1991 10-16-17 Tridandisvami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Gosvami Maharaja Discourse on Madhurya...

7/29/2019 1991 10-16-17 Tridandisvami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Gosvami Maharaja Discourse on Madhurya Kada

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1991_10_16&17_MADHURYA KADAMBINI THIRD MEETING 3 AND QUES

FROM GOV PUJA TAPE

rla Gurudeva: Then we shoulduh(Hindi aside)I wanted to see these things before your

coming.

GBC: But you didn't get a chance

rla Gurudeva: but no time; very scarcity of time.

GBC: It doesn't matter. It is already inside of you.

rla Gurudeva:(chuckles). Any question? No?

GBC: No, I just want to hear you explain more.

rla Gurudeva:You have any question? You are satisfied?

GBC: UmI want more explanation.

rla Gurudeva: What about you? Any question? Everything is so easy for you. And he is an in-

tellectual gent.

(chuckles with audience)

Then we should go. What thing?

GBC: Where was the place we left off?

You had explainedyadcchay. You had already explained.

(discussing where rla Gurudeva left off with other members of GBC)

I think in speaking Mahrja explained almost the entire first chapter.

GBC: No, really?

rla Gurudeva:Something.

GBC: Maybe something more.

GBC: No, he hasn't explained this.

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GBC: Where?

GBC: Page four.

GBC:Mah

rja, I have a question: "Nor is bhakti dependent even upon faith:sacred api parigi-

tam raddhay helaya va.." And then it explains that, "The name of Krsna chanted even once, ei-

ther with faith or without faith, can deliver any man." But, still, to say that faith is not necessary

seems very surprising. Even though one verse is given that the Hare Ka mantra is so great

even without faith he gets benefit. But don't you need faith for bhakti? Isn't great faith needed?

But here it says it's not needed, or not dependent on faith.

Audience: sakrda api parigitamraddhay helaya va.

GBC: Don't we need faith in Guru and faith instra?

rla Gurudeva:(Hindi aside) We have not yet discussed these things.

GBC: No.

rla Gurudeva: It will come.

Here, dna vrata homa rddhaya it has been finished. After that he is giving some lokas, refer-

ence. Sreyah svitim bhaktim udasya te vibho and ko 'vartha apto 'bhajatam sva-dharmatah pur-

vaiva bhuman bahavo 'pi yoginah (reading directly from original Bengali version [jna

karma yogina]).

Here he is telling that ko 'vartha apto 'bhajatam sva-dharmatah. Bysadachara, or by ubha kar-

ma, we may have bhakti if anyone tells prva-paka.Prva-paka you know?

GBC: Questions, answers.

rla Gurudeva: Questions and answers. Any one questions that. Next, (ubha) karma and

sadachara give bhakti. Withoutsadachara and ubha karma we may not have bhakti. Here Vi-

vantha Cakravart hkura is quoting this loka from rmad Bhgavatam thatsadachara and

by ubha karma or (sata) karma bhakti can not come.Ko 'vartha apto 'bhajatam sva-dharmatah.

He is telling that if a man hasprarambha karnastarted to do Hari bhakti but he has not left his

bad works asadachara. He is yet doing some asadachara and not ubha karma, aubha kar-

ma he may do it. But he is trying to do ananyabhajana also.

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Here he is telling that, if a man living sva-dharma; sva-dharma meaning service of father and

mother.

GBC: Occupational duty. Prescribed duty.

rla Gurudeva: Varrama dharma. If a man living all these things he has started to do bha-

jana of Ka and in the mid-way he falls down, no harm. Again he will, after that is gone, any

how he will get any (indistinct) and he will start from there. Thatptam, falling down, will not

disturb him. For some time it will cover; but after some time, after enjoying, the karma phala, he

will again start bhakti. But if a man, leaving hari bhajana, doing (sata) karma,sadachara, and

varrama dharma, very faithfully he is following, what is gained? He gains nothing because

he will have some bhoga, enjoyment, after that again he will fall forever. So, there is nothing to

gain in this. So, if a man falls, if he'ssakma yet, no harm. God will fulfill hisquench.

GBC: Quench his thirst.

rla Gurudeva: And again he will do bhakti after that. He falls down, he will fall down, but yet

Ka will take his hand and he will again engage in his service. So, we should only fear from

apardha anartha; these are a kind of anartha. But here this can not give adhikr to bhakti,

these things. So, we should respect a man who is yet fallen but doing bhakti; not to a man who is

so pure to his varramadharma.

