OREGON COMMISSION FOR THE BLIND535 SE 12 th Ave. (Portland headquarters)

BUSINESS ENTERPRISE PROGRAM of OREGON2014 FALL IN-SERVICE--BECC MEETING

Saturday, September 27, 20141:30 PM – 4:00 PM, BECC Meeting portion

Tele-conference: (404) 443-6397Participant code: 943611#

AGENDA1. Called to order.

a. Roll callb. Disposition of minutes (Aug. 28, 2014)

2. Fall elections.a. Chairperson. (nominee: Lewanda Miranda)b. Portland 2 (nominee: Cathy Dominique)c. Salem 1. (nominees: Char McKinzie, Jerry Bird)

3. Elected committee/sub-committees, OCB web site.(action item)4. Adjournment.

[START OF MEETING]

Young: Okay, everybody, I’m going to call this meeting to order. I thank everybody for making it here to the In-Service at the Commission for the Blind. I’d like to thank Eric and Kathy for putting on the [inaudible].

[applause]

Young: And I’d like to start with roll call. Could you do the roll call for me, Ms. Miranda?

Miranda: Sure. Art Stevenson?

Stevenson, Art: Here.

Miranda: Jerry Bird?

Bird: Here.

Miranda: Cathy Colley-Dominique?

Colley-Dominique: Here.

Miranda: Char Mckinzie?

Mckinzie: Here.

Miranda: Derrick Stevenson?

Stevenson, Derrick: Here.

Miranda: Gordon Smith?

Smith: Here.

Miranda: Harold Young?

Young: Here.

Miranda: Ken Gerlitz?

Gerlitz: Here.

Miranda: Lin Jaynes? Lin, are you on the line?

Jaynes, Jesse: Ms. Lewanda, Lin will not be back in. I had to put her back to bed, I’m sorry.

Miranda: Oh, okay, thank you, Jess. Lewanda Miranda’s here. Steve Gordon, are you on the line? Tessa Brown?

Brown: Here.

Miranda: Randy Hauth?

Hauth: Here.

Miranda: Salvador Barraza?

Barraza: Here.

Miranda: Steve Jackson?

Jackson: Here.

Miranda: Ann Wright?

Wright: Here.

Miranda: Thank you. Agency staff?

Morris: Eric is here, and Kathy Ewing, and I think Art Marshall’s over in the corner.

Stevenson, Art: Are you in the corner again, Art?

Smith: He’s the bad boy.

Miranda: And visitors, would you please announce yourself?

Miranda, Oscar: Oscar Miranda.

Haseman: Linda Haseman.

VanHorn: Martin VanHorn.

Haseman: Linda Haseman.

Smith, Karen: Karen Smith.

Miranda: Thank you.

Young: All right.

Bird, Cindy: Oh, Cindy Bird.

Gerlitz, Kathy: Kathy Gerlitz.

Young: Yeah, Cindy. Yep. Is that everybody?

Brown: And then Jesse’s on the line, right?

Miranda: And Jesse.

Young: All righty, next on the agenda is the disposition, disposition, [inaudible] disposition of minutes for the August 28, 2014 meeting. I would like to make a motion that we accept the minutes as recorded. Do I have a second?

Brown: I second.

Young: Tessa Brown seconds it. Does anybody have any changes or concerns or anything with the minutes? Okay. We’ll do a, we’ll accept those minutes by roll call. Oscar, Lewanda? Oscar-Lewanda?

[laughter]

Miranda: Yes.

Young: Lewanda, Lewanda Miranda!

Miranda: Yeah.

Young: Art Stevenson?

Stevenson, Art: Yes.

Young: Tessa Brown?

Brown: Yes.

Young: Cathy Dominique?

Colley-Dominique: Yes.

Young: Char Mckinzie?

Mckinzie: Yes.

Young: And Harold Young, yes. That motion passes. All right, next is the elections and I’ve asked Eric to go ahead and facilitate those elections for me.

