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MINUTES BIBB COUNTY BOARD OF COMMISSIONERS

February 25, 2003

The regular meeting of the Bibb County Board of Commissioners was held in the Commission Boardroom on Tuesday, February 25, 2003 at 6:00 p.m. Members present: Chairman Tommy C. Olmstead, Commissioner Samuel F. Hart, Sr., Commissioner Bert Bivins, III, Commissioner Charles W. Bishop and Commissioner Elmo A. Richardson, Jr. Staff present: Mr. Virgil L. Adams, County Attorney; Mr. Bill Johnston, Director of Buildings & Properties; Mr. Sam Kitchens, Assistant Director of Buildings & Properties; Mr. Ken Sheets, Interim County Engineer; Mr. Tommy Brown, Director of Human Resources; Mr. Bill Vaughn, Director of Support Services; Ms. Deborah Martin, Interim Finance Director; Mr. Barry Smallwood, Purchasing Agent; Mr. Tony Rousey, Director of Information and Technology Services; Don Hock, Director of Lake Tobesofkee; Mrs. Barbara Wood, Public Affairs; and Mrs. Rhonda Scott, filling in for the Clerk of the Board. News Media present: Mr. Travis Fain from The Macon Telegraph; WMAZ; Fox 24 Chairman Olmstead recognized Reverend James Bumpus, Pastor, Tremont Temple Baptist Church, for the PRAYER FOR THE DAY. Chairman Olmstead asked everyone to stand for the recitation of the Pledge of Allegiance. ANNOUNCEMENTS Chairman Olmstead read a Resolution in memory of the late County Commissioner Earl Zimmerman, Jr., and asked everyone to stand for a moment of silence. APPROVAL OF MINUTES On motion of Commissioner Richardson, seconded by Commissioner Hart and carried, the Minutes of the regular meeting of February 11, 2003 were approved as written. Chairman stated he wasn’t going to hold the hearing for all the people who were talking about the I-16/I-75 Interchange until he finished the items on the Agenda and would introduce the guests and acknowledge the guests who wished to speak.

RECOGNITION OF VISITORS Chairman Olmstead recognized Ms. Amy Pierce, who has been chosen as one of Georgia’s top two youth volunteers for outstanding community service.

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Ms. Amy Pierce: “I guess I just want to share my own reasons to volunteer. You don’t have to be especially good at anything or have anything really different that you are able to do. Really, it is just a matter of giving of yourself and giving of your time. And for me, it was just a matter of fun to work. Even though the Blind Academy was across the street from my house and I realized there was a need and decided to step out and help the kids there. I have been blessed more than I ever thought.”

BOARD AGENDA (Mrs. Rhonda Scott, filling in for Mrs. Shelia Thurmond, Clerk of the Board) REFERRALS: The following items were referred to the ENGINEERING/PUBLIC WORKS COMMITTEE: 1. Correspondence from Gerald M. Ross, P.E., State Road & Airport Design Engineer,

Department of Transportation, respecting Lighting Agreement for I-75/Arkwright Road Interchange & Portion of I-75.

2. Correspondence from Mr. Gerald M. Ross, P.E., State Road & Airport Design Engineer,

Department of Transportation, respecting Lighting Agreement for I-16 from Coliseum Drive to SR 87.

3. Petition from Felicer Lewis for the paving of Frederick Drive in Bibb County. 4. Petition from Shirley Smith Realty for the paving of Seville Avenue in Bibb County. 5. Correspondence from Michael Y. Windom and David E. Sentell requesting an official

closing of a platted Cul-De-Sac located on St. Andrews Road. 6. Ordinance of the Board of Commissioners establishing and constituting Nowell Estates as

Street Light District 5026. RECORD & INFORMATION: - No Report.

ACTION:

1. Ratification of Resolution presented to Dr. Josephine D. Davis during the annual Black

History Program of The Ozzie B.

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McKay Federated Girls Club on February 16th.

On motion of Commissioner Hart, seconded by Commissioner Bivins and carried, the before mentioned Resolution was ratified.

2. Authorization for Chairman Olmstead to sign Contract between the Department of Human Resources, Division of Mental Health, Developmental Disabilities and Addictive Diseases and Bibb County respecting the development and operation of a 30-bed residential substance abuse treatment facility to provide ongoing services for individuals with addictive diseases.

On motion of Commissioner Bivins, seconded by Commissioner Bishop and carried, the before mentioned recommendation was approved.

3. Ratification of New 2003 Alcoholic Beverage License for the following establishments: Houston Spirits & Tobacco - 5615 Houston Rd. Marathon Mart # 4 - 5950 Hawkinsville Rd. Shoki Japanese Steak House - 3850 Riverside Dr. Ocmulgee Fields Inc. d/b/a Hawthorne Inn & Suites - 107 Holiday North Dr.

On motion of Commissioner Richardson and seconded by Commissioner Hart and carried, the before mentioned recommendation was ratified.

COMMITTEE REPORTS: Chairman Olmstead stated he was going to move on to Committee Reports because of the business at hand. FINANCE, TAX AND REVENUE COMMITTEE - Committee Chairman Hart reported the following: 1. The Committee recommends approval of the purchase of a ½ ton 4wd 4 door truck for Bibb

County Engineering Department in the amount of $19,434.00.

The Committee further recommends that the Purchasing Agent be authorized to piggyback from the previous bid awarded to Riverside Ford on December 10, 2002.

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On motion of Commissioner Hart and carried, the before mentioned recommendation was approved as presented.

2. The Committee recommends that Chairman be authorized to approve the leasehold ad

valorem taxation schedule proposed by the Macon-Bibb County Industrial Authority in conjunction with the Tax Assessors’ Office for the Cohen Financial LP project to be located in the Airport East Industrial Park, Hawkinsville Road/Highway 247.

On motion of Commissioner Hart and carried, the before mentioned recommendation was approved as presented.

3. The Committee recommends that the proposal covering repairs to the Courthouse Annex Elevator be awarded to Montgomery Kone in the amount of $66,690.00. On motion of Commissioner Hart and carried, the before mentioned recommendation was approved as presented.

4. The Committee recommends award be made to Milner Records Management Solutions in

the amount $44,014.17 covering the Sole Source procurement of Microfilm Reader Printer equipment and accessories.

On motion of Commissioner Hart and carried, the before mentioned recommendation was approved as presented.

5. FOR THE RECORD: Monthly report on the Bibb County Purchasing Card was received. RISK MANAGEMENT COMMITTEE - No Report. ENGINEERING/PUBLIC WORKS COMMITTEE - Committee Chairman Bishop reported the following: 1. The Committee recommends approval of the request of Ted Baker, American Real Estate

Investment Company, Ltd. that a lot identified as “Common Area #1" in Summit Ridge Subdivision, Phase 2, be exempt from charges for street lights until further development of the subdivision.

Comm. Bivins: Did Engineering mention whether there is a precedent for these exclusions? Comm. Bishop: I don’t remember the circumstances of it Bert, but from what I understand, it

was a recommendation that these type street lights are exempt. Comm. Bivins: From Engineering?

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Comm. Bishop: From Engineering.

On motion of Commissioner Bishop and carried, the before mentioned recommendation was approved as presented.