GBC: We see examples of this in ISKCON sometimes. Some devotees, even they are fallen but

they are still doing bhakti.

rla Gurudeva:Then they should be respected. But very carefully. Not interjectionuh

GBC: Not intimate association

rla Gurudeva: Association. We should not do nind or anything like that. But we should not

praise also. If he comes, oh come, come on. But not from heart. Not association. Sadachara sam-

bandha, aikntika bhakta, they should be associated with. And especially those who are more

qualified than us.

He is telling that also (break audio)anything?

GBC: No. No.

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rla Gurudeva: For having Kaprema or doing bhakti someone thinks that we should take

help ofjna yoga karma or any thing. But these things are not good. Only bhakti can be done.

No help from all these things. Some times we see that we should do some yoga for our body.

GBC: For health.

rla Gurudeva:For health.

GBC: For good health.

rla Gurudeva:We should do some yoga.

Audience: Exercise.

rla Gurudeva: These are yogas. But I think for Vraja bhakti these areprtikla. Wrestling and

all these things. It uhwhat?

It coversgopagopbhva, especiallygopbhva andpurua bhva comes.Purua means?

GBC: Man. Male false ego.

rla Gurudeva:So, we should not adopt.

GBC: We should discuss this point further because so many of use are doing these exercises.

GBC:Otherwise we can not digest food, we are sleeping all the time, we are tired.

GBC: Yesterday he saw Ayurvedic doctor who said get more exercise. Now is there an vaiava

exercise that is notprtikla?

GBC: We should wrestle with Tamla Ka Mahrja.

GBC: Dancing in krtana

rla Gurudeva:Ah! Dancing in krtana and doingparirama for all thesesev it will do.

GBC:Parirama?

Audience: Labor. Hard labor.

rla Gurudeva:Labor.

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GBC: Most of our labor is taking pen and moving

GBC: All day long we are simply sitting and talking, writing, and thinking. We have no opportu-

nity for any exercise.

GBC: Except for Hanumn.

rla Gurudeva:In krtana? You should do krtana surely. Both purposes will be solved.

GBC: Supposing when we are doing these exercises we are playing some tape recording of

Ka-kath. Then our conscienceness is hearing the recording but the body is doing the exercise

but the mind is thinking of the tape recording. Is it stillprtikla?

rla Gurudeva:I am telling of yogas. Especially yogas.

GBC:Aga-yoga,pryma.

rla Gurudeva: Aga, pryma, all these things. Caitanya Mahprabhu has done bhakti

cult so easy that we can do everything. In dancing and doing thissev, thissev. To go Govard-

hana to come to doparikram. These are all the things.

We should try to save our innerbhva anywhere anyhow. And if there is no bhva then (go out

indistinct) what you are doing? Doing bhakti also and all these things also. But a special bhva

has come in our heart and those things which are opposite we should try to leave all these things.

We will think it. You will think it.

If any man is in gopbhva, he is doing, he should not do anything that his purua bhva will

come. By (daunknown)puruabhva can come.

GBC: By daa?

GBC: Something with a stick. Exercise.

rla Gurudeva:Daameans exercise. Whatgops have done, dance with Ka and all ac-

tivities, we can follow. And if you think to besakh you can wrestle you can do all these things.

Good for you.

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We should follow every thing of that person to whom we have greed. That is anukla. And those

who have not gone up to this stage they can do everything. For body also for mind also for

everything.

GBC: But what if we haven't come to that stage but we want to come to that stage? Then

stop?

rla Gurudeva:We have to consider from very beginning.

GBC: Where we are at. You have to consider your actual stage and not imitate.

rla Gurudeva: We should go to real position. Not imitation. But to follow from beginning it is

good. From beginning.

GBC: So much of our work, not only exercise, developspurua bhva. We are managing. Wehave to say, "You must do this, immediately!" Most of our life is like that.

rla Gurudeva: You are doing for gurusev. If it is actually gurusev all will help you. And

you should wait for that time. Then actually this will come.

He is also telling that:yat marabhir yat tapasa jana vairagyatas ca yat. What begets fromyaja,

yga, vrata, tapasy,jna, vairgya, yoga, tapasy. Only by bhakti doing we will have all these

things.

If a man has started bhakti then he is requiring stra jna, reading so many books and somequalities, he is doing effort for gaining some qualities, it should not be done.

Understanding?

