. (Hear, hear !) He did not care who the man was-he might be the son of an immigrant or of the King of Great Britain-he should be recognised; and if the Minister could see his way cl·ear before long to initiate sonw means of bringing this about he would be doing a very good thing·. (Hear, hear !) Although he had spoken regarding the higher-paid officials, hB wished it to be understood that he was in favour of properly paying men in the service down to the lowest naid man on the road. He would do his he't to S< o that" men in the low Dr stations of the department were paid a fair living wage. (Hear, hear !)

Mr. MAY (Flinders) thought that mem­bers who got up first should be called on to speak. first, yet early that afternoon his friend, Mr. Maughan, was allowed to have the first go. (Laughter.) He was ready to speak when he rose previously, but now he was not ready, having lost a lot of what he had intended to say. It was not right that men who had not been present in the House attending to their parliamentary dutie~

Mr. MapJ.]

lli4 Suppl,y. [ASSEMBLY.] Suppl,IJ.

should be called on before others who at­tended regularly, and the Chairman was to blame for calling on Mr. Maughan before calling on those who had been waiting patiently for their turn and watching for a chance to speak. However, he did not wish to say anything derogatory to his mates or those members on the opposite side of the House. The general railway policy of the State was to promulgate railways in the mining and agricultural districts, but it seemed that they neglected the mining, and gave great preference to the farming dis­tricts. He had been a farmer himself, and he knew how necessary it was to have rail­way communication from one point to another to get their produce to market, but they should not neglect the mining districts. The Railway Commissioner had been known to him for many years. He had known the Commissioner in his lower grades and in his higher grades, and he was the right man in the right place. Mr. Evans was put into the position of Commissioner at a salary of £1,750, and after three months' service he was raised to £2,000 per annum. He had no objection to that, but thought he should have received the £2,000 from the start. He did not want to bolster him up or run him down, but if he could do the work he was entitled to the larger salary. They did not get the same fair treatment for the em­ployees in the Railway Department in the North that they received in the South. He had a request to make to the Minister, and he hoped the hon. gentleman would receive him later on. He had waited on the Mini­ster many times with requests from his dis­trict in regard to railway matters, and he hoped after he had mentioned what he wanted to consult the Minister about that that hon. gentleman would receive him in a better spirit than if he went to him in a bull-dog fashion. He wished to get better wages and better conditions for the men en­gag-ed at the Malbon construction. The pre­vailing rate in the district for surface ground men at Mount Cuthbert, Hampden, and Mount Elliott was lOs. lOd. a day, and that was the wages that they wanted the railway men there to get. He had a deputation on the subject to wait on the Minister, and he hoped the hen. gentleman would receive them that evening.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: Not this evening. I will be here till half-past 10 o'clock to-night.

Mr. MAY: Well, to-morrow evening then, and he was sure the Minister would receive them courteously, but whether he would act in accordance with their views was another question. He had started his remarks in a frivolous manner, but he would now be serious and ask members to pay some atten­tion to the advisability of adopting the mono-rail system in Queensland. Before they spent such a vast amount of money on railway construction, they should make further inquiries into that system.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: I would like India to try the experiment first.

Mr. MAY: He had studied the matter deeply, and he was a thorough advocate {)f the Brennan mono-rail system. They had not brought the system into prominence enough, and he was going to read from an article in the Sydney Bulletin which favoured .that system. He brought this matter before the Chamber a few years ago,

[Mr. May.

soon after he was elected a member 0f th<? Assembly. . The mono-rail sy~tem had. been introduced into several countries, and It had not been made to pay, for the simple reason that the capitalistic interests had been dead against it. The article in the Sydne_y Bul_le­tin which had been brought under his notice was headed " Plain English," and read as follows:-

T:rm 4FT. 8¥:, IN. Lnm. " 'l'he announcement made by the Fisher·

!viinistry that the railway to \Vestralia is to be built on the 4 ft. 8'/2 in. gauge " represents the policy of the Governn1ent" again sugg~sts that the Governn1ent has got very deeply Into. the old grooYe or ancient rut." ·

Now this was the part that he wanted the Com~ittee to take notice of-

~~ So far as is known. it has not made the slightest attempt to discover by personal re­search before starting on its great railway­building career whether the Brennan m.ono­rail is a real success or not." Two years ago he mentioned that they were experimenting with the Brennan mono-rail between Berlin and Hamburg, but they had heard nothing further about it, which showed that no notice was taken of what members of Parliament said in the House.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: Mr. Tha!lon reported on it.

Mr. MAY: He knew Mr. Thallon reported on it but the Government did not make any further inquiries into it. It had been proved that the mono-rail system was a good system, and if they could get that system into their mining districts it ":ould be afl right. Here was an opportumty for this proo-ressive Government of Queensland to make a trial of the mono-rail system and see if it was efficient or inefficient. It would be one of the greatest things that had ever been promulgated in Queensland. They knew that in making experiments they would have losses, but, if they gained t~e upper hand, eventually it would. be wo~th It. If they l~st: over it and failed m makmg a success of It, then they could say that they failed iJ?- try­ing to assist in the advancement of sc1ence. The Bulletin said-

" The record of that invention is that it has. answered every trial, and that the engineers who have seen it working have admitted that it lived up to its pretensions."

He hoped Hansard was taking down all he, said, as he wished it to go out into the country to let people see that they were behind the times in not adopting this sys· tcm. They did not go in for enough innova­tion. Even if it cost a few thousand pounds, what was that when they were promulgating something for the benefit of tho community? Then the article went on-

" Of course Britain, France, Germany, Swit­zerland, Italy, and even the United States look upon it with a gloon1y eye. These countries have already built on the two-rail system most of the lines they ever expect to want, and the proposal that they should tear these gigantic works to pieces in order to instal a new system does not appeal to them."

Tho bell indicated that the hon. member's. time had expired.

Mr. :MAY: With the Chairman's permis­sion he would continue-

" When Louis Brennan told the British rail­way shareholders, for instance--shareholderg who had about 1,300 million pounds invested

[27 SEPTEM:BER.] Supply.

!n railway enterprises in their own little !&lands-that he had devised a great improve­ment wluch would tend to put all their old methods on the scrap heap, they naturally enough told h1m to go speedily to perdition and take his in1provement with hin1." '

He beli~ved there was a future before the ~Jon'?-raJl system. They did not want to fol­lOW m the old groove in which their fathers and grandfathers moved. He remembered

the time when he was living only [5 p.m.] 16 miles from London and used

. . to dr_ive 10 miles to get a ride of 6 miles Ill the ra1lway train; but those things were altered now. He contended that in this country _they did not advance fast enough­they "a1ted for the people in the old country to show. them the way. This was a young comm~mty and they should have new inven­tions nrought for:ward by the people coming from the old country.

The bell indicated that the hon. member's furthm· time had expired.

Mr. MAY repeated that they should go in for t,]le mqno-rail system, and advocated the ::,ppomtment of a committee or a commission to make investigations with the view of the system being adopted here. If that system were _adopted members would not have to go be_g·gmg to the Minister for R-ailways for ra1lways to be constructed in their districts. A~ the present time the construction of a ra1lway me':nt the expenditure of £2,000 or £3,000 a rmle. The question of expenditure would be a small matter under the mono-rail system; and he thought the Minister should take steps to find out whether that ,system would be effective or not.

';!?he bell indicated that the hon. member's thrrd allotment of time had expired.

Mr .. RYAN (Bm·coo) said the hon. membe1· for Brrsbane North, Mr. vVelsby, passed some very c'?m_Phmentary remarks in regard to the 9ommrssro1_1er and the ot]ler of!!.cers high up 111 the servrce-remarks wrth whrcli he person­al~y agreed-but he thought the bon. member mrght not have forgotten to mention also the large army of junior officers in the service on whose loy!llty and _efficiency to a great extent the effectrve carrymg on of the Railway De­partment depended. He thought the Govern­ment would be :well advised in seeing that the officers occupymg lower: positions re'ceived adequate remuneration for their duties. He ref~rred particularly to salaried officers. He noticed that station-masters in the Western parts of Quee.nsland had to work very long hours, for whwh they got comparatively low pay. And t~ey did not get any Western allowance-whrch was given by other depart­ments as payment for extra cost of living in the We•t. If other departments could pay \Vestern allowance, whv could not the Railwav Department do so ( · •

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: The Rail­way Department doe;. ~'ay \Vestern allowance.

Mr. RYAN: To some officers, but not to station-masters. Probablv the i\Iinisw;·'s in­terjection was the result' of the hon. gentle­man not being- thoroughly conversant wit,h the facts of the case; and if the hon. gentleman made himself convmsant with them, probably he would see that an alteration was brought about 111 that regard. Another matter for eonsideration was the pay to gatekeepers. There were many women receiving 5s. a

week as gatekeepers; and in some instances they had to deal with telephones, mails, tele­grams, and all sorts of things. He would' not labour the thing, because it probably only required to be mentioned for the Minister to·, remedy it.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: House,. light, and fuel are provided.

::\Ir. RYAN: They got some incidentals; but the pay was only 5s. a week, and there, was a universal complaint about it. He got Ycry few complaints from servants in the· Railway Department, but wherever he went he heard complaints with regard to the sta­tion-masters apd gatekeepers. Probably they· were the most glaring instances of insufficient pay.

::\Ir. ::\IA'GGHAK: Many of the men have• their unions.

i\Ir. RYAN: Quite so; and their unions could help them to get what they, desired. He hoped the Minister would see that their resolutions were carried into effect with re-· ga.rd to a minimum rate of pay and a living v. age. He now wished to rder to a matter that particu,larly concerned his own elector.ate. It was an incident that occurred one mght last week when he was not in the House. \\'hen the l}reat \\'<.•>tern Railway proposals ,;ere before the House he was one of the twenty-one members wh<? voted against the second reading on an amendm_el?-t n:oved by the deputy leader of the OppositiOn m fav~mr' of getting more information ~efore passmg such a huge scheme. In vol. cvr. of Hansard, page 2544, he found that he spoke as follows:-

"As I had not an opportunity of finishin&: what I wished to say when I spoke on tJ::e amendment, I dsire to add a few words ':t thiS' stag-e. "\Ve are df<1ling 'vith a propos_1t10n. tO'· Rpend about £5,000,000, and we are dealm~ With. it on information on which no memper stttlng on the Treasury bench would act in his ov:n business. I tnust protest against the manner Ill' which the Governn1ent are pushing this m_easure through the House. I am now speakmg at half-past 5 o'clock in the morning, and there are a number of men1bers lying asleep on the' benches. I have a particular duty to discharge· to my electors in this matter. There is going, to be forced upon them a guarantee which will amount to a considerable sum per mile,. whether they lil<e it or not-which will, as the hon. member for Gregory interjects, amount to· twice as much as is estimated. I would like to· know whether Isisford is included in this bene­fited area, and Jundah, and places close to • Blackall, which can gain no possible ad-..-an­tage whatever from being included in this area? The people of Jundah have wanted a: railway for a long time."

Then, on page 2545, he said-" On those grounds I am opposed to the"

second reading of this Bill. It would be a breach of trust on my part to the people of Queensland, owing to the vast expenditure to be incurred by the construction ol the railway without :-,,ufficient infonnation being obtained,. and also on account of the detrimental effect it will ha;·e on rny own people."

That "as the attifude he took up on the· second r0ading of the Bill, and that was the position he took up before the ,eJectors of Barcoo when he contested tho election, the first time he spoke at Blackall. The House passed a railway extension from Blackall ta Windorah, and latterly an agitation hoo sprung up at Longrcach ~nd Jundah to have· the route altered from Longreach to Jundah ..

Mr.Ryan.l

1173 Supp1.'J. [ASSEMBLY.] Sup;J;!f·

At the time the second r<>ading of the Bill was before the House, he desired to have proper information afforded members so that thev should be able to judge which was the proper route to adopt. He said then, as he said now, that he thought the choice of a route should be left to the departmental c<oxperts. 13ut what he wished immediately to rdPr to was tho f"ct that when he re­

-c<:>iy0d telegrams from LDngreach, Stoneheng-·, the Barcoo Shire Council, the Jundah Pro­gress c\sscciation, and from Blackall last week concerning some difficulty about the route, he a;Jproached the Minister for Rail­ways in his plaee in the House, and asked him if ther<e was any possibility of this qu<:>stion being reopened; and the Minister informed him that Longreach had lost its {)hanee ,-ears ago, and that the railwav must start from Blackall. •

The SECRETARY FOR E\ILWAYS: I told you that I replied to those people that the rail­way was being built from Blackall to VV'in­,dorah.

}h. RYAX: The han. gentleman told him .distinctly that the railway must start from Blaekall, and that Longreach had lost its -chance years ago. On thB following morning he wired to tho Mavor of Blackall what the Minist<>r had to:d Iiim, and he saw it pub­lished in the Rockhampton papers on the Saturday morning and in the Barcoo Indepen­.dent. He also communicated to the Jundah Progress Association and the Barcoo Shire ·Council, and the next thing he found was that fhe :\finister on the floor of the House stated that he was going to reopen the question. fl:e was not now so much eoncerned with the Minister reopening the qu<:>stion, but he did not think the Minist-er should put him in a false position with the persons who had been in communication with him.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: I gave you the exact words which were said to me.

3-lr. RY AX: The hon. gentkman need not fenec about the matt-er. Would the han. gentleman deny that he said that LDng·reach had lost its chances years ago, .and that the railway must start from Blackall? All he (Mr. Ryan) wanted to do was to put himself right with the people he had telegraphed to, and also to make his position dear with regard to this r~ilway proposal. If the han. ·gentleman, in defercno<J to the suggestion of the hon. member for Townsville-because he notic<'d that it was aft<?r the hon. member for TownsvillB spoke that tlw :\1inister wob­bled with rcfer·once to this matter, if he was permitted to use the term " wobbled "-had d€0ided to reopen tho question, he would like tho han. gentleman to let the Com­mittee know definitely what the· Government ·were gOing· t-o do with regard to the route. What had taken place proved unmistakably that the eJtitude taken up by the leader of t!'<; Opp_osition and e\·ery man on the Oppo­sitiOn sid<> of the House on that oceasion wa_s the cm·re<:t one. The l<'·ldCI' of the Oppo: Sihon then said that the railwav was rushed through too quiekly, and that inembt:·rs had not sufficl{'nt inforn1ation a-ivcn to thcn1. What did they find with "regard to the

'Wallal-Tobcrmm·y extension? The hon. member for Townsville and the hon. member for Brisbane North agitated to have tho

·route altered with the view of benefitin•' Brisbane. He should like to draw attehtio~ 'to what ho said with regard to this par-

[,'tfr. R?frm.

ticular n1e.ttor ·wlten the Bill \vas before tl10 House. At page 2521' of lf,tnsm:d for last year it would he found that he sard-

" It is the influence of Queen street and the influence of nH~n1bers on the other side; and I venture to predict that before this Bill gets through Cmnmittee you will see an an1endment 1noved rnore in the interests of Queen street­an a1nendm.ent that will take the railway from Charleville further to the North to st<:cl trade fr01n Central Queensland-the san1e as To\:vns­ville stole it by tlH~ '';'inton connection.

"The S:ccRETARY Fon P-c-BLIC LANDS: It is not wise to prophr ;,y before the event. l t is safer to do it afterwards.