Morris: Good afternoon, everybody. On the agenda for the Fall Elections there’s three positions open, and that includes the Chair, Chairperson position, Portland 2 and Salem 1. So, what we’ll do is we’ll go through each position. We’ll give each person a chance to give a short, I wanted to say “presentation,” but that’s probably the wrong, say a few remarks and then once we’re done with the position we’ll move to the next, to the next. And then Kathy and I believe Karen are going to tabulate like we did last year. And then we’ll give a report on the results. Now before, before we actually start voting, Kathy’s going to read out who has voted electronically, because there’s people here who voted electronically, so we don’t want to have, like, an extra third of the votes, because you were here and you voted electronically. So, Kathy, if you could read those off real quick.

Ewing: Okay. Ann Wright has already voted. Derrick Stevenson, Lewanda Miranda, Cathy Dominique, Steve Gordon, and Art Stevenson [inaudible].

Morris: And you have the ballots, right?

Ewing: Yes, I do.

Morris: So, what we’ll do is we’ll start with the Chairperson position. So, Lewanda Miranda is the nominee, and Lewanda you have the floor.

Miranda: I’d just like to say that I believe I could do a good job as Chair, and I look forward to it. I believe I could help move this program forward. I think we’re heading in the right direction. The Elected Committee is working well with the, with the Agency. I think we’re learning how to have respect and trust for one another. I think Harold did a great job, but he’s very busy… [applause] Yeah, and he’s very busy with home life and, and things, and it does take a lot of time, and I realize it. And I’m going to put a lot of time into it. I’m going to work positive with the AG’s office. I, I hope that we can learn to work better together than we have in the past. And I’ll, I’ll do my best to, to lead and I want everyone to know that my door’s always open. And if there’s anything I can help you with or you have advice, you know, to share with me and concerns that the door’s always open.

Gerlitz: Well, that’s not what Oscar said.

[laughter]

Miranda: Oscar!

Young: That darn Oscar Lewanda.

Morris: All right, so the, I think what we’ll do is wait until the end and then pass out the ballots and then everybody can vote or can get assistance with voting. So, Port, Portland 2 is the next position that is open with nominee Cathy Dominique. Cathy, did you want to make a short statement?

Colley-Dominique: Well, I’m proud to be on the Board. I like the things that have been happening. I do attend meetings and I do keep with the emails and things. And I’m only hoping to help, hoping that I can help be a part, and help push our program forward and make it more, more cohesive. And thank you very much.

[applause]

Morris: The last position we’re voting for today is Salem 1. The nominees for Salem 1 are Char Mckinzie and Jerry Bird. Char, do you want to give a short statement?

Mckinzie: Sure. I’ve been very proud to be on the Board as a replacement this last several months. And I’m excited to be nominated to be on the Board again. I have only missed one meeting since 1998. That was the first one and I’d been a manager for two weeks. And I’ve always come to the meetings and been on the phone and especially the In-Services which I feel are so important. And so, I’ve, I would love to work positively with the other Board members and with the Commission staff. And I’m looking forward to a, a really great year with really great things happening. I was excited to hear what Jesse said this morning about what’s happening with their director and their… So I think we’re all going to be moving forward, so I’m excited.

[applause]

Morris: Jerry, do you want to give a short statement?

Bird: Yeah, I been in the program 27 years and I’m not going to say a whole lot about it other than I do believe that things need to get back the way they are, used to be as far as elections are going. I know you guys don’t want to hear this, but I believe if you’re not, if a person don’t represent you, you should not have a vote for the, for that person. So, because the rest of you vote on the person that’s in an area that’s not even your area. That person is to represent the people in the area. They, they, they are going to vote for what, well, my area’s me and Sal.

Mckinzie: Char.

Bird: Char. And so if, if every people gets to vote in your area, that means that me and, me and Sal or whatever, rest of the, rest of the managers are going to dictate who, who, you know, going to represent us. And that’s happened a couple years ago, and I think that was, at times we were, everyone was trying to change different ways of who they want on the Boards and that, and trying to get away from that. The rest of the 25 years it’s always been whoever’s in your area votes for the person in that area. And to me that’s democracy and the way it is in the United States. And I just believe it’s wrong to have people that you’re not going to support, that’s not going to be voting on your behalf to allow you to vote for who you want. When you, your vote is for who’s in your area. And that’s all I wanted to say, thanks.

[applause]

Morris: All right, Kathy’s going to bring around the ballots. If you need assistance with a ballot, and she’s going to double check that people aren’t voting twice, thought that through this morning.

Mckinzie: Darn.