GBC: But study ofstra is good.

rla Gurudeva:Is good.

GBC: If it increases that bhva.

rla Gurudeva: Increases that bhva. But to increase bhakti this idea is not there and we, for

our name and fame, and that I am so much learned person, we are doing all these things, then it

is bhakti virodh. We should do:

ravaa krtana vio

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smaraa pda-sevanam

arcana vandana dsya

sakhyam tma-nivedanam

All these things. To read book is also ravaa, it comes. When we chant harinma man goes

everywhere, hither and thither, it may go; but when we are emerged in reading books who has

come, not come. Nothing. So, it is a good kind of bhakti.

GBC: It is easier to pay attention by reading than by chanting.

rla Gurudeva: And if it is of rmad Bhgavatam and of tenth canto, especiallysakh, sakh

sambandhi, then is is so good. By remembering man can go hither and thither by chanting also

he could do; but not in reading. Whole energy should be given there so mind does not go here

and there.

In bhakti, he is telling that for yoga,yaja, tapasy, vrata, homa,svdhyya,sanyam, they will

dee, kla, and ptra; dee, kla, and ptra?

GBC: Time, place, and circumstance.

rla Gurudeva:Time, place, and circumstances. They should be verypavitra.

GBC: Pure.

rla Gurudeva: Pure. If these three are not pure they will not give any fruit. But for bhakti no

need. When we are reading bhakti, whether it is magha or any bad nakshatra, should not (indis-

tinct). When we are giving name and dk, or taking, no this times should be considered. When

harinma is given or harinma taken, that time is good. Whether it may be magha, agha, or

anything.

GBC: It might even be in the evening.

rla Gurudeva:Evening, morning, any

GBC: Fordk also?

rla Gurudeva:Uh?

GBC: Fordk also?

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rla Gurudeva: Fordk also. But those who have not this quality to think these things they

should be given in proper time. To increase theirrddha only; but harinma and dk mantra

does not need all these things.

GBC: I remember our guru Mahrja was givingsannysa to someone and this person was verykeen to getsannysa. So, he told me, "Make a big arrangement so he thinks that something has

happenend."

rla Gurudeva: Otherwise nothing is needed. Only that mantra is needed and at any time it can

given. Gopla mantra has no time and space and all these things. It is siddha mantra. But yet,

seeing the condition ofsdhaka, guru gives it. Thinking all these things, that he may not feel

anything.

I have heard that Prabhupda has given any one, in evening, dk mantra. No fireyaja andnothing. And that is dk. Only Gopla mantra he gave. But now, "Oh gurudeva, you have not

given your guru mantra."

Caitanya Mahprabhu, um, I svara Purpa da not any mantra, only Gopla mantra; and that Gopla

mantra onlygopjana-vallabhaya svaha. Not all these things, full mantras. Because it issiddha

mantra. No fire, nothing,yaja, nothing was done. But we need all these things.

These are like a karma but yet vaiava has recommended them: vaiava yaja, vaiava homa,

vaiavarddha, and they do it only for

GBC: For therddha of their ancestors.

rla Gurudeva: They don't require any bhakti. When they mother of Nrada i was dead and

he left that dead body there. Went away.

GBC: Norddha ceremony.

rla Gurudeva:No, nothing, nothing.

(Hindi aside)

He is telling: (reading from original Sanskrit).

Lubdhaka means uh?

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Audience: Hunter.

rla Gurudeva:Hunter. Oh, hunter.

GBC:Hunter deer.

rla Gurudeva:Deers hunter.

GBC: Hunter! Oh!Mgayu. Like this.

rla Gurudeva:Mgayu. Oh, mgayu, nma sakrtana rpa bhakti aga anuhne. When a

person is doing harinmasakrtanadee niyamne. The niyam for place.

GBC: Limitation of place.

GBC: Rules. Rule of

rla Gurudeva:Pavitram. Rules and regulations.

GBC: Yea, rules and regulations.

rla Gurudeva: For place or time no niyam at all. And, in harinma, ucchiyou are eating

something and you can not dosakrtana. It is not forbidden there. You can do.

khiteuite yath tath nma laya

kla-dea-niyama nhi, sarva siddhi haya

[Regardless of time or place, one who chants the holy name, even while eating or sleeping, attains all perfection.

CC Antya (20.18)]

GBC: What about when we are doing theyaja?

rla Gurudeva: Yaja.