" Mr. RYAN : That is the sort of prophecy that the hon. gentleman indulges in, but I mn prepared to take the responsibility of 'a;ring that it is highly probable that we shail see the hand of Queen street in some anwndu1ent to alter the route at present proposed.''

Had theY not s0cn that this question of route- ·wa~s now to be reopened, .aft-er the House had authoris0d the spending of millions of money to build the railway? The Government wBre now going to send out officers to find out which we.s the ;Jest route.

Mr. COYNE: And at that time we were to:d that we had all the information we requir-ed.

Mr. RYAN: Yes; at that time they were told that the House had all the information it required, and that the Labour party were prepared to block the progress of the country and did not want development. All the Labour party said was, " Develop the country, and spend as much money as yo·~ like on reproductive works, as long as you spend it with ordinary care, with the eare that you would exercise in spending YOUr own money." Last session they said that to the people of Queensland, and this session the Government were proving the truth of what they said by the attitude which they were now taking up with regard to these railway routes. He did not think he could put the matter more clearly. He thought the Minister for Railways and the Premier, as well as those sitting behind them, must appreciate what he had said, and he had no doubt that the SecretarY for Public Instruetion appreciated and "approved it, and was somewhat anxious to know what would be the result of the proposed altera­tion of the route between Blaekall and Win­dorah.

The bell indicated that the hon. member's time had expired.

Mr. RYAN (continuing): He contended that the departmental experts to whom the hon. member for Brisbane North had referred in snch complimentary terms should decide the question of route, because they were men of eapacity, of judgment, and impartiality. There were many other smaller matters that he wished to refer to, but he would take an opportunity of dealing with them when they came to the particular votes. ·

Mr. FORSYTH (Jloreton): It was a pleasure to hear the hon. member for Barcoo discuss the question of the Walia! and \Vindorah routes. The hon. member stated that it was all a question of the interest of Queen street. It did not matter whether the railway went through Walla! to T'obermory or to Eromanga, it must eome to Queen street in either case. He (Mr. Forsyth) was not at all anxious that it should go to Tobermory, and did not eare

Supply. [27 SEPTEMBER.] Suppl,y. 1177

if it went to \Yindorah. But when the hon. member spoke about the great change that had come over members on the Government sidP of the IIousL', he would remind him that a good many of those members were absolutely against the line g-oing to Tober~ mory, because they km'w the country.

~Ir. }lAY: \Vhy didn't you vote against it, then?

:\lr. FORSYTH: Because members who were opposed to that route had to take the besr they could get. He hoped it would go direct west, or perhaps north~west.

:llr. RY.\X: Do you think the Gon'rnment made a mistake in passing the route adopted?

:\lr. FORSYTH: r~Ic did think the Go~ vernment made a mistake in passing that route.

0PPOSITIOX ~1E1IBERS : Hear, hear ! :11r. }lAy: But you helped them to pass it.

:\Ir. FORSYTH: ?\o. A man could not ahYays get exactly what he liked, and when he could not get \Yhat he liked he must take tho best he could get. He hoped that the G.oYcrnment would alter the route, as by domg so they would meet the needs of more peot~lc than they \Yould by the present route. \\ Ith n'gard to the statement of thE' hon. member for Ipswich in connection with the construction of railways by day labour, he would remind the Committee that the han. membcl' sho\:ved that 730 miles of railway .had been built by day labour, that the estimated cost of that work was £2,135,000, and the actual expenditure £1,814,000, and that there was therefore ca saving of £270,000 in favour of doing the work by day labour as against con~ tract. But the estimates ginm by the hon. member were the parliamentary estimates a_nd not the W?rking estimates. If the par: hamentary estunate was taken as the work­ing <'Stimate, and the actual expenditure was such as was shown, they must see what 'Stupid fools the officers of the department must be to make a mistake of £270,000. How could any engineer tell what the cost ?f a railway would be unless he had work~ mg. surveys and working plans made?

:\1r. HARDACRE: How would you test the :h:vo s~·stems?

:\lr. FORSYTH: If they wanted to test wlwther day labour was cheaper than con­t:act, they should arrange for the construc­tiOn of 20 or 30 miles of railwa v let the e_ngineer prepare the working pia;~ of that lme, and then call for tenders from con· tractors to sec what they would build the hue for on the conditions laid down. That was the only true way of arriying at a deciSion as to whether day labour was cheaper than contract.

:\lr. 1VIAY (Flinde1·s): In replv to the hon. member for Carpentaria-- ·

The CHAIR.:\IAK: The bon. member has already spoken.

Mr. J. :\II. HUNTER (Jfaranoa) was very pleased to see such a fayourable report sub­mitted to the House b:v the Commissioner for Railways. It was re"ally an epoch in the

history of the Queensland railways [5.30 p.m.] because we had a very large in-

crease in mileage and traffic, and had also decentralisation introduced which he thought would increase the facilities to the .Public and also lessen the cost and expedite the

work of the department. He would like to express his sincere regret at the death of the late Commissioner. It was unnecessarv for him to dwell on his merits, but, apart· from tbat. the Government \'as to be congratulated on the fact that they had been able to replace that g-entleman by an efficient officer who had already shown administrative ability. 'l'he scheme of decentralisaLion had also brought into play a number of capable officer, who would assist him very matcrialy in the execu­tion of his duties. Our Railway Department was a very big concern, and it would be a pity if the one grand system which demon­strated the value of nationalising great under­takings should break down because of under­manning in the direction that had already taken place. He was firmly convinced that a good deal of reorganisation was nece~o·,a1-y in the Railway Department: indeed, he went so far as to say that a Royal Commission would be able to get a lot of information which would be of value in the working- of the de­partment in spite of the decentralisation he had -.;efe~red to. For some time he had thought that our method of running the rail­ways was not right. On the Financial State­ment he had referred at some leng-th to the railway freights and fares, and showed that we were charging- in some cases 100 per cent. and in others 50 per cent. more for freights than thev were cha.rg-ing in New South 'Vales and yet our railways were not what might' be called a very profit~ble investment. Our railways cost us somethmg hke half of what the l"!ew South \Vales railways cost to build and equip. He believed that it cost something like £13,400 per mile in New South Wales to build and equip the railways.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS : Yes ; and we have two and a-half time' their area, and three times less population.

Mr. J. i\:I. HUNTER: Ours cost so.mething like £6,400 per mile. At a low cost hke t~at, with double the freig-hts that were bemg charged our lines should pay better than what they are doing. Our population was small and a good deal of it at the port end of the r~ilways instead of being at t_he ext:eme end. and so long as we had these b,gh freig-ht• he believed the tendency would be for the people to keep at ~he port end instead ,of the end where the frmghts came from: We .had a lot of vacttnt lands along our railway hnes that should be earning money for the railw>:ys, but by the high freights we were stoppmg people. from getting on to those lands. ~nd earning a living for themselves and providmg business for tne railways.

i\Ir. G. P. BARNES: Can you na.me any one instance in which any man has been prevented from going into the country on account of the railway freights?

Mr. J. :\1. HUNTER: The hon. memb~r might just as well a;k him if he knew anyboa_:v who refused to d<·al with him beca'!se. o_f h1s liigh prices. He did not know a!?- mdividu.al case; it was sufficient to g·enerahse on this. He thought a plain statement of fact should be sufficient to convim·e any reasonable man. But he did not think there could be any doubt that tho Railway Department was not running this business on the lin<·'l that were going to bring them the larger t1·affic t~at they should get; therefore. they kept Plftbng on the high freights so as to mak? the railways pay. The experience of all railways. tram­lines. po8t and telegraph offices, was that the

.1/r J.Jl.Hunter.]

1178 [ASSEMBLY.l Supply.

cheaper you made the cost and the greater facilities you gave to the people who used (hem, the more they would use it and the bigger would be the revenue. It was no use for him to waste time by repeating it. When speaking the other night, the Treasurer rc· £erred to the fact that the Sandgate line was paying better this yPac than it did last year. He found that tho Commissioner, so as to give good figure' for Sandgat", had brought in the wool traffic which came to the Bulimba wool stores, and had therefore swelled the business to almost double what it was in former years. Then the traffic from the North stopped at Northgato Junction. He did not know whether the Commissioner was crediting the Sandgate line with all the traffic from Northgate Junction, but he presumed that was the idea; that the Sandg11te line got all the benefit of the traffic from Northgate Junction into the city. They did not get a fair idea of what tho travelling public were paying on the Sandgate line, and the same thing was done in regard to the ;\Ianly line. 'l'hey simply shut off from :1\Ianly to Brisbane, instead of showing th<e eornin!!S on the whole of that line. It was a short line, and yet it was cut into two divisions so a.s to make it appear really better than what it was. It was worse for Cleveland, but the Treasurer was naturally anxious that that particular portion in his electorate should show up well, and that the loss on the part from Manly to ClovPland tihould not reduce tho profits on the oth2r part. He was pleased to see that the Com­missioner was arranging for some econo1nies in connection with the ha.ulage of carriages. At the present time there were attached_. to most trains two or three carriages which often ran empty.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: They arB a great convenience-! find them so.

Mr. J. M. HUNTER: But it would be more convenient if these empty carriages were attached to an engine and run through oncf\ a day, so as to bring in passengers in decent time-only under necessity would people travel by them at present. He be· lieved a lot of power was wasted in hauling empty carriages, when the engines should be hauling traffic. He particularly referred to the \VPstern line. The Commis· sioner should go into the question o.f running passenger trains daily to Roma, and confine the trucks to the goods trains instead of drawing along empty c'lrriages for nothing. He would like to see the Commissioner run the \V estern train express both from Bris· bane and to Brisbane. At the present time it ran express from Brisbane to Ipswich. When the people were fresh and could stand the train stopping along the line, it did not happen, but the moment they left Too­woomba on the return journey, after travel. ling 500 miles, the passengers were com­pelled to put up with the train stopping at every station, and particularly from Ipswich. He hoped that the Commissioner would sec ihat the \Ycstern travellers >vore allowed some sort of comfort in their long journey, the same as the trains from the South wcrc being run. Reference had boon made to tho e!Prical staff, and the salaries paid to Yarious officers in the dcparttnent. HP took the trouble to put th0 question to the Minister some time ago with regard to son1e anornalies \Yhich existed in the ser· vice in the various departments. He had always hdd that right throul"hout the Go­vernnwnt service there e,hould be uniform systems of payments for \V estern allowanceo

lJh. J.llf. Hunter.

and other things of that kind. The :Y1ini3tet" said he could not see that there was any anomaly in it, but he asked him to again consider it to see if there was not some· anomaly in it.

The bell indicated that the hon. member's. time had expired.

Mr. J. Ivl. HUNTER (continuing): They found that the ·western allowance for a bridge foreman, irrespective of locality, was 6d. per day extra. All wage employees between Chinchilla to Blythdale were allowed 3d. per day extra; and from Blyth­dale to Mungallala >vage employees were· allowed 6d. per day extra. Blythdal<:> was only 12 miles from Roma. The mamt<:>n­ance men were only allowed 3d. per day, whtle in the traffic department the guards i,;-ere allowed 1s. per day, and foreman shunter 1s. per day, while common shunters and porters were only allowed 6d. per day. It c'!st tl_lC ordinarv shunter just as much to !tve m Roma ,;:nd west of Roma as it cost the fore­man shunter, and there was no justification for the difference in the allowance. In the locomotive department, engine-drivers were allowed 1s. a da v extra ; fire men, 1s. ; cleaners, 6d. ; fitters, 1s. ; fitters' apprentices, 6d.; blacksmiths, ls.; strikers, 6d. ; loco­rnotiYe labourers, 6d. ; and storemen, 6d .. These were all in the one department, and thev had also different departments giving different amounts. Every person in the ser­Yice, whether in the Education Department, Lands Department, Police Department, or Railway Department, should receive a fixed a mount for \V estern allowance. It was not right that a man getting £500 a year should be allowed 5s. a day for \Vestern allowance, while a man getting £100 only received 1s. a day extra. There would be a goo_d deal more satisfaction amongst the staff tf it were equalised. HB was in favour of zones being fixed and a standard \V estern allowance being g-ranted every officer in the services on a scale that covered the extra cost of living. There wBre one or two complaints m;,de to him about some of t_he· staff not receiving promotions, and he m­tended to place them before the Minister himself, but he had other grievances in con· nection with the delay in the erection of a crane at \Vallumbilla and a siding at Mungallala. A good deal of traffic was lost to the railway on account of the abspnce of a siding an'd proper facilities at Mungal­lala. A large number of sheep and cattle were drafted down the line overland because these conveniences were not estab­lished. Petitions had been presented asking for this work to be done, and requests for· it had been made twelve months ago. The people only wanted the siding and th0 ordi· nary conveniences, and they would do the rPst thcmselvPs, but the department wanted tho users to also crcet their own yards, and that was not fair. \Vhen the department f]Uotcd a price for freight it should cover all convenience', and they should give people· <'very facility for putting their stuff on the line.

'l'hc SECRETARY FOR R.ULWAYS: \Ve don't ask them to do that unless it is for their own private use.

Mr. J. M. HUNTER: It was not for their own use. There would be 25,000 sheep trucked from Mungallala, wool would be sent from there, and a large number of cattle would also be sent from there.

The bell indicated that the bon. member's; further time had expired.

Supply. [27 SEPTEMBER. J

Mr. J. M. HUNTER (continuing): If these conveniences were granted it would be for the benefit of a large number of settlers. Yet they were asking the people to find the mo?ey to put up the yards, and they were askmg the same thing at Wallumbilla.

Mr. LENNON: A very shabby thing to ask.

::\Ir. J. l\1. HU.N'TER: The hon. member for No.rth Brisbane, Mr. Welsby, suggested that some. encouragement should be given to ~he men m the workshops to display their mventlve gemus, and that was a good idea. Suggestions should also be · accepted from the statio.n·masters and clerks, as they would be of assistance to the l\linister and wou;d create an interest in their work amongst these employees. With regard to the exten· sian to 'INallal, he happened to be one who opposed that extcnsiol1, as they had not got sufficient informatiou on the matter. \Vhen they were dealing with the expenditure of £4,000,000 they should have had the plans, books o.f reference, and everything· else be· fore they paboed that \Vestern railway. He did not believe in allowing a latitude of 25 miles o.n either side of the suggested route. The hon. members for FaHifern and Mary· borough supported the proposal, and said they were prepared to leave it to the Minister to work out the details later on. They now found that they could not work out the de· tails. 'rhore was 110 principle in it at all, and if there was a principle in it it was a bad one. .\Vhen they brought in railways in that way It meant that they would have to pay more money and greater interest on the money which would come out of tho pockets ()£ the taxpayers.

* Mr. MANN (Cairns): Tho Commis;ioncr in his report had the following:-

"On my appointment I deemed it :aeeesstl,tY to confer rnore authority upon the district officers in Rockharnpton and Townsville 2>0 as to some extent decentralise the a:drninistration in ihe Central and Northern divisions. I therefore increased the status of the officers as follows, viz. :-

" Traffic rnanagers to general traffic nranagerf\.

" District engineers to n1aintenance engi­neerB.

" District locomotive superintendents to loconrotive fngineet:-J.