Colley-Dominique: Darn.

Morris: If you need help with a ballot, raise your hand, holler. I can help, maybe.

[laughter]

Stevenson, Art: Maybe.

Morris: I’m not sure what it looks like.

Stevenson, Art: You mean those ballots aren’t in large print, Eric?

[Kathy passes around the ballot, background noise and talking]

Morris: All right, so heads up everybody. Kathy and Karen have tabulated the votes, and I’m going to have Kathy read what the results are.

Ewing: Okay. Lewanda and Cathy of course were elected because, yeah… [applause] And then for the contested, Char Mckinzie, should I read the number?

Morris: Sure.

Ewing: Nine votes. Jerry Bird, six votes.

Stevenson, Art: Char wins.

[applause]

Young: All righty, and the next agenda item is an action item. And Mr. Stevenson, would you like to poll that action item?

Stevenson, Art: Oh yeah. Well, Eric and I were talking about the website, and you know, things that we were, we’re putting up there. And he talked about the possibility of the Elected Committee being put up on the website, our names, contact information. And if they so desired, maybe a picture. However, I don’t think I want my picture splattered all over the internet.

Gerlitz: We don’t either.

[laughter]

Stevenson, Art: But anyway, so, so you know, I, I had the thought that, that we probably should list the Elected Committee and their contact information. I think for the Chair and the Vice Chair, it probably should be their email addresses and phone numbers, but then for the rest of the Board members, you know, at least their email address. If they want their phone numbers on there I guess they could, but… I would, I just think it’s a good idea and so I would like to just poll the Board. And of course, if you don’t want your name up there, you could say, nah, I’d rather not have my name on there, but poll the Board and get permission of the Board members to put their contact information on the Commission website under the vending program.

Young: Jerr?

Brown: [inaudible]

Stevenson, Art: So, I’ll be the first one you can poll, Mr. Chairman. And I say, “yes.”

Young: All righty. Art, would you like to have your contact information on the website?

Stevenson, Art: Yes. And you can go ahead and put my phone number in there as Vice Chair.

Young: Okay. Char, how about you?

Mckinzie: Yes, that’d be fine. And I have a business phone number. I wouldn’t mind having that on there.

Young: Okay. Cathy?

Colley-Dominique: Yes, but email only, please.

Young: Tessa?

Brown: Yeah, I can have both.

Young: Okay. Lewanda?

Miranda: Both.

Mckinzie: What’d you say?

Miranda: Both.

Mckinzie: Oh.

Bird: Would it be proper for Lewanda to take your place? She’s been elected and that’s how [inaudible].

Young: She’s going to take over at the next Elected Committee meeting.

Bird: Oh, okay.

Young: All righty, so, I’ll make a motion that the Elected Committee’s information be placed on the Oregon Commission for the Blind website. Do I have a second?

Miranda: Lewanda.

Young: Lewanda seconds it. All right, we’ll… Anybody want to have any comments or anything about it? All right, we’ll go down the vote by roll call again. I’ll do it right this time. Lewanda Miranda?

Miranda: Yes.

Young: Art Stevenson?

Stevenson, Art: Yes.

Young: Char Mckinzie?

Mckinzie: Yes.

Young: Cathy Dominique?

Colley-Dominique: Yes.

Young: Tessa Brown?

Brown: Yes.

Young: And Harold Young, yes. All right, that motion passes.

Stevenson, Art: Mr. Chairman.

Young: Yes, Art?

Stevenson, Art: I realize it’s not on the agenda, but I would like to let everybody know, and it will be posted on Monday, that the Rules and Regulations Committee will be having their first meeting on October 8th at 3:30. It’ll be posted properly on the websites and notification will be sent out to all the managers and those pertinent people that need to receive it.

Gerlitz: Okay. Art, I got a question.

Stevenson, Art: Yes, sir?

Gerlitz: Are you going to pick this up from where we left off or are you starting all, all over? I thought we’d covered…

Stevenson, Art: No, we’re going to, we’re going to pick it, pick it up right where we left off, Kenny. And if you remember, I sent out a email to all the managers with input and stuff like that. And so we will be foc--, focusing on, right now, the things that need to be focused on. The grey areas in our rules and regulations and stuff, that definitely need to be addressed as soon as possible.