GBC: Yeah, when you do theyaja.

rla Gurudeva:There it will be; because it is karma like karma. So, there

GBC: And when you are doingsev of the mrtisev you can not eat.

rla Gurudeva:No, here he is telling about nmasakrtana. Insev we should

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GBC: Be (indistinct-purified)

rla Gurudeva:all these things.

But I think anysev, ifbh

vabhakti is there, he can do anything. He is taking something, him-

self, and he can give to Ka, like Yaod.

Santana Gosvmcame to Mathur and saw that a widow was serving her two boys. One was

Madana-Gopla Himself and other was her son. They were playing together and so many places

they were playing.

One day Santana Gosvm came and saw that they were playing guli daa; daa you

know.

Audience: A stick and(game).

rla Gurudeva: Ka was defeated by that boy. At first Ka won and that boy was defeated.

Ka told that, "You should sit, I will sit on your shoulders." He did so. He went some distance

and when Ka was defeated then boy told that, "You should sit and I will sit on your shoul-

ders." Ka at once fled away and He entered in temple and the boy followed with that stick.

That you are not giving my

Audience: Reward.

rla Gurudeva: reward and you are flying. I will catch hold of You, I will beat You. So, he

followed up to mandirbut there priest was there and he prohibited that boy, "Oh, don't come

here." Then he told from there that, "I will see tomorrow."

Santana Gosvmwas amazing, "How this is." Next day he came again to see them playing. He

saw that the two boys were weeping and they were wanting something to take, eat, and mother

was cooking khich. She was washing her mouth by a stick.

GBC: And she was cooking at the same time.

rla Gurudeva: And cooking and by same thing. By this here (hand gesture?) and she was

cooking.

Santana Gosvmtold that, "You are brhmaa lady have you takensnna?"

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"No, I have not done."

"So, without taking bath and by thisyour all thing are coming in this and you are doing and

this will give to two boys. Oh, it should not be done."

"At first I did not do. Now I'll obey you."

Second day he again came and saw that both boys were weeping and lady has begun to take bath

and after that came, washed all the pots, and she brought good clear water, pavitra water, and

then began to cookkitri from spoon. And it was too late and the boys were weeping. Santana

Gosvm thought that, " Svayam Brahman Ka, wanting to take her, ucchi, so I have done

mistake. He is weeping to take herucchi."Ucchi means?

Audience: Remnants.

rla Gurudeva: Remnants. So, she should do what she wants. Then he begged pardon and told

that, "You should not take bath; you should not be pure; what you want, you should do and serve

these boys."

So, in bhakti ucchi and all these things but that person should be, thatsdhaka should be, in

upper level.

GBC: Where is that from, that narration about Santana Gosvm, which, is it from some

scripture?

rla Gurudeva: Bhakti-ratnkara. There are so many places. Caitanya Mahprabhu also told:

khiteuite yath tath nma laya

kla-dea-niyama nhi, sarva siddhi haya

[Regardless of time or place, one who chants the holy name, even while eating or sleeping, attains all perfection.

CC Antya (20.18)]

If you are taking something and your Gurudeva has called you, "Oh, come at once." What will

you do?

GBC: Drop everything and go.

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rla Gurudeva: Even I will not wash my hands. At first see that what is his orders and then I

will wash hand and if something order is to carry at once in this same uh

Audience: Condition.

rla Gurudeva:condition I will do first.

GBC: We were on a train with our Guru Mahrja. So, we were all eating so, he said, "Give me

some more of this." So, their hands, they were eating, he said, "Just give it to me. Don't worry

about it." So, he said, "Just give it, don't wash your hands. Serve me now." Like that.

rla Gurudeva:So, in connection of Ka also as Guru vaiava.

GBC: You told that your Guru Mahrja did not take bath for so many days.

rla Gurudeva:Uh.

GBC: Ka was accepting everything he did.

rla Gurudeva: He used to tell that, "I don't want to loss my time in bathing and all these

things." At least one hour it will take, this time will take. Why should I loss? For these clothes

when it will be maila

Audience: Dirty.

rla Gurudeva: dirty after two, three, four days, five days. No harm.

GBC: And bathe only once in a long time.

Audience: One month. On day ofprim.

GBC: One month. Once in a month.

rla Gurudeva: On prim. He used to tell that his Prabhupda also used to do. He used to

take oneghoti of water. Ghoti?

Audience: Lota. One pot.

rla Gurudeva: Ghoti you know?

