Adapted from a presentation by Professor Dave Mearns

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emphasising ‘non-directivity’ (Brodley, Bozarth)

emphasising the client’s ‘process’ (Greenberg, Elliott)

emphasising ‘focusing’ (Gendlin, Lietaer) emphasising the client’s existential

experiencing (Cooper) emphasising the relationship (Schmid,

Mearns)

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AAOffering

relational depth

BBNegotiating

client processes (including ‘difficult’ process)

CCContact with the

existential process

‘Relational depth’ is a state of profound contact and engagement between two people, in which each person is fully real to the Other, and able to understand and value the Other’s experiences at a high level.

Mearns, D. & Cooper, M. (2005) Working at Relational Depth in Counselling and Psychotherapy. London: Sage.

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(Buber) (Schmid)‘I-thou’ ‘Thou-I’ relating

Schmid, P.F. (2002). ‘Knowledge or acknowledgement? Psychotherapy as “the art of not-knowing” – prospects on further developments of a traditional paradigm’, Person-Centered and Experiential Psychotherapies, 1(1/2): 56-70.

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Encounter, not invasion

‘moments’ of relational depth;

relational depth experienced as a continuing relationship

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‘Presentational Level’ of Self

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We touch him in his experiencing; We ‘knock on his door’ at a deeper level

of his experiencing; We respect his positioning; But we do not collude with a superficiality

norm.

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High levels of the ‘therapeutic conditions’ in mutually enhancing interaction.

The ‘stillness’ and ‘fearlessness’ of the therapist.

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‘Listening to the expressing rather than the expression’

‘Meeting the client inside his experiencing’

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Two aims in offering the client an engagement at relational depth

Tony: I can’t, I can’t, I can’t, I can’t, I can’t …..

Bill: No, ….. you can’t. Tony: No one can. Bill: Silence Tony: (Thumping his fist on the floor and

screaming) I need to kill myself. Bill: Silence. Tony: I need to go ….. I must go ….. I

must go away from me. Bill: Silence.

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Tony: I don’t know how to do it. Bill: It’s hard, Tony …. It’s hard …..

there’s no way ….. Tony: No way ….. no way ….. How

do people do it? Bill: God knows Tony. Tony: Can you warm me Bill? Bill: Puts his arm round Tony.

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It’s an example of how you can be with someone and have conversation without having any idea what it’s about. Yet all the time you can feel them - and be with them feeling. It was weeks later that I found out the ‘content’ of this meeting. Tony was ‘being’ the part of him which had done some bad stuff. In war people can do bad stuff that they can’t live with later. Tony was feeling that part - he wanted to get rid of it - to kill it or for it to go away - to ‘exorcise’ it might be a good metaphor, But, of course, there was no way to do it - that’s what we were in. 16

‘Relational Depth’

‘Emotional Depth’

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Relational depth is about the quality of the relational contact, not

the quantity

‘Existential Process’

‘Psychotic Process’ (Prouty)‘Fragile Process’ (Warner)‘Dissociated Process’ (Warner)‘Ego-Syntonic Process’‘Existential Disconnection’‘Transference’

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RestrictingExistentialContact

The person has survived a parenting in which love and acceptance was not reliable. Negative experiences would follow when positives might be expected – there was no way to rely on the relationship. Ridicule, hate or abuse would come when love might be expected.

To survive, the person needed to:1) Withdraw their emotional attachment.2) Find ways to control the relationship3) Find ways to control themselves in relationship.

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The fellow who has a parent who is sometimes nice and sometimes horrible thinks that is the way the world is. Now, in my own case, that is how it was. At the time when I came to the school I think the difficulty was, among other things, that I was confronted by Patti [his counselor], who was an exceptionally fine human being and a very affectionate and decent human being. I wasn’t able to accept the affection, which caused even more anger because everyone likes to accept affection.

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popular but ‘unreachable’; alone and lonely; controlling; cold; cruel; homicidal and suicidal;

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The person’s self-protective systems become generalised to other relationships (cf Sterne’s ‘RIGs’ – ‘Representations of Interactions that have become Generalised’). The seriousness of the resulting pattern can vary hugely. The person may become:

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In its mild expression their ego-syntonic process leads the person to be confused and scared in relationships. They know that things go wrong for them and they come to expect things to go wrong. But they genuinely do not understand why they go wrong. They have done their best. They have even tried to think about what the other person wants, and be that (within limits). But it always goes wrong.