Hauth: Mr., Mr. Chair?

Young: Yes, Randy.

Hauth: Yeah, you know this rules and regulations thing obviously has been a long, ongoing process. Maybe, Art, you can share with us where we are in the, in the process. I know that the Agency spent close to $50,000 for us to work together and build a consensus model. And it was my understanding that that consensus model and the agreed upon rules and regulations were simply going to be reviewed at the Department of Justice and sent back to us. And again, if there were any changes, or alterations, or concerns, we were going to go back to the consensus model. So, I think it’s been like eight months and really, nobody’s heard a word from them. So if Eric or you or anybody who has more information on that can bring us up to speed, I think we’d appreciate that.

Stevenson, Art: Well, I can tell you that it has been at the AG’s office, and the AG’s office works at their own speed. And I know Eric has been in con—, in contact with them on a regular basis, and, and trying to get them to hurry up the process and get through and, and submitting their recommendations. And that’s exactly where we’re at. When it is received and gone through, we will get a copy of what, you know, what changes are going to be recommended, if any, from the Commission for the Blind. And then, then we will look at those just like we did before. And basically the Rules and Regs Committee will look at it, make any recommendations that they think, or don’t think should occur in accordance with the information that they give to the AG’s office. And actually consulting with RSA, because I’d much rather have them weigh in on any controversial issues so that we don’t have any problems. And then I, I see it going to RSA in its completed form with less [inaudible] and the Commission Board so that they could look at it, give us any recommendations that they have. And of course we would have to make changes if they made the recommendations, if you had, and then it would go through the state process, which is, you know, they have to have, put it up for notice and then there’ll be a hearing on it, and it’ll go through the state process for administrative rule making. And then once that has been completed, the Commission Board will vote on it. And as everybody knows, it’s a long drawn out process. And the only thing that I know about the AG’s office is they have one person assigned to the Commission for the Blind. They have to do all the other work for the Commission for the Blind including the ongoing things that are going on, the grievances and stuff, and so that is the only justification I guess I can have for you, Mr. Hauth, on why it has taken them so long to get it done. Because I, I do believe that our AG also has some other responsibilities. She’s not just the legal counsel for the Commission for the Blind.

Hauth: Yeah, it, it was just my understanding when we finished that initial process that, pretty much dialed in and there weren’t supposed to be much, you know, concern there. So I was just curious why it has taken so long. Have, Eric, have you been, have you received any input or feedback from the AG’s office on the rules [inaudible]?

Morris: I did, recently. About two, two and a half weeks ago? I finally got a response back from the AG’s office and as, as warm and fuzzy as it sounds that we were just going to run it by the AG’s office, the information that I received back from the AG’s office was extensive. And the problem with the way they sent it to us is it’s attorney-client privilege. So, it’s 23 pages long. So, while attorneys are great, and I think we all love attorneys, and I talk, that’s all I seem to talk to any more is attorneys, they’re never short and to the point and succinct. So there’s a massive amount of data that needs to be gone through to see what needs to be changed from a legal perspective, as in relating specifically to law? Or what is in there that, you know, is just advice from the Attorney General’s office, because she didn’t, you know, it’s

just one massive document. So that, I do, I do have that. And it is a chore to go through and sort through.

Hauth: So, the Committee doesn’t have it and nobody has it other than you because of the client-attorney privilege?

Morris: Correct.

Hauth: Okay. So, Art, what…

Stevenson, Derrick: This is Derrick.

Young: Go ahead, Derrick.

Stevenson, Derrick: Yeah, I just, I’m not understanding the attorney-client thing, because it’s my understanding that they’re working on behalf of, of all of us, not just the Commission for the Blind.

Gerlitz: Yeah, it’s our rules and regs.

Stevenson, Derrick: Yeah, I mean we’re writing [inaudible]…

Jackson: Can you explain that, Eric?

Morris: I was going to say, if you’re, if you’re looking to me to explain attorney-client, attorney-client privilege, I would not be the expert on that.

Bird: Why would it be so, I mean…

Jackson: Aren’t we all the clients?

Stevenson, Derrick: Did they, they tell you that, or?

Morris: Yes.

Stevenson, Derrick: Is that just something you assumed?