2. The Committee recommends approval of Budget Modification No. 14 for the Macon-Bibb

County Road Improvement Program. On motion of Commissioner Bishop and carried, the before mentioned recommendation was approved as presented.

3. The Committee reports that the County Engineer has signed Work Authorizations on the following Road Improvement Program Projects:

Hofstadter & Asso, WA#247, Bloomfield Road/Log Cabin Dr, RIP# 13 (additional for r/w revisions) Claxton Architects, WA#265, Mulberry St @ Second St, RIP # 57-00 (plans & construction admin)

Cunningham & Co, WA#266, Tucker Road, RIP #23 (additional for r/w plans) Arcadis, Geraghty, WA#267, Houston Road, RIP#45 (additional for final plans) Moreland Altobelli, WA#459, Log Cabin Dr, RIP#12 (additional for plan review & proj mgmt)

WA#460, Ingleside Ave, RIP#34 (additional for const eng) WA#461, Intersection Improvements, RIP#57 (additional for const eng) WA#462, Millerfield RD, RIP#54B (additional for final plan review & contract) WA#463, Intown Historic Dist Sidewalks (additional for const eng)

TOBESOFKEE COMMITTEE - No Report. PUBLIC SAFETY COMMITTEE - No Report. HUMAN RESOURCES AND INFORMATION SERVICES COMMITTEE - Committee Chairman Bivins reported the following: 1. The Committee recommends the approval of the reclassification of Mary Jo Powell from

Grade/Step C28-6 to Grade/Step C29-7, effective 1/1/03. Ms. Powell’s former position (Chief Deputy Clerk) will not be filled

On motion of Commissioner Bivins and carried, the before mentioned recommendation was approved as presented.

2. The Committee recommends the reappointment of Mr. Chris Sheridan to the Macon-Bibb

County Urban Development Authority for a four-year term.

On motion of Commissioner Bivins and carried, the before mentioned recommendation was approved as presented.

3. The Committee recommends that County Commission Voting Districts be redrawn in

accordance with the attached voting map and that the same be submitted to the State Senate for approval.

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On motion of Commissioner Bivins and carried, the before mentioned recommendation was approved as presented.

4. The Committee approved that the Tax Assessors’ Board should be comprised of a total of

five (5) board members, which will reflect the four (4) districts and one (1) board member at large. Also, the terms of the board members should be staggered.

Further, the Committee authorized the County Attorney to amend the ordinance to reflect the changes.

On motion of Commissioner Bivins and carried, the before mentioned recommendation was approved as presented.

LICENSE & TAX COMMITTEE - Committee Chairman Richardson reported the following:

The Committee recommends that the request of Mr. Robert Burnham of 369 Hines Terrace that the County waive the tax Fi Fa, penalty and interest on his tax bill be respectfully denied due to the fact that the problem resulted from a mis-communication between Mr. Burnham and his mortgage company. On motion of Commissioner Richardson and carried, the before mentioned recommendation was approved as presented.

PROPERTIES COMMITTEE - Committee Chairman Richardson reported the following:

The Committee accepts the recommendation of RDC that it submit a proposal for a Georgia Historic Resources Survey grant to provide a comprehensive survey of the historic properties in the unincorporated Bibb County. The total amount of the grant is $16,000.00 and the County will provide a 40% match of $6,400.00.

On motion of Commissioner Richardson and carried, the before mentioned recommendation was approved as presented.

ORDINANCES, RESOLUTIONS & LEGISLATIVE COMMITTEE - No Report. Comm. Bishop: Chairman, we were suppose to have a Committee Back coming out of Human

Resources tonight on the proposal to send the map back for redistricting; It was voted to come out tonight.

Chairman Olmstead: That’s correct; Yes.

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Tommy Brown: Apparently, it didn’t get on there. Chairman Olmstead: Let’s see if we can find it. Comm. Bishop: If necessary we could go ahead and just make the motion as a Committee of

the Whole and have it come out as a motion. Chairman Olmstead: Tommy has gone to see what happened to it. I don’t know myself, but there

was two of them. You had one, and I think Comm. Richardson had one. It will take just a minute. In the meantime, I am going ahead and recognize some visitors who said they did not want to speak. I will do that and then I will call on the ones that wanted to speak as we get to them. .

After calling out some of the names, Chairman welcomed each one of them; I am just going to do that as they come on board; We haven’t heard from Mr. Brown yet. Well, let’s go ahead with this, I don’t want to hold up too much so we will get started and I may want to cut in so we can get this one, two Motions passed but with that said in advance, we will move right on.

Comm. Bishop: Chairman, it might rush matters up; I am prepared to make the Motion in an

open meeting again and let it be voted up or down, since, we didn’t get it out of Committee.

Chairman Olmstead: Okay. Virgil Adams: Call for a vote to discuss it and put it on this agenda cause it’s really not on

there. Comm. Bishop: It should have come out of Committee. Chairman Olmstead: He’s looking for it; We can get it now or we can do it your way. Whatever

you would like to do. Comm. Bishop: Then it will be in the Minutes of the Meeting. Chairman Olmstead: Why don’t we go on with them, we’ll break in as I said when he comes up

with it. We will get it before the meeting is over. Comm. Bishop: I just wonder if it is going to be written up. Chairman Olmstead: It’s two of them. Comm. Bishop: I don’t have a problem.

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Chairman Olmstead: We have Commissioner Richardson; He’s coming, let’s just wait. Let’s go ahead. The first person I want to call is Victor Jones. Vic, let me just say this. We lost Mr. Z today and your father served with him, all of the 16, most of the 16 years that they served together and I remember them sitting around this table up here for it. Just seeing you, just brought back memories of both of these people that’s gone forward. We are allowing 5 minutes on this so I am going to tell you that so that if you see me getting itchy you know it’s getting close to 5 minutes. If you see me kinda stand up and get a gag out, no I’m just kidding. Let’s get started and take your 5 minutes.

Victor Jones: I signed up so that I could yield my time for others if that is permissible? Chairman Olmstead: Well, it’s not but we’ll work it out. Alright.

Johnnie Mae Dawkins--- I left you out and I had you over here with the people that wanted to say something and you don’t.

Ms. Dawkins: No. Chairman Olmstead: We talked about you today, about all those pictures of Kings Park that we

had and hope that something can be done.

Now I have several of these that said no and I’m sorry. Bobby Gibbs, Jr., you don’t want to say anything?

Bobby Gibbs, Jr.: No, I wouldn’t at this time. You know I always have something to say. Chairman Olmstead: Oh yeah, that’s what I said. Alright, Kent Baldschun, where is Kent

Baldschun? You did put no didn’t you Ken?

Kent Baldschun: Yes, Mr. Chairman. Chairman Olmstead: Welcome.

Alright, Lillie Ambrose, North Highlands Association. No. Thank you for coming.

Some folks came in while I was talking. Jim Haskins, North Avenue, Clifford Johnson, Kingston Court. Clifford, you have been here before, haven’t you? Ron Richards, 953 Curry Place. I use to live on Curry Place, Ron.

Ron Richards: I know, you lived right across the street.

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Chairman Olmstead: Rick Hutto. Rick wants to talk. Okay, why does that not surprise me? Come on Rick.

Rick Hutto: Thank you, Mr. Chairman, Commissioners, I will be brief. Sorry that we

aren’t able to sort of share the slides or presentations with you but there are too many people so that is very understandable. Just two comments.