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GBC: Pot.

rla Gurudeva:Pot. Little pot.

Audience:Lota.

rla Gurudeva: And after shaving all these things he used to fall the water from here but all

water

Audience: Outside.

rla Gurudeva:outside. So, very little water used to come there. And

GBC: Why he did that?

rla Gurudeva: (with mirth) Maha-purua? You can not ask from Datttreya and all otherswhy. They are not in this body, physical body. Always thinking and thinking.

(break audio)

rla Gurudeva:In any mantra ucharana

In uttering any karmmantra, ourjna, karma, yogi, ityd.. The fruit will be upset; indra-a-

tro indra-atro. Upset. Understanding?

GBC:Yes.

rla Gurudeva: That brhmaa, i, wanted to take revenge from Indra. So, he was doing

something Tantric upacra. Tantric upacra you know? Tantric upacra, so that Indra should be

killed. So, he wasjapa-ing

GBC: Chanting.

rla Gurudeva:Not chanting.

Audience: Uttering.

rla Gurudeva: uttering in mind some mantra indra-atro vivardhasva [from SB

(6.9.11)].

hata-putras tatas tva

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juhvendryaatrave

indra-atro vivardhasva

m cira jahi vidviam

[After Vivarpa was killed, his father, Tva, performed ritualistic ceremonies to kill Indra. He offered oblations in

the sacrificial fire, saying, O enemy of Indra, flourish to kill your enemy without delay.SB (6.9.11)]

The atro of Indra should come and kill him. But, by chance, it was uttered wrongly.Indra-atru

vivardhasva: he stressed on atro. Indra will be atro of my son. The meaning came. And at last

that was done. He got a son and that was killed by Indra. That son could not kill Indra. So, in

karma yaja, leaving bhakti, anything will upset; but in bhakti: kl kya govindo nama.

Nothing will be harmed. Bhva will be there, and Ka will take it, but by knowing all these

things I will do like this, then everything will be

Audience: Finished.

rla Gurudeva: If a man is telling kya kr snve. Only he is telling Ka, no harm. His bh-

va should be there.

GBC: Sometimes we hear a devotee, I have seen sometimes, especially in China, I sit and I lis-

ten to some devotee and they may not be chanting the mahmantra always perfectly.

rla Gurudeva:No harm. God knows. Ka knows everything.

GBC: You say the Chinese can't even say it.

GBC: Yeah, they have difficulty saying it.

rla Gurudeva: I have seen a lady: We were trying her to chant Hare Ka, Hare K a,

Ka Ka, Hare Hare/ Hare Rma, Hare Rma, Rma Rma, Hare Hare. And she was so

much eager, waiting for so many years; but we tried hard but she could not utter all at a time.

Hare Ka, Hare. I told that, "Everything you will have. You should do."

GBC: Was she an uneducated lady?

rla Gurudeva:(indistinct)

GBC: But very eager.

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rla Gurudeva: Very eager. And always doing with mala; always. And such veryvery with

rddha. Serving everything.

GBC: One of ourWhen Guru-Mahrja gave us thegyatr, first time, one of our godbroth-

ers, very sincere devotee named Jaynanda, so, he could not get the correct pronunciation. So, hewent with me and we went to Guru-Mahrja. So, he said, "I can not get this correctly." So,

Guru-Mahrja said, "You say it, let me hear." So, he tried to say it but it was so wrong that

Guru-Mahrja started to laugh. He said, "It is hopeless." He said, "You don't worry." He said,

"Ka will except. Ka is excepting your feelings. Never mind."

rla Gurudeva:(joyous laughter from rla Gurudeva)

GBC: But he was laughing.

rla Gurudeva:When bhvana is there then Ka takes everything.

GBC: In Bhakti-rasmta-sindhu one of the agas is mentioned is nma japa. So, I think the

commentaries mention kl kya nama as the mantra. So, we don't chant that mantra. We

chant mahmantra.

rla Gurudeva: What Caitanya Mahprabhu and His followers have done, we should do. What

our guru has given, only his instructions, should be followed.

(Hindi aside)

sakrda api parigitam sraddaya helaya va

(Mdhurya Kdambin)

He was asking.

If there is no apardha there then withoutrddha or anything Ka name will catchrddha.

brguvara nara matram tarayet krsna-nama

(Mdhurya Kdambin)

In jna, or karma, by chance a man does any durcra, any kind of durcra, you understand

durcra?

Audience: Bad habits.