Morris: No, it’s, it, it’s like when you think of, like when I was in the Navy, things are stamped a certain classification, the stuff, the, like this stuff we got from the AG’s office is, there’s no way, shape, or form you can misconstrue that this is not attorney-client, client privileged information.

Miranda: So are you guys just reviewing it?

Morris: Yeah. So what my intent is to do, like a lot of privileged information that we’ve talked, because, “privileged”, you know, that quote unquote privileged term, there’s, there’s been a lot of “privileged” information that I’ve gotten from the attorney general’s office since I’ve been here that I’ve went through and then provided to the Elected Committee, or provided the members, just by going through and analyzing it and passing the information along. So there’s a process, and I need to go through, and it’s not, if it was a page, it would be easy. But it’s 23 pages, and I don’t remember how many thousands

of words it said the document was. It’s big, and it’s not easy stuff. Some of it is easy stuff, but most of it is very complicated type of thing. So, that’s where we’re at with that.

Bird: Well, [inaudible] okay.

Gerlitz: Excuse me, but how long do we have to wait? I mean, are we going to get this reviewed by RSA? Is it imperative that we have to keep waiting, or can they give us a time to get this show on the road, because it’s just holding up the show.

Morris: You mean from the Agency’s perspective, Ken?

Gerlitz: Yeah, from the Attorney General.

Morris: Well, the Attorney General’s provided, finally provided their feedback. I mean, that’s…

Gerlitz: That’s it, that’s the final…

Morris: Well, it’s, it’s, it’s the opinion and the advice of the Attorney General’s office. So, we need to really take that in and see which advice we’re going to take and which we’re not, and what we’re… Some things are required by law. They have to mesh, mesh up with the law. So, that’s what I need to go through and spend some serious time, myself and Dacia, to try and understand what the AG’s office is saying. And like most people will tell you, the AG’s office works for the Agency. We don’t work for the AG’s office. So we contract with them to provide legal advice. So, yeah.

Bird: If I may, I, what…

Wright: This is Ann, may I ask a question?

Miranda: Harold?

Young: Just, just a second, Ann, Jerry had a question.

Wright: Okay.

Bird: Yeah, just wondering, so apparently, I know you say that 22, 23 pages long, I mean, that’s not super long… But you can’t even tell us, so apparently, we don’t get to know nothing, she, are they saying they want some changes? Are they saying they don’t believe this is right? I mean, that’s what we want to know. We don’t want to say, see, what’d she say, well, Eric, because this might do this and this, we don’t want it this way. We want to know what, what don’t they like about our Handbook?

Miranda: So, is it, like, 23 pages of recommendations?

Bird: So we can, so we can, you know, we don’t need to know the confidential stuff. But that stuff should be public. It’s our Handbook, we had the meeting, we sent it in. Why are we not hearing what, what, what they don’t like about it? It sounds to me, it’s, it’s insane, like we’re being left out. And we’re not going to tell you nothing, and I don’t know. I’m confused again on, on the stalling, why, just… I don’t know. Don’t sound right.

Miranda: Eric, is it 23 pages of recommendations?

Morris: I’m trying to, I’ve read through it sum total of one and a half times.

Bird: You’ve had it two weeks?

Morris: Yeah.

Young: Okay, Ann, what question did you have?

Wright: I, my question is that until we have an understanding as to what these recommendations are and… I mean, we put a lot of hours into this when we were working on it. There were several of us involved.

Morris: Yeah.

Wright: What is the purpose, or is there a purpose, of, of rules and regulations committee going forward now without knowing what work we’ve done is going to stand, or what has to be changed, or are there other things that need to be worked on that have nothing to do with it.

Miranda: That’s for you, Eric.

Stevenson, Art: The, the question is…

Stevenson, Derrick: Well, basic, basically I think she’s saying, where, what happened to the active participation? Is, is, do we get none in this decision making of what the AG said, or not?

Female voice: Nope.