Chairman Olmstead: I did say that if some of the Commissioners wanted to see it that we would allow him to show it after the conclusion of the meeting.

Rick Hutto: I appreciate that, thank you sir. The two comments, one has to do with the

process and one has to do with the project itself. The process of course, Mr. Palladi has said over, over and over has been the most inclusive one ever and that they have had the members of the neighborhoods participate. That’s just not true and saying it over and over is not going to make it true. Almost three years ago we pushed to have a member of our neighborhood appointed to the Citizens Advisory Committee. He finally was added and in that length of time almost three years he’s never once been invited to or included in a meeting. We also after having a chance to study the proposal that was given to us we requested repeatedly with G-Dot to meet with us, they repeatedly refused to do so. It was only when a member of the Federal Hwy. Administration agreed to meet with us that G- Dot suddenly changed their mind and said they would come and meet with us and at that meeting told us repeatedly that it was too late, there was nothing we could do and that they knew best. We also were told by one of the people who was in the Citizens Advisory Committee who’s here tonight and who I think sent an e-mail to all of you today that anytime they tried to bring up a proposal that was outside of G-Dot’s guidelines they were told that was not included and was not appropriate. They were also not given a chance to meet again and give their reactions to the plans once they had been able to look at them and study them. So, I think that’s far removed from being an inclusive process. There’s also been a claim made that we are just a victim of the old process of not in my back yard. I won’t see this interchange from my house on Jackson Springs. I will certainly hear it, but I won’t see it, so it’s not a question of nimby with me. There’s certainly people here who will be looking directly at it straight out of their front windows and out of their front doors. However, I am on the Board of the Hay House, on the Board of the Rose Hill Cemetery Foundation, and both of those will certainly be affected by this. The fact that you’ve got Rose Hill, you’ve got Riverside Cemetery, you’ve got Linwood Cemetery with our only Congressional Medal of Honor winner in it. All of those are going to be looking directly at this huge, huge project. I do not in any way want to stop this project, but I just want it to be scaled down in scope and size. I see no reason why G-Dot will not at least listen to other alternatives even when they met with the City Council at a work session. Even before hearing one person testify at that particular hearing, Mr. Palladi

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said that they would not be changed. That was before anyone was able to even say anything and at the end of the evening he said it again. We just find it difficult to understand if we are the ones who are going to be affected by this that we are not able to have any input in it. Finally, yesterday at Rotary I happened to sit with Dr. Bob Maddox who mentioned to me and I didn’t know it, that his daughter was actually killed at that interchange. There’s not much you can say to that. I sort of sat in stunned silence and then he said to me, it is dangerous, it’s needed to be fixed, but not this way. He said it’s over kill, it’s excessive and it does not need to be this large. I find it impossible to understand how those who are most affected by it have not been allowed to have any say in it and as I said G-Dot, the fact that they say over and over we have been included does not make it true. Thank you sir.

Chairman Olmstead: Thank you.

Tom Scholl. Tom Scholl: Mr. Chairman, thank you. I did ask to speak last in case, so I that wouldn’t

take time if I’m just going to repeat. But one thing I would like to point out to all that the solution for all of this road problems and program as it is going to continue, I think would be found in Walter Kulash. He was your man who could bring you a different viewpoint. He was a man who could bring you the trust. The community did trust him. Even if the community didn’t necessarily like what he was saying, they would go along with it, if it came from Walter Kulash. I think if you want to hear a very informed, nationally renowned opinion on do we have another alternative on I-16/I-75 for instance. I think all you have to do is turn to Walter Kulash. You don’t have to do what he says but he can at least give you an opinion and it would be a valuable one for you to hear. You say the word and we’ll bring him back. We’ll get him back here. Thank you.

Chairman Olmstead: I’m sorry, I overlooked two more. Danny Jones and Susan Baldschun,

welcome. I just got yours. I’m getting one at a time. We’ll have this thing together before it’s over.

Mr. James H. Webb, Oakcliff Road.

James H. Webb: Mr. Olmstead, how are you? Chairman Olmstead: I’m doing fine. I have done better. James H. Webb: I don’t know if what was quoted in the paper by you was what you actually

said but I have known you the thirty years I have been in Macon. I have always had a lot of respect for you. This is not in anyone’s back yard. It’s in

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Macon’s first yard. It’s what everybody coming to Macon is going to see and if you put this monstrosity of concrete barrier right where everyone will see it, you will block the view into Macon, you will create a very un-welcoming, unfortunate, unnecessary overbuilt thing that doesn’t need to be done. What you need to do is, you need to join with the City Council. Now one of the City Councilmen told me that if they said it was night outside that yall would say it was day. I hope that’s not the case.

Chairman Olmstead: Just consider the source. James H. Webb: What needs to be done is, it needs to be gone back to different designers.

People who can think outside the box. People who are not just interested in making something as big and as pretentious and as important and as expensive as they can possibly make it because that’s what we are getting. You need to take it back and you need to go to different designers who can understand that there are ways to compromise on things and ways to move traffic safely without building a monstrosity that the people of this community are going to have to live with and put up with and see on a daily basis. That’s what I have to say.

Chairman Olmstead: Thank you. Nettie Thomas just walked in. Welcome.

Walt Austin. Walt Austin: Mr. Chairman and members of the Committee, thank you for giving me an

opportunity to speak. When Mr. Palladi came he inferred that one of the motivations behind this exchange or this interchange improvement was to improve the safety. I have looked on the Moreland-Altobelli website and it’s site says the primary objective of the project is to improve operational efficiency of each of these interchanges. It is not listed as a primarily safety. There is a professor from the University of Michigan who resurrected Japan after the war, Edwards Demming and he said that without data you’re just another person with an opinion. I went to the Macon-Bibb County Traffic Center and I got the accident data on there and that the accident data at this interchange indicates that this is the most dangerous interchange in Bibb County. The Federal Hwy. Administration says you have to look at injury data and that this is the 5th most dangerous interchange on the interstates going through Macon either I-16 or I-75. So I think that it is totally felonious to say that this is going be a safety measure. In fact almost 60% of the accidents which take place at this intersection are rear-end collisions. Rear-end collisions according to the Federal Hwy. & Safety Administration are caused primarily by excessive speed and significantly by a lack of law enforcement. I think that this falls to the Mayor of Macon and to the County Commission to get the automobiles and trucks slow down out there. That

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would probably solve a significant amount of the problem without engaging in building this large over-change. In fact the interchange itself, it ranks very, very low in terms of accidents relative to other intersections on the I-75/I-16 corridor. I have prepared in fact for you and I will distribute to each of you if I may, data which was taken from the Traffic Commission or from the Traffic Center and you’ll see this is not one of the high accident areas of Macon. In total, it is on each of them, but there are certainly other solutions that will be more effective and law enforcement is the first one that until we try that it is foolish to spend $200 million dollars of the taxpayers’ money. Thank you.