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rla Gurudeva: Um. Bad habits. They are called nirlajja and vaman bhog. Vaman bhog

means

Audience:Vnta-.

GBC: Vnta-. Oh.

rla Gurudeva: Vnta-. What?

GBC: Vomit

rla Gurudeva: and again taking.

(reading from original Sanskrit Mdhurya Kdambin) Kasa, Hiranyakaipu, Rvaadi

They were so much jn, learned persons. Rvaa so much learned person and he was certainlya guru ofjns. He has wrote some Lankastra.

GBC: Who is this?

rla Gurudeva:Rvaa.

GBC: Ah! Rvaa.

rla Gurudeva: Kasa also, uh, Hiranyakaipu also. He was a learned person of Vedas. They

can utter and do Vedic rti. Everything there. But they were durcrso, in stra, stra has re-buked them. But forbhakta it has not been told. Like Ajmila, no nind of Ajmila; Bilvama-

gala and likewise.

bhakti par bhagavati pratilabhya kma / hd-rogam v apahinoty acirea dhra

He has taken aloka from rmad Bhgavatam:

vikrita vraja-vadhbhir ida ca vio

raddhnvito nuuyd atha varayed ya

bhakti par bhagavati pratilabhya kmahd-rogam v apahinoty acirea dhra

[Anyone who faithfully hears or describes the Lords playful affairs with the young gops of Vndvana will attainthe Lords pure devotional service. Thus he will quickly become sober and conquer lust, the disease of the heart.

SB (10.33.39)]

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Someone tells that we should give up our bad habits and then we should do bhakti.

GBC:After.

rla Gurudeva:Uh. Afterwards. If there is a pot full of clay we should take out all these clays

and wash that pot and then we should put water. That water will be qualified for drinking. If clay

is fully there, not a drop of water will come in that pot. So, we should give up all these things.

Here Vivantha Cakravart hkura is telling that, having this body, physical body, physical

mind, anyone can not be pure, quite pure. So, if we try to be pure and then after being pure we

will do bhakti, it is absurd. So, in what stage you are, you should adopt bhakti and by bhakti

everything will gradually go out and in the ratio bhakti comes all these goes away.

vikrita vraja-vadhbhir ida ca vio

First we should hear bhakti in what stage we are.

hd-rogam v apahinoty acirea dhra

If we have hd-roga, hd-roga means kma vsan, hankering from viaya to taste viaya.

Everything is there. So, if you have, but at the same time you have taste in hearing, chanting and

all these things, you should do. You should not try to concentrate your mind. You should try to be

so pure. You should do bhakti and by doing bhakti you will have, create, no time for all these

things. And hd-roga will come; hd-roga is bad to any other otherroga.

Audience: Worst than any other disease.

rla Gurudeva: This is very worst roga, kma roga, that Bilvamagala had Prahlda Mahrja

had.

Audience: Prahlda Mahrja?

rla Gurudeva: At first part. When he was in brhmaa clothes. Nrada also has this in Gand-

harva Janakabirth.

So, when bhakti is done hd-rogam v apahinoty acirea dhra. Whenpara-bhakti is done toBhagavn, by the effect of thatpara-bhakti, hd-roga yet goes away. Slowly. So, we should not

try to concentrate our mind and all these things to do, but always be engaged in bhakti so that a

single moment will not be found to do all these things.

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So, he is telling that those who, the persons, those who are some rddha, and by rddha they

are hearing rmad Bhgavatam, rsa-panchadhaya or any pastime withgops, they are hearing

with rddha, those persons will have para-bhakti and by having para-bhakti every hd-roga

and everything will go away. Certainly. So, do not try to leave all these bad habits at first. They

should wash these, all these things, by bhakti only.

GBC: Still we see that we try to remove some bad habits. If we see in a devotee, in a disciple or

something, some habits which are not good we may point it out.

rla Gurudeva:But we will be have some balbhakti and by bhakti these thoughts are coming.

What I want to say?

GBC: I'm not sure.

GBC: That it's by your devotion that you destroy their

rla Gurudeva:No.

I am thinking to destroy all these things; but why?

GBC: By bhakti's strength.

rla Gurudeva: Bhakti is coming slowly and slowly they we are thinking like this. If we are

not in a mood to hear, chant, and to go in the association ofbhaktiman purua this thought will

not come. So, it is the effect of bhakti that we are thinking like so and then we are doing so, it is

proper.