Stevenson, Art: Derrick, yes, we do, Derrick. What, what’s going on is Eric’s going through the document and, and looking to what the A--, what they’re going to accept or reject from the AG, and then we will be presented with the document that we get to go through all the changes that are going to be proposed in the Handbook. And, and we get to go, the Rules and Regulations Committee will go through it. And then we will, we will vote on it. And so all the blind licensed managers, as soon as the Handbook comes out from Eric after he’s gone through it, and, and Dacia, I, I assume. You’re doing the grunt work and then it has to be okayed, you and Dacia have to have a discussion. And then we will get the Handbook as OCB believes it should be. We will get to examine it. And of course the written documentation will be there, why it, they think the change needs to be made. And then we will look at it. We will make our determination. And basically we’ll go through that kind of Confluence process again in the Rules and Regs Committee. And then we’ll bring it forward to the Elected Committee and the Elected Committee will vote, but the blind licensed managers will all have the right to see the Handbook when the Elected Committee gets it and submit any, any comments, recommendations to the Committee, and then the Elected Committee will work on it. So we, whatever rule or regulation, and I can guarantee you all that, if the Elected Committee doesn’t approve it, then RSA isn’t even going to look at it. We will have to hammer out what is acceptable with the blind licensed managers and, and the Commission before RSA is going to look at it. And I remember the last time when there was a little bit of controversy. RSA came back to the Elected Committee and said, “do you, have you approved this Handbook?” And the answer was yes, and so they went ahead and went through it and pass--, and passed it with a few minor

changes, which was acceptable by both sides. So that’s the process that’s happening. There’s not going to be any hidden agendas or anything, because the Elected Committee, if we don’t think what’s there, what’s in there is correct, we’re not, we’re not going to pass the Handbook. And the AG knows that they have to give us written reasons why the changes are being made and, and the laws, rules, and regulations or whatever they’re making that determination on to make the changes. In state and federal law.

Wright: I think…

Young: Go ahead, Ann.

Wright: I’m sorry, I think my question was misunderstood. It was not meant as a criticism. My question is, is it in our best interest to move ahead with the rules that, just start meeting on the 8 th until we have this information in our hands. Is, is there a point of starting something that may be futile?

Stevenson, Art: Um…

Wright: Until we know exactly what we’re dealing with. That, that was my question. It was not meant as a criticism or…

Stevenson, Art: No, no, no, I, I, I understand that. And Ann, I, I, another… I forgot, I left that little part out. Yes, we do need to start, start meeting because there are some things that have come to light to us that need to be addressed, like putting in to the administrative rules a process that needs to be processed to declare a contract null and void, because if everybody remembers, the AG’s office has said, well, there’s no way that, there’s no set down policy or process that needs to be, that we can do, so we can’t do anything. Well, the state statutes declare that the Commission for the Blind must promulgate rules, or shall promulgate rules, to administer the, the program. And so, we need to figure out wording and stuff on, that we need to put into the Handbook to make sure that there’s a process for the Commission for the Blind to take to declare a contract null and void. And we also need to clarify in administrative rules, what quality, quantity and price is and address those issues so that we won’t have some of the problems that we’ve been having with certain government entities in the state of Oregon.

Bird: Let me ask a question.

Stevenson, Art: Okay, Ann?

Wright: Yes.

Stevenson, Art: Okay.

Young: Go ahead, Jerry.

Smith: Did this basically arise from Jerry’s problem at the college?

Stevenson, Art: What, you mean the thought that we need to put something in there on, out of employer of a…

Smith: The [inaudible] got through the college signing, is that what this is about?

Bird: Well, we don’t know what they’re not liking. They’re not showing us. Can we send it to RSA anyway, even though it hasn’t been approved by the AG and see what they think about it? I mean, because I think the AG’s going to come back and say, we believe this, we believe that we shouldn’t have this, and we don’t want this in here. But if RSA believes that it’s, it’s, it’s acceptable, we, we might, they don’t know, but the RSA come back and says, yeah, they were right. So at least RSA’s going to see the version that we spent $50,000 on and all of our time to do, and to see if, if it is out of proportion.

Stevenson, Art: Well, Jerry, I talked to Deanna Jones…

Bird: Okay.

Stevenson, Art: And she said she wants a complete Handbook that has everything in it that, that we want in it. Since we do not have the recommended input from the AG’s office, and the written explanation why it needs to be changed, we can’t, we can’t submit them a quote unquote “Handbook” that the Commission for the Blind may or may not be agreeative to. So it has to be agreed to by the Elected Committee and, and by the Commission Board before it goes to RSA. And that’s straight from Deanna Jones.