Chairman Olmstead: Lindsey Holliday. You want to talk on the Levy? Lindsey Holliday: It’s a related issue. I am going to put this display board up. This is on the

Internet for six months I told yall about it. This is the 16 to 80 solution, beginning of the solution. It doesn’t solve all the intersection problems yet but this is a broad overview. It solves actually 50% of it right now. What you have got here is the river, the levy is the red thing and I-16 is here. Macon floods because the DOT put this I-16 right on the other side of the levy. It’s a bigger levy than the Macon levy and that is why it breaks. What we have is the Fall Line. That is something the engineers in here are going to understand this immediately. This is household that goes under your sink and this is the feeder tube to the same sink. Same amount of water goes through this pipe as this pipe. What’s the difference? Engineering knows right off the bat. Yall understand, water pressure is real high here, real low here. That’s what happens at the Fall Line. At the Fall Line from here north is white water, the river is a narrow channel, deep gorges, rocks, fast water. At Macon the steam boats can come up here and that’s when Macon was a port city. There were no falls from here to the ocean. It’s a broad, slow river, like a big pipe. The same amount of water. The problem is that the engineers who wanted to flow this thing through here. They put this size pipe in the drain. They cramped this thing down. The river broadens out. You see all the green stuff, that’s how the big the river gets when its floods. For millions of millions of years, that’s how big it’s going to get, no matter what you build in here. That’s the problem with this interchange up here, you put more stuff in the river, an already constricted river. It’s like throwing hair and toothpicks down this drain. So what you have got to do is narrow from here, it’s got to get broad, this solves that. This also solves a lot of cultural and heritage problems. It begins to solve this problem because it takes an awful lot of people that coming through I-16 and are velocities, speeding and they hit this thing and all of sudden they are faced with local traffic. People coming from Atlanta aren’t shooting for Savannah, because they would come down to here and pick up the Fall Line Freeway, I-16. So this solves an awful lot of problems for yall. And you can call it thinking

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outside the box, it’s not segmenting the problems of what DOT has done. They have looked at this little problem, they think they have solved it, they look at this little problem, they think they have solved it but what they have done, is when they have solved this, they screwed up something over here. You see. You look at these three projects all together and you do something different and it solves them all. This solves the levy and unfortunately, I’ve heard that yall think the levy, you throw it back in the city because you think the levy is in the city, you think it’s their problem. Well, this building is in the city too. This is your problem. You need to help solve the levy. This is a solution. This works.

Chairman Olmstead: Are you going to help us get the Fall Line Freeway from over to I-16? Lindsey Holliday: Yes, that will work. Chairman Olmstead: Good, I am glad. Can I quote you saying that you support the Fall Line

Freeway? Lindsey Holliday: To I-16? Chairman Olmstead: Yes. Lindsey Holliday: Not what you are thinking. Because what you are talking about is putting

I-16 over here and intersecting right there. Chairman Olmstead: I don’t know where it intersects? Lindsey Holliday: That’s exactly it. And what that does is put an enormous intersection right

in. This is the weak part, this is the part that is already constricted. What you are talking about is putting another enormous clog of grease and dirt in that already constricted area. Do you understand that?

Chairman Olmstead: Not really, but I’ll get my engineer fellow commissioner to explain it to me.

I’m sure he knows what you are talking about. I don’t specialize in road building.

Comm. Richardson: I don’t deal in dentistry either. Lindsey Holliday: That’s why I brought this here. Everybody has little pipes in their house with

a high pressure water. They have a big pipe going out with the low pressure water. That’s what you got to understand about Macon, because that’s where you live. You don’t live in Jackson, where it’s all high pressure. You don’t live in Savannah where it’s all low pressure. Atlanta is all high pressure water. You live on the Fall Line.

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Chairman Olmstead: Thank you. I think your time is about up and we appreciate the lecture. Lindsey Holliday: Some people are really unable to understand it. Chairman Olmstead: Thank you.

Dan Fischer. Dan Fischer: Thank you very much. I sent my comments earlier, I won’t repeat all that. Chairman Olmstead: I passed them around. Dan Fischer: Thank you very much. I was a member of the Citizens Advisory Committee

appointed by the Department of Transportation for the I-16/I-75 intersection and I can tell you that our last meeting was September the year 2000. We never had an opportunity to meet and react to some of the citizen concerns that came during the public hearings, although most of us attended the public hearing. And basically, the committee picked from alternatives provided by the engineers and we didn’t have the expertise, I’m ashamed to say to come up with some of the more innovative solutions that I have seen since. We never had a chance to meet on the Passoneau recommendations, where it narrowed it dramatically but still addressed all the problems. The possibility of making some modifications on Spring Street which was the cause of the biggest merging problems and the merging was the biggest concern DOT had and that was why they were proposing adding additional lanes just for acceleration, deceleration, just to avoid some of the merging. But it did restrict some of the flexibility of turning movements.

Chairman Olmstead: Wasn’t his main issue, because he was paid by Intown Macon, to work out

where the railroad could go across the river and go down the river? Wasn’t that why he was here?

Dan Fischer: That was absolutely a part of why he was commissioned but the interesting

thing is whether or not you move the railroads, his ideas added more options that were viable, with or without moving the railroad. But I think the critical thing is that better ideas have come up that reduce the scale and the visual and sound impact and probably create a safer roadway. There’s definitely a safety problem when you have 11 or 12 lanes. Anyone who has driven around 285 in Atlanta knows that the scale of the road has its own affect on driver behavior and on safety. I think ideas have hit that we never were privy to and that are better and more eloquent solutions and it would be well worthwhile to ask DOT to at least sit down and consider them. I speak for myself as a committee member but I know other members of the CAC were

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equally as considered by the shear volume in scale of the project. We just didn’t have a better solution. I think better solutions have come up now and should be considered. We save a lot of money for spending a little extra time and we sure help the City of Macon, the County of Bibb if we don’t create a monstrosity that we have to live with for the next 100 years. Thank you very much.

Chairman Olmstead: Thank you. I have Amanda and James Upshaw. Do both of you want to

speak? James Upshaw: I just want to say thank you very much Chairman for meeting with us and

Commissioners. I just want to sound very briefly and tell you why we are here and tell you what we want and you have heard a lot of the concerns. I think you have a general feel for what we are concerned about. We have met and naturally our first instinct was to meet with Ga. DOT and when we heard about this project being undertaken we went to the citizens meetings and expressed our concerns. Well, we tried to gather information and learn about the project and over the course of several meetings that were scheduled by the DOT we became alarmed at certain aspects of the project. Although again, we were only speaking in generalities because we really didn’t know a lot of the specifics. So about a year ago we requested the actual plans to the project and they gave those to us and after reviewing those with engineers we learned to understand exactly what was planned and that’s when we became alarmed. Some of the aspects about it, the monumental scale of the project and I know that we keep making references or people have made reference to the spaghetti junction or the Tom Moreland Interchange up in Atlanta and it’s just easier for us to understand something that’s already there. It’s true, it’s not quite the same as that interchange. The difference in that interchange is that it’s an intersection as opposed to just a T shape what we have here at 16/75. It’s admittedly 4 bridges less than that intersection, however it’s seven which is quite a large number. One of those bridges is, this is of course all from the plan, I’m not just creating a story, is going to be 45 feet higher than what is there now, 4 ½ stories higher, which is a total of about 70 feet above the Ocmulgee River which is pretty substantial. But we asked for at all these meetings with DOT is consideration for alternatives, something less large. When the road coalesces beneath that intersection it will be approximately 15 lanes wide. Actually, all of this is in our presentation the Power Point which I had hoped to do here for all the group to see but maybe some of the Commissioners can stay afterwards and we can show them that then. It will actually address the actual numbers so you can see it is quite a substantial spread of asphalt and steel. What we had asked them to do is to consider alternatives that would be more sensitive to the neighborhoods and to the areas. Although when one thinks about it, it’s all of Macon, I mean this thing is pretty big. There’s not that many 7 story structures in Macon, so

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this is a fairly large piece of property, that was just a dead-end, there was no hope. We met, we talked and it became very clear, that there was no compromise. There will be no compromise as best we can tell and this project will go through, it will be built. So our next step was to turn to some of our representatives including yourselves, the City Council, State Representatives and anyone that would speak with us and that’s sort of why we are here today and obviously we all don’t think the same and we all have different opinions but we ask that you all would keep an open mind with what we are saying here ht. Obviously there is a lot of people here that really care that are invested in Macon, want to stay in Macon, and want to live their lives and raise their families here and these folks are here talking to you and telling you that and I hope that is of significance. At any rate, I won’t go in all the specifics because I think one of the other speakers can give you more of that and when we do the presentation I think you will see that as well. I think I have probably used up my time.