So, he is telling that ifkma is there, kma means

Audience: Lust.

rla Gurudeva: Lust is there, or any asadachar is there, he is not, this fact is not that, "He

should not do bhakti."

GBC: But he can not be given initiation, our spiritual master said, unless you give up illicit sex,

intoxication, meat-eating, and gambling for six months, then you can get initiation and dk.

rla Gurudeva:(unknown Hindi aside)

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We say like this, Guru says like this, but he knows that everything is there but he can not leave.

GBC: Can not give up the bad habits.

rla Gurudeva:Mm-uh. By bhakti he can give up. You are married but you are doing the same

thing that you are doing but you have got license only. So, he knows that he is doing everything

but under his license he is doing. If that thought does not come in my heart then it is pure any-

thing, to marry or anything. We are not smoking, no? We are not drinking and gambling. We

have no lust or anything but we have no charm in harinma chanting or hearing hari-kath.

What will be the use of all these things?

So, guru tells it as a warning but he knows that is everything is there.

GBC: Everything is there means?

GBC: You are doing the bad things.

rla Gurudeva: Bad things are there, in any form or other form, but they are. We want praise

also at that time. I think that if a man takes bidi cigarette and if a man does a nind of any

vaiava, who is more culprit?

GBC: The vaiavanind.

rla Gurudeva:But we don't think it. We say, "Oh, you gamble?"

"Uh. Yes."

"Then you will not have harinma."

GBC: But are you saying that we should give harinma even if

rla Gurudeva:No, I am not saying this. You should

GBC: Get the point.

rla Gurudeva: my heart's view. We know that something is wrong but yet we give harin-ma orcrya gives harinma.

"You gamble?"

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"No, umYes."

"You have lust?"

"Yes."

"You should not do this. You have any asadra?"

"Yes, I have."

"You should leave all these things."

Four things, Parkit Mahrja, um, ukadeva Gosvmhas dytam pnam striyah sn (rmad

Bhgavatam 1.17.38)

These four things. But these are not so offensive to do nind avgya of vaiavas or toum"Oh, harinma will not do all these things." These are more sinful. But yet we don't care

for all these things. We, um, a kaniha-adhikrgoes on that points, outer points, but vaiava,

uddha-vaiava, uttam-adhikrgoes on this.

If a man in habit of taking cigarette, what is harm in bhakti cult of he takes? Any harm? What

harm? But he tells lie, he is doing offense of bhakti nma apardha and all these things, anartha

is there. But anartha is not there, only he is smoking? What is harm?

Audience: Smoking is anartha.

GBC: There are some harms.

rla Gurudeva:What?

GBC: UhI think

rla Gurudeva:If Vasdsa Bbjis takinggudgudi, what harm?

Audience: He is liberated soul.

rla Gurudeva: If you are taking (unknown) this period, Cturmsya, what harm? If I will see

that, we shave on prim, if a man comes being shaved on other days, "Oh, why you have

shaved? You should not do like this." Is it harm for bhakti? Shaving or not shaving. If a man not

shaves, what is harm? But yet we are following our guru parampar. We should do what they

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The prostitute lady went to Haridsa hkur and Haridsa hkur, by chanting, he gave that lady

Ka bhakti, pure Ka bhakti, and she became mahnti. So much great lady that all mahnts,

mahnts means

Audience: Great vaiavas.

rla Gurudeva: great vaiavas used to go and

Audience: take herdarana.

rla Gurudeva: darana and to salute and to doprama and everything. Bhakti is so much

powerful that anyone, if he enters in his heart, he becomes pure and he is very srestha in this

world.

GBC: Very?

Audience: Great person.

rla Gurudeva: Uttambhakta and devat, Brahm, akara, all respect.

Vas today's

Now it will be easier.

GBC: More quickly.

Audience: Second chapter one day, third chapter one day.

GBC: No, I doubt it.

GBC: The students are slow.

rla Gurudeva:No, I am slow. My English knowing is giving disturbance.

GBC: No

rla Gurudeva:Otherwise everything

GBC: Not to us. Not to our ears.

rla Gurudeva:It takes time.

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GBC: Quite sweet.

rla Gurudeva:I am not satisfied but you are satisfied. Hindi and Bengali I will be satisfied

I have seen that translation but so wrong.

Audience: English or the

Audience: English. Idea is different. Just opposite.

GBC: Which one?

Audience: In that Jaiva-Dharma. Just opposite.

rla Gurudeva:Question is different, answer is different.