Miranda: Jerry, are you asking about just, just the, just that item if we can run it by RSA for their opinion instead of having to wait for all of the rest of it to come out? Yeah.

Bird: Well, yeah, my idea is, is to get it to them because if, if actually some of the, it’d be nice to be able to, to you know, see the letter. I’m still confused on why we don’t get to see what the changes are, but… My thinking was, that way, because it sounds like to me the AG’s only con--… It might not be the way she wants it to be…

Gerlitz: Micromanaging the program.

Bird: Yeah, but, but if, if it’s not illegal and we want it in there, we should be able to put it in there. If it’s not helpful for her, that’s too bad.

Gerlitz: Yeah.

Bird: As long as it’s not…

Female voice: Illegal.

Bird: Illegal! You know, or breaking some kind of law, that the idea, the Handbook is to govern our program, not to help them govern our program because they want, they, the way they want us to govern it. So they’re dictating to us and this, we thought this was going to happen. We spent all that time and, and, and voted on it, and, and you know, worked it out. And then now we get this. Nine months later and, and we’re going to make a bunch of changes but we’re not going to tell you what they are. You know, I, it’s, it’s amazing. I’m, I’m…

Jackson: Can I ask you a question, Eric?

Morris: Yes.

Jackson: Can you, can you ask the Attorney General what part of that document you can share with the rest of the managers? Because that was the whole reason, is to have them edit it and get back, go back and forth, and…

Morris: So, so here’s, to answer your question and probably to answer several questions, my intent is to go through that before we have the Rules and Regs Commission, Committee meeting and mine out the issues. And, I’m sitting here wracking my brain trying to remember what some, some things that are fairly innocuous that we could talk about. You know, one of the points she made was that, you know, if you’re going, if you’re going to talk about a law, like a federal law, then you just say, “As per this federal statute,” instead of plugging all the language in. Because it says the same thing. So there’s some, like, basic stuff that, you know, how it’s, how the lettering and the numbering is. I mean, there’s some innocuous stuff like that. And then there’s bigger issues, that, I don’t remember them exactly. But my, my process is going to be to get through that in the next week and a half, what, two weeks, Art, before then?

Stevenson, Art: Uh, October 8th.

Morris: And…

Stevenson, Art: So it would be…

Female voice: Two weeks, then?

Morris: Yeah, so that, like Ann said…

Stevenson, Art: A week from Thursday.

Morris: …we’re not, we’re not having a meeting just to have a meeting, because there’s plenty of that going around. So, so we can start chomping through. And if you guys, if anybody listened to the, why am I drawing a blank, Terry Smith’s presentation the other day about active participation. That’s, that was a failure, as I saw it, last time in the Handbook was trying to be revised. They went through the process, they, everybody got input, then they got the feedback from the AG’s office, then they sent it out to the RSA. They didn’t come back and continue the active participation piece, and tried to basically force it down everybody’s throat. Now, if there’s stuff that we don’t agree on, then we’re going to have to figure out a way to get everybody happy on it, or everybody un--, as Terry said it, good negotiations: everybody walks away a little uncomfortable. That, they didn’t get everything they wanted and is, both sides didn’t get everything they wanted. So, that’s negotiation and active participation. So, I, I don’t see it going to RSA until everybody here is good with it, in one, and we may not all be good in the same way, but we can all live with it. So that’s, that’s the failure of what I saw that happened in 2012, I think it was? So that’s, that’s how I see it happening, whether, I mean that’s, from my perspective.

Stevenson, Art: And, and, and Jerry, you know, they’re going through the whole Handbook and then, like he said, referring to this instead of that so they got to make the changes in there and get it done, and then, and then we’ll get a copy of it. And then like I also said, we, it has come to the, our attention that we absolutely need to address in this Handbook wording that spells out how OCB or the Elected Committee will go through a process in declaring a contract null and void. So that particular, kind of grey area that’s been in there, that there is a complete description of what quality, quantity and price is,

excluding the, the thing on, on commissions. Because on the federal level it, it’s absolutely, you can’t, you can’t put out an RFP or any of that kind of stuff on commission. So those are the critical issues that we need to address, and that’s why we, you know, are scheduling that first meeting and to get this pounded out so we can get the dang thing sent to RSA and, and get it approved and go through the state process of adopting administrative rules. But we want to make sure that this time it gets done completely and correctly, like it wasn’t done back in 2001.