Chairman Olmstead: Thank you. Well, I’m sure the next speaker can take up where you left off, if

not so.

Samuel P. Jones. Welcome. Samuel P. Jones: Thank you Mr. Chairman and Commissioners. Thank you for allowing us to

come here today. I’m here to say that for myself and my family and the people in my neighborhood, we believe that something needs to be done at the I-75/I-16 Interchange in terms of safety and efficiency. However, we believe that the proposal as presented is over-kill, it’s too much, too high, too noisy, too wide, it’s too much. I think this thing has been railroaded by this state’s 800 pound gorilla. The Georgia Dept. of Transportation is more powerful than any other entity in this state. It’s more powerful than Macon City Council or the Bibb County Commissioners and probably the Governor or maybe even the Legislature, but it’s more powerful than anything else in the whole world. Now, let me stop here a minute and tell you that there have been a lot of things in the press and comments made off the record about engineers know more than everybody else and all you other people go home. Well, I’m an engineer by education and unlike Commissioner Richardson, I’d probably starve to death today if I had to make a living at it. But I was an engineer for 17 years in a prior career and I dealt daily with the G-DOT and I know the mentality of that group of engineers. It’s a bureaucracy, they are myopic, they are focused on how to spend money the fastest. Engineers by a definition are looking for the most efficient way to do something at the least cost. Now, in recent years, environmental concerns have come up. That was not so much the case 30 or 40 years ago but environmental concerns are very big now. But we seem to be more concerned about the snail darter or the owl than we are about this community and the people that live in it and

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the impact that this interchange is going to have on that community. Now I grew up in Macon as many of you did and I have seen a lot of changes in this community as many of you have and I am elated about the apparent and evident revitalization of the downtown Macon. If you come into downtown Macon on a Thursday, Friday or Saturday night you can’t find a parking place and half of the cars in those parking places are from outside Bibb County. They come down here to patronize the good restaurants we have and I think downtown Macon has a bright future but we need to get ways to get people in to Macon as a destination and what is being proposed out here is a way to get people through Macon as fast as they can and it’s going to be a self-fulfilling prophecy because they built it on some 25 or 50 year time line and I don’t know what that is, but we heard more acronyms and more arcane methods of measuring things from Mr. Palladi at City Council Chambers a few weeks ago, everybody’s eyes were rolling back in their heads. But we need something not that’s going to be a self-fulfilling prophecy because if you put 18 lanes here you are going to have that many more people traveling down those lanes. Look at Atlanta, that’s what happened since 1996. The more they expand, the more cars get in there and the faster they go. We need to be looking and I’m not saying it’s your fault but it’s a problem in this community. We need to be looking at ways to get traffic that’s not bound for Macon around Macon. And we need to make it easy for people who are coming to Macon to get here safely. And we need to make it easy for people who live here to travel from one side of the County to the other safely and what’s being proposed out here does not accomplish that. It has an adverse impact on my neighborhood but I submit that it has a much larger adverse impact on this community and what we are trying to do in it. Thank you.

Chairman Olmstead: Thank you.

Lee Martin. Lee Martin: Mr. Chairman, could I award my 5 minutes to Ms. Hanberry when her time

comes up, she’s far more engaging and eloquent that I am. Otherwise, I will give my 5 minutes but I would rather give it to someone else.

Chairman Olmstead: If I give you an extra 5 minutes, I got to give Vic. He wants to hand his 5

minutes to somebody, so we said 5 minutes a person. Lee Martin: That’s fine. No problem. Chairman Olmstead: Susan Hanberry. Susan Hanberry: Good evening, thank you. What you said was wonderful. Thank you. In

today’s newspaper, Mr. Olmstead was quoted as praising G-DOT’s

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__________at designing transportation systems and I beg to disagree. If they were so good at doing what they do, they never would have built such a flawed interchange to begin with. They would have done it right from the get go. They may be able to lay asphalt but their planning is terrible and this is not just my opinion. We’ve had lots of outside consulting firms to come in for all kinds of different projects and I attend many road meetings. These are firms with national prominence and they have all criticized G-DOT’s work here in Bibb County. In particular, the scope and the intrusiveness of the designs. I also read lots of books and journals on urban planning, it’s become sort of a hobby of mine. In Georgia DOT and these publications is held up as a national example of how not to plan and design transportation systems. Atlanta is a mess and G-DOT is determined to put us in the same place. In your quotes today Mr. Olmstead you also referred to the citizens as “NIMBY”, as not in my back yards and you use this term as a __________________ term and that’s never made any sense to me. Why do we do that? Who better to decide what should happen in our community but the people who live here. All vital communities as Reverend Bumpus explained in his opening prayer should work together to promote quality of life and I can’t agree more. Vital communities have involved citizens. This commission should welcome their involved citizens and not call them names ‘nimby’. If not us, then who? Some bureaucrat from Atlanta, Joe Palladi. We know best how our community should grow. The citizens in this community have plenty of common sense. Engineers construct roads but the plans should come from the community. This is not a Shirley Hills issue, I don’t live in Shirley Hills. I’m not going to be affected by this one-iota. This is a Bibb County issue. Joe Palladi and G.-DOT don’t care how our community grows or is in the case of Bibb County in the last 20 years not grow. He doesn’t care how this project will split our community, he doesn’t care what’s going to happen to downtown, he doesn’t care how this is going to damage the revitalization efforts in east Bibb County. We care, and you should care and you should listen to the community that you represent. The intersection needs work, no one denies that, but this fix is not the right one. Please listen to the people here, we can change the course of the 800 pound gorilla with some political will, federal highway administration. Well, tell them to do some more work and to look around and find a better solution. Thank you.

Chairman Olmstead: Mary Kay and Terry McCullough: Terry McCullough: First say, I’m an engineer, I’m not a public speaker. I would like to invite the

Commissioners and also everyone here to stay for a little time afterwards to see a presentation that we worked hard on that just shows what our concerns are for not only Bibb County but everyone in Macon, the entire region. Talk a lot about tonight is a Bibb County issue, it’s not just Bibb County, it’s the

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entire region. It’s going to affect people in Dublin, it’s going to affect people in Warner Robins. It is going to affect people in Atlanta and really affect people all over this country. And we need to look at what’s not just best for those people to get through Macon, we need to look best for those of us who actually live here in Macon and I’m not from Macon. My wife is not from Macon. We have chosen Macon, Bibb County to live in, to raise our children in. This is really what we want. We want to see this city grow. We want to see the city expand and this current plan is wonderful, it’s great, it’s huge but it’s not what we need here in Bibb County. Thank you.