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In another expression they attract relations but fail in relationships because, ultimately, they have to be so controlling. They need to define the reality and protect against its changing. They provide well on a material level, function well enough in more superficial relationships, but they must not make themselves existentially vulnerable. Usually they are genuinely surprised when the other person leaves them. Again, they had done their best.

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In a more serious expression, the person is dangerous to themselves and others. They are so threatened by relationship that their self-protection manifests itself not in confusion or controlling, but in detachment and even violence. Their fear is so profound and the degree of adjustment they have obtained so tenuous that detachment and even destruction (of self or other) are the only existetial ‘protections’ they have left.

‘But there really was someone there to love – I saw him – I saw him often’.

‘It’s not just a “rescuer” thing – it’s much stronger than that’. I couldn’t let him go because there were times I really saw him.

‘It’s so frustrating – sometimes she was a wonderful person – she was the fullest human being anyone could want…but then it would evaporate in tears and anger’.

‘He couldn’t let me in. For 20 years he couldn’t let me in. We could even talk about how he couldn’t let me in – Maybe that was it – at times he wasn’t who he was’.

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The separation of the person in their everyday life from the

existential significance of their life (c.f. Bill Murray and Scarlett

Johansson in ‘Lost in Translation’)

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‘A part of me is not sure she should trust you, but…’.

‘I can’t believe I’ve just talked about me, like that, with an old man like you.’

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‘Difficult process’ rarely defines the whole of the person. Often there is a dissonant part that houses a different conception of self. Its appearance can be erratic and its voice very small. Often its dominant feeling is sadness.

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He gives you his self as he experiences his self.

What he gives is not dominated by relational self- protective strategies

He finds it impossible to lie.31

Sandie: Do you really want to know me? Like, do you want to meet the ‘me’ that I am to myself?

Dave: Yes, I want to meet all of you.(Pause)Sandie: I kill my babies.Dave: Is that meant to put me off?Sandie: No, it’s just what I do.Dave: (serious eye contact) You ‘kill your babies’

….. It’s a difficult thing even for me to say. I have to ‘steel’ myself to say the words. They are hard words for me to say - I think that’s why I was glib.

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Sandie: It’s what I do - the words are me - I’ve killed three babies inside me.

Dave: You sound ….. You sound ‘flat’ about it - on the outside at least - I don’t know what you are ‘inside’ about it …..?

Sandie: I need to feel ‘flat’ inside about it as well.Dave: Yes ….. I think I can understand that ….. I

think I really can ….. it’s the only way ….. to …..

Sandie: Survive.Dave: Yes.Sandie: Isn’t that funny …..Dave: That when you feel as you do, you still

want to survive?Sandie: Yes - I’ve never thought about that before.

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Bobby: I’ve been feeling really bad things Dave - really bad things.

Dave: Tell me Bobby.Bobby: I don’t know if I can Dave ….. I don’t know if I can.Dave: This is really tough for you Bobby - I can see that

in your face. You’ve tried to make yourself tell me by bringing it up. But it’s still maybe not possible. I say ‘tell me Bobby’ like I usually do ….. but this is not ‘usual’ stuff - this is ….. different …..

(Pause)Bobby: Dave ….. I want to kill me.(Long silence)Bobby: All the roads lead there - I could make a good job

of it too.

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Dave: I bet you could, Bobby - I’m scared to use my imagination.

Bobby: It would be one thing I could do well.Dave: What are all the feelings Bobby - how do ‘all

the roads lead here’?Bobby: I don’t know if I want to go into it Dave - I’ve

got to this point and I feel a kind of ….. peace.Dave: Christ Bobby, this is tough for me. I knew you

were going to say that. I want to stay with you in that and I want to pull you away from that. I’m no use to you unless I can stay with you in it.

Bobby: That’s not true Dave - it’s nice for me to hear that. Anyway, you couldn’t stop me.

Dave: I really knew you were going to use that ‘peace’ word. I could feel how ‘all the roads lead there’. I can see how that is a conclusion for you ….. and a retribution for you …..

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It’s the same as cutting yourself used to be for you, isn’t it?

Bobby: Yes, it has the same sense of ‘punishment’ and ‘control’ ….. Do you understand how important it is for me to face this?

Dave: Yes, I do. You must face the question that perhaps the only way to make retribution is to execute yourself.

(Long silence)Dave: You will have worked it all out?Bobby: In detail, Dave - in detail.(Long silence)Bobby: It’s funny to feel so alone, yet with

someone.(Long silence)

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When a client is met at relational depth and enters his existential process, he takes an ‘inside’ view of his Self. From that perspective he sometimes experiences his Self in terms of different ‘parts’ rather than a single ‘whole’.

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