" The officers act nr:.re on their own responsi­bility than hitherto; the result is that public business receives greater despatch and de­partnrental businE:s'::: i~ rendert:d le~s cunrber­son1e."

He wanted to. know how it was that more power. was not given to the Traffic :Manager at. Cairns. Ho had a greater mileage of railwa:y:s to ";ttend to. with the opening of the railway lrom Atherton to Evelyn and from Tolg-n to the Johnstone River and the taiking over of the l\Iulc rave TramV.:ay.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: And from Almaden to Forsayth.

Mr. I\IANN: Yes: and he would a1so like the Government to take ovn the Chiliaaoe Rail· way. If it wa.s a good thing- to inc~eu •,e the powers of the railway officials at Hockhamp· ton and Townsville they should also do it at Cairns. The officers at Cairns should have more responsibility in looking after the rail· way and working it in an up-to-date manner. l!e did .not believe in rcf<:cring everything to 'Io.wnsvi!le, beca.use they know nothing about Cairns and what was wanted there. Thn officers at Cairns were just as capable as the officers at Rookhampton and Townsville.

They had 1Ir. Prewett and :\Ir. Fraser at Cairns, and they were just as capable of looking after tJw railways in that district a& the officers aC· Rockhampton and Townsvi!le were capable of looking after their railways.

The SECRE'rARY FOR RAILWAYS: The office1: at Townsville is in charge o£ the whole of the North, including ;\lackay, Bowen, and· the Cook. '

:\Jr. MANN: ::Yiackay and Bowen had small mileages compared to Cairns. They might allow the officers at Cairns to have control over the whole of the Cook section. He thought it was a mistake in the past that all the railway officials had to consult Brisbane, but now that Rockh01mpton arod Townsville were to run their own lines with­out consulting Brisbane, the same principle· should bD extended to Cairns. The late Comrnissioner could not fiud tin1e to uwke p.n arduous journey all over tho North, and the present Comrnissio.ner decentraliscd tho ''·vrk to a certain extent, but he should also have extended it to Cairns. He (:\lr. :'.ldnn) ob­jected to tho Cairns Railway being " run" from Townsville. The pres'2nt Cv1nrnis::uoner was in favour of mo,re povver being given to ufficials in different districts to run tneir railways with'out consulting the head office. If power were given to the officials on tbe· Cairns Railway to deal with local matters pro.vision would be made for shelters ale ng the line where the men might have their

dinnero. The refreshment-room at [7 p.m.] Kuramla had no a.ccommodation

for ladies to have a cup of tea" and they had to take their refreshments in the carriages. The department should have thf5 refreshment,room ~ thems.:lvcs and· get ali the profit. They erected one at l\Iar()cba, where there were fh·e or six hotels within two minutes' walk; while at Kuranda there was a miserable littee room that would ac­commodate at most twelve or fo.urteen people. Then the railway a.ccommodation a.t ::\Iareeba wa.s insufficient. Occasionally there were as· many as five trains there at a time. and' there wa.s far from sufficient accommodation for the traffic in the ::\Iareeha railway yard .. It was an annual matter bringing these matters forward, but the idea sPCmed to be· that anything would do for the North. ThD Commissioner was a bnsy man and could' not spare the lime to visit the North oftDn enough to put things right. but there WM no reason why th· y should not be put rig·ht if they had a local official with power to· deal with these things.

The bell indicated that the han. mcmlwr's time had expired.

:\Ir. :\TANN said he had a.notlwr minut-e to. 'peak. He only startf'd at four minute,; to G ..

The CHAIRMA:\: Tho han. member com­menced nt five- minut<'s tD 6; I took a note of it. The hon. ElcmbPl' is a n1inntc oYer· hi' time now.

"Ir. ADAMSON (IIo,.l.-lwmpton) cxpn•o;sccl' sincere regret at the hnncnted death of the late Commissioner, \Yhcm he had always found a most courteous gentleman. II e had known the pre'0cnt Co1nn1issionPr a great number of years, and sometin1cs had crossed swords with him, bat had alwa, s found him a straig·htforward man. He believed that officer was devoted to duty, and would do his best for the railwavs and for tho people· of Queensland. He had risen from the low­est rung of tho ladder to the highest position,

Mr. Arlamson.1

iiSO 8upply. [ASSE:\fBLY.] Supply.

in the Hailway Dcpartlllent, and it was only right to pay a tribute to his worth. (Hear, hear!) He understood that Mr. Pag·an had worked his \vay up too: and be was also glad of Mr. Bell's promotion, and of Mr. Steer's increase in salary. He did not be­grudg·c thc-.e higher-paid officials what thev r< c·ciYcd. He ho1wd they would seek to do all thPy could for the lower-paid mPn. If tlwy 1H'r<' not prepared to do that, he did not IH,]ieYc they were worthy of their posi­tic ·1. Tic now wished to refer to one or two liaragraphs in the Con1tni,'isioner's report, ancl the first wns with r0spcct to the carning·s ·of o:.n· r2.il y, ays---

.. Aft0r paying all working expenses, re­newal~. etc., the proportion of net revenue to

·{'apital expEndEd on opened line~~ was £4, lOs. ~d. per rent., or J.Js. :-1d. lUOrC' than laRt year. Tlli_<;; return is the highest ever experienc€d in the hL~t0r/ of the- Queensland raihvays, and i~ an evid{;-nce of the general developn1ent of the State, thr continuance of good sasons, and the t".>U'eful Ina1utgen1ent of my predecessor."

'That 1Yas Yery satisfactorv. Then there was ·thi.' paragraph- ·

·· The percentage of working expenses to reYenue "\Ya~ 57.25 co1npared with 60.48 during J H(19-10. This reduction is. very satisfactory, but it cannot be expected to continue, as saiaries and wages are being very considerably increased this year, and the capital expenditure i> being rapidly added to by the building of new line~. The details of expenditure are given in Tnble 11."

Personally, he boped that if things went on vrospering- the expenditure would go on in­'Crcasing. particularly in raising the salaries· 'Of those who wore most in need of increases. Another paragraph referred to sectional ·earnings : and he was pleased that the Cen­-tral district came out so well in this respect. Another paragraph referred to the matter

'Of workmen's compensation. He was glad the expenses had been reduc0d, but he hoped the department would take heed of what the 1wn. member for Gympio said the other .:>ight in regard to the department insuring Its own men. Another paragraph that par­lticularly pleased him was this one-

" In entering upon Iny dutie~_, as Con1mis­sionPJ', I issued a circular to the staff inform­ing then1. that I had decided to giye every man ·a dean history, his previous offences not being '<"ounted against hiin in the future. This has ·been rnuch apprrciated. as is sho,vn by the fact that about 4,500 men have sent their history ~heets to this office to haYe all their previous ·promotions Pntered. I feel sure this has in­-creased the zeal of a nu1nber of e1nployees who will now endea Your to keep their history BhPPt clear of offences."

-J~>st. as last. night he stood against the whip--pmg of clnldren. so he believed a bit of ·clcn1enc:y shown to\vard') tho.::;c 1nen vvho mi;rl>t haye erred sometimes would increase ihcir zeD!. \Vith respect to lines under con­struction, he vvas glad to sec that there 'vas to he a modification of the Great \Vestern RaihYay, and that more information was to be. ob.taincd .. At tho time it wa' proposed he saul rt was mtendcd to forestall tho Fodera! ·Govc·rnmont in the construction of their transcontinental railway. He believed that still. IIowe,~cr, he ,\·a:s glad to know that there were to be some moui!ications made in this particular, as he did not think that mil­wa,· was needed in the interests of the State half w nwch as the North Coast Hailway. He nnu;t c••ngratulal'e the Minister for Raii­'Ya':·:' and thoso with wbotn he \Yas associated 0r;. thcii· ~el'kinp; to bring C\tirns into close ltouelt with Brisbane, and hoped that some

fMr. Adamson.

day the ronwic't ],art., of t.bo State would be brought into touch with tho capital as far as raihra.ys were concerned. l-Ie trusted also that the Minister would listen to any requests made for feeder lines in agricultural districts. He was g·lad to know that tho hon. gentleman "as doing something in that direction, but there were still many districts in which railways were needed to enable farmers to got "their produce to market. Thoro vas "' district near Hockhampton which '"as closely settled now, but would be more closely scttL d if it was connected with Rockhamptcm l>y railway.· This district was in the oloctorato of the bon. member for Normanby, and he was pleased to be able to assist the hon. ll1l'Jnbcr in any \Yay, to repre­sent the claims of tho place for a railway. He hoped that a line from Hockhampton to Alton Downs woulcl be constructed in the ncar future, because such a line was much needed. Nmv, he wished to refer to a matter which was not perhaps so ple<tsant, and that was Rule 18 in tho Staff Regulations, which he thought belong-ed to Hussia, and not to Queensland. It read as follows:-

" Einployce::> in the railway service will be afford~d evf'ry rea.o;;onable facility for recording thdr votes at parlimnentary elections, but they are hereby forbidden under pain of dis­nlissal fron1 taking any active or prominent part in v~Jlitical matter~. or from canvassing for any parliair1entary candidate."

Despite all that could be done by regulation in this matter, that rule was more honoured in the breach than in the observance, and he was glad that there were men who were pre­pn.red to face dismis.,al rather than have tbeir rights taken away from them. During the elec­tion at Rockhampton one young fellow em­ployed in the railway service sent a letter to the paper setting forth the grievances of certain

of his mates, and signed his name to the letter. Some people said he was a fool for doing so, but he said that he was a man for doing so, and if he (Mr. Adamson) was in the railway service he would do everything h!l could to get that rule discredited and wiped out. On the Monday morning after the election that young man went to his work, and he was told that he was not to be allowed to start. He was a temporary hand, and had not been l<?ng in Queensland, and yet his means of earnmg his living were taken out of his hands. That rule was a disgrace to Queensland, and should b) wiped out 'as speedily as possible. Refer­ring further to what took place at the recent Rockhamnton election, he contended that wheh a li.~Iinister of the Crown attended elec­tion meetings and on tho eve of an election rnade promis~s to do certain things for the constituency he was getting just about as near to brib~rv and corruption as it was pos­sible to get, and in some places it was treated as Lribery and corruption . Of course they knew tha.t Roope's BridgP was in need of improve­ment to provide against floods, but. the work should'be done, and not merely promised on the e1·e of an election. The Stanley-street Station \\as a disgrace to Rockhampton. It was the same no1.,r: as it was t'\v~nty-six years ago when he first went to Rockhampton. The ;,-ards 'v~ro altogether too crowded. a.nd were rwt safe for the shunters who worked there, "nd the workshops were a!top:eth,,r ont of ihto.

'The bell indicated that tho hon. mem her's time had expired.

Mr. ADAMSON: He had another ten minutes. He thn.nked the Minister for giving

Supply. [27 SEPTEMBER.] 118~

members an opportunity of visiting the Ipswich workshops last week, and dtd not begrudge the expenditure on those shops. But he held that thBy wanted workshops at Rockhampton and Townsville, and that much of the work which was done at Ipswich at the present time should be done at Rockhampton. Last year the sum of £2,500 was spent on the Rockharnpton Junction, and that expendi­ture was needed, but he would point out that it was absolutely necessary that it should be made a stopping place for the convenience of passengers by train. Con1ing now to the question of permanent versus temporary hands, he was told that there was no real encouragement to temporary hands to become permanent hands in the railway ser­vice. The temporary man got ls. per day more for the first six months than the per­manent man. Then he had 6d. per clay morr as long as he remained in the service as n temporary hand. The permanent man got six days more holiday a year than the tempo­rary man for the first eight years then one day more until twelve days were re~ched, and then the prospect of long service holidays if h·e remained in the service. Practical men said that tho difference between the treatmcn; of temporary and permanent hands was nor sufficient to encourage nwn to becon1c per­rflanent hands on the railways. He tho'l'.;·ht the liability to be discharged at the end of six months was an ab"-urd prov-ision, as l)y that time the mon would become mm-e uoetul to the department. The "ages of the p~r­manent men should be raised to the amount vaid to temporary hands, and not the tempo­rary men's wages reduced to the rate paid to permanent 1nen. The Government shuuld

Ee;-k to pay the highest ·wages possible to nwu m the lowe-;t grades of the service. That would 1nean mor·~ prosperity to tho State, as the spending power of those men would be in­creased, and the men themseh·es would ::,., benefited. The lowest wages paid on railwn:· construction workti ought to be Ss. per day in the South, 9s. per day in th0 Centre, and iOs. per day in the North. He had that day received a letter asking hirn to rc1uind the ~finister for Railways that a pro1nise 'vas 1nade to rncn 0ng-aged un the rail way construc­tion works in the C'cnLal District that sJit­able recreation t.:·nl3 would be provided.

The SECRETARY For: RAILWAYS: Tltey ar·.' being arranged for.

}lr. ADA:YISON: He was glad to hear it. A large recreation tent ought to be put up at the camp outside Rockhampton, and smaller tents for reading provided at other centres further awav. It was also asked that since the depa'rtment provided baths for the officers on the railway they should provide baths for the men as well. It seemed to him that the men needed baths more than the officers, as they sweated more, and worked surrounded bv dust all the time. He wished now to refer to another matter with which he was told the Commis­sioner was in sympathy. He thought that the railway refreshment bars ought to be brought under the local option provisions of the Licensing Act or closed altogether. Men who worked on the railway were told that if they were found under the influence of drink the;'; would be di•,miesed, and yet they had placed under their noses these tempta­tion shops to encourage them to drink. He brought this matter before a high authority in the Railway Department on a previous occasion, when one of the men who had got

into trouble was said to have been under­the influence of drink. He said that he had. seen other men under the influence of drink. "Oh !" was the reply, "they were not in uniform." He answered that he would have them put in unifonn, and then if they got under the influence ~f drink he would treat them in the same way as he would treat an engine-driver. He would probably be told that all the things he had mentioned meant money. The Labour party were not opposed. to borrowing money for needful works. What they said was that they should get as much moncv as thev could out of the land for develop;nent pur'poses. They believed in a land tax-in getting for tho community thp value which the community had created. in the land, and in using the revenue derived from that source for development purposes, as was clone in New South \Vales. Then, if necessary, they should borrow, but not the 1naxinnun an1ount on eYery occasion.

:\Ir. MuRPHY: They are not proposing to put on a land tax in N e\\· South \Vales.

Mr. ADAMSON: No; but it was certain that they were going in for the leasehold system, and intended to get all they could out of the land in that way.

An Ho~WURABLE ME1IBER: That is knocked on the head.

::\Ir. ADA:\lSO::\': It >Yas said that the rate le,-ied by tho local authorities was a land tax.

Mr. D. HU:\TER: It 1s called a land tax in New South \Vales.

Mr. ADA:!:IlSON: In :\few Zealand they had a graduated land tax, and in every State of the Commonwealth, except Queens­land, they had a land tax. The Labour party held that money should be got out of the land for development purposes. At the time of the Federal Referendum there ,\-as a great deal of c.tpital made out of the rail­way question. The people of the Sta tc were

told that if the referendum were [7.30 p.m.] carried, tho railways would go

out of the control of the Sta to and como under Federal control, and that then the (Jueonsland railway men would have their wages reduced. He said then that it was a false cry, and he said now that it was a false cry. The wa.gos of Queens· land railwav men were the lowest in the whole of the C:ommomvealth, and the people who made that cry at that time knew it, and they onl:v did it to get votes, which they succeeded in doing. It "as a pitiable thing when votes were got for any party upon a false issue or statement. (Govern­mAnt laughter.) That was the truth. Any man who got a vote on a false cry know· ingly-well, he would not characterise it.