Chairman Olmstead: And the last one is Brian McDavid. Brian McDavid: Always save the best for last. Brian McDavid: I’m Brian McDavid and I’m the representative of East Macon on the

Citizens Advisory Committee. I was the one that Rick Hutto was referring to that had been on the committee for three years and has never been invited to a meeting and has never seen any information on alternatives to this project, was just told this was the way it was going to be. I don’t deal in road building. I don’t deal in engineering but I deal in common sense. Common sense tells me that Macon, Georgia does not need an interstate system through it wider than the interstate that goes through Atlanta, Georgia. We absolutely don’t need that. It will split East Macon and Macon apart, further than we are now. I grew up in East Macon. My whole life growing up in East Macon the thing was you’re from East Macon, across the river. When we build this wall, it’s going to be like Dublin and East Dublin. The river divides those two and now they have two different governments and that’s the way we are going to go. We way we are going to have to go that way because we won’t be able to communicate with each other and I just think that’s going to be bad for the City and I know everybody is referring to your article in the paper and I’m going to go to it one time and then we’ll leave you alone on it.

Chairman Olmstead: I didn’t write it. Brian McDavid: It quoted you though. Chairman Olmstead: It sure did. Brian McDavid: It seems to be a concern, two main concerns that I think probably some of

the Commissioners have voiced their opinion on this and I’m going to address both of them real quick. One of them is, you build a road, great for business. Well, that’s true to a certain extent, but if you look at the design of this road, the gas stations on Spring Street, at Martin Luther King, all those

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interchanges, they are going basically dry up. They cannot make a living on in-town traffic. When you come South, if you are going to Savannah and you come south from Atlanta or let’s just say you are from Michigan because you don’t know anything about Macon. When you get to, before Pierce Avenue, you have to decide at that point whether you are going to Savannah or Macon. So if you are coming into Macon and you are on one of these roads that you can’t get off of and you look and you see Macon, you say “hey this is a pretty cool town, I think I’ll stop here and maybe get something to eat, spend the night, you can’t do it. You got to go all the way to Cochran Short Route to get off and come back. Nobody is going to do that. So all these interchanges where people get off now, get gas, get a hamburger, ride around downtown Macon, enjoy it, spontaneously now, they are not going to be able to do that any more. They are going to go through Macon 80 miles an hour and say whoa what a nice town, I’ll be back next year. That’s what is going to happen. So this design is not good for business. Now it’s going to be good for business, let’s say, at the end of Cochran Short Route where you get on and off these spur roads. Oh yeah, they’ll have plenty of businesses right there, they will do great and on the other end of it at Arkwright Road, they’ll do fine, those are all in the County. And another thing is, it seems like some people are concerned about if this thing is delayed, the money will disappear. Well, that’s not true. When we met with the federal people at a meeting they assured us that 80% of this was federal money. It was there. It’s going to be spent but they want to spend it wisely and G-DOT said at the meeting with the County Commissioners well three weeks ago, City Council, I’m sorry, that the money was not going to disappear. It was there, it has been allocated, so it’s not going anywhere, so we don’t have those two concerns to worry about, let’s just plan and do it right. Thank you.

Chairman Olmstead: Thank you. Commissioner Richardson would like to respond.

Commissioner Richardson: You know I’m an engineer as previously stated and I guess it’s been referred to as a monstrosity and I guess beauty is in the eyes of the beholder and I’m in the business. My firm designs major interchanges such as this. We have designed several around Charlotte, North Carolina, some in Virginia, Richmond, Virginia, along the interstate highway system up in that area as well, so I probably will look at it a lot differently than most of you will and view it differently. This is bigger than just East Macon or Shirley Hills issue. It’s got to function as a reasonable interchange, it’s a major interchange. One thing I do like about the DOT proposal is that we do get an additional exit at Second Street and I have recommended to DOT that U.S. 129 traffic be diverted to the Second Street exit as opposed to the Spring Street exit which I think will

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alleviate part of the problem out there as well. It’s been mentioned that this virtually cuts off the east side of the City. I’d have to disagree, it doesn’t. Actually, we have three accesses to the east side of the City instead of two. Right now you can only get off at Spring St. or MLK. We do pick up an additional exit in this particular case. This is a possible hurricane evacuation route from the coast, so it is important that we have an efficient movement of traffic through this interchange. I have talked Joe Palladi, the Urban Design Engineer on several occasions over the last several weeks. DOT is currently re-evaluating traffic data and traffic projection. They will go through the process of re-evaluating that data to insure what they’re doing is correct with the traffic. If they find that data is incorrect then they will make the adjustments accordingly. They have assured me of that. They are currently addressing the Federal Highway Administration of their concerns and are in the process of doing that as well. When all this is done, then they plan to go back and remodel the interchange from the model again, to make sure that what they are doing is right. This is not necessarily carved in stone at this particular time. They will run the model again. It doesn’t mean that they will change anything based on the data that has been presented. I know I have looked at the Passoneau proposal, Cullick proposal. Neither one of these accomplish what I feel like is necessary to move traffic and provide the exits at all three locations. I have not seen any proposals that I feel that accomplish the same thing without bidding the height. Concerned about height, the fly overs bridges occur on the west side of the river, they don’t occur on the east side of the river. As a matter of fact, DOT has shortened up the ramping up from Spring Street to cross over the river. Originally they started the ramping up back at Spring Street. They have shortened that up to alleviate one of the concerns that some of you have had. You mentioned 70 feet above the Ocmulgee River of course its 35 or 40 feet above the Ocmulgee River now. They are having to deal with the flood plains. Dr. Lindsey Holliday’s concerns about the hydraulics. That has been a concern. Most of the flooding that occurs today is not because of necessarily the constriction. I do agree that I-16 has created some what of a levy or constriction down through there, but you do have a lot of openings under the I-16 that hopefully will alleviate some of that problem. A lot of this flooding has been cause by all the development north of us. North side of the City and north of the County. We’ve just got a lot more runoff occurring and that creates the problem. I know Susan disagrees with me about on a lot of this but she is on a different side of the street. We will probably disagree on a lot of these things. I have over 40 years of engineering experience in dealing with DOT I agree with what Sam Jones said

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earlier. In fact, 15 or 20 years ago, yes it was that big elephant that did it their way or no way. I think the DOT today is having to operate under different rules than they did back then. They have to listen, they have to deal with the Federal Highway Administration particularly on interstates such as this, so they are having to address some of these concerns. Well, I have never seen DOT over-design anything in my 40 years. By the time it is designed from concept to design to construction a lot of cases it has been obsolete by the time it was completed, put in operation. We are concerned, otherwise we would not have invited you here tonight to listen to your concerns. I feel like we can work with DOT and hopefully pick a solution we can all live with, but I feel, you know we got this thing is major, this interchange on the interstate highway system and we got that too. This is more than a just an East Macon and Shirley Hills issue. We certainly appreciate all of you coming tonight and listening. I have a copy of your Power Point presentation and will be glad to watch that.