Young: All right. Anybody else have anything they want to add to it?

Colley-Dominique: For what it’s worth, I…

Stevenson, Derrick: Yeah, this is Derrick.

Miranda: Just a minute, Derrick.

Young: Just a sec, just a minute, Derrick. Cathy had something to say.

Colley-Dominique: Oh, I was just going to say, for what it’s worth, I, I do feel that Jerry’s point’s well taken. And, and, and Ken’s and stuff. I think we, because we kind of really thought we had taken care of pretty much the, yeah, everything that we thought would certainly be back long before now. So, I, I do, I applaud, I do agree with you, Jerry, that you know, it’s, it’s really frustrating, so…

Young: Okay, Derrick.

Stevenson, Derrick: Yeah, I don’t want to put a cog in the wheel or anything, but you know, we had a, we had a group that worked hard in, for weeks, upon weeks, upon weeks. You know, is knowledgeable about what we put in there and why we put stuff in there, and I just, I just think that that group, that particular group should be a part of this meeting. Because they’re already [inaudible], and I don’t think it would be proper for us to just say though, you, you don’t have a say anymore, thanks for your work, but we’ll do the rest. I mean, I think anybody that was in the consensus group should, should have the opportunity to serve on the rules and reg committee if they wish.

Young: Okay. Thanks, Derrick. Good input.

Stevenson, Derrick: Yeah.

Stevenson, Art: But they, everybody does, certainly, and everybody… Did everybody receive my, my email, ah, suggestions… And everybody… Everybody has the right to attend a committee meeting, especially in the rule making process. They have the right to submit any comments, any suggestions, anything to the Chair, and the whole committee will look at it. And so, I’m hoping that everyone in this room will participate, because it’s very, very important to all of us, this rule making process. And the more you understand it as blind licensed managers and work within it, the better it is. So, nobody will be excluded from coming to the meeting, sending in input, making suggestions, and in fact I encourage it, because then it makes it an easier process when we come to the Elected Committee meeting to vote on it, we don’t have to spend a long time debating it because we have all, all participated in the process. And it, it should, it’s… We have a committee, but it’s all our responsibilities to give input, to understand the laws, and rules, and regulations so that this program starts running smoother than what it has in the past.

Young: Okay, thank you.

Stevenson, Derrick: All right, and I just, I just want to make sure, you know, if we’re going to have this meeting, if we’re, if we need to have in place, what kind of rules we’re going to follow, if we’re going to do the consensus vote, or, or, or how things are going to finally be decided. Can’t just show up and not know the parameters of, of how we’re working. That make sense?

Female voice: Moving on…

Young: All righty…

Stevenson, Art: I will send something out so everybody knows what’s going on before the first committee, committee meeting occurs, so that everybody has the complete understanding of what process we’re going to…

Stevenson, Derrick: Thank you.

Young: Thank you. Okay, next meeting.

Miranda: Um, the last Thursday of November is Thanksgiving, so if you guys [inaudible] to get to the next Thursday which would be December 4th.

Brown: That’d be easier. Better.

Morris: Umm, oh, yeah, I’ll be back in town for that.

Mckinzie: And the week before we’ll all be in the BLAST [inaudible]…

Young: Yeah, that’ll be good, because everybody’ll be able to come back from BLAST and have some good input for the meeting, too. So…

Morris: So, December 4th? Okay.

Young: All righty, well, I move to…

Colley-Dominque: Mr. Chairman?

Young: Yes, Cathy?

Colley-Dominque: I’m sorry, I’d like to do two things. Some of you may know that my husband did have surgery about three weeks ago, and the Sunshine Fund sent him a beautiful arrangement. And he isn’t technically savvy and he asked me to please thank everybody for the stuff. And I want to thank Kathy and Art and, and, for all their work, and, and, and, and Eric, and to say that lunch was amazing.

[laughter]

Colley-Dominque: Thank you.

Young: Thank you. All right, well, I move to adjourn this meeting.

Stevenson, Art: Second.

Stevenson, Derrick: Hey, who’s got the basket?

Miranda: We’re going to do it right now.

Stevenson, Derrick: All right.

[end of meeting]