Mr. MUllPHY: I would not take one. (Laughter).

Mr. ADAMSON: The hon. member for Croydon was always waggish, and all that he said in relation to these matters were side issues that he tried to bring in, but he liked him, and would not like to say that he 'vould take a Yote in that \vay, nor any one else. (Laughter.) If the railways came under Federal control, there would be a rise of .,-ages all round. Anyone who· looked at the document which he had in his hand giving the rate of wages of the· station-masters in the different States, and

Jfr. Adamson.]

1182 [ASSI:£;\lBLY.] Suppl!J·

knew what was paid to the engine-driveL< in New South \Vales and other State,; in '()omparison to Queensland, knew that so far .as the other States were concerned every grade of the service was better paid than jn Queensland. ,

OPPOSITION MEMBERS : Hear, hear ! The bell indicated that the hon. member's

:time had expired.

11r. CORSER (Jiaryborough): He nctir:ed that the Commissioner for Railways said-

" It is my painful duty to place upon record in this report that :\Ir. J. F. Thallon, Commis­sioner for Railway:-:;, died on 24th March last, ·after a brief illnc·.,,"

pc f<;l~ sure that the R>:ilway CommiAsioncr 1n wl'ltmg those words d1d so from his heart for he did not think any oi!icer of the Rail: way Department had an unkind word or unkind feeling towards the late Commis­siOner .. (Hear, hear !) He congratulated the Ra1lway Department on the nmny c•xcel­]ent men they had in the service, not only m the traffic, _but also in the Engineering departr:l8nt, smtable for holding high posi· t1ons m the raJlways. and he hoped with others that it would be many a long day before they would have to go outside QueC'nsland to find men suitable to fill tho high, positions in the ~lepartmcnt. (Hear, hear . ) . He also complmwnted tho Deputy ·comnusswncr on h1s promotion. H0 thouo-ht the appointrnent of the Commissi011er .;~as .an excellent appointment, and one which bad given general satisfaction throughout Queensland; and, judging from the start that he had made, he felt sure that that officer \\~auld endear himself to ~he people ·under h1s command. The appomtment of Mr. Bell was also a very popular one. He h_ad shown his. ability ii_l a subordinate posi­twn, and he d1d not thmk a better appoint­ment could haYc been made in succession to 11r. Pagan. It was the opinion of those who wero qualified to judge that in the RaihYay Engineers' Department iu Queens­land \YO had e:ot men oqctal to any m Aus­traha. \Vhen the hon. memb,,r £or Forti­tude Valley was referring the other night to tJ:e construction of locomotives at the Ips­wiCh workshops, as compared with the con­struction of looornoti ves by private entor­pnsc, he read a very interesting table show· mg wh~t wages l~ad to be paid b~ private ~ntc,rpnse a.s agamst tho wages being paid 1n tne Ipswwh workshops. He quite under· stood from the remarks which fell from other speakers that there were certain con­cessions given at the Ipswich workshops which wore not. given to men in private shops-such as holidays and concessions in travelling on the railway lines, but he had always been of the opinion that they should have more details supplied as to whether every item in connection with the construc­tion .. '•I as charged.

The SECRE'r.\RY FOR RAILWAYS: I have already said that that is so.

:'\lr. D. HUKTER: The land is not charged.

Jl.lr. CORSER: He was going on to sav that they had not heard whether land and in_ terest, insurance-fire and compensation-w€re charged, and he should also like to see a table 'Compiled showing the advantages that were set forth, in connection with the permits to travel on the railway lines and holidays, as compared with the hard cash that had to be ·parted with by contractors for locomotives for

[Mr. Adamson.

the Railway Department under their con­tracts. This he thought should be shown. If they were to compare the work of the State workshops with private enterprise they should have that detailed information before them.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: The con­tractors' shops are full of work at the pre­sent time.

Mr. CORSER: He was looking to the future, when perhaps they might not be. In South Australia, where they had at the present time a Labour Government he noticed that they were very particular to see that everything was oharqed up to the manufacture, and that in competition for locomot_ives they had been beaten by private enterprisE'.. As he said the other night in a large order for locomotives in South Aus­tralia, Walkers Limited were able to tender against the workshops in South Australia, and although they had to deliver the locomo­tives to that State •. they were only £2.,000 above on the whole JOb, aggregating £100,000. That showed ~hat with equal opportunities pnvate enterpnse could compete successfully with locomotives constructed by the State shops.

:\Ir. O'SULLIVAN: It did not show it in Que-ensland.

:Mr. CORSER: If it could be done cheaper all they wanted was to know that it was so -it was not enough for him, at any rate to be told that it was so much cheape/ Takmg the answers to questions which were asked only yesterday as to the diffBrence be. twee': the cost of C16 engines made at the Ipswrch workshops, as compared with what had been placed under contract at W alkerii Limited, the difference was £13 7s. 7d. per ton. They could very easily account for any ;omount like that if all the items were not charged, and then they had not been told that the locomotives contracted for by \V alkers Limited were identically the· same in every respect as those manufactured in the Ipswich wo.rkshops.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: They are the "arne pattern.

Mr. CORSER: They were the same pattern, and the -same name, but he wanted to know if they were identically the same. Could the present locomotives that had been made by Walkers Limited be made in the Ipswich workshops as cheaply or cheaper?

i\Ir. MuRPHY: What are you worrying about, we give you a fair share up there.

Mr. CORSER: 'We wanted this to show ~hat we were getting work done as cheaply in the Ipswich \Vorkshops as a.t Walkers Limited.

Mr. NEVITT: :\Iaryborough is getting spo~n­fed.

Mr. CORSER: They had had to fight for all they got by tendering low and giving every satisfaction. He wanted to refer to the state­ment of the hon. member for Bowen, who stated that Walkers Limited only kept their apprentices until they were eighteen o.r nine­teen y-ears of age, and then drove them out into the labour market, without giving them an opportunity of stopping at their trade. That he denied, unless it had bP,en in oases where young fellows had no wish to complete their term of apprenticeship. :Fro.m Walkers Limited they had sent out some of the moot brilliant young fellows who were now holding high positions in other works, not only in

Supply. [27 ShPTEMBER.j Suppl;lf· 1183

Queensland but elsewhere, and statements like these should not be made by members who knew absolutely nothing about the facts.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: He was a Maryborough boy.

Mr. CORSER: Yes, but he must have de­generated since he left Maryborough. Another matter which the Minister should take into cQilsideration now that railways were being extended into the Wide Bav and Bur­nett district was the railway revenue. The l'evenue on the line from Gympie to Mary­borough was £5 7s. 7d. per cent; Theebine to Kingaroy, £6 14s. lOd. per cent; Colton to P1alba, £5 4s. 2d. per oont; and Isis J unc­tion to Cwdalba, £5 15s. 9d. per cent. 1\lungar Junction to Gayndah showed £2 2s. 4d. per cent., but it was only a young line, .and the district was beginning to get closely settled, and it would not be long before it was up to £4 or £5 p€r cent. WhilB this l1ad been going o.n there had been no attempt .to keep the workshops in Maryborough up to a proper efficiency. The machinery was practically obsolete, and they had sent some of the best plant to Ipswich. He understood there was a desire to decentralise and the repair wo.rk in a large district like \Vide Bay 'and Burnett should be done at a local Govern­ment workshop, and he hoped arrangements would be made that these repairs should not be sent over a congested line to the Ipswich workshops. They had just as good men in Maryborough to do the work if they were ,given the chance and the tools to do it.

:\lr. O'SULLIVAN: Extensive repairs ?

:\Ir. CORSER: They could do extensive repmrs there as well. There "as another matter to which he wished to call the atten­tion of the Secretary for Railways, which he felt sure he was not cognisant of, otbBrwise he would take steps to see it removed. A very large amount of trade was taken from Jl.Im·y borough by preferential rates to the port of !=Jrisbane. He did not say that with­out havmg the facts in his possess'ion. He would not delay the Committee by rderring to it now, but probably later on hB would gwe numerous facts with the idea of remedy­~ng It. There were some serious discrepancies mdC'ed. In takmg the goods in truckloads they carried bQttled ale and stout from Roma street to Gympie, 107 miles, for £2 lOs. per to:'· From Maryborough to Gympie, 60 mil<:>s, the rate for bottled ale and stout was £2 9s. per ton; therefore the Raih1 ay De­partment was carrying bottled ale end stout 47 miles for ls. per ton, as against £2 9s. for 60 miles.

::'vlr. COLLIKS: I did not know that you ground your axe in that way.

The bell indicated that the hon. member's time had expired.

:\fr. CORSER: He would take his five minutes. The question of the salaries of the ~,tation-masters had been raised, and it should receive the earliest consideration of the Com­missioner. In some cases the station-masters were harshly treated by the classification. \Vhen the junior member for Ipswich, ~\Ir. Maughan, was speaking, he said that the Labour party were desirous for the con­struction of railways, more particularly railways into agricultural districts. That was news to those members sitting on the Government side, when they rem'3mbered that the members of the Labour party dis­tinctly said that the Government should call

a halt; that they were going too fast with their loan expenditure, which was growing up very rapidly. If they called a halt, how could they construct these railway lines ? The senior member for Ipswich waxed wrath with him (Mr. Corser) because he interjected, and he went on to say that railways built by day labour were con· structed at less cost than by contract, be­cause certain estimates were given, :1nd because the lines were built at less cost than the estimates it was contended that the work was done cheaper by day labour. 'l'h" hon. gentleman would not admit that the same thing might have happened if tenders had been called for those lines. They could not prove that day labour was cheaper than contract by such methods as that. He did not say that he was in favour of contract over day labour, but he favoured getting thd work done in the best and cheapest way they could for the taxpayers of the State. He "as interested when the junior member for Rockhampton trotted out a grievanf'<3 about the baths not being supplied to rail­way men along the railway lines as well as the officers. He did not hear the hon. gentleman say whether he would make it compulsory for each of the navvies to take a bath, because he knew of a man who was made to take a bath on one occasion and he got a severe cold, and he s>\ore he would never take a bath agam. He said that he had never had a l:>ath for forty y0ars, and the first one he had gavu him such a severe cold that it nearly caused his death. (Laughter.) If they m"d 3 it compulsory for tho men to take a bath SDill8 of them would think that the Govcrnm,~nt was very hard-hearted indeed. He 'Yuuld deal with other details of the estmu1tcs ;;~ thev proceeded with them.

Mr. BO"GCHARD (Brisbane South) : 1 t was a matter of congratulation that the railways had paid so handsomely during the past year, and it went to strengthen the policy which had been pursued in the past of con"tructing railways, even al­though at the commencement they were not likely to pay. It was necessary to build railway' for the purpose of opening up country o that settlement would take place and tl railways would ultimately prove profita' 'c. The junior member for Rock­hampto J referred to the regulation in the railway service which prohibited railway employees from taking part in elections, and he professed some indignation that that regulation should be continued. He (Mr. Bouchard) considered that that regulation, which was pa&.;ed by resolution of the House, was one that was concein>d in the best interests of the railway employees themselves. It would be a great misfor­tune if that regulation were repealed, be­cause if railway employees criticised their superior officers and then did not get pro­motion, they would turn round and say that thev were being penalised for the action they took during the election. He trusted that the regulation would not be repealed. It was better for tho employees themselves that it should remain in force. The junior member for Rockhampton also stat0d that members on the Government side obtained votes under false pretences by making pro­mises which thev had no intention of ful­filling. That hon. member had no reason to complain about members on the Govern­ment side, because members of his own party made promises to electors.

Mr. MULLAN: And we keep them, too.

Mr. Bouchart!.]

llR t [ASSEMBLY.] S11pply.

Mr. BO"CCI-IARD: Members opposite told tho electors that if the Labour party \Vere returned to power their wages would be largely increased, but as a matter of fact they knew they would have to be guided in their expenditure by the amount of re­venue th0y received.

Mr. MURPHY: Thev may be prepared to rai~e ftut her reycnue'.

Mr. BOCCI-lARD: Yes, they would tax the other fellow to put money into their own pockets, but they were not prepared to accept their share of the taxation.

Mr. MURPHY: Should not the wealthy people find the most money ?

Mr. BOVCHARD : So they did. It was the '.'Ccalthy people who contributed most largely to the revcnn<'.

Mr. MURPHY: \Vho finds most of the Com­monwealth revenue ? The poorer people through th0 customs.

Mr. BOVCHARD: His time was limited and the hon. member for Croydon was .not going to draw him into au argument on that question. Some reference had been made to the mistakes in regard to certain railwavs passed by the House. There was no doubt that some mistakes had been made in the railways that had been passed. \Yhen rail­way proposals were brought in a large num­ber of members had practicaliy no knowledge whatever of the countrv through which they passed, and the small amount of information giwn to . the Corr_nnittee hardly qualified them to gn'e an opmw.n as to the advisable­ness of building them. He was strongly in favour of the establishment of a public works committ ·e, consrstmg of members from both sides of the House, who would go into the matter thoroughly and furnish information to the House 011 '·''hich rnomberc could decide to the lwst of their judgment. Too manv of the rai:way proposa.!s introduced \Vere made party questions. II e had voted himeelf for railways because it was a party qul'stion, and he lmc-,•, that members opposite voted against c~rtain 1:ailways because it vva"' a party ques~ twn. 'I hey were about to reconsider the route of railways passed last session. That should not be. If the Government would do as •,•·as clone in other States and appoint a public >:arks committee, they would get the fullest mformatwn furnished to them on which they could act. There was a proposal !o convert the railway shops in Roma street mto cold stores. He submitted questions to the Thlinister for Agriculture that cla v and the answers showed that the proposal had been quite unconsidered by the Government. The I\Iinister for Agriculture had been visit­ing sites that had been suggest·ecl with the view of deciding on the most suitable. It was aclvisa.ble that it should be a suitable site and a central one in close proximity to shipping and the railways. He asked mem­bers if they thought that the site at Roma street was suitable for the establishment of cold stores? It must be admitted that it was necessary to have them close to shipping

and to the railwav in order to [8 p.m.] have as little handling, and conse-

quently a.s little expense as pos­sible. At the present time the 11inister could not tell thE' Committee what the storage capacity of the place was likely to be, and he did not know the expense. \Vas it going to

[Mr. Bouchard.

be a temporary expedient at great expense to convert these useless shops, as he might term them, into cold stores to centralise everything ronnel the ra.ilway station? Ther& was too much centralisation. (Hear, hear !) The Commissioner stated in his report that he was in favour of decentralisation in the matter of administration; but it was neces­sarv that there should also be decentralisation in other respects. It would cost a consider­able sum of money to convert these shops into cold stores; when erected they would not be useful for any very lengthy period. The area of the land would be quite inade­quate in a few years. In 11eibourne they had a site of 5 acres for cold stores. He said it was the duty of the Ga,vernment to take the matter in hand in a proper way and erect stores which would serve the require­ments of the Southern portion of Queensland for the next twenty-five years.

:\lr. MURPHY: \Yhere would you suggest?