Chairman Olmstead: Any other Commissioner want to say something? Chairman Bivins: I have a question. Is this going to come up before a Committee? Chairman Olmstead: Well, I was going to touch on that. Chairman Bivins: I don’t know if anybody took notes. Chairman Olmstead: I took notes. The truth about it is, what’s been said has been said

several times. It has been printed in the paper several times. Chairman Bivins: I never heard some of these issues and their concerns for

consideration. Comm. Richardson: One additional thing. Mr. Palladi did say that they would be glad to

come down and meet with us, the Public Works Committee. Mr. Jones: Mr. Chairman, let me say one thing. I appreciate what yall have done

in allowing us come here and talk, but Mr. Palladi would not, I don’t believe he would have taken another look at it if we hadn’t done what we have done so far. And unless we keep the heat on through our political offices, they are going to go back and do exactly what they want to do. So I would encourage all to do that.

Chairman Olmstead: I’ll agree. My problem is and I’m going to just say this. Look, yall

are shooting the messengers here. Yall are blaming us for building the road.

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Mr. Jones: I’m not blaming. We need for you to back us up. Commissioner Bivins: Mr. Chairman, I’m thinking what they would really like is to feel that

when we go to these meetings we are going to be thinking about what they said.

Chairman Olmstead: Yeah. Well, what I was going to try to say, if I may. I have not had

one call to me on I-16/I-75 Interchange. I got your letter. I got an e-mail from you but I don’t read them all the time. I want to tell you this is a state and federal highway. It’s not part of the road improvement program which we are a part of really as the County.

Mr. Jones: It’s an integral part. Chairman Olmstead: We understand that, but I was just telling you that I’ve not been

contacted at all. The meeting at the City Hall was called and I asked them to change the meeting so the County Commission could attend and they would not do it at the City Hall, said it wasn’t convenient for them to change and we were having County Commission here while yall were up at City Hall. That’s why we weren’t at the City Hall at the time and they knew that we were having a County Commission because we changed it so that we could be available on swapping places. There is one other thing. We have MATS program here and to my knowledge .....

Mr. Jones: Tell us what that is. Chairman Olmstead: Macon Area Transportation. It’s a MATS program and part of the

program discuss and decided on that, but that’s the place, I’m not sure. I missed the last meeting. I haven’t missed any other meetings but I’m not sure. Has I-16 been brought up at the MATS meeting? See, I think Mr. Palladi mentioned that everybody is jumping on him and going to the Feds. They really haven’t even gone to talk to our own local people.

Susan Hanberry: The local people spoke in MATS. The Citizens Committee has not

voted to approve the MATS Transportation Plan for the last 3 years. In part, because of concerns like this. And that came through MATS, that’s one of the established committee under MATS. So yes, they have spoken.

Chairman Olmstead: I have not heard it discussed while I was at a MATS meeting.

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Susan Hanberry: We have extensive comments and they have been submitted to the Policy Committee and each PIP ________ to vote.

Chairman Olmstead: It wasn’t on record ...... Let me just say this. I live in Wesleyan

Woods and I have to come downtown every day. I won’t use Vineville Avenue. There has been one wreck in my family in the middle lane and that’s enough. I won’t use I-75 because or regardless of the report what’s happen is, if there is no one hurt or killed. I think there was 3 people killed in the last year, I won’t use it because it scares me to have to come down I-75 and switch over so I can get off Spring Street there so I really use Riverside Dr. I cut through and go down Northside Dr. and hit Riverside Dr. and come down. That is the most, I think the most pleasant way that I can get in to town from Wesleyan Woods. Now that’s bad, that’s bad.

Brian McDavid: If you were in Atlanta, would you get on the interstate or would you

go down Peachtree Road? Chairman Olmstead: Well, when I was in Atlanta and I was there 4 ½ years. Brian McDavid: You go down Peachtree Road. Chairman Olmstead: No, I did not. I didn’t have to. I lived downtown and I worked

downtown but I got on the interstate and came home on Friday afternoon and that was a trip, I’ll tell you that much. It was a trip.

Why don’t we try law enforcement? That is what the Federal Highway Authority would recommend as the first thing because 60% of our accidents are rear-end accidents because of speed.

Chairman Olmstead: You go up at City Hall and they are the ones who patrol inside the

City. I’m going to have to cut this off right now because we got these other two pieces of business to do. Thank you. Alright.

Comm. Bivins: Back to Human Resources Committee, two items to complete.

Human Resources and Information Committee approved that the Tax Assessors’ Board should be comprised of a total of 5 board members which will reflect the 4 districts and one Board Member At Large. Also, the terms of the Board Members should be staggered. Further, the Committee authorized the County Attorney to amend the Ordinance to reflect the change the Committee voted to approve.

Chairman Olmstead: Is there any discussion on this? All in favor, say aye. Opposed no.

Motion carried.

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Comm. Bivins: Human Resources and Information Services Committee recommends

that County Commission Voting Districts be redrawn in accordance with the attached voting map and that the same be submitted to the State Senate for approval and this was approved by the Human Resources Committee.

Chairman Olmstead: Is there any discussion on this? Comm. Hart: Yes. I just like to reiterate my opposition to sending it in at this time

and for 2 reasons. One, is I think how it’s currently drawn is not perfect, it sill offers the opportunity for us to more broadly represent the citizens of Bibb County and I think it has the potential of really bringing us together in a way that currently we have not been brought together. Because it again, it forces us to have to consider a broader constituent and I think that would be good and a more diverse constituent. I think that would be good for this particular county. And even at best, if the one that is being proposed should be considered then I don’t think we have adequate time to consider it and so even if it rectifies some of the concerns that we have in terms of the way the one is currently drawn. I think we need more time to adequately review that, and to examine it and to see if it makes any appreciable changes that would make a difference in terms of that broad representation that I’m concerned about.

Chairman Olmstead: Any other discussion? Comm. Bishop: Yes, I would beg to disagree. Number one, I think the way the map

is drawn here is almost like it was drawn when the State Legislative disregarding the Water Board’s unanimous vote to approve the map after it was given up for public review and with no public review and for the first time in history of Bibb County, the Legislature tore apart District 4, cut it in half and for no other reason, except to dis-enfranchise the voters in Rutland I and Rutland II Districts. I think that this map puts District 4 back together. I think the diversity is almost the same, the only difference is that you have a community of interest and most of this area in District 4 is unincorporated. Historically, the Legislature has not gotten involved in drawing of local districts. The City Council can draw their own district without interference with the State Legislature. The Association of County Commissioners most of them think that the Legislature should not be involved in the drawing of County Commissioners’ districts. They don’t run for County Commission, they run for State Legislature in their districts which are just about as bad but for them to come and

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meddle in local affairs and to dis-enfranchise a County Commissioner during his first year in office where the people in District 4 don’t know who to talk to about problems in the area is wrong and I hope that we will see that it is rectified. I hope that the local delegation will go along with the changes and put District 4 back together.