GBC: What's that your manuscript?

GBC: I don't know. I don't have any manuscript.

rla Gurudeva:I will show you.

Then you will come tomorrow? At seven.

GBC: Today you have a program.

rla Gurudeva:What?

GBC: I think you are going out today. You mentioned that you are going somewhere.

(break audio)

GBC: We are most poor. They are rich.

rla Gurudeva: You will go to, certainly, when ISKCON person will call you and you will go

to so many rich person, but we are not rich. And began to weep bitterly. I told her that I have got

(indistinct) today very (indistinct).

GBC: Did that person come to see you who was on the roadside. In the bus when we were going

(indistinct) on person who was there.

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GBC: Sdhu Mahrja.

rla Gurudeva:Uh? Sdhu Mahrja?

GBC:The one who ta

astha

akti book.

rla Gurudeva:Oh, yes, yes.

GBC: He came and saw you inRpa-Santana?

rla Gurudeva: We went day before yesterday but at that time I was ready to come here. So,

only one minute or two minutes. He didprama to me. No

GBC: Nothing special.

rla Gurudeva:Nothing special. And I wasthere were so many persons there questioning, Iwas answering. He sat down for two or three minutes. He did not go to ISKCON?

GBC: No.

rla Gurudeva:He has takensannysa by rdhar Mahrja?

GBC: No. He tooksannysa from a disciple from one of the devoteesa disciple of our guru

Mahrja who had joined rdhar Mahrja gave himsannysa on behalf ofrdhar Mahrja.

rla Gurudeva:But I told him, "Your fact may be true thatjva has not come from Goloka but

the persons and the ideas of Svmji was not like this." He has told as a general but putting of

(his presentation) is not so. I told him.

Audience: (indistinct)

rla Gurudeva: I told that I have given a lecture there and somehow I have clearly that both the

ideas of our guruparampar and Svmji are one, not opposite. They have told something he is

silent in some cases and he has told that: jvera svarpa haya kera nitya-dsa.So, I

think that these are not controversy.

GBC: You have reconciled.

rla Gurudeva:I told that you should have reconciled, it was very good. He could not answer.

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GBC: You said all these things two days ago.

rla Gurudeva:In a moment I told. I was ready to come. By standing

Audience:(indistinct)

(break audio)

(krtana in background)

rla Gurudeva:Everything?

GBC: Everything. Every word we want.

rla Gurudeva: Niha means buddhiprvik. By wisdom wethere is some

Come here to sit

GBC: No, this is

rla Gurudeva: Buddhi prvik: when we decide this thing is good, but no taste. We have

heard it anywhere that to do Ka bhakti is good thing. But I have no taste. So, deciding by

mental

Audience: Intelligence.

rla Gurudeva: intelligence we decide that we should bhakti; but when we go to do bhakti

there is alasa,alasa meaning

Audience: Laziness.

rla Gurudeva: laziness, sometimes sleeping, sometimes we don't care, but know that this is

good. So, when we do it by deciding by mental thing, then it is niha and we do it regularly; but

when, if we do not do, there will be something lacking and there will be taste. No alasa, no

sleeping, no wastage of time. Then it will be ruci.

Similarly there are some differences between ruci and sakti. Ruci insdhana and sakti may be

onsdhy, Ka. Something remembering the pastimes of Ka rpa,gua, ll. So, there are

some differences.

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GBC: One has the taste in ruci and one is fully absorbed, his consciousness is fully absorbed in

sakti.

rla Gurudeva: In bhva avastha we can absorb. Not in sakti (unknown). We'll gradually go

up. Vivantha Cakravarthkura is this mad Madhurya Kadambini has given

(Hindi aside)

When we go anywhere all are

GBC: Hankering.

rla Gurudeva: anxious to go.

GBC: In r Bhakti-rasmta-sindhu it describes how sdhana of bhakti is kleaghn and ub-

had. So, those two qualities only seem to completely manifest themselves at niha for the

sdhaka.

rla Gurudeva: Heresdhanabhakti meaningsdhana ofuttambhakti. But when we dosd-

hana it is not complete, completely done. So, it is sdhana, by externalmna, buddhi,

ahakra, cit, all.

(END AUDIO)

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1991 10-16-17 Tridandisvami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Gosvami Maharaja Discourse on Madhurya...

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Transcript of 1991 10-16-17 Tridandisvami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Gosvami Maharaja Discourse on Madhurya...