:\Ir. BOUCHARD: He v:ould come to that presently. He was not speaking for the pur­pose of el~ctioncering; he was honestly sincere in the matter. When a largo deputation waited on the Premier on the 4th July last, the han. gentleman replied in substance that he was very much in accord with the deputa­tion in regard to cold stores being erected on the South side. And he appealed to· members of the Committee whether there could he a better place-a beautiful reach of river. 1.vharfage second to none, and a raihvay running right along the riverside. _-\..nd he 111ight lllention that t0-1110lTOVY it 1YUS in­tr,ncled to bring to Birt's wharf, South Bris­(,ane, probably th12 large2t vessel eYer seen in the port of Brisbane, a vessel of 14.000 tons.

The bell indicated that the han. member's cime had expired.

:\Ir. BOUCHARD: He would take his time. He was not asking for money to be :;pent in South Bri•bane merely for the eake of having it spent there, hut he contended that there were sites in South Brisbane more suitable in evei-y respect than the site chosen by the Government, and before the Govern­n1ent embarked on this scheme, pren1aturely born, it ''as their clutv to reconsider the positio,n. Did they intend to burke the con­struction of the bridge across the river to connect South Brisbane with the Central Station until they had erected all Govern­ment works in the city?

Mr. D. HuNTER: That's the game.

Mr. BOUCHARD: It was proposed by the Government of New South \Vales to connect their line irr the No.rthern Rivers district with our South Coast Line, and it was generally admiUed that when those railways were con­nected Brisbane would derive the bulk of the trade from the Northern Rivers. And was there any place more justly entitled to that trade than South Brisbane? There waB too much centralisatio11 going on, and there should be clecentralisatio.n wherever it could he practised with advantage to the proclucBr and the consumer as well as to the conveni­ence of all people concerned. He urged the Government to take the matter into their serio,us consideration, and not throw away money in the conversion of tho&e shops in Roma street into stores which in a few years would be found totally inadequate. (Hear, hear!)

C27 SEPTEl\IBER.] Suppl!J.

. lioN. E. B. FORREST (Brisbane .Yorth) said the impression left on his mind by the :t~emarks of the hon. member who had just sat . down was that there was a great deal of centralisation going on in Brisbane North, and that it was desired that the butter depot should be erected at the Roma Street Station because that happened to be in Brisbane Nor.th. He would like to disabuse the hon. member's mind of the idea that Brisbane North had anv desire to hav·e the butt-er stores there. ·

Mr. BoucHARD : I did not suggest that.

HoN. E. B. FORREST : The hon. member stated there was a desire on the part of ~orth Brisbane to have cold stores there.

Mr. BoucHARD: I said nothing of the sort.

HoN. E. R FORREST: If the Govern­ment were going to build cold stores of that kind, they should neither be in North Bris­bane nor 'in South Brisbane. \Vhere was tho shipping of the port done? ·where was the produce of the country shipped from l1t the present time?

Mr. BoucHARD: South Brisbane'. There are more v<JASels !<'ave South Brisbane Reach than any other reach in the riYcr. (Laugh­ter.)

HoN. E. B. FORREST: Was that alwavs going to be th<' case 9 Go dmnr as far as Bulimba and sec what is going on there. (Renewed laughter.} \Vhere the export trade of the port was being· carriecl on \Yas the place for the cold stores.

Mr. BoucHARD : That is Scnth Brisbane.

HoN. E. B. FORRES'I': There was not the slightest doubt that Bulimba was the place for those cold stores. Would the hon. mem­ber say t.hern was going t.o hn more export trade done from South Brisbane than from Bulimlm? The thing was too ridiculous to talk ahout it. Go down there and see the stores that were being built. and where tho stores were being built \Vas the place the produce 'Yas g·oing to. He was not decrying South Brisbane. South Brisbanf' was doing very well. They had a magnificent reach, and had magnificent wharfage accommoda­tion for the vessels going .there, but they were not gomg to do the trade of the port by a very long way.

:Mr. BouCHARD: I did not say they were.

HoN. E. B. FORREST: There was no de,ire of centralising in Brisbane as regards cold stores. Was the export trade of Queens­land going· to be done from the railway sheds at Roma street? It was absurd to talk about it. The hon. member for Brisbane South spoke of the area required for cold storage purposes. 'Where was a sufficient area avail­able in South Brisbane to enable them to put up suitable cold stores? The very reason the hon. member assigned for not having the cold stores at Roma street-be­cause there was not a sufficient area-applied to South Brisbane. They wanted a bigger area than was available there. If they pro­posed to put the stores on the top of High­gate Hill, they might get a suitable area. At any rate, there was a better place than either North Brisbane or South Brisbane. The cold stores should be convenient to the shipping, and they should be on the railway line. Now, there were two places where those conveniences could be obtained. South

1911-4D

Brisbane was one, and Bulimba the other .. He did not know at the present time where· the cold stores were to be, and he did not think the Government did either. The hon • member for Brisbane South stated that the· Premier was trotting round and inspecting various sites, and he seemed to approve of the whole of them, but he (Mr. Forrest) did not know that the Premier had made up his. mind whero they were to be erected.

An IlONOUHABLE J'vlE~IBER: It has heert stated they will be erected at Roma street.

HoN. E. R FOH,REST hoped they were not to be built at H,oma street. It would be a blundPr to Prect them there. The cold stores should bo where the export trade of the port as don<'. and if the butter trade n1cant anything, it rneant a big export trade. There was no doul>t thev were wanted some­where, and a sitP must be selected beforG long. He was n·ry sorry to hear that the Premier had decid-ed on the Roma-street site. He did not intend to say anything· on the Estimates of the chief office, but when they came to the departmental Estimates he might have something to say.

Mr. PAYNE (M-itchell) was not going to say anything about the cold stores, as he really did not know tho best place for those stores. One would think, in listening to hon. member• on tho Government side who had spoken that afternoon, that they were on the eve of a general election. Every Governtnent member who had spoken had stated that members of the Opposition wore only talking to the Pkctors of Queensland.

Hon. K B. FORREST: You will do exactly the same• thing· bt•fore you sit down. (Loud laughter.)

Mr. P A YJ'\E : It wa.' not his intention to do so. It had b0en stated that a sum of £90,000 had been placed on the Estimates, and that the lo.•·or-paid men in the service would roc< ivc some benefit from that. He· was not g-oing to argue whether it was too much or too litr.lc, but he considered that tho railway men in QuePns!and should get a living· I< age, and the least the Government could do wa.< to place the railway men in Queensland on the same footing as the rail­way men in the othe1· States of the Common­wealth. It had been repeatedly stated that the earnings on the railways had increased considerably, but yet the men were paid less than those on the railways in the other States. The station-masters in Queensland were badly treated. He was not saying that to get the supp.ort of any station-masters.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: What sec­tion?

Mr. PAYNE: The whole of them. Any man who liked to take up the Estimates and sec the pay meted out to station-masters in Queensland, from the top to the bottom of the ladder, and compared them with the salaries received by station-masters in the other States, could see that the salaries of the Queensland station-masters were very much below the mark. He was not going to say what they should receive, but the State and the Government were not doing their duty in not paying the railway men, from the top rung to the bottom of the ladder, the same as was given to the railway men in the other States. Something had been said about the accommodation on the Charle• ville line.

Mr. THORN: That is not electioneering.

Mr. Payne.}

3.U.86 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supp(IJ

Mr. PAYNE : He did not care whether ·he was accused of electioneering or not, but when one was aware that serious grievances iflXi.sted, he would be a wooden man if he ·dJ.d not say something about them. He had .. -called attention time after time to the miser­: able accommodation provided on the railway hei;ween Rockhampton and Longreach. He had gone to the Commissioner and pointed

·-out that there were second-class carriages running a distance of 424 miles without a h.Yatory. Was it a fair .thing that women and nhildren should be obliged to travel under "uch conditiq_ns? The last time he was along

• the line there was one carriage that had no . lavatory compartment, and he had been pes· ltered about the matter every time he had

· ibecn up during the last two years. He hoped the Government would remedy that state of affairs. He did not think it was

. slectioneering to make such a request, · =p.ecially as the stations were so few and fa.r between. He had also referred several

.1ti.mes to the miserable low hovels provided for lengthsmen on the IV estern lines. They were hardly fit to put a horse in. They 'had )?assed an Act compelling private em­ployers to provide decent accommodation for ;shearers and sugar-workers. and the least the Government could do would be to give o>mne decent accommodation to the railway men, especially in the hotter parts of the 'State. They saw women and children in -low tin hovels that they had to stoop to

. get ·into, and were not fit for them to live irL Another thing he had noticed on the Jine betvreen Longreach and Rockhampton wRs that there was only one of the new engines on that line. Time after time he 'ha-d seen some of the best engine-drivers :and ·firemen in the department stuck up on that line, and, when they were asked what

, was the cause, they put it down to the old ·rattle-trap engines with which they had to do the journey. On such a long journey the least the Government could do was to give the men decent engines with whioh they

' could rnn to time. He made inquiries at Emerald, and found that from Emerald to Lt.ngreach there was only one engine with

'which it was possible to do that. That was not a fair thing. He did not know whether it was electioneering if he again referred to the miserable station accommodation at -~greach. He was told on a previous occa­"lion to wait until the question of the exten­sion of the line was under consideration; but even if the line were not extended one inch beyond Longreach, the district ·.v-ar­ranted a better railway station. It was a miserable, pokey place. The last four or dive men they had there had died. He did not know whether that was due to the hot place in which they had to work, but the whole thing wanted going into. Hon. members on the other side had been to Longreach, and knew the kind of station they had. The revenue obtained there for the year was something like £60,000 or

· £70,000, and yet there was only a shed pro­Tided by way of station buildings. That was not a fair thing in such a big centre. A

· good deal had been said abont the routes proposed for the \Vestern extensions. He could not see how he could be accused of

, electioneering in this matter, because the ·chances were that his advocacy of the line

·'from Longreach would give offence to a good many people in his electorate. He had >W.id. repeatedly that the one line should run "i'rom Longreach to Jundah, and the other.

{Mr. Payne.

froin Charleville to Adavale. He had no axe to grind in the matter. Personally, it did not matter to him which routes were decided upon, but anyone who knew the country and had been over it in flood time knew that there was no sense in taking &

line in such a dog's hind-leg fashion as wail proposed in connection with the extension from \Valia! to Tobermory. The Longreach connection would cost £250,000 less than the Blackall extension. Another advantage the Longreach route would have over the other was that thene was water right down the Thomson River every 25 miles or so and it would not be very expensive to 'eneet pumping-stations. Even in the big drought there was water every 25 miles. There v·ere also in the locality some very fine coal seams. It was stated in the Courier the other- day that a seam 4 feet 9 inches thick had been discovered on the Long­reach line at a depth of 60 feet, and he knew that there was a 6-feet seam about 3 miles on the line at Spencer's place, just outside Longreach. He was pleased the Commissioner had intimated that he was going to obtain expert evidence on the vari­ous routes of the Western lines.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: He is visit­ing the places himself, with engineers.

Mr. PAYNE: He was pleased to hear it, because every hon. member who was in the House last session knew that those lines were brought in in a very hurried manner. When they took into consideration that their construction involved an expenditure of something like £6,000,000, he thought the hon. membm· for Barcoo had taken the right stand in pointing out that they should have expert evidence as to the best routes. He (Mr. Payne) would be satisfied if that were done. He had always advocated the con­nection from Longrcach, but he was satisfied that when the exoerts went into the matter and discovered the cheapness of the one route as compared with the other thev would do the right thing. Even at tha't late hour it was pleasing to know that the Government intended to make further inves­tigations before spending a huge sum of money in the construction of those lines. It was quite possible for any man or any

body of men to make a mis· [8.30 p.m.] take. and the great mistake

made with reference to these railways was that of making them a partv question. He knew tho stand the then leader of the Government took in the mat­ter, and in his opinion it was a wrong stand in the intt rest of the country. He (Mr .Payne) was gaining nothing by advo­catmg the routes he favoured, but advo­cated them b0cause he believed they were the best routes to adopt in the interest of the people of Queensland. The hon. mem­ber for South Brisbane, Mr. Bouchard, had practically admitted that the Great Wes­tArn Railway was made a party question.

Mr. BoucHARD: I did not say that; I said some.

Mr. PAYNE: It was difficult to know what the hou. member meant by "some," nnless he meant the Port Alma and We.­tern hncs. He was satisfied that if the railwav experts, and possibly an expert from the Lands Department, went into the matter, the right thing would be done. No one could make him believe that •~ bod-.. of men occupying the Treasury benches,

Supp(IJ. [27 SEPTEMBElt-~ Supply. 1187

whoever those men might be, would wilfully £pend millions of the taxpayers' money out of pure cussedness. If the Government built the linE\ along the route which had been indicated by more than one member of the House, they would do the right thing. In any case, he was glad that the matter had been reopened, and that they were going to have expert advice on this particular railway.

The bell indicated that the hon. member's time had expired.

At twenty-seven minutes to 9 o'clock,

The CHAIRMAN said: Under Standing Order No. 11 I call upon tho hon. member for South Brisbane, Mr. Bouchard, to relieve me in the chair.

Mr. BoucHARD thereupon took the chair accordingly.

Mr. BRESLIN (Port Curtis): There were one or two matters in this vote that he should like to refer to. He was very pleased to note that the Commissioner intended to carr} out tho policy of his predecessor, and travel throughout the State, because in his DWn district there was great need for a periodical visit from the gentleman who had control of the railways. HP was also pleased to know that substantial rises were to be given to the, secretary to the Commissioner and the assistant eccretary, by which they had been brought more into line with the Dfficials at the head of other departments of the public service than they were pre­Yiously. The Commissioner, in his report, made reference to the policy of decenkali­sation, and he sincerely hoped that he would extend that policy, and do away with the monopoly of Brisbane. There had been an argument that evening between the han. member for Brisbane North and the han. member for Brisbane South with reference to the location of the proposed cold stores. There were other places besides Brisbane where cold stores could be erected. Instead of buying expensive land in Brisbane for tho purpose of erecting thereon cold stores, the Government might go to Gladstone or Bowen, whE're there was raihvay comlnu­nication with the V\T est, butter factories, and meatworks. They could erect their stor<>s there. and avoid the squabble as to which suburb on a little river in a corner of Queensland should have the honour of pos­sessing G-ov€rnment cold stores.

Tlw SECRETARY FOR RAILW\YS: V\7 hy not haw' other stores 9

Mr. BRERLIN: He was glad to hear the ]I,Iinistn sngg-est that they should ha;-o cold storage at other places, and hoped that he would carry out his promise.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: I made no pron1ise.

Mr. BRESLIN: At any rate, he hoped to sec cold stores erected at Gladstone, where there was a harbour practically free from dues. He was pleased to see that the Co'm­missioner had decided to give a clean sheet to railway employees, and hoped he v.oL<l<l extend the principle and give men who had been dismissed for trivial offences during the last eighteen months a chance of getting back into tl1c service. He knew of one case in ·which a porter-he would not like to say was goaded into iusubordination by the station-master, but it went very close to it. This porter and the station-master c<mld not agree, and the man was worried a lot .

by the station-master. One day he lost hia temper and spoke in a disrespectful manner, was reported, and dismissed. He was a married man, and had since been down as low as he could get, having been unable to. obtain constant employment, and having been refused readmission to the service. If that man had had influence and had known the right way to go about the matter, he would probably haye been retained in the service, and would have got his clean sheet. He trusted thac the Commissioner would extend his clean sheet to men of that class. He wished now to refer to the extreme difficulty ther9 was in getting railway sidings in country dis­tricts. He was quite surprised to fmd that on the Cleveland Railway, which was only 23 miles long, there were twenty-one stations. That line showed a loss of £2,271 on the cost of working last year. In his district there was one place on the Boyne River where a siding was very much needed, and the farmers of the locality had been fighting for some time to get that siding. At present they had to take their produce to Benarll!Py. There was a sufficient number of farmers on that side of the river t,o maintain the station there. The farmers on the other side had to cart their stuff across the river over a very dangerous crossing, which the shire council would not repair'. He had in his hand a letter from Mr. F. A. Pershouse, one of the most re­spected residents of the district, and a pioneer of the place, in which he pointed out that-

" There are about twenty farmers prepared and anxious to use proposed siding, and there are others who1n I have not seen.

" It is Vf'ry inconvenient for the people on my side of the river to get to Benaraby, as the crossing has been washed out, and it is still wors,, to get to Rodd's Bay Railway Station, which is about 5 miles of very rough travelling.

" Lately a man from Bundaberg expressed his intention of purchasing land for sugar­growing contingent on a siding being made on this side of the river, but he said that it was absolutely impoodble to cross the river with cane.''

'l'lw riYer was affected by the tides at that place, so that it could only be crossed at cer­tain times. 'What assistance was that to a farmer who had to take his produce across, even leaving out the prospect of canegrowing? Then the crossing was frequently washed out; it was absolutely dangerous, and they wanted a small siding put in on the other side from Benaraby, He hoped when the Commissioner v,ent up North there would be no difficulty in getting a siding there. It was 7 miles from Benaraby to Robb's Bay. That section was paving handsomely, and yet they had much tr~uble in getting a siding. More than that, it was a good timber district. He had been told by timber-getter:J, whom he had known ever since he could remember, that they were prepared to work in that district. TheY had had to leave because they could not· cart their timber to Rod d's Bay, and they could not cross the river. They said that there would be at least 250,000. f~et ?f timber sent through this proposed stdmg m a year. When he was goin~ to Many Pe~ks last Friday, he left the tram at one statt~n and spoke to two men who h!ld ta!<en. thetr teams from the Boyne Crossmg drstnct '!P to N agoorin, because they were on the ra!l­way line there, and w_ere ab.le to send th~ir timber away. Thts p~rtwular. part,, which was a good paying sectiOn, was m .the

Mr. Brel!lin.l

U88 Supplp. [ASSJ!:MBLY.]

section from Y andaran to Rockhampton, in which the net earnings was £6 3s. ld. per cent. Suroly the Commissioner would be able to afford to put in a siding on that railway, which would show a substantial increase in consequence ! He wanted to refer to the trains on the Boyne Valley line. They had four trains a week, the distance was 58 miles, and it took five hours to travel that distance. Tho excuse for the slow trains was that they could not possibly get along any faster. He had known cases where it was desirable that the train should get into Many Peaks at an early hour, and the officials had done their best, but the amount of business was so great that it could not be dono. The excuse was made that the flux trains met the requirements of daily passen­gers, but they did nothing of the kind. He had travelled on a flux train from IGlotdstone to Many Peaks, and the guard refused to let him out at the nearest point to Glad­stone, and in consequence he had to walk 6 ~Jlilos. He might mention a small matter here. From Mount Larcom to Ambrose was 3 or 4 miles. Children were able to get down by a goods train which left .at an early hour, and put them into Mount Larcom for school, but they had to walk back in the afternoon. If the flux train "hich started from ~Mount Larcom about 4 o'clock would let the children down at Ambrose, they could go back in it, but the g-eneral traffic manager at Rockhampton had not seen his way clear to lot the,e children be carried on that train, and the consequence was that they had to walk back in the afternoon. He found that the net earnings on the line from Boyne Valley Junction to ::Yiany Peaks for the• first twPlvc months tlw line had b0cn O)Wil was £4 6s. 6d. per cent., and allowing from Gladstone to the Junction brought it up to about £4 9s., and he thought that result justified the dailv train they were asking for. While on the"Boyrw Valley Rail­way, he might mention that there "as con­siderable dissatisfaction with the prices paid for resumption. There were cases in which somP owners had been paid much more than othPrs adjoining. He had asked the Secre­tary for Railways if he would table tho amounts paid, but he had refused, because it was private business. He (Mr. Breslin) did not see that at all, because it was public money which was expended. He did not think the department should be ashamed to show the amounts they had paid. There' was a great difficulty in coping with the traffic at the Gladstone Railwav Station. For mw thing, tho platform was only sufficient to hold one train. They had at last, after many years, succeeded in getting a dec<mt lighting plant, but they wanted the platform enlarging to cope with the traffic. On some Saturdays there were as many as eight trains at Gladstone at the one time, and some were shunted on the jetty line, some into the siding, and some in the yards, and it was almost impossible to carry on business. He trusted that the Commissioner would see his way to enlarge the platform; or they would prefer that he put in a donble plat­form and an overbridge.

The boll indicated that the hon. member's time had expired.

Mr. BRESLIN: He would take his time. They also wanted extra assistance in the goods department there. It seemed absurd io him that for the train that left at half­past 2 o'clock for Many Peaks, no goods could

[Mr. Breslin.

be taken after half-past 10 in the morning. There was another small matter that had been brought under his notice-tha~ was the action of the department in charg•ing the local race club such a heavy guarantee. He was not objecting to a race club paying a guarantee, but when the department put a heavy guarantee on them and made a big profit, the club should receive some con­sideration. He thought that it was about the only race club in Queensland which had b0en treated in such a way.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: Oh. no; we make no distinctions at all.

::'lir. BRESLIN': Tho secretary had pointed ont to him that the reason given by the de­partment for refusing· a rebate on the pTofit was because BriHbane or other places could claim it, and had told him that there was no guarantee required in Brisbane, and that the Bundabcrg Hacing Club had given no guarankc this yc><r. He did not know if that was con·ect or not. Tho Gladstone race. course was onlv about a milo and a-half from Gla<l"tonc, am[ tho Hailway Dq1artmcnt. had

·been charging a gua.rantee of £35 for the last throe years to run a train out there. Lust year the takings by this train amounted to £70. Tlwy charged 2s. return, and the Gladstone Hacing Club did not object to that, hut in ot htr places, such as Brisbane and Bunda berg, they had some kind of a platform provid0d. ami th<·y should have onc at Glad­stone.

The SECRETARY FOil RAILWAYS: If the• club­do not object, why talk about it?

:Ylr. BHESLI.'<: I-Io said they did not ob­ject to the 2s. retum, but they did object to having to gi vo a guarantee, c~ i,ecially as they got nom· of the profits. ThP Railway Depal'tment ought tu provide a platform, or landing stagL', at the rn.rocourso, as at pr0sent the only thing there was a turnstile which the club provided at its own e'cpense. It was a regulation of the department that <lL·rnand<'d the guarantee, and he thought the club should get some small share of th& proilts. He had hoard a great deal in the last month or two about the Calliope Valley Uailway, and he hoped to see the plans tabled for that line during tho current sos~ion.

Tho SEC!lETARY FOR RAILWAYS: I can assure you that there will be nothing of thC' sort.

Mr. BUESLIN: He was sorry to hear that. It was a rich district, and Mr. Paget, when Minister for Agriculture, promised to send an export to have a look at it. That expert from the Agricultural Department was in the district now, and was quite satisfied with it. If tho Secretary for Agriculture or Secretary for Railways went through that district,. they would bo favourably impressed by it. He trusted that that railway would be tabled next session, because it would open up a good agricultural district, as good as they would find anywhere. It was better than the Boyne Valley, and it had a big mine at the l'nd of it known as tho Callide Coalfield.

LIEUT-COLONEL RANKIN (Burrum) con­gratulated the Minister on the excellent re­port of the Commissioner. He expressed his regret at the loss sustained by the depart­ment through tho death of Mr. Thallon, as that gentleman was held in esteem and re­gard by his employees and the public gene­rally, A yery wise step had been takm in

Suppl;IJ· [27 SEI'TRMBBR.] Supply. 1189

appointing Mr. Evans as Commissioner, and Mr. Pagan as Deputy Commissioner for Railways, as they had both grown up in the service and knew every detail of it, and from their positions they obtained a wide know­ledge, not only of the departments over which they administered, but of the require­ments of the State generally. It had some­times been argued that it was advisable to introduce new blood into these departments in order to bring them up to date and have the latest ideas from other countries intro­.duced into them, but, while there might be something to be said in favour of that, they must remember that any advantage was dis­counted by the fact that any new arrival was entirely ignorant of the conditions prevailing in Queensland, and it took them some time to become conversant with the requirements of tho State. Ho heard of a Commissioner of Railways who was appointed for Queensland years ago, .. ,-yho, when he arrived, was practi­cally an infant so far as tho Queensland rail­way requirements were concerned. That was a drawback which the importation of any man from England carried with it. He con­gratulated the Minister on being wide aw:~ke and keeping abreast of the times in regard to 6ny scientific and engineering improvement·s that might be taking place in other countries. He was glad to see that the Minister showed his judg1nent in that respeet by sending rail­way officers home at periodical intenaL; to learn the latest rnodes of running railways in other countries. He read with interest the report of :\Ir. Steer on his visit to France, India, and England. He was sure that these visits to other countries res.ultod in a great deal of saving, a!!cl great benefit must accrue from them. as the0 incorporated lYhat they saw in their work in Queensland. The best note to be found in tho Cocnmissionm's re­port was to be found on page 6, where he said in referring to the earnings-

" This incrt<:tF,e in gross earnings-viz., £:'91,962 above 1909-10, and £627,311 more ttan 190S-n9-is to some extent accounted for by the opening of new railways ; but the ex­pansion of traffic upon the older lillf'S has been enorn1ous, and fai4 exceeded all expectations.,

That was perhaps one of the most hopeful signs that we had of the prosperity of Queonsbnd. 'l'hcre \Yas no better barometer of tho prosperity of a young country than the railway earnings, as they showed exactly how the;' ctoocl a'·:cl what progress they wore making. It was distributed right throughout the Stale, as, with the exception of one or two s nail unimportant lines, tho whole of the railways paid handsomely during the year. "When they considered tho smormous mileage they had and the sparse population of Queensland, it reHoctecl very high]~' on the prosperity and tho thrift ,and energy of the people they had here. The great increase in respect to our staple product-vvool-was par­ticularly noticeable, the receipts from which

totalled £231,563 last year, being [9 p.m.] an increase of about £20,000 on

the preceding year. In agricul­tural produce there was a distinct increase in quantity, but a distinct fall in revenue re­ceived. The quantity carried was 626,903 tons, being an increase of 188,065 tons, while there­ceipts were £192,436, being an increase of only £39,521 ; so while there was an increase of 43 per cent. in quantity there was only an increase of 26 per cent. in revenue. That was explained in the next paragraph of the report, which pointed out that the sugar-cane

traffic, for which a very low freight was charged, increased during the year by 88,559 tons. The freight on cane had always been Yery moderate, and had it not been so it would have been impossible in many in­stances for the growers on the North Coast line to send their cane to the mills; therefore the department wore to be congratulated on the great assistance given to c:megrowers in enabling them to take advantage of the railway in sending their cane to the mills. There had been a distinct falling off in the quantity of coal for shipment, there being a, decrease of 76,601 tons as compared with last year; and he urged the Government to see if it was not pos"ible to give such shipping facilities as would enable Queensland to supply the whole of the Northern market instead of coal being imported from New South \Vales. Before federation there was an import duty of 2s. a ton, and since that had bef'n remoyed the coalmasters were seriously handicapped in competing for the Northern trade. He hoped this was the last time they would see such a large importation of coal from New South Wales. All along the C<;ntral line there were excellent coal­bearing strata; in the North there were ex­C811ent coal-bearing areas; and in the South­cast part of Queensland there was practically untold mineral wealth, so he failed to see why such a, large proportion of the· coal used here should be brought from another State. He noticed that there was a considerable increase in tho construction of rolling-stock, but he did not. think the countrY districts receiyec\ that consideration with "r0 Jpect to the nature of tho accom nodation which they ought to receiYe. He did not say the quantity was insuflicieJit, but some of the carriages in which th~;. were callL·d upon to trayel would not be sub·nittecl to for fiyc minutes on the suburban lines about Brisbane. He hoped some i1nprove nent would be rna de in this matter in the near future. The fares in country districts were higher than on the suburban lines-certainlv not lower-and there was no reason why ",j.;Je acco!nn1odation should not be as good.' It was with a dis­tinct feeling of rejoicing hn notic :c1 that all the railways in his district paid handsomely.

The bell indicated that the han. member's time had expired.

LIEUT.-COLONEL RANKIN (continuing) said that shouid be an inducement to the depart­ment to provide better accommodation. There was one other matter he wished to mention. In country districts they not in­frequently had what were called shelter-sheds on branch lines where tho traffic was insuf­ficient to justify railway stations, and though these shelter-sheds were cxeollent in protect­ing goods from the weather they did not protect goods from pilferers. It would be advisable, if possible, where those shelt-er­sheds were erected, to have gatehouse keepers, as there would then be some super­vision over the goods. He had received several complaints from different places under that head, and he merelv mentioned it as it would be of great advantage to some people if his suggestion were adopted. His griev· ances were very small, both in number and nature, and he again congratulated the Minis­ter and officers of the department on the very excellent work they had clone during the last year, and the very excellent results they had brought about, as shown in the Commis­sioner's report.

Lieut.-Colonel Rankin.]

lHJO Suppl_lf. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

:Mr. J\fCLCAHY (Gympic) was very sorry to ''"-Y that the Minister for Railways was one of thc• most unsatisfactory :Ylinisters they had. He (:'dr. :Ylulcahy) had got to that >tage tha( he neyer asked the ,Minister any­thing, because be answered invariably that he would look into the matter, and nothing morP was heard about it. Some time ago a deputation of members put before the Min­ister the case of the charge made by the department for collecting money on con­struction v, orks. \Vherc they gave orders on storekeepers or other business pt:.·vplc they charged 5 per cent. The Minister stated at tho time that the matter had not been lost sight of. He (Mr. J\lukahy) had had .oe>me difticulty in "rranging the deputation, as the ::u:nister was so irritable. At all events, the deputation was arranged, and tho Minister said he >Yould go into the matter. That w.1s son1e ¥Veeks a(';o,~ and so far the 11inis­ter had done nothing in the matter. It was, no doubt, a very good way of getting rid of men1bers, but ho liked to go to a }1inis­tcr v:ho ·would say "Yes" or "No" to any request. \VheneYer he went to any of the other :Yiinishrs he got a reply, at all eYents. Perhaps he did not happen to strike the I\Iinister for Raihva\':::i when he \''/as in a good humour, but it" wa' not a question to hirn ,,chether a ntan was in a good hun1our or no' \Yhen he asked for cortain informa­tion, he did so as the repres,cntati.-e of the people. and no distinction should be made bctwePn Govern1ncnt supporters and lTIOlTI­bc:'s of tho Oppc:ition. He would like to cxpr0,:>: 1 in t Ollll110l1 with other n1en1bors, the grc 't loss th" State had sustained through the death of the lde Commis,ioner. He had ahvays found ih~ late Con11nissioner a thorout,h bthin ,. o man, and he always gave the fullest' information at his disposal. \Yith refrard to th(' new ConEni' .;ioncr, he cxprc-~sed the hope that tho appointm, nt would be a good on,;, [t~._d that the Cornrni· sioner \\-ould carry out his duties for tho benefit of tho State. Thr :'.lini,·ter had stated the other day that ~voung lads joining tho scrdce, for tho first six months received only 2s. a day. In tha case of a boy being s<'nt away from hi' han e, it was quito impossible for him to g·-t his food bupplied for that sum. He hac! to go to some hotel or decent boarding­he JSc' and a young fellow could not get bo0,rcl' for anythin; u,1dcr 1-1,;:;. or 15s. a \+'!ole It was the duty o£ the C-Jnnnittee to !-._-; that thoso bo:y, ~bot f.:Uffif :ent 1noney to pay for their l•oe1r,J, and Dn{' or t\vo ~·hil~ ling' extra as pocket-monev. It would not n1c<tn a vcr:-;. big an1ount out of the earnings of the Railway Department, and it would be money well spent. He pointed out that last year a ,um of £2,500 was put on the Esti­mates for improvement, to the Gympie Railway Station, but none of that amount had been spent. This vear a sum of £5,000 had been placed on the Estimates on account. It was well known to the Com­missioner and the officers of the department that some alterations were absolutely neces­sary. He wanted to know whether it was the intention of the Government to have that work gone on with this year, or were they going to hold it over until next year? There was no accommodation there for cattle or live stock at all. It had been stated that there was not a great quantity of live stock sent there, nor was there likely to be while the accommodation remained as at present. It would be seen by the reports that in the Gympie district there were 10,000 dairy

[Mr. Mulcahy.

cm.-s. That went to show that it was a large dairying district, and a good number of cows would be trucked from Gym pie if there were any faoilitiee. People would rather drive their stock 8 or 10 miles than run the risk of trucking at Gympie. The station accom­modation was simply wretched and alto· gether inadequate, and he really expected that the >York would have been gone on with long before now. He understood that the plans were approved of some time ago, but he believed they had since been altered. He understood from some of the officers of the department that if they had an overbridge there it would take up too much room. He undcerstood that some local person, a bit of a draftsman, who was not in the service, had made some sketches and certain pto­posals, and those proposals were to be acted on. It was hardl:y the thing for the officBrs of tho department to take any notice of that. Thev should send their own officers to go into" these matters before they came to a decision. He would like to know whether this work would be gone on with or not. He urgffi it because he knew how necessary it was. He was told recently that it was not to be gone on with, but was to be dangled before the people just before a general election. He hoped that was not so, because it was not acting on proper business lines to do that kind of thing. Another matter to which ho wished to call attention was some train alterations that had been made, and which were alto­gether unsuitable. He pointed this out to the pn"ent Commissioner, and that gentle­man told him that the alteration had been made at the request of the people of Gympie, He had made inquiries, and found that the ex,prcsident of the Gympie Chamber of Con1n1orce, on his ov~,n initiative, had written a letter askin!! for the alterations in the train s,cn·iee. The other mPmbers of the chamber told him that they did not agree to it at all. 1'\ow, before any alteration was Jnadc in a train scrYico, the Con1inissioner should catisfj himself that rhe people in the district wa~nted that alterahon made, unless it ,-,:as nccc~-.,itatcd by departnwntal re,,~,.ons. He should not toke t-:>o much notice of any one Plan in a di,'rict. He should fmc! out especially if tho al!eration was desired by thosr who used the line, because he did !Jot supposi' that the gentle;e1an who wrote the lntter made mo i'e than t>YO or three trips to Brisbane in c: year, <tnd he did not Slwnd lOs. ' year in sending stuff oYer the line. The alterations were most inconveni­ent. One effcci was that a number of men who used to tra.-el from Gympie in the morning to Pomona and other place· to work, and return to their h0mes about 7 o'clock, did not get back now until 10 o'clock. He pointed these things out to the Oommi·1Sioner and his officc·rs in order that before they made an:; future alterations they should consult the people >vho used the trains. He understood that new plans were being prepared, and he hoped that before action was taken upon them the people in the district would be allowed to see them to see what facilities they were to be offered. That would give great satisfaction. Passing from purelv local matters, he hoped that the men engaged in the construction works would get a fair deal. Some of the men working on the Mary Valley line told him that the pay they got for horses and drays was not adequate, taking into consideration the high price they had to pay for fodder. They had

Sup;l.if. [27 SEI'TEM BEll.] Suppl.1J• ll9lf

to find £60 or £70 for an outfit, and though they got 8s. a day for themselves it had to be .borne in. mind that they h~d to feed then horses m wet weather, even when thov could not W?rk them. Expenses were going Ocll all the ~nne. He hoped that those men would receive some consideration, and that they wo~ld not be expected to work for next to nothmg. He pressed for a reply with r~gard to the local matters that he had men­twned·.

Mr. LAND (Balonnc) was not at al! sur­pn~ed to learn that the Government had decided to get more information in connec­tion With the Great 'Ncstern Railway. When the BI.Jl was before the House la;t session the prmCipal objection of the Labour party to tho proposal was the meagre information t.hat was .afforded. He expected they would haYe sufhmont information available later. '!;'here was no.t a man who knew the \Vpstern cour~try who would not say that the most foolish proposal introduced last session was the railway 0xtension from \\Tallal to Tobm­mory: He eli~. not hold a brief from any­one m coDncccJOn w1th the extension other than from the people of Queensland gener­ally. He never could see why any member sh<.mld 'be exported to vote against a line bem&' exte_ndecl because tho inhabitants in a district wish0d him to refrain from doing so: That was not a wise thing or a fair thmg or a ~usiness-like thing. He con­tended that this particular extension should be made almost duo west. There was a large area of land beyond Charloville taken up uncle,· closer settlement, and any line to con­n:ct th~t land with a market should be a di~ect h~e. It was a Yery wrong thing to bu.Ild a !me m a roundabout fashion for no fair or h'!nest reason. It was stated that the ext<;nsi_on from \Valia! was proposed to ~1tve bndgmg; but he thought it would be much better for the Government to incur the expense of bridging and take the line str:>i~ht out from Charleville, instead of bmldmg a line which would compel people to pay more for haulage than tliey ought to be asked to pay. It must be rem<'mbered that a railway was built for all time. No doubt there was more than appeared on the surface to cause that line to hang fire as it had done. ).1cmbors were told some time ago that th., departnic·nt were unable to get nwn, but he knew that there were any

amount of men available. Some [9.30 p.m.] men engaged on railway con-

struction works out West struck for an extra 6d. per day, and he thought that anyone who knew the conditions under which men had to work in that part of the St:>te w_ould admit that lOs. a day was a fmr thmg. . In considering what wages should be paid to men <'mploved out West it should be remembered that they had t~ pay at least 50 per cent. over Brisbane prices for food supplie•, owing to the distance they h"d to be carried. The Government should in his opinion, provide stores at which th~ me'; could purchase their supplies ; they co.wd use >; closed wagon for that purpose, WI~ho_ut gomg t'! .the expense of erecting a bmldmg. He -yisited the Talwood railway works early this year, and he found that the men employed there had also to pay over 50 per cent. above Brisbane prices for their ~uppl!os, and were not always able to get supplies when they were needed. He believed that some promise was made by the Go­Ternment to remedy that state of things, but, whether a promise was made or not, he

held that the Government should make Jilt; th':'ir business to se.e tha.t men working on ratlways were supplied With stores at reason­able prices. Coming back to tho question of­the !Great \Vestern Railway, anyone looking·. at the map which had been supplied to hon_ . members would see that if the line was run , in tho direction it was proposed to run it, they would practically spoil all chance of · running a railway due west from Cunna­mulla to open up that country. If the rail­way was extended west from CunnamulJa_ and a connection was made with Burke the . bulk of tluit Western country woulcl be · brought within 80 miles of a railway, and producers would have both the Sydney and Brisbane markets at their command. \Vith, such facility for removing stock they could get rid of any surplus stock in case of a drought or partial drought. We had not had a very dry time during the past few years, but at the present time there were. young sheep and old sheep dying in that part of the country, so that they were worth only their fleeces. A railway in the direc-. tion he had indicated would serve the·· country Yery much better than the route . pwposed last year, as people using such a railway would be compelled to pay for the haulage of their produce by a roundabout. way. He would suggest that the G"vern-· mont should pull up the whole of the line·· ah·eady constructed, and start the line from Charlevil10. With regard to the manage­ment of the railways, he admitted that the· timetable for the running of trains to Cunnamulla was the best they had had· since the line was opened. The inspector · went up there, and he came to the con­clusion that the district was entitled to a· better train and mail service than it 'had. had, and decided to nm a regular passenger· train through to Cunnamulla, at the cost of: £4,000 a year. That would be a great con-. vPniPnce to the travelling public, especially long-distance travellers, and he hoped that if this passenger train was found to be a success the Commissioner would see his way clear to increase the service. The Govern­ment sent inspectors along the line to inspect tickets. in order to see that no one travelled.­on a tick0t out of date or without any ticket at all. That was a very. good thing to do,· no doubt, but he hoped that those inspector"' would look also after other things that needed attention. They should see that there· WE're plenty of water-bags on the trains. and that those bags were kept full, and' they might see that the carriages were kept · clean, and that there was plenty of soap, al'! ' well as towels, in the !a vatories. Long­distance travellers complained that the· cars were not always as clean as they ought to be, ·especially at Roma and Too.woomba­He had an ide.,. t.hat at Roma the porter" had their hands full in att.,ndin.o.· to the trains that came in, and in doing- other work, so that thev had no time to look after the· water-bao;s ;.nd lavatory requisites. The pas­s<:'ngers from Too.woomba also very frequently· complained when they got into the tra,i:a_ Ffe did not think there was sufficient con-·· sid<:'ration to railway workers generally­either permanent or temporary hands.

Tho bell indicated that the hon. member'Jt" time had expired. '

Mr. LAND (continuing): He certainly did not think thoro was too much paid ou construction work. The little strikes which-· occurred now and then, he thought, were·

Mr_ Land.l

lHJ2 ·:up,, .1J· [ASS El\1BL Y. ~ Suppl;ij.

the fault of the Gm·crnmcnt themselves. They ought to take the conditions and the climate into account. It was all very well to say 8s. a day for eight hours' work-that was right enough for inside work. He held that the Government were responsible for the strike at \Valla!, and urged that con­sideration should be gi,·cn to the necessity for b0tter accommodation for long-distance .travellers.

At 9.45 p.m., The CHAIRMAN resumed the chair. The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS

•(Hon. W. T. Paget, Mackay): As the Chair­man automatically left the chair at half­·past 10 o'clock, it was advisable that he should take the opportunity, as he did last Wed­nesday, of replying to the various queries ·that had been put to him during the course of the debate. The hon. senior member for Ipswich referred to the omission of the stores report-the list of contracts let for the year

·covered by the Commissioner's report. The -sole reason was that the late Commissioner ·decided to omit it from the report because it ·cost a considerable sum of money to prepare, and also to have it printed. He thought verv few references wew made to it. It was ·adv:isable, if possible, that a great number of sheets of returns about the employees who were dismissed or left the service in the tweh·c months should also be omitted from the report. He did not know that it served

-a very useful purpose, but the Commissioner ·-was obliged to keep it in his report under :the terms of the Railways Act. 'l'lw hou. member for Ipswich also referred to the dual engineering co.ntrol-that was, construct. tion and maintenance. He thought that ,perhaps the hon. member slightly misunder­stood the position. There had been no .ltttempt in any way to take away from the 'Chief Engineer the control of construction work and of maintenance work, but what had been done, in view of the district engi­neers having very often a large amount of loan money to spend, as well as maintenance .moneys-he was referring now to deviations ·and alterations of existing lines-it was ·thought that the three district engineers iu the South, Centre, and North might take over the supervision of these works that were being carried out with loan money, :and that were partly being done by the Maint-enance Branch. The hon. member for 'Ipswich also asked whether young men were being trained in the service to fill the pro· fessional appointments as they arose. He

·was able to say that quite a number of young men were being trained, both in the profes­

·flional branches of the service, and during the last eighteen months or two years

, quite a number of them had been drafted out to take positions in the field, thus supplying the want that was felt with regard to professional men, and they were doing

·excellent work. The hon. member for 'Gregory referred to the lengthsmcn's accom­modation in the \Vest. This was a matter that had been brought up several times.

'The hon. member referred to the fact that ·cottages were going to be built at Ma:me for a number of the workmen. That was per­fectly true. A number of cottages were to

·he built on a good portion of the land, but rent would be charged to the men occupy­ing them. The trouble had been that hith­

. E>rto the lengthsmen did not wish to pay ordinary rents for the cottages, but pre­ferred to build for their own accommoda­;tion, and under the circumstances he found

f.Mr. Land.

it was extremely difficult to do that which they wished to do. He would much rather see lengthsmen in the Central West getting decent cottages than putting up with the accommodation which hon. members sa1d that they did.

:\Ir. HARDACRE: I think the cottages should be built, and we should then charge them 5 per cPnt. on thp capital cost. I think they would be willing to pay it.

The SECRETARY FOR Rc\ILWAYS: That was all that was charged.

Mr. HARDACRE: The capital cost was put down too high.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: The rent charged by the department was 5 per cent. on the actual expenditure.

Mr. COYKE: Does that allow for deprecia­tion?

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: Surely the rental of 5 per cent., which covered the interest on the money and depre­ciation;· was an extremely low percentage to charge! (Hear, hear!)

Mr. COYNE: There would be repairs needed in ten years' tin1e.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: It was not the occupant of the cottage who made repairs-the department did that.

Mr. HARDACRE: They do not give the true capital value. That is the cause of the trouble. They put down £150, when it only cost £80, or was not worth more than £80.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: 't'he hon. member for Leichhardt was mak­ing a charge against the department, and 1f he would give a specific instance he would look into it. The hon. member said that a value of £150 was put down where only £80 was spent. If he would give him the particu­lars of that case, he would inquire into it, and if it was as he stated, he would rectify it at op.ce.

Mr. HARDACRE: I don't say that only £80 was spent on it. I say that it was estimated tJ be worth £80. I will give you the case to-morrow.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: The junior member for North Brisbane, Mr. \\'elsby, suggested that premiums should be given for inventions by men in the. service. Any employee was encouraged to g1ve sug­gestions, and if any one of them gave, ~y suggestion that was of value to the Commis­sioner or to the department, he would take care that that kind of thing was encouraged,

Mr. J. M. HuNTER: Don't you think it would be a good thing to invite it'!

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: When the hon. member was speaking he made the note "suggestion box," and perhaps they might provide a suggestion box at the Ipswich works or anywhere else, into which em­ploye~s could drop suggestions for any im­ptovements in their work or in the machines they were using, so that the Commissioner would be able to get all the information from them. The hon. member for Barcoo, in speaking about the gatekeepers getting only 5s. a week, forgot to mention that they were the wi;-es of lengthsmen, and they also re­ceived a. house and fuel and light free.

lllr. CoYNE : Some of them run post offices for which you get £12 a year from the Fed­eral Government.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: With respect to station-masters in the West,

Supplg. [27 bEPTElfBER.] 1193

Jihey did not receive any \V estern allowance, but they were graded higher, and received .higher salaries than they would if they were .on the coast.

Mr. RYAN: You want a reclassification of all 'l!tation.masters.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: The reclassification of stations was now in hand, although it had nothing· to do with th& reclassification of station-masters, and when it was completed it would materially assist sta­. tion-masters in respect of their salaries.

Mr. RYAN: What about the Western Rail. <way?

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: He had heard a great deal about the \Vestern Railway, but, as he said last \Vednesday even­.ing, it was passed by a majority of the House.

Mr. MuLLAN: And you said last year that it was passed after the fullest information had .been give!l.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: He gave hon. members the fullest information .he had in his possession at the time. At any .rate, the majority of the members of the House thought that the information was suffi­.cient as they voted for it.

iVlr. MuLLAN: You know they did not think it was sufficient.

Mr. J. M. HUNTER: :tnat side of the House.

The majority was on It was a party Bill.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: He knew it was ·made a party Bill because members on the other side voted against it as .a party Bill.

Mr. J. M. HUNTER: A lot on your side wanted to vote against it.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: \Vhat was the use of discussing matters such .as that when a majority of members of the House approved of the proposal, and not only

.approved of the proposal, but voted the money to build it? He did not pretend to possess all the information that it was possible to possess about the matter, but he presented all the in­formation that he had, and he went to a _great deal of trouble, as han. members knew, to get all the information he possibly could.

Mr. J. M. HUNTER: Was the information sufficient for the House to vote on?

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: They did vote on it. He had no reason to .present a bad case, and he must have pre­.sented a good case, as the Bill was passed. In view of the representations that had been made since tho beginning of the year, Mr. Hamilton, the hon. member for Gregory, knew very well that with respect to the route from \Vinton to Springvale, there was a surveyor in that locality surveying a route that was some­what further to the North than the 25-mile .limit allowed by the Act passed last session, because it was found out that the route marked on the plan was not the best route.

Mr. COYNE: You are violating your own :law.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: 'With res!>.ect to the line from Walla! to

Tobermory the Commi>Osioner and the Chief Engineer \~ere leaving for the \Vest on .l<'ri­day next to inquire into the further informa­tion that had been furnished to the depart­ment. With respect to the requests that had been made for a railwav from Longreach to Jundah he thought it ~auld be possible for tho Co~missioner and Chief Engineer to also Yisit the Central district and inquire into that request.

Mr. RYAN: You did not tell me that when I approached you, and you allowed me to con­vey different information to the people there .

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: The han. member for Maranoa brought up the qm ,tion of anomalies in pay on the

\V estern line, but the firem<;n. [10 p.m.] guards, drivers, and mechamcs

alwavs had higher pay than the other men. He also brought up th~ question of conveniences at sidings and statwns; but at Mungallala there was not much stock traffic at present.

Mr. J. l\I. HuNTER: How can there be when people cannot truck them?

The SECRETARY FOH. RAILWAYS: 'The department offered to erect a small yard if the owners of stock would do tho rest.

Mr. J. M. Hu:->TER: But they have not done it yet.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS : The han. member for Cairns brought up the matter of shelters for the men on the Barron Valley Range, and that would be attended to. The matter of the refreshment-room at Kuranda would be looked into. With respect to the Mareeba Station, a great number of improvements had been r:'ade thm:c from time to time. And as to h1s contentwn that the officers in Cairns should have further powers, the officers in charge at Townsville were in charge of tho who!~ of the Northern division but the officers m charge of the Cairns ;ystem had only to make their recom· mendations, which would be atten~<cd to as well as if the officers in charge ns1ted the place personally .

Mr. 'THEODORE : Is it intended to erect a new station at Mareeba?

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: Not at present, but some improvements were necessary. The han. junior member for Rock­hampton said that a young fellow wrote a letter to the Press during the Rookhampton election, and on th~ JYionday morning he was dismissed. The department were not cognisant of the matter, but if the hon. mem· bor would give the name, ho would cause inquiriP, to be ma.cL. With respect to tlw railway workshops at Rockhampton, thD present value of the shop W';LS £20,000, and there were forty-four machmee valued at £3,500. It was proposed tD spend a furth:r £30,000 in buildings and a. further £10,000 m machinery. \Vith rcspec.t to the mattm: of recreation tents he mentwnod on a provwus occasion that the Young Men's Christian Association had taken up the work which the Railwav Department had failed to carry out. success'fully; and it had been a v_ery great succesq on the Oakey to Cooyar !me. (Hear, hear!) It had been such a success that the committee of the Young Men's Christian Association were prepared to go very much further.

lion. W. T. Paget.J

119t Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

Mr. COLLINS: Why could not the State do it?

Mr. FOLEY : Why should not the Minister do it-he is a bit of a local preacher.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS sai.d he must deny the soft impeachment of bemg a local preacher-he was not good enough for that. (Laughter.) As the Young Men's Christian Association were pre­pared to take the matter up on a number of the lines untle1' construction, he had authoM rised the expenditure of £3,000 in tents and material, and he hoped members would not throw out the vote. The senior member for Maryborough, Mr. Corser, referred to the building of locomotives in the Ipswich wcrkshops, and oaid he would like further infonnation as to the privileges the men got: because he thought lower wag0e were paid at Ipswich than outside. Tho privileges of employees were these :-Annu"'l leave­\Y ages men one ""'·cpk, salaried 1ncn t"\vo weeks. Long sm·vico leave-One extra day for each year over eight in service-maxi­mum, throe weeks. Extended leave and re­tiring allowance-Fifteen years' service, three months; twenty years' service, four and a-half months; twent.Y-five years' service, six months. Passes for self, wife, and members of family dependent on him, with an annual leave, and those passes extended to. all the States. 'rhey received a privilege ticket at any time, at half fare for 100 miles, and long distances at quarter fare; season tickets at half rates; rations were carried free; practi­cally constant employment, and uniformR free in some cases. 'l'he station-masters not only had the salaries found in the regula­tions, but they were also supplied with fuel and lights, and in· some cases they received savings bank allowances amounting to £50 and £60 per annum. Gnards and drivers were allowed half pay on Sundays when they were away from home and not working. The hon. member also spoke about the cost not including the co.st of the land. The collt of the engines did not include any land charges, but all other charges were included. The cost of the Ipswich workshops was put down at £465,000. In connection with Go­vernment buildings, no insurance. was taken up by the Government.

Mr. LENNON: That would mean nearly £20,000 a year in interest.

Thf. SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: The who:e of the interest and redemption was charged in proportion. Th" scheme that was drawn up by tlFl late Deputy Commis­siont'r. :\Tr. King, was a very eial:orate one indCBd, and practically now, in the Ipswich workshops, the cost of every job was brought down to the fractional part of a shilling.

Mr. C'ORSEH: Docs it include anything for '\Yorkmen '.3 con1pensation?

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: I:-I{' p::~sunw<l sD. Fie was vrry p~cascd the R.ai:wav E~stinJa.tes hnd caine on first, as he had rf't;civ:_~d some very valuable suggestions frotn han. n1C'n1h rs. The hon. n1€'rnbcr also spoke about the C m1gincs being huilt at Maryhorough, and hD asked whether they were the same as tho:;e built .at Ipswich, and, as ho had interjected, tlwy were the same pattern. The question of the cold stores h~"d been brought up by the hon. member for South Brisbane. and also touched on by the hon. member for North Brisbane. As a

[lion. W. T.l'ngtt.

matter of fact, that was a question for· thCc Agricultural Department, but it had beell­passcd over to the Railway Department .for the reasons he had pointed out. After the question of a site for the cold stores ha-d been discussed, he had had the matter in hand when he was at the Department of Agricul­ture. and at that time he tried to get the very place that had now been decided up?n,. but he \Vas told hP. could not get possess1on of tho. shops for some time. Those. shops wore admirably suited for cold stores.

Mr. J. M. HuNTEH: You want them on th4> wharf.

The SECRETARY FOR RAIL\VAYS: A, a matter of fact, 40 per cont. of the butt~r that pa::;se· l through thE' cold stores of B:._·l5-

l>ano was not exported .at all.

:•1r. J. :\I. H C.);TEH: That will not ]p t!1<0

c'"" later on

The 8ECRETAHY FOR RAILWAY~: ·fhc proportion would practically always ''" the sam B. \Vhcn he referred to the locac trade he did not HH'::tn the immediate Brie~· bane traci<'. hut butt0r taken out of thu eoul store, and put on board the coastal boat•, anc1 it v a:l a ycry good thing indeed to have the cold store;; in as c-:-ntral a positio-n a5·

poRsibl-e--

Mr. ,J. ::\II. IIu:.:TER: You will have frui~k iJoPf, and mutton latPr on.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYB: For the rl'ason tha.t orders came very sud· .denly from the North; and if the cold store;; \V€!'0 not in a central position, those .qr.clers could not be fulfilled in time to catch· the steamers. H., would be very please(f indeed when the tinw ca!llf' when no butter would' he shipped to North Queensland, hut that ilH'Y would be exporting buttH by th.­British-India boats to the London markets. With regard to the area. if present arrange­ments were carried out, there would be roorr. enough, without any expansion under the JinEs of rail of R.oma Street Station. . At" present there was a ·line of rails and big·. stores on top of those shops.· and if presc'lt arranrr0n")cnts 1vcro carried out, there would he ,.;om for about eight tim;>s a~ tnnch. butter in that pl.ace as they had at pr<>s('nt, in the cold stores. ~h. ,T. M. II eNTER: Are you not making:

provision for anything· else besidBs butter?.

THE SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: ·when he spoke about. butter he referred to milk, cheese, and fruit. He did not think it would be at all advisable that meat should be· stored in cold stores with butter. If tho matter was thoroughly inquired into, it would be seen tha.t the proposal to make -the very bPst use of those ·shops would mean the saving of tens of thousands to the people, and it could be so arranged that when it became necessary to do away wit)l. the present cold stores they could have the stores down below fully at work, and then the refrigerating machinery at present in the cold stores could be utilised for refrigerating the balance of the room. The hon. member· for Port Curtis referred to children being allowed to go home from school on the flux trains. He found that very often there was no passenger accommodation provided on those trains,. but the matter would be recti. fied. because it was not fair that the children

Supply. [27 SEPTEMBER.] Adjournment. 1195

should be taken to school in the morning by train and not be able to get home in the same way in the afternoon. The hon. mem­ber for Gympie referred to the Gympie Railway Station. There was £5,000 on the Estimates for a station, and the plans were now in hand, and as soon as they were ready it was the intention of the department to go on with the work. \Vith regard to the alteration of the timetable to which the hon. member alluded, he presumed he referred to the change that was made with reference to the running of the morning train from Brisbane to Bundaberg and the morning train from Bundaberg to Brisbane. One reason for tho alteration was to obviate the inconvenience of having the two trains arri.-e at Gympie Station at lunch time, and it was arranf'ed that the one train should come in in ti"mo to let tho passengers have luncheon and get away again before the arri.-al of the other train. It was the desire of the Commissioner to suit the convenience of the local people as much as possible. With respect to the train that left Brisbane at five minutes past 12 o'clock, and which reached Gympic at 7 o'clock, he found the alteration with regard to the train from Bundaborg to Brisbane necessitated holding tho other train up at Beerburrum. If it was poesible to arrange the timetable so as to convenience men who came to work from Gympie in the morning-, he was quite certain it would be done. The hon. member for Balonne mentioned the question of water­bags, lavatory carriages, and the cleaning of the carriagcc. There muet be some abnor­mal reason, because the officers of the department always endeavoured to send trains out in as clean a condition as possible, a:>d thoro was absolutely no reason why water-bags should not be filled and tho lava­tory accommodation looked to. With respect to the wagee paid on the \Y alia! extension, all he could say was that the wages paid to the navvios who were sent there were 9e. a day, and the0' were the wages that they knew they would be paid before theY left tho old country.

Mr. J. M. Hl'xTER: You did not tell us what you were going to do Yith regard to the \Y oetern allmvance.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: H8 would have the matter inquired into.

:\Ir. THORN (Aubiony) considered they were wasting thousands of pounds annually by continuing the day-labour svstem of rail­way construction.

Mr. COLLINS: What rot !

Mr. THORN: They were told they were getting lines built ,a gTeat deal cheaper than if thee' had been built by contract.

Mr. COLLINS: And a lot better.

Mr. THORN: There were some men work­ing on tho railways who were worth 12s. and 14s. a day, and they were only getting 7s. 6d. and Ss. a day. There were other men who were not worth 4s. a day who were getting 7s. 6d. and Ss. a day. That was one of the effects of the day-labour system. Why should a man who was worth 12s. or 14s. a day only receive 7s. 6d. a day? They had come to what was termed the minimum wage, which meant the maximum.

Mr. O'SuLLIVAN: Why should it?

Mr. THORN: The hon. members opposite should know much better than he did why it did. They were driving all the good work­men out of this State into i\ew South \Vales, where railways wore built by contract.

Mr. J. M. HUNTER: Why don't you pay the same wages as they do in New South Wales?

Mr. THORN: There were men who were quite able to shift their 10 m 12 yards of muck a day on the railways, but they were not allowed to do it, and they were not likely to do it when men working alongside them, who were not able to shift 3 yards of 1nuck a day, yyere r.cceiving the san1e .. wage. Seeing that their J;ailways were being built on the guarantee principle, the people in the districts through which the railways ran were haYing to pay for that kind of thing.

An OPPOSITION MEMBER: I don't see why the country should not pay for it.

Mr. THORN: If the country had to pay for it, the hon. member would pay very little of the taxation necc3sary. (Laughter.) The country was crying out against the day­labour system. Good honest working men who were worth 12s. and 14s. a day were only receiving 7s. 6d. and 8s. a day.

Mr. COLLINS: What do contractors give them? Six shillings a day.

Mr. J. M. Hl'KTER: As little as they can.

Mr. THORN: A contractor would give them what they were worth and nothing more. If they were only worth 7s. 6d. a day they would get it. It was a nry sore question with hon. members opposite. If the system was not altered Queensland was going to get into a very bad state. One other little grievance that he wished to bring under the notice of the department vtu s the delay in supplying trucks. The Minister and the Commissioner had done their best, but the Government which had been supported by the Labour party had not built trucks to carry away produue. \Vh' cl tho members of the Labour party wore sitting behind a Go­vernment, why did they not rectify those matters? They now blamed the present Government, but for three or four years they had the opportunih- of doing some good to tho railwav service and yet they did not get trucks built.

At 10.30 p.m.,

The CHAIRMAN said: Under Standing Order No. 306, I must now leave the chair and make my report to the House.

Tho House resumed. The CHAIRMAN re­ported progress, and the Committee obtained leave to sit again to-n1o1TO\V,

.WJOURNMENT.

The PREMIER: I move that the House do now adjourn. Tho business to-morrow will be the continuation of the Committee stage of the State Children Bill.

Question put and passed.

The House adjourned at twenty-nine minutes to 11 o'clock.

Han. D. F. Denham.]