Comm. Hart: Mr. Chairman, I certainly don’t wish to dis-enfranchise anybody and

support to that we certainly want as much local input as we can but the other thing is that I want to push forward is the fact that we ought to get beyond District 4, District 1. I think our broader concerns for this community that goes beyond districts and my concerns for District 4 is the same as this Commissioner who represents District 4. I think that is the kind of thing we need to recognize as a Commission that we are here to represent the citizens of Bibb and I think the thing is at least a change in the way the districts are concerned give us an opportunity to have to be more responsive to a broader community. And I think that is in the best interest of Bibb County. So, I think that even if this makes a change, we still need adequate time to review it so I don’t want it pushed before us tonight, because I think if not, we have the same problem that we had with the one that was done by the Legislators. I still think we need time to examine this. See if it does what you are proposing Commissioner.

Comm. Bishop: Well again, I want to point out that this map was examined with the

exception of Hazard 2 and Hazard 7. It was examined, it was put before the public, it was passed by the unanimous vote of the Board of Water Commissioners. That’s the only difference in the map and the only reason it was tweak was to insure that it was pass the Justice Dept. muster. The first one would have pass the Justice Department muster. I still think it was highly unusual and suspect for the State Legislator to get involved in the drawing of a map with no consultation with any of the County Commissioners unless some of them did it in the back room because I never was consulted by them. In fact, when we were meeting to discuss it we got a call that said they didn’t agree with the map from the Water Board and if they thought they were going to accept this and they sent us their map, which was drawn by the State Legislative. Not only that, one of the Legislators that helped pass this thing against the wishes of the Commissioner that served in that district is no longer there. He is no longer there and he knew he wasn’t going to be there because he was getting re-districted out. And he went ahead and went along with this map and for no other reason except I guess for he was planning on later on getting appointed to the DOT Board.

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Comm. Bivins: You know, I want to say something now. We had as a Board, we had an opportunity to select a map. And it’s not like we didn’t have a chance and it wasn’t like we didn’t have an opportunity to select a map that would have kept the district together that you are talking about. We did. We did not, or could not, come together and agree on something. Now that’s the problem. Now we are talking about going back to something the Water Authority had and I personally did not agree with that particular one myself but one of the reasons the Legislator ended up doing this is we had an opportunity to select and agree on a map and we refused to do it. Now, we are talking about who is going to be represented by it. I have no problem representing people in the new district as it’s drawn up. I have no problem with that because my concern is Bibb County and what is in the best interest of Bibb County and all the people in Bibb County and that includes those new people who are out there. But, I just think that one of the things that concerns me about this is it says the map we submitted. That’s not a map that all of us agree with. So, I have some problem with that. I mean if we just said consideration for change, I mean I have a problem anyway, but having a map and saying we are going to have this particular map, I don’t agree with that and I cannot support this.

Comm. Bishop: I didn’t agree with the last map and I didn’t support that one and I

don’t think anybody on here was asked for any input into it. I think it was just shoved down our throat.

Comm. Bivins: We had a chance to select a map. Comm. Bishop: We had three years. Comm. Bivins: It was drawn by an impartial body. Comm. Bishop: We had three years. Chairman Olmstead: We are getting back and forth, arguing back and forth. If you have

got something to say be recognized. I will call on you to say. Comm. Hart: I think sending it back again does exactly the same thing that he’s in

opposition to and so I still stay that if it is something that we want to examine we would be able to do in our group to see if we can come to a conclusion and it’s too early to do that. It’s premature to do that because if we send it back to the Senate to somebody else who does exactly the same thing that he is opposition to. So why do that again? If it was wrong the first time, then it’s certainly wrong this time. So,

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I say we really got a concern, then let’s look at it and put in on and see if there is a better thing that we can propose.

Chairman Olmstead: Anyone else? Comm. Bishop: Yeah, I would like to say I did discuss with yall last time. I discussed

the fact that they were tearing up District 4, cutting it half in two. They took exactly half of the vote. They took it out of District 4, half of the vote. They pulled out who had voted for the Commissioner that year before I served my first term in office and nobody then wanted to talk about it and discuss it. But nobody then wanted to call the Legislator and as far as not working out a map, I don’t think we weren’t in any hurry to work out a map. The problem was that the Water Authority submitted their map so that’s what rushed us up. But the truth of the matter is, still got two years left to run but what is done has caused these voters in Rutland I and Rutland II to feel like they don’t have anybody to turn to. How do they hold me accountable when they don’t even know where their district is at next time. Their district split up and just like one of the Legislator said they can’t do squat.

Chairman Olmstead: Is there anyone else. Comm. Hart: Let’s call for a vote. Comm. Bivins: I still say we had ever opportunity to select a map. A map that would

have kept that district together. We didn’t do it. And also, I don’t think there is anybody down here that won’t represent anybody in this County that wants or needs representation.

Chairman Olmstead: I am going to call for the questions. All in favor of the Motion

signify by saying “Aye”. Comm. Bishop: Aye. Chairman Olmstead: Opposed, “No.” Comm. Hart: No. Chairman Olmstead: I see it’s two and two and I’m going to break the tie and vote with the

Motion. I vote an “Aye”. It’s three to two. Is there any other business to be brought before this?

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Comm. Bishop: Mr. Chairman, I would just hope to say again, that if what happened to the other two Commissioners happened to me, I would have been just as strong in support of them on their side to make sure that their district wasn’t torn apart, because these people are being added to the other districts, not taken away from the districts that you represent.

Chairman Olmstead: We have already voted on this. If yall want to discuss it in private. I

think it has been discussed enough. Comm. Bivins: I’ve lost a lot of people out of my district. Chairman Olmstead: It’s been voted on. Is there any other business to be brought before? Visitor: I don’t know to do this, so I’ll just ask you how to do this. I’m

delighted to actually see all this conversation about representation and not having any input in it and people doing things behind closed doors. That’s what this I-16/I-75 thing is really all about, so what I want to do is ask yall to do two things for us and this may come under old business, new business whatever. One, would be to pass a resolution in support of this community and the people who live in it opposing the DOT idea as it stands and asking them to please go back and redesign. That’s number one. Number two, if you say we need to go to MATS, whatever in the world that is. Who’s on MATS and would you please help us meet with them?

Chairman Olmstead: When is the next MATS meeting? The Mayor is the Chairman and

he calls the meeting. Bob Fountain: Vernon is the resource person. Chairman Olmstead: Yeah, Vernon Ryle is the person that can tell you all about this. Visitor: It’s in April, Mr. Chairman. Chairman Olmstead: I thought it was another one coming up right soon, maybe not, I don’t

know. I’ll look at may calendar. Visitor: If the Mayor is the Chairman, he indicated to me that he didn’t know

this thing was as big as it was. If you all could help us meet with MATS.

Chairman Olmstead: Yes., I’ll see you will be given time on MATS agenda whenever it’s

called.

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Visitor: Good, because we really don’t want to have to go the point of suing people. Thanks.

Chairman Olmstead: Would you put that on my calendar to be sure to remind me on that

at the time. Well, thank all of yall for coming. I wish we could be more exact in what’s going on but like I said the State and the Feds., we had not any part of this design or anything. It’s their project. The Road Improvement Project we take blame for or credit by some people. But with that, thank yall for your interest enough in Macon and Bibb County to come out and spend an evening with us. I’ll be available. You can call me here at the office, I’m here all day long if you want to talk about it. I’ll be glad to talk with you. I return all my telephone calls. Thank yall very much, the meeting is adjourned.

There being no further business and on motion duly made and seconded, the meeting adjourned at 7:50 p.m. ___________________________ Rhonda J. Scott Administrative